Leo , You said In your PM Episode , that you have changed your approach ? Details pls

[Past-Philosopher-562]

Hey Leo,

I’ve been following your work, and in your last episode, you talked about narrowing your niche and guiding us towards Spiral Dynamics Tier 2, construct awareness, and metarationality. It sounds like an amazing journey! Your episode on post-modernism was fantastic.

I have a couple of questions. Since everything seems to hinge on the Spiral Dynamics stages and the 9 Stages of Ego Development, do you think it’s more effective to use the principles you discuss to transcend or integrate these stages, rather than diving into each episode separately?

For example, should I assess where I am in both Spiral Dynamics and the ego development stages, and then apply relevant principles from your episodes to integrate and transcend these stages holistically? Is this the approach others are taking?

Also, could insights from episodes like the Psychology of Being Wrong and life traps help identify what’s blocking progress in our current stage? And then, once we see results, use other episodes and psychological principles to move forward with you guys toward other stages ? - 

I’m coming from a purple culture with some blue influences and a few orange institutions, but no green.

Thanks!

[Past-Philosopher-562]

@Leo Gura

[Leo Gura]

It is not clear to me what you are asking.

Using SD and 9 Stages model you should know where you are and what the next stage is for you. This then gives you a good idea of what to work towards and which traps to avoid.

Edited September 4 by Leo Gura

[Past-Philosopher-562]

@Leo Gura Yes . Since you are already leading people somewhere into metarationality , and Tier 2 thinking and all the episodes you have that are practical or have understanding feature into them helps the audience to reach to tier 2 , then I thought I should focus on Development psychology videos since that is what you are trying to teach people to move towards . 

I wasted a bit time studying Practical episodes independently, when I should have understood that they should help me move to the second stage with , in SD and 9 Stages model . 

[Leo Gura]

@Past-Philosopher-562 Dude, you gotta do what is right for you, not what I am doing with my channel in general.

Think independently. Pick and choose videos from my work which apply to your situation, values, and goals.

Edited September 4 by Leo Gura

[NoSelfSelf]

15 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@Past-Philosopher-562 Dude, you gotta do what is right for you, not what I am doing with my channel in general.

Think independently.

Exactly,its not a cult but unfortunately people think its best to follow someone else that they look up to, which is dangerous.

[Nemra]

@NoSelfSelf, if you position yourself as a leader, then followers will gather around you.

[NoSelfSelf]

3 minutes ago, Nemra said:

@NoSelfSelf, if you position yourself as a leader, then followers will gather around you.

But the leader educates the followers that its not about the leader, its about them and their individual path,if the leader is not saying that then hes a cult leader.

[Nemra]

@NoSelfSelf, I agree, although it doesn't necessarily mean that it's a cult. I love it when leaders take responsibility to teach their followers to think for themselves.

Edited September 4 by Nemra

[NoSelfSelf]

@Nemra it is always a cult for the individual who has so called "cult mentality" no matter how you slice it, since the other person is looking something outside of themselves to tell him how to be,who to worship,how to think or thinking that leader is going to take you to where you need to go.

[Nemra]

@NoSelfSelf, I would say that it's an inspired and also blinded following.

This is more about having unrealistic expectations of others.

I think it's best to know when to learn from others and when not, which is quite difficult.

Edited September 4 by Nemra

[NoSelfSelf]

3 minutes ago, Nemra said:

@NoSelfSelf, 

I think it's best to know when to learn from others and when not, which is quite difficult.

Well its difficult because one doesnt know himself enough to know what to include in its own way for the personalized journey.

Its like one doesnt know who he is,so one goes to a group to give him that identity, then if that group is a cult it will program it to be as the leader wants him to be, because one didnt ever take a lead in its mind.

[Nemra]

3 minutes ago, NoSelfSelf said:

Its like one doesn't know who he is,so one goes to a group to give him that identity, then if that group is a cult it will program it to be as the leader wants him to be, because one didn't ever take a lead in its mind.

That could happen. You live and learn. But leaders are responsible for keeping their followers blinded.

[NoSelfSelf]

Just now, Nemra said:

That could happen. You live and learn. But leaders are responsible for keeping their followers blinded.

How i see it im responsible for being misguided ,what it look to me that blaming a leader is precisely why he can misguide me in the first place.

[Nemra]

@NoSelfSelf, I also agree with you in taking responsibility.

If someone abused you, you could say that you didn't know better at that time, but what the abuser did is on his/her.

Also, I think there's more to being a follower or leader. You could have the mindset of a leader but want to be led, or the opposite.

Edited September 4 by Nemra

[lostingenosmaze]

1 hour ago, NoSelfSelf said:

@Nemra it is always a cult for the individual who has so called "cult mentality" no matter how you slice it, since the other person is looking something outside of themselves to tell him how to be,who to worship,how to think or thinking that leader is going to take you to where you need to go.

I've always had this sentiment. This place ain't a cult, but that doesn't stop followers becoming parasocial "cultists" in their fanaticism. You think just because Leo said this is not a cult or idealogy means you're completely safe from being idealogical over this work yourself? Bah!

[TheAlchemist]

5 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

It is not clear to me what you are asking.

Using SD and 9 Stages model you should know where you are and what the next stage is for you. This then gives you a good idea of what to work towards and which traps to avoid.

Wouldn't a postmodernist be highly skeptical of these stage theories like SD and 9 Stages? Aren't they a sort of grand meta-narrative that many of us here accept as true? If we apply the process of deconstruction to these stage theories, what remains?

I'm curious because it seems like these stage theories aren't being put through the filter of deconstruction as much, they seem to remain as a kind of meta-narrative, where postmodernism is seen to be as just one stage in this grand arch. Postmodernism is seen as valuable, but partly only as a stepping stone to higher stages.

It seems to me like a postmodern view would be highly skeptical of such narratives. Yet still, there could be a way forward from postmodernism, but it's hard for me to imagine it's something that can be modelled in such ways as these stage theories suggest. 

[Leo Gura]

6 hours ago, TheAlchemist said:

Wouldn't a postmodernist be highly skeptical of these stage theories like SD and 9 Stages? Aren't they a sort of grand meta-narrative that many of us here accept as true?

Yes.

That's one of the limits of PM.

But also, you should question SD and ultimately see how it is a construct and how it limits your mind.

SD can be taken from grand narrative to micro-narrative, one of many.

Edited September 4 by Leo Gura

[Starlight321]

4 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Yes.

That's one of the limits of PM.

But also, you should question SD and ultimately see how it is a construct and how it limits your mind.

SD can be taken from grand narrative to micro-narrative, one of many.

@Leo Gurayes, you are totally right about this. I've a friend how is totally pm and he's highly skeptical about those models and after watching your new video complained about you diplaying pm as some monolithic thing. He also argued against your model with faucoult