Trump shot at again (shocking)

[Leo Gura]

12 minutes ago, PurpleTree said:

don’t know if you heard that tobert epstein jre pod and i don’t know if it’s true. But he said that voters were unknowingly influenced/manipulated by « big tech » to vote hillary and biden vs trump, which is also quite undemocratic.

https://www.heritage.org/election-integrity/commentary/dont-let-big-tech-influence-the-elections-yet-again-year

I am not listening to that right-wing garbage.

Every election cycle they roll out yet more self-biased garbage and projection.

Edited September 16 by Leo Gura

[Joshe]

It's funny when people say things like "how come you only became interested in political corruption when Trump came into office?".

Our political system has never had its norms shattered the way it has since Trump came in. Because of this, most of us have not been following every potential political scandal. This is not because we're biased hypocrites, it's because the system was healthy enough to take care of itself, or so we thought. Those were the good ole days!

Edited September 16 by Joshe

[DocWatts]

Dictators have always attracted assassins like flies are attracted to shit - no surprise there.

Obviously it would be better for the country if Trump is defeated electorally. But don't expect any sympathy if you've spent the last decade encouraging stochastic political violence, only to have it blow up in your face.

Edited September 16 by DocWatts

[questionreality]

39 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Of course it is an undemocratic act.

But the right-wing in America, and especially MAGA, has lost any right to cry about undemocratic acts.

It is precisely because the right-wing doesn't care about democracy and is actively assaulting democracy at every level -- politically, economically, via corruption of the media, electorally, legally, morally, and spiritually -- that we on the left do not buy your crocodile tears about democracy.

The entire case against Trump has been that he will corrupt and prevert democracy. And that is exactly what he has done and continues to do without shame. Right wingers think that they can get away with corrupting democracy and things will turn out well for them. But any student of history knows that's not how this works. If Trump continues to corrupt democracy, he will end up dead from his own stupidity.

When you flame hatred, guess what? You get hatred in return. When you corrupt to courts to escapr justice, people take justice into their own hands. This corruption is Trump's doing and he is responsible for it no matter how much the right-wing fingerpoints at the left.

This is obvious to anyone with a serious understanding of politics. Which is why we have been saying Trump is unqualified for office. It's only MAGA fools who think they can promote hatred and lies against the Dems without consequence.

Assassination is wrong. But Trump doesn't care about right and wrong. So he has no grounds to complain. Assassination is illegal, but Trump breaks the law all time. This is the problem with supporting Trump. You are supporting incoherent garbage but then crying about it when it blows up in your face.

The entire case against Trump is that his corruption will blow up in your face. Trump's corruption, hatred, and devisiveness cannot be free. It comes with a big cost. The cost is what we see playing out in the media. And it could easily get much worse. But right-wingers wanna fuck around and find out. Then they will do the surprise Pikachu face and blame everyone but themselves.

In the end, everything related to Trump will collapse, die, and lose. The only question is how much collateral damage will America will incur?

So now you are reverting to whataboutism? Really?

Why do you assume that only the right-wingers have a problem with his assassination?

It doesn't matter whether you are on the left or the right - if you support assassination of a political candidate you for sure don't support democracy, or at the very least don't understand what it is and how it works.

I knew you were biased, but didn't know that you could be this blinded. I can now see why this forum has such a strong echo chamber and groupthink. 

I really can't believe what I have just read.

 

Edited September 16 by questionreality

[Leo Gura]

3 minutes ago, questionreality said:

So now you are reverting to whataboutism? Really?

It's not whataboutism, it has been my core position from day 1 about Trump.

All that's happening now is just the unfoldment of the chaos and corruption Trump as been sowing for 8 years. And if Trump is re-elected it will get much worse. And it will all be his fault.

Edited September 16 by Leo Gura

[Forestluv]

@questionreality In another thread you stated that you like to be grounded in your construct of “raw reality”. There are benefits to that, yet also a huge cost: paradigm lock. 

You “can’t believe what I just read” because within your construct of “raw reality” it is absurd and you are locked in that paradigm. 

You get benefits for doing that, yet you pay a huge cost, which you are unaware of. 

[Scholar]

13 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

It's not whataboutism, it has been my core position from day 1 about Trump.

All that's happening now is just the unfoldment of the chaos and corruption Trump as been sowing for 8 years. And if Trump is re-elected it will get much worse. And it will all be his fault.

At this point I don't think he is likely to win.

[Quader]

@questionreality

This forum is meant to be generally inclusive, there are people of all stages of development here.

When someone says good riddence trump tastes his own medicine, be aware that that's not a representation of quality conciousness, it's just short sighted and mean. You can try and help out by pointing things out you take issue with, but realize you're role could be to help people develop! You seem to be using the opportunity to instead hammer more nails in a coffin that holds people you detest. 

[Emerald]

4 hours ago, questionreality said:

So now you are reverting to whataboutism? Really?

Why do you assume that only the right-wingers have a problem with his assassination?

It doesn't matter whether you are on the left or the right - if you support assassination of a political candidate you for sure don't support democracy, or at the very least don't understand what it is and how it works.

I knew you were biased, but didn't know that you could be this blinded. I can now see why this forum has such a strong echo chamber and groupthink. 

I really can't believe what I have just read.

It's not that most of the people here are condoning an assassination attempt. Obviously, it's important to condemn political violence of all sorts because it sets a bad precedent to normalize it.

It's just that it isn't surprising that Donald Trump would be the target of one (or more) assassination attempts because he is a politician the sews chaos and engages in telling lots of Fascistic falsehoods that put vulnerable people in harm's way... and he is a genuine threat to democracy. And there's a lot of fear around him getting back into power because of his indications of a desire to become a dictator.

So, of course some crazies might try to be vigilantes and take the law into their own hands.

But it's quite silly for people on the right to point fingers at the left and accuse the left of being responsible for the assignation attempts against him by pointing out his dictatorial behavior. 

Really... the answer is that crazies will be crazies. But there are reasons why this is happening multiple times to Trump in particular when it doesn't happen that often to other politicians... and that is a direct reflection of the way he has shown up on the world stage over the past 9 years.

[Gennadiy1981]

The entire thing sounds very bullshittitng. It’s not like someone was shooting at Trump for immigration stance or economics or say on political tension, the shooter was disagreeing about stance on Ukraine that sounds very weak in argument. I see everyone here is picking a side even unconsciously, but the motive was very childish at best, that Trump may not allow to recruit foe reigns to fight in Ukraine. That’s not a real stance, how many Americans really debate about such thing.

Either there is much more than meets the eye here, or people really started to degrade and our society is on the verge of collapse.  

[What Am I]

I'd like to point out that there's been 37 successful political assassinations in Mexico's 2024 election season, which edges out their previous record of 36 in the 2021 season. Not attempts, but rather successful killings. There's room for things to get worse in the US, even though our normalcy bias makes it difficult to imagine.

Obviously we're not dealing with a 1:1 when it comes to Mexico, and there's other factors at play that contribute to a nightmare scenario of that magnitude. But I wouldn't get so comfortable in the thought that Trump would be the only casualty and then things would return to normal afterward. He'd be dead, but those who would avenge their loss of choice won't be. The same tribalism instinct which is so well-defined now in the US could quickly turn into literal tribal warfare. Perhaps something to consider when the impulse arises to flippantly proclaim "He gets what he deserves."

https://www.reuters.com/world/americas/mexican-candidate-assassinations-hit-grim-record-ahead-sundays-election-2024-06-01/

 

[aurum]

56 minutes ago, Gennadiy1981 said:

The entire thing sounds very bullshittitng. It’s not like someone was shooting at Trump for immigration stance or economics or say on political tension, the shooter was disagreeing about stance on Ukraine that sounds very weak in argument. I see everyone here is picking a side even unconsciously, but the motive was very childish at best, that Trump may not allow to recruit foe reigns to fight in Ukraine. That’s not a real stance, how many Americans really debate about such thing.

Either there is much more than meets the eye here, or people really started to degrade and our society is on the verge of collapse.  

Were you really expecting the shooter to be a political scholar?

[Joshe]

This post title is misleading. The guy didn’t actually shoot at Trump. When Trump said “there were gunshots in my vicinity” what he meant was, secret service spotted a guy over a football field away and shot towards the guy they spotted. 

Edited September 17 by Joshe

[Alex4]

9 hours ago, Joshe said:

It's funny when people say things like "how come you only became interested in political corruption when Trump came into office?".

Our political system has never had its norms shattered the way it has since Trump came in. Because of this, most of us have not been following every potential political scandal. This is not because we're biased hypocrites, it's because the system was healthy enough to take care of itself, or so we thought. Those were the good ole days!

You weren't following politics out of laziness and a fear to have opinions on controversial topics. There are a lot of moderate people out there who don't vote for these reasons, and that's one of the reasons why the far right is on the rise. 

[gettoefl]

the less mature care about the result, the win, the power, personalities

the rest care about the journey, unifying, perspective (what is important?) and compromise

Edited September 17 by gettoefl

[El Zapato]

@gettoefl Unfortunately, the Trumpian journey is f*cked!

[El Zapato]

@What Am I The topic of Mexico can be interesting.  No doubt they have serious problems. But what is the story?  It's complex, one of the common refrains maintains that Mexican immigrants should stay home and fix their own state.  Well, they have been fighting a revolution since the 1800's against foreign infiltration on the one hand, and if statistical reports are accurate most of the population in Mexico is already living in the U.S.  Which is only fair because at least from the perspective of the Indigenous it was their continent to begin with.

 

[El Zapato]

13 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

I am not listening to that right-wing garbage.

Every election cycle they roll out yet more self-biased garbage and projection.

For sure, it is a manifestation of the 'evil' gene.  Sick puppies they be.  In that opinion, I will not relent!

[gettoefl]

39 minutes ago, El Zapato said:

@gettoefl Unfortunately, the Trumpian journey is f*cked!

yes a populist will always be popular

[Jodistrict]

The left has as many biases as the right.  I have talked to democrat party liberals who hate Putin and blame Russia for all the problems in the world.  But they are doing the same thing that Senator Joseph McCarthy did in the 1950s (which all good liberals condemn).  They both listen to their own echo chamber and are locked into a group think.