The Relationship Between Time and Eternity

[Spiritual Warfare]

If something is truly eternal, can it engage in creation or change? Creation inherently involves some form of transformation, which presupposes the existence of time. If an entity exists entirely outside the confines of time, any act of creation would require a transition from one state to another. This suggests that an eternal being might be fundamentally incapable of such actions.

I would love to hear your thoughts on this, as I seek clarity and understanding. I genuinely want to know if what Leo is saying holds true, and I hope to avoid being misled.

 

 

 

 

[Breakingthewall]

the absolute is immutable and eternal. movement and time are apparent, since movement and time go from one point to another, and in infinity you do not reach anywhere nor start from any point

[Spiritual Warfare]

12 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

the absolute is immutable and eternal. movement and time are apparent, since movement and time go from one point to another, and in infinity you do not reach anywhere nor start from any point

If the Absolute is entirely immutable and beyond time, how can anything else, such as the apparent reality of time and movement, exist at all? This suggests a paradox: if everything emanates from the Absolute, how can time and change appear to be real if they are fundamentally illusory?

 

[Breakingthewall]

21 minutes ago, Spiritual Warfare said:

If the Absolute is entirely immutable and beyond time, how can anything else, such as the apparent reality of time and movement, exist at all? This suggests a paradox: if everything emanates from the Absolute, how can time and change appear to be real if they are fundamentally illusory?

 

the absolute, as absolute, is total, it's not something. Eternity and infinity are outside of the time, the change. The time and the change are in them, as and they are infinite changes, doesn't mean nothing.

How I'm perceiving a concrete movement? Because I'm that movement, it's like the absolute is merged with this concrete movement but if you can do a step back and be in the perspective of the absolute, this movement means nothing. This is a scary movement, but then you can be open to the infinity, the abyss. to its taste, that is openness and freedom. 

[Spiritual Warfare]

8 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

the absolute, as absolute, is total, it's not something. Eternity and infinity are outside of the time, the change. The time and the change are in them, as and they are infinite changes, doesn't mean nothing.

How I'm perceiving a concrete movement? Because I'm that movement, it's like the absolute is merged with this concrete movement but if you can do a step back and be in the perspective of the absolute, this movement means nothing. This is a scary movement, but then you can be open to the infinity, the abyss. to its taste, that is openness and freedom. 

If eternity and infinity exist outside of time, doesn't that mean our finite experiences contribute to a bigger story? Instead of viewing concrete movement as insignificant, could we see it as an important expression of existence? Might this connection between the absolute and the concrete be where true meaning lies, helping us appreciate both the infinite and the fleeting moments of life?

[Atb210201]

Why would an Eternal Being be incapable of anything?

If there is such a thing as time then only an Eternal being can be responsible for it's creation because time must come from something outside of itself

[Spiritual Warfare]

35 minutes ago, Atb210201 said:

Why would an Eternal Being be incapable of anything?

If there is such a thing as time then only an Eternal being can be responsible for it's creation because time must come from something outside of itself

If this being is truly eternal and unchanging, how can it engage in the act of creation, which inherently implies change and movement? Could it be possible that the characteristics we attribute to an Eternal Being limit our understanding of its nature and capabilities? How do we reconcile the idea of timeless existence with the dynamic reality we experience?

[Atb210201]

34 minutes ago, Spiritual Warfare said:

If this being is truly eternal and unchanging, how can it engage in the act of creation, which inherently implies change and movement? Could it be possible that the characteristics we attribute to an Eternal Being limit our understanding of its nature and capabilities? How do we reconcile the idea of timeless existence with the dynamic reality we experience?

We can do that by believing levels and depths to existence

On the deepest level The God Head is still and without any movement or time whatsoever full and ready to manifest and explode everything into existence

And then movement happens time happens apparent existence also happens (the surface level)

And why does that happen out of nowhere?

Because of Love

Only because of Love it happens

Not because God needs something to happen

Just Because God is Love and thus Love bursts into existence 

And if you only see the Absolute time and movement would also stop for you

But we are caught up in apparent world

Edited September 4 by Atb210201

[Breakingthewall]

1 hour ago, Spiritual Warfare said:

contribute to a bigger story?

It's not bigger, it's infinite. Absolute. The first time that you look the absolute in the face, you will see the horror. The absolute eats everything. God is a history, everything falls in the abyss and reality reveals itself as nothing, empty, then you will know the horror. But there is something there, you. And you open your heart and your heart is the absolute light of existence, and that's everything, the absolute. End of the movie. Nothing really happens, everything is an empty hologram, but under any appearance, the absolute shines, and it's always the same. 

Edited September 4 by Breakingthewall

[cetus]

35 minutes ago, Atb210201 said:

On the deepest level the God Head is still and without any movement or time whatsoever full and ready to manifest and explode everything into existence

Potential: existing in possibility : capable of development into actuality

[Ishanga]

3 hours ago, Spiritual Warfare said:

If the Absolute is entirely immutable and beyond time, how can anything else, such as the apparent reality of time and movement, exist at all? This suggests a paradox: if everything emanates from the Absolute, how can time and change appear to be real if they are fundamentally illusory?

 

Absolute, i would say from how I understand it from an Experiential POV and researching it from many Indian masters, Absolute is a non physical realm of Potential, its all about Oneness, Completeness, Absolute, Eternal, Infinite, and all these Grand words, but if You look at simply, its all Potential and Possibility, so from that, we here on this dual material planet have to exist as a part of the Potential that exists, so existence goes from Gross (us, everything on this planet, raw material, etc), to Subtle (the Absolute is the most subtle, for our purpose, Kundalini is the most subtle aspect of the physical I would say, everything after that is non physical, can't be measured), and we are here to play this game of duality and potential, we can live like Goats, or Gods, its up to us if we evoke our Free Will..

[Hojo]

Eternity created time as a limitation

[Yimpa]

"I went to a restaurant that serves breakfast at any time. So I ordered French toast during the Renaissance."

-Steven Wright

[Princess Arabia]

Maybe nothing is actually happening or moving and it all just appear to be. Maybe it's just one big friggin' magic trick and we've all been duped. Maybe it's like one giant TV screen with God outside looking in and watching the movie, but just like how on a TV screen it's all just appearing with no real movement and God is actually the TV and we are all inside the screen. Maybe God is imagining everything and there's nothing here. Maybe it's one big psychedelic party and God is trippin'; and the day the body dies is when he runs out of mushrooms or 5meo and when a baby is born is when he gets some more and starts trippin" again. I need a job.

[Spiritual Warfare]

10 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

It's not bigger, it's infinite. Absolute. The first time that you look the absolute in the face, you will see the horror. The absolute eats everything. God is a history, everything falls in the abyss and reality reveals itself as nothing, empty, then you will know the horror. But there is something there, you. And you open your heart and your heart is the absolute light of existence, and that's everything, the absolute. End of the movie. Nothing really happens, everything is an empty hologram, but under any appearance, the absolute shines, and it's always the same. 

If everything is an empty hologram and the absolute always shines beneath appearances, how can we reconcile the profound sense of horror with the light of existence in our hearts?

 

[Spiritual Warfare]

8 hours ago, Ishanga said:

Absolute, i would say from how I understand it from an Experiential POV and researching it from many Indian masters, Absolute is a non physical realm of Potential, its all about Oneness, Completeness, Absolute, Eternal, Infinite, and all these Grand words, but if You look at simply, its all Potential and Possibility, so from that, we here on this dual material planet have to exist as a part of the Potential that exists, so existence goes from Gross (us, everything on this planet, raw material, etc), to Subtle (the Absolute is the most subtle, for our purpose, Kundalini is the most subtle aspect of the physical I would say, everything after that is non physical, can't be measured), and we are here to play this game of duality and potential, we can live like Goats, or Gods, its up to us if we evoke our Free Will..

If the material world is also a part of the Absolute, can our goal truly be to transcend it, or is it rather to find the Absolute within both the physical and the subtle?

[Spiritual Warfare]

7 hours ago, Hojo said:

Eternity created time as a limitation

How can that be possible if time itself doesn’t exist?

[Spiritual Warfare]

7 hours ago, Yimpa said:

"I went to a restaurant that serves breakfast at any time. So I ordered French toast during the Renaissance."

-Steven Wright

I tried the same thing, but when I asked for an omelette in the future, they told me I’d have to wait.

[Spiritual Warfare]

3 hours ago, Princess Arabia said:

Maybe nothing is actually happening or moving and it all just appear to be. Maybe it's just one big friggin' magic trick and we've all been duped. Maybe it's like one giant TV screen with God outside looking in and watching the movie, but just like how on a TV screen it's all just appearing with no real movement and God is actually the TV and we are all inside the screen. Maybe God is imagining everything and there's nothing here. Maybe it's one big psychedelic party and God is trippin'; and the day the body dies is when he runs out of mushrooms or 5meo and when a baby is born is when he gets some more and starts trippin" again. I need a job.

If everything is just an illusion or a "magic trick," and nothing is really happening, then why do we experience growth, change, and consequences? If there’s no real movement, how do we account for the tangible ways our actions impact others, or the meaning we derive from relationships, creativity, and experiences? Could it be that what we perceive as "illusion" is actually just a different layer of reality, one that holds value even if it's part of a grander, cosmic play?

[LastThursday]

13 hours ago, Spiritual Warfare said:

Creation inherently involves some form of transformation, which presupposes the existence of time.

I think there's two ways to think about time. The conventional way is "block time", where events are ordered in a linear way like on a calendar. The other is "instantaneous time", where reality changes moment to moment. The two are quite different.

Eternity would then be an infinite extension of block time. Block time has the sense of being permanent and unchanging, once events have happened they are forever fixed and immutable. You could even imagine events in the future already being pre-determined as a consequence of events in the past.

Instantaneous time would be like a very thin sliver of block time. Nothing is fixed or remembered, as soon as something happens it's forgotten and there is no pre-determined future. Since there is no block there is no past or future, just now. 

In a way the two are opposites of each other, block time is unchanging and eternal, instantaneous time is always changing and ephemeral.

In my experience instantaneous time seems to be the correct interpretation and block time is a fantasy. Which if true, would mean that transformation is a feature of reality: time is presupposed from the existence of transformation.