Latest Ukraine/Russia Thread

[Hatfort]

59 minutes ago, PurpleTree said:

Russia would have probably installed a puppet in Ukraine and the people didn’t want that. Russia would have taken over Ukraine but not with straight violence. Similar to what pooh bear did in HK. Look even in Belarus the people were protesting because they wanted to be closer to Europe and fuerher from Russia/Putin. But the puppet dictator smashed the protests unfortunately. People choose freedom rather than Russia or China. Ar least in Ukraine, Belarus, Georgia, Armenia, Taiwan etc. etc.

That's not true, Russia hasn't intervened in Ukrainian elections. Obviously, they didn't like the far-right 2014 coup where the elected president Yanukovych was made to resign, as he was more friendly to them, but that's precisely the opposite of democracy. The Ukrainians didn't choose that.

Georgia just had elections and said no to those NATO friends who had money injected, which is rightfully considered an illegitimate political intervention that no country accepts in their laws. Which is what they did with more success in Ukraine and tried everywhere they could. I'll say it again, the US has to step back from messing in other countries' political life. If they have something bad to say about them, just say it, but that's it. People will agree or not, and that's okay.

I think Armenia wants to embrace the West politically and economically, after receiving a few treats. Okay, leave the arms of Russia, and deal with your conflicts with Azerbaijan with the West. Decisions have consequences, which we can say in advance, the EU won't really help. Azerbaijan right now is receiving a lot of love and friendship from everywhere, as they have oil, which apparently goes to Israel through Turkey. Erdogan's recent criticism of Israel, beautiful words, but they don't go accompanied by coherent action, for now.

Taiwan has its autonomy level and elections, but it's part of China. Their chances for independence are zero, because China is not going to allow it. I wouldn't oppose it if they democratically chose that, I'm just being realistic saying it won't happen.

Edited October 6 by Hatfort

[PurpleTree]

14 minutes ago, Hatfort said:

That's not true, Russia hasn't intervened in Ukrainian elections. Obviously, they didn't like the far-right 2014 coup where the elected president Yanukovych was made to resign, as he was more friendly to them, but that's precisely the opposite of democracy. The Ukrainians didn't choose that.

Georgia just had elections and said no to those NATO friends who had money injected, which is rightfully considered an illegitimate political intervention that no country accepts in their laws. Which is what they did with more success in Ukraine and tried everywhere they could. I'll say it again, the US has to step back from messing in other countries' political life. If they have something bad to say about them, just say it, but that's it. People will agree or not, and that's okay.

I think Armenia wants to embrace the West politically and economically, after receiving a few treats. Okay, leave the arms of Russia, and deal with your conflicts with Azerbaijan with the West. Decisions have consequences, which we can say in advance, the EU won't really help. Azerbaijan right now is receiving a lot of love and friendship from everywhere, as they have oil, which apparently goes to Israel through Turkey. Erdogan's recent criticism of Israel, beautiful words, but they don't go accompanied by coherent action, for now.

Taiwan has its autonomy level and elections, but it's part of China. Their chances for independence are zero, because China is not going to allow it. I wouldn't oppose it if they democratically chose that, I'm just being realistic saying it won't happen.

I think Georgia elections are upcoming.

https://amp.dw.com/en/georgias-elections-will-voters-lean-to-the-eu-or-russia/a-70203786

 

https://kyivindependent.com/viktor-yanukovych-ukraines-scandal-ridden-ex-president/

 

[Hatfort]

12 minutes ago, PurpleTree said:

I think Georgia elections are upcoming.

https://amp.dw.com/en/georgias-elections-will-voters-lean-to-the-eu-or-russia/a-70203786

I got that wrong then.

They can choose what they want, and that's fine. But they won't get a better economic deal from the EU than what they actually have with Russia. They need Russia more than vice-versa. NATO is still a red line though, like in Ukraine.

[Karmadhi]

On 06/10/2024 at 8:27 PM, PurpleTree said:

here are some possibilites in which Russia withdraws from Ukraine.

We‘ll just wait and see though I guess.

That means Ukraine would kick Russia out of 20% of the Ukranian land it occupies.

They tried last year in the famous counteroffensive which failed horribly.

Now Russia has progressed further, with Ukraine suffering more and more from lack of weapons and especially manpower.

Ukraine was stronger in 2023 during the counter offensive yet it failed to grab any land back.

Now how can they magically not only stop loosing more land but kick out Russia over the land it occupies, where Russia has long since built heavy defenses.

I fail to understand this logic.

It is like saying Germany will conquer USSR in 1944 after they horribly failed in 1941.

[PurpleTree]

7 hours ago, Karmadhi said:

That means Ukraine would kick Russia out of 20% of the Ukranian land it occupies.

They tried last year in the famous counteroffensive which failed horribly.

Now Russia has progressed further, with Ukraine suffering more and more from lack of weapons and especially manpower.

Ukraine was stronger in 2023 during the counter offensive yet it failed to grab any land back.

Now how can they magically not only stop loosing more land but kick out Russia over the land it occupies, where Russia has long since built heavy defenses.

I fail to understand this logic.

It is like saying Germany will conquer USSR in 1944 after they horribly failed in 1941.

I mean it could probably only work if more oligarchs get tired and push for regime change in Russia and an end to the war.

And maybe they would still get a small piece of Ukraine for them not to feel like total losers and Ukraine would get more protection from the West and more economic integration or something like that, or maybe not.

But oligarchs have a lot to lose and they don’t want that.

[Hatfort]

1 minute ago, PurpleTree said:

I mean it could probably only work if more oligarchs get tired and push for regime change in Russia and an end to the war.

And maybe they would still get a small piece of Ukraine for them not to feel like total losers and Ukraine would get more protection from the West and more economic integration or something like that, or maybe not.

But oligarchs have a lot to lose and they don’t want that.

You know what happened to oligarchs? That the moneys they had out of Russia have been taken by the West, so they became weak, and can't negotiate anything with Putin and his government anymore, they have to bend. This also weakened the West, because their banks are not trustful anymore for foreign rich people. Oligarchs are a burden anyway, so not a big loss for Russia.

[PurpleTree]

4 minutes ago, Hatfort said:

You know what happened to oligarchs? That the moneys they had out of Russia have been taken by the West, so they became weak, and can't negotiate anything with Putin and his government anymore, they have to bend. This also weakened the West, because their banks are not trustful anymore for foreign rich people. Oligarchs are a burden anyway, so not a big loss for Russia.

So you think Ukraine will lose, lose the whole country or lose the coast and east? I mean anything is possible 

[Hatfort]

Yes, Ukraine will lose for certain.

I don't think it will be the whole country, I hope it's not. I think it may be easier even for Russia if Ukraine holds some territory for itself, to avoid more inner tensions, that will probably have anyway. But conditions will be signed, which Ukraine will have to abide by from now on. I think Russia will extend from the four territories it already holds, including Odessa for its sea and proximity with Transnistria. The time it takes is hard to predict, but after the elections in the US are done and Biden leaves office, things will probably accelerate, no matter if it's Trump or Harris. It's becoming more unpopular to send money to foreign wars, it's more noticeable when there are disasters like hurricanes, but many people are struggling in their daily lives too.

[Karmadhi]

2 hours ago, PurpleTree said:

mean it could probably only work if more oligarchs get tired and push for regime change in Russia and an end to the war.

And maybe they would still get a small piece of Ukraine for them not to feel like total losers and Ukraine would get more protection from the West and more economic integration or something like that, or maybe not.

I think it is far more likely that Zelensky will be overthrown by the Ukranian military or oligarchs and a more pro peace guy will replace him.

Keep in mind that Ukraine is the one who has been destroyed, Russia is intact.

Therefore, the limit of Ukranians is reaching its peak.

Not to mention they running out of menpower.

 

[PurpleTree]

Probably just propaganda-esque wishful thinking

but whatever.

 

[PurpleTree]

Meanwhile in Russia, Chechnya.

 

 

[royce]

 

[Bobby_2021]

Babe wake up. Zelenskyy's new peace plan is out. 

https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2024/10/16/7479922/

Quote

Zelenskyy said that the implementation of the Peace Plan depends on Ukraine's partners, not Russia.

Shit hits the fan, and now the blame game starts. Who is to blame for the loss? Ukraine? no. It is the Ukraine's partners. 

Quote

Zelenskyy said that Ukraine and its partners should work together to change the circumstances so that the war ends and Russia is "forced into peace".

Okay. No comments.

Quote

The president said that the second point of the Plan is defence. It is the permanent strengthening of Ukrainian defence and the redirection of the war towards Russia (in the sense of relocating the combat to Russian territory). This point has a secret appendix.

gimme more moneey

Quote

The third point is the deterrence of Russian aggression. It also has a secret appendix to which the leaders of the United States, the UK, and Italy have access. Ukraine proposes to deploy a comprehensive non-nuclear deterrent package on its territory to deter further Russian aggression

more moneey.

Quote

The fourth point is Ukraine's strategic and economic potential. There is also a secret appendix that is being passed on to the US and EU. It provides for an agreement with partners.

Hey feel free to loot our natural resources you greedy fucks.

Quote

The fifth point is designed for the post-war period. Ukrainian experience should be used for the whole Alliance and the defence of Europe. Kyiv proposes replacing the US military in Europe with Ukrainian troops after the war.

lmao now Ukraine now protects Europe from Russia by replacing US troops. lmao.

 

[Leo Gura]

@Bobby_2021 What do you expect Ukraine to do? Lay down and get raped by Putin?

You sit in comfort and laugh while people lose their homes and land.

Edited October 17 by Leo Gura

[Bobby_2021]

4 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@Bobby_2021 What do you expect Ukraine to do? Lay down and get raped by Putin?

You sit in comfort and laugh while people lose their homes and land.

The people of Ukraine will agree with me. The mothers of Ukraine agrees with me. The common men of Ukraine agrees with me. I speak for the Ukrainian people. Not the rouge regime who wants to sell his own country to their capitalist overlords. 

The people of Ukraine would hate you if you say anything that prolongs the war. Which is what your current policy is. 

You absolutely do not have the moral ground here. You have lost it long ago. 

[PurpleTree]

28 minutes ago, Bobby_2021 said:

Babe wake up. Zelenskyy's new peace plan is out. 

https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2024/10/16/7479922/

Shit hits the fan, and now the blame game starts. Who is to blame for the loss? Ukraine? no. It is the Ukraine's partners. 

Okay. No comments.

gimme more moneey

more moneey.

Hey feel free to loot our natural resources you greedy fucks.

lmao now Ukraine now protects Europe from Russia by replacing US troops. lmao.

 

Another guy on my ignore list.

Nice. 💜

[Starlight321]

On 12.10.2024 at 9:19 PM, royce said:

 

@roycei've researched and the maps of these channel are one of the most accurate ones you can get but still taken with a grain of salt. However you and everybody else be aware that alone listening to the phrasing of the report warps your thinking about the matter over time. It brain washes you with russian bias and propaganda. I haven't followed the whole thread but I felt obligated to this reminder here for everyone.

[Bobby_2021]

9 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

What do you expect Ukraine to do?

1. Unconditional Surrender. 

2. Give up NATO aspirations. 

3. Give up the land that currently occupied by Russia.

4. Also remove the illegitimate president while you are at it. It is time for new elections and his term is over.

Resistance is futile. This is the land that has trillions of dollars worth of rare earth minerals. Russia and China will make use of it now.

US Fucked up big time. Bad policy has a price to pay. Pay the price and move on. Accepting the Truth is hard. What else can you do. 

I predicted this exactly on Feb of 2022. But then I was a "Russian propagandist". Now nearly 3 years later, West backed Ukraine is scrapping the bottom of the barrel. The west got high on their own arrogance thinking they can collapse Russia with sanctions and Ukraine can win. All of those were bullshit. 

Hey I know how bad things are. It is very bad. 10x worse than what is being reported. And it will only get worse. 

[Leo Gura]

@Bobby_2021 You are unhinged.

[Nivsch]

@Bobby_2021 Not only that surrendering might encourage Russia to keep conquering more territory, it might also have serious consequences on Ukrainians moral and sense of security for many years after the war, including much more widespread PTSD across the country's citizenship.

Edited October 17 by Nivsch