Women are my only and only distraction from Enlightment

[theleelajoker]

1 minute ago, Leo Gura said:

@Forestluv That is because relationships are about survival, and spirituality is not.

Don't agree. Can't see why it has to be that way. In my personal experience a relationship can be about both.

Maybe it's only like that because you think it's like that.

In the province of the mind, what one believes to be true is true or becomes true, within certain limits to be found experientially and experimentally. These limits are further beliefs to be transcended. In the mind there are no limits.

John C Lilly

[Forestluv]

37 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@Forestluv That is because relationships are about survival, and spirituality is not. The more you intermingle survival into your spirituality the more corrupt it will get. Which is why the most spiritual people are monks who live in caves.

Also, I don't have children. I've noticed if I date someone with children the pull is much stronger. 

Edited September 8 by Forestluv

[Princess Arabia]

16 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@Forestluv That is because relationships are about survival, and spirituality is not. The more you intermingle survival into your spirituality the more corrupt it will get.

Yes, but most people use get into Spirituality as a survival mechanism; suffering, trying to gain something, maintaining their Spiritual identity, that's why it's hard to intermingle. True embodied Spirituality, one can intermingle no problem. It's like a male doesn't go around consciously trying to maintain his male identity, doesn't try to avoid activities that doesn't make him a man, he just is and, if anything, tries to improve upon his already manhood. He doesn't avoid females because they'll turn him into a female. If his Spirituality was truly embodied and not on shaky ground he wouldn't feel the need to have to avoid being in a relationship that was of good caliber, loving and a fit for both. 

Edited September 8 by Princess Arabia

[Emerald]

37 minutes ago, Princess Arabia said:

Kind of like sometimes if I'm on here for a bit in one day, talking back and forth, different topics, different people, all in for about 2hrs straight or so, then.......log off to find myself alone in my room. I can't explain that feeling, it's like before I was all engaged and now all alone in a split second. The difference in feeling is unfathomable and hard to put in words. As if I'm all alone in the Universe, just my room exists and all that talk never happened....then boom, back to reality. All that happened in a split second. So, I kinda understand what you mean.

It's definitely a bit like that. This was that feeling too.

But there was also this sense that, when my daughter was speaking I could feel that sense of namaste... which means the God in me sees the God in you. And even though she was just talking about a show she was watching, it was this quick awareness that I was looking directly at God and I could "see" it shine through her face. 

And for a split second, it was like I was God talking to God in a bubble of experience made of God... and that that was all there was. And it was this quick flash of a feeling.

But I took it as a nudge for me to recognize how significant small moments of connection like that are... and how that moment was really everything. And it felt this struck me like it did in this mundane moment to emphasize the importance of being present in moments like that with my kids.

 

[Leo Gura]

1 minute ago, Princess Arabia said:

True embodied Spirituality, one can intermingle no problem.

Easy to say, hard to do.

[Clarence]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

You don't need to find a girl who knows Actualized.org. You just need to find a girl who roughly aligns with your values and then you as the man will guide her into watching Actualized.org or whatever else is important to you. You lead and teach her what is important.

Ok… though it's still as hard to meet someone willing to. Or I was just unlucky so far. The only one I met who was interested didn't understand English well enough to listen to a video.

Honestly, I don't know what else I can realistically expect out of a relationship. I'm not into sex so much and I'm not interested in girls either, which makes dating harder.

The last person I dated said he had never been on dates with someone for so long (6 dates total) without having sex. We never had sex and stopped dating because I didn't fall in love and he was working too much.

Another one, I went on 4 dates with without sex either. And we stopped dating.

I need to be in love to be interested in sex with someone, but I don't fall in love that easily. So that's complex at the start of a relationship. Forcing oneself into sex is not much fun and quite uncomfortable too (I tried in my first relationships).

I experience things a bit upside down compared to most people, which is why I feel a bit confused about my situation and don't know what to act on.

My most successful relationship… I was in love with my (sexual friend) partner but he wasn't in love with me. So quite bad still. Very bad. But sex was good and it was fun. The secret to this working: I fell in love before manifesting interest. But to reproduce that to find a balanced relationship seems like a fantasy and doesn't make me feel like I am in control.

But how much in control are we of our romantic feelings? So confusing.

@Leo Gura If you have other advice, they're welcome. You may just say that I'm doomed and that I complain too much

[Princess Arabia]

3 minutes ago, Emerald said:

It's definitely a bit like that. This was that feeling too.

But there was also this sense that, when my daughter was speaking I could feel that sense of namaste... which means the God in me sees the God in you. And even though she was just talking about a show she was watching, it was this quick awareness that I was looking directly at God and I could "see" it shine through her face. 

And for a split second, it was like I was God talking to God in a bubble of experience made of God... and that that was all there was. And it was this quick flash of a feeling.

But I took it as a nudge for me to recognize how significant small moments of connection like that are... and how that moment was really everything. And it felt this struck me like it did in this mundane moment to emphasize the importance of being present in moments like that with my kids.

 

Beautiful. All your explanations are beautiful to read. Something within me feels something when I read them.

[Ajax]

14 hours ago, Emerald said:

From the perspective of those on this forum or people who see seeking enlightenment as the one true path, I'm sure that my decision to surrender to and embrace my human limitations and to live the story will seem resistant and deluded.

But J have been shown that enlightenment isn't the only game that God plays with itself. And I choose to exercise faith in these experiences and their feeling of rightness over what some people in the world of Maya believe about enlightenment and truth. 

 

The spirit can’t resist. To have existence is to resist. It is something you put there to have a game. Something to resist, and something that resists. As I frequently state. Truth is what you put there. It is what is real from your viewpoint. The problem comes when you have fake realities…. By which I mean something that you have assigned as cause and consider yourself the effect of. It’s not delusions… it’s simply the mechanics. You find what you are looking for.

In the end, the only thing a person really objects to is their lack of choice. It is interesting that “want” has a double meaning. Something you wish to obtain and something that you consider that you lack, or deprived of.  Interesting, isn’t it?

Truth and force do not mix. Why because you put it there, and when you try to put something else there, it changes because you find what you are looking for. The spirit creates something out of nothing. It’s most basic characteristic is ultimate reflectiveness. What does it reflect?  The basic characteristic of the viewer that you put there. You put admiration there, you see admiration there, you put confusion and admiration there, that is what you see… as the spirit does not resist it uses existence to reflect what it sees.

So what you put there is what is true, because you put it there. The number 1 spiritual law is that you are a nothingness that creates something out of nothing. Therefore, truth cannot be seen, or observed without knowing that you are the one that put it there.

14 hours ago, Emerald said:

What it showed me is that it is just as happy to be a Buddha as it is happy to be a sea urchin. And any incarnation comes with limits and handicaps. And it is through these limits and handicaps that meaning and beauty are possible.

It is only because a story has a beginning and an end that you can have happiness and joy. And it is only in separation that relationship is possible.

Define happiness. It is simply an effect, something that happens after you do something, or decide something. You put the idea that there is something called happiness and then decide that it is happening to you. This is what the spirit does(form something out of nothing). To the degree that you are capable of causative effects, you can decide where happiness is or it is not.

You are a spirit. That is the most important thing that you can know. A spirit is the one that creates something, you put it there. Beauty in something only exists because you put it there. It’s not limitations, it you that put beauty and decide that it is beautiful… things are dead, just particles until you put the beauty, joy and life into things.

Of course, having a game is important… there are infinite amount of games.

14 hours ago, Emerald said:

And my path is a feminine path of embracing limitation and contraction rather than the masculine path of expansion. Though my experiences of expansion and awakening have served to enrich my Earthly experience, transcendence is not actually what I want. I came here to play the game and live the story.

First this masculine/feminine dynamic isn’t very real to me. Neither is transcendence.  What is considered normal, is agreeing with other points of view as what is normal. However, in your native state.. the component parts are no space, no time, no agreement, source, knowingness, cause and creation. These are what are used to construct something out of nothing. It doesn’t matter if you are in your native state or not… they are the parts that are used to create “life particles” Which are used to create something.. to create the conditions for existence.

 Your most basic Freedom is the ability to assume any possible viewpoint. Having the ability and willingness to admire anything for no reason at all. These are native abilities, not defined by such lesser considerations of this so-called masculine and feminine.

To tell the truth, I could not even define the idea of masculine and feminine.. so we do not share a reality regarding this. Anything physical of course is a shared reality. But, first I would have to create the reality and then agree with what others consider to be reality… You see you can not escape this so called, transcendence whether you want to or not.  It is a decision to be or not to be, or to agree or not to agree.

14 hours ago, Emerald said:

So, if you lay out the option to be Emerald or to be God, I'm definitely going to pick Emerald every time as it is as clear to me as it is possible for a human to have clarity that this is the function of this lifetime.

To give some context as to why this is integral to my path, I have dealt since I was very small with a God complex that originally stemmed from a lack of trust and feelings of unsafety. And it's come from a traumatized 3 year old aspect of myself. And at that age, it isn't so clear that you aren't the center of the universe. So, I have this part of my that feels it must be perfect and do all the scary things alone.

And it has created this lonely anxious God dynamic that hums underneath all of my experiences. 

And it has given me this life-long burden of feeling like I have to know perfectly but also paired with a genuine curiosity that's pretty insatiable. And it has led me to constant expansion into more and more insights. 

But because I cannot know Truth in the absolute, it has left me ever expanding and expanding and expanding and spreading myself thin trying to know. This is even true, having gone through ego dissolution and many awakenings. You can be it, but you cannot know it.

And in my journeys, I have experienced infinite knowledge twice... and it is completely overwhelming. It showed this to me to help me remember that my path doesn't have to do with expansion of knowledge but rather to do with contraction of knowledge.

And I can tell you, infinite knowing is a real crown of thorns. And I'm not Christian, but God had shared with me that it is only the Christ that had to bear the burdens of the infinite as a finite being and that I don't have to do it because no one has to do that anymore. And that's a good thing too, because it is like hell in ways that I struggle to communicate and understand.

And it has even taught me how to wear the crown and then pass the crown and appreciate other people more, and to disappear into being a side character in the story to diffuse the weight of the crown. And it was such a joy to conceptualize of myself as a background extra in the story of someone else's life.

These are simply excuses and justifications. If you consider life is complex, unfair or ugly…  you simply don’t understand enough of the rules.  There doesn’t need to be a reason to choose a path. It was nothing before you decided that it is something. Just a thought, a consideration. Reasons are simply self deceptions. They are a substitute for knowing something.  To put is succinctly… all the freedom and slavery you will ever experience is found in the midst of your considerations.

When you break down a decision it goes like this..

 First you have a miscommunication with something... Then you have a misunderstanding of something... that there is something out of alignments of what you consider to be true, a disagreement, a separation, a barrier to the interchange between ideas, as well as apparent pull away from that thing.. such as trying to force two identical magnetic polarities together.  Then, we get into the realm of limitations… you consider you failed, or lost something, that something is non optimal… it is the realm of control.. the consideration that there is something there that you did not intend, or doesn’t belong or something that is unwanted.. something related to your survival, that challenges your considerations… the introduction of a counter intention… Which causes you to consider something is an unwanted effect… since it is unwanted… you drop responsibility for it which is to lie to yourself and say you are not the cause of it (responsibility is simply the willingness to accept cause)… which assigns importance… something you must do about it… whether if it is to avoid it prevent it, or to stop or change it, fight it, drop it or in any other way react to it. In this way to drop it and put it on something else… It is the decision to say I am weak and you are strong… but I am right and you are wrong.. but since I decided I am weak I must prove myself right and confirm so, so I will act as if I am so… that something other than…

It is a beautify and amazing mechanism.

14 hours ago, Emerald said:

So, as God it has picked Emerald to incarnate this overwhelmed part of itself into to relieve that part from the burdens of the infinite. But Emerald can't help herself and keeps going back into knowledge expansion mode and sneaking back into the cookie jar of knowledge. So, there is a learning curve to contraction and the letting go of the need to know.

But in my Ayahuasca experiences, God has worked with me to heal my knowledge-seeking obsession and show me the value of embracing ordinariness, limitations, and contraction and to be able to surrender and to exercise faith in lieu of knowledge... which is what my neuroses have disallowed me from. And this constant truth-seeking has put a cap on my ability to show up in life fully as myself as it is like I am always in protection mode.

So, over the past couple of years my path has been about embracing the path of contraction and limitation... and grounding deeply into the human experience and allowing myself to be ordinary and imperfect.

As I say repeatedly… You find what you are looking for.  Since you create something out of thin air, you will find what you put there. The problem is removing what doesn’t belong. It is like an artist painting, you add and detract from your portrait as it is yours… to the degree that you consider it is something or someone else is the author, you will know tragedy and devolve into thinking, rationality, looking for confirmation, forcing something that doesn’t belong in your personal portrait which causes pain.

 Why are you considering as God as something as external to you? Do you not make something out of nothing. You are your viewpoint on others, you put love, beauty and admiration into existence and that is what you are… you put imperfection ugliness, confusion, complexity and impurity that is what you are because you can not be wrong as truth has the characteristics of ultimate reflectiveness… your viewpoint makes it so.. it’s not something you see it is something you put there.

There is no human experience, only your ideas about human experience that you reinforce and create… something out of nothing after all.

You are perfect and anything that isn't perfect isn't you. Winning and losing is relative to your viewpoint on whether you can maintain the same level of enthusiasm and joy from it regardless of the form it takes... which is a godly action in its self... not a human consideration... consider that...

14 hours ago, Emerald said:

And a huge part of that has been about recognizing and accepting the limits to my ability to know... whilst also exercising faith in my own experiences of God consciousness and exercising faith in my own inner compass of my intuitions and insights.

And a big learning curve is in being able to put trust and faith in my own subjective experiences and perspectives, despite recognizing that they are limited and that I cannot know and do not know the absolute objective truth and never will.

There really is only one “law” that is really worth knowing. That is that you are the source of your thought, awareness and activity. You have the ability to create something out of nothing. It is this certainty, not knowledge, that makes possible. It is the ability to know you put it there, and that you can create something out of nothing, and that you are the decider of your willingness exorcise this power or not, by your choice and your choice alone. It is simply a matter of preference. And preference is a beautiful thing. For it is your game.

 

14 hours ago, Emerald said:

I know that my path doesn't fit your idea of a spiritual path, and you may see it as deluded.

But keep in mind that both truth and illusion are part of the Truth.

And both expansion and contraction are part of Expansion.

And both the finite and the infinite are part of the Infinite.

There is not two... but one. And the contraction path is just the other side of the coin to the expansion path. And it is clear to me that I open up and expand when I allow myself contract... and contract when I try to expand.

Its not about a path. A path is just something you do through your own personal viewpoint. As I mentioned, Truth is simply an absence of… it’s not even one… The spirit is this “thing” that knows and creates something out of nothing. What you put there is true… I like the idea of a postulate being an “ithere”, as in I put it there… I-there! Lol

As for your path, I consider it very valid for you.

My objection is your assertion that objective truth cannot be known. Truth is an absence of…  therefore, it is the removal of.. rather than the seeking of… how in the world can you seek a “nothing”.  It is not even one as one signifies quantity… when a particle comes together it ceases to exist after all… truth has no continuation because it is not existence… you put an idea and existence forms around it.

Of course the greatest pretense is that it is not all a pretense...

I have no intention to force you off your own road of truth, far from it… I simply wished to engage in an interchange of ideas, just for fun. I created a reason because there is no reason… an interchange is just the consideration that there is something one does not know and wishes for an exchange, thank you for participating and indulging… it is a mockup of a disagreement as it is the vessel of and exchange to balance an imbalance.

My point, is you don’t have to have a reason to decide to embrace a human experience. It simply is. That is our “gift from god” to postulate without confirmation and to decide to confirm and limit ourselves in this confirmation… there is no need to “surrender” just decide to embrace for no reason at all other than just to do it.

Love your idea about expanding and contracting… beautiful pure and simple and it is true because you decided to create it!

LOVE LOVE LOVE

 

[Princess Arabia]

4 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Easy to say, hard to do.

Not if there's no attachment there and if one is operating from a place of identification. You're right, it's not easy but pass this point it becomes unmalleable for outside forces to influence you. I'm not there yet, but I've experienced spurts of it depending on my state.

[Emerald]

46 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

What I meant is that ultimately, infinity is absolutely empty in the sense that it's impossible that god wants anything, like being an individual, or hidden anything. Could happen relatively, in a given moment in the infinity, but in the whole infinity no, there is no intention, no real change, no movement, just because it's infinite. Then, any perception that we could have, even it seems very true, is just relative,  not false but not absolute. The absolute is just total, is the essence, only the essence is real, and it's nothing that can be defined, just totality, existence.

I've experienced the emptiness too... after I experience ego death. And there there is nothing and no desire. And there is no self to take anything in.

But most of my experiences of God have been a more subtle decentering of the ego to reveal God's consciousness underneath... and showed me the everything-ness element of the infinite. 

It's like a drop that realizes that it's the ocean... or a twig that realizes that it's the tree.

But I don't claim to know anything about infinity, as I do not know its true nature. And my suspicion is that no human being can know the true nature of infinity.

I only 'know' that I've had certain subjective experiences of different facets of God, and that the understanding I've taken from my memories of these experiences has led me to certain conclusions that I now use to help me navigate through life.

I take my experiences a bit like the blind men and the elephant. 

In my experiences, it has been like feeling the tusks of the elephant. Perhaps in others' experiences, they have felt the tail of the elephant.

So, my perception is that we are both blind men... and you are just describing one part of the elephant. And I have felt this part of the elephant too.

I also like to think of it through this analogy.

Let's say that God is an infinite pie. And I have experienced God in my medicine journeys 8 times. So, I've eaten 8 slices of infinite pie.

And 7 out of those 8 times, God was a cherry pie with the experiences of oneness and everythingness. But one out of those 8 times, God was a meat pie... this is when I experienced ego dissolution.

But with an infinite pie, you cannot know the true nature of its filling.

Even if you were eating pie nonstop for your whole life and you only ever ate cherry pie from the infinite pie... you could not know that cherry was the true nature of the filling of the infinite pie.

And that is because, you could have all sorts of unknown fillings in the pie that are outside of the realm of your experience. Who knows, maybe most of the infinite pie has a filling of motor oil.

And that is where the surrender of the illusion of knowing the ineffable comes into play for those who have had awakenings. 

[Davino]

@Emerald Thanks for your detailed answer.

I've had very similar insights to yours. I just took another decision from them.

It seems to me that after some point the path seems to satisfy the Awakening urge and it revalues the mundane and infuses it with meaning.

My Salvia breakthrough made me value real life so much that I cried for the possibility of feeding my cat after becoming boundless disembodied Consciousness. I was so grateful to be a human back again.

So I really see the beauty in Life and the magnificence of living.

I just seem to have an overwhelming pull for Truth, Awakening and the like. I don't even have a choice. It does me at every time. I'm in the current of this Universal Awakening Force.

[Emerald]

Just now, Davino said:

@Emerald Thanks for your detailed answer.

I've had very similar insights to yours. I just took another decision from them.

It seems to me that after some point the path seems to satisfy the Awakening urge and it revalues the mundane and infuses it with meaning.

My Salvia breakthrough made me value real life so much that I cried for the possibility of feeding my cat after becoming boundless disembodied Consciousness. I was so grateful to be a human back again.

So I really see the beauty in Life and the magnificence of living.

I just seem to have an overwhelming pull for Truth, Awakening and the like. I don't even have a choice. It does me at every time. I'm in the current of this Universal Awakening Force.

You're welcome. I definitely relate to this. There's a lot of tension between my seeking/expansion drive and my contraction/meaning drive.

[Davino]

53 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

The more you intermingle survival into your spirituality the more corrupt it will get. Which is why the most spiritual people are monks who live in caves.

Not only spirituality, all truth seeking suffers corruption from survival.

Probably that's why Isaac Newton was so reserved and died virgin.

[Keryo Koffa]

1 hour ago, Emerald said:

• Here's my comprehension of your writing:

1. The infinite polarizes to converge in omniscience or diverge interconnected perspectives. 
2. Contraction individuates to explore meaning through contrast, value fulfillment & immersion. 
3. The infinite contains and shines through the finite, as they oscillate form and formless in polarity.

I see through some parts of the dynamic but do have questions:

On one hand, you said that the contracted perspective allows greater immersion and appreciation of the relative.

On the other hand, you talked about the burdens of the infinite, is it because it seeks to harmonize the entirety?

Does the relative expand the infinite, or was it always part of it? Is the experience deeper or more personalized?

There are infinite perspectives to explore, are we creating the relative or tuning into it?

49 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

1. Dualities are relative, hence divided, and not absolute. The absolute must be formless, hence empty.
2. God, being Infinity, cannot be any thing and so cannot exhibit any behavior, nor bias, nor intention.
3. The absolute is undefinable since definitions strip it of wholeness. Only this essence is real.

What do you mean by real and why use that word specifically?

[Buck Edwards]

1 hour ago, Davino said:

---

Despite sex being quite overrated, sexual programming is hard wired in the masculine psyche to levels I'm still astonished to discover. It's not going anywhere any time soon.

And that burden should not be placed on women. If you find a highly conscious partner you can flow with them. In fact a woman can lead her man to high consciousness and spirituality. It does not always have to be the other way around. 

[Buck Edwards]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

@Forestluv That is because relationships are about survival, and spirituality is not. The more you intermingle survival into your spirituality the more corrupt it will get. Which is why the most spiritual people are monks who live in caves.

Your claims are false and not sustainable in objective reality. There are people like Adyashanti. They live spiritual lives and are happily married too. This whole idea that spirituality is all about living in caves is outdated now. 

 

[Buck Edwards]

3 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You don't need to find a girl who knows Actualized.org. You just need to find a girl who roughly aligns with your values and then you as the man will guide her into watching Actualized.org or whatever else is important to you. You lead and teach her what is important.

It's gender neutral. 

[Lyubov]

1 hour ago, theleelajoker said:

Don't agree. Can't see why it has to be that way. In my personal experience a relationship can be about both.

Maybe it's only like that because you think it's like that.

In the province of the mind, what one believes to be true is true or becomes true, within certain limits to be found experientially and experimentally. These limits are further beliefs to be transcended. In the mind there are no limits.

John C Lilly

It’s that way for him because he believes it’s that way and doesn’t realize how unfathomably deep the spiritual lessons go when it comes to relationships and mundane sober living. With that mindset the Tao will not bless him with these lessons BUT every path is different so it’s a matter of personal preference if you want to explore this aspect of life or go in a different direction.

Many “seekers” I’ve spoken to are some of the most childish people you will meet and are hopeless when it comes to relating. I prefer spirituality with legs. Not state chasing. I’ve learned more from life and about spirituality from the dysfunctional relationship with my ex more than any ayahuasca ceremonies I’ve done. 

But I wouldn’t say my path is better or more enlightened than anyone else’s. I don’t believe there is a tier list or even a way to compare paths.

But anyone who thinks relationships are just some novel aspect of life without deeper spiritual lesson to them is kidding themself, and if you believe that and believe this is absolutely true about relationships, then definitely don’t bother with them cause you’re wasting your time. 

Edited September 8 by Lyubov

[Keryo Koffa]

All this repetitive relationship advice leads nowhere, I have a better idea

Just throw some neuralink vr sex simulators at the horny men, to stop distracting us from metaphysics lol

[Leo Gura]

15 minutes ago, Buck Edwards said:

Your claims are false and not sustainable in objective reality. There are people like Adyashanti. They live spiritual lives and are happily married too. This whole idea that spirituality is all about living in caves is outdated now. 

What I said does not mean relationship and spirituality cannot be combined.