There is one mystery science and philosophy can not answer

[Reciprocality]

It is not the question why particular things exists and it is not the question of how particular things relate to other particular things.

It is not the question of why there is something as opposed to nothing.

 

It is the mystery of why the whole thing that exists, which we call the universe, begun the way it did and not in another way, even if the only alternatives are quantitatively different (how could they be anything else?).

Edited September 3 by Reciprocality

[Reciprocality]

I wrote this in the hope that the reader would want to investigate why someone would make the claim that the former questions can actually be answered, and that they will see thereby far more clearly why the last question is the existential question.

[Leo Gura]

The reason is something like: the universe is how it is and not otherwise because it is the most intelligent way it could be.

If it was otherwise it wouldn't be as intelligent.

You would need to infinitely conscious and Omniscient to understand universe's structure in detail.

But you can realize that it is maximally intelligent.

Edited September 3 by Leo Gura

[Spiritual Warfare]

Just now, Leo Gura said:

The reason is something like: the universe is how it is and not otherwise because it is the most intelligent way it could be.

If it was otherwise it wouldn't be as intelligent.

I value this response, but who ultimately decides what defines greater intelligence in comparison to something else?

[Leo Gura]

4 minutes ago, Spiritual Warfare said:

I value this response, but who ultimately decides what defines greater intelligence in comparison to something else?

Intelligence.

There is no way around this. It is circular. You need intelligence to see intelligence.

The only one who can appreciate God's intelligence is God. A human cannot.

So, when you become God, only then will you appreciate the infinite intelligence of your structure (the universe).

But you could just walk outside, look at a humming bird and see the sheer intelligence in its design. This is one tiny step towards seeing God's intelligence.

Edited September 3 by Leo Gura

[Spiritual Warfare]

3 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Intelligence.

There is no way around this. It is circular. You need intelligence to see intelligence.

The only one who can appreciate God's intelligence is God. A human cannot.

So, when you become God, only then will you appreciate the infinite intelligence of your structure (the universe).

But you could just walk outside, look at a humming bird and see the sheer intelligence in its design. This is one tiny step towards seeing God's intelligence.

That's a valid point, but the real question is: how can one be certain that they have truly attained a divine state without falling victim to deception and making erroneous judgments?

[Leo Gura]

14 minutes ago, Spiritual Warfare said:

That's a valid point, but the real question is: how can one be certain that they have truly attained a divine state without falling victim to deception and making erroneous judgments?

The only way is to just be more conscious and more intelligent.

And you have to own your own sovereignty of mind.

If you can't stop doubting yourself then you will never reach God, because God is beyond self-doubt. You have to ultimately recongize doubt as itself a self-deception.

Edited September 3 by Leo Gura

[Spiritual Warfare]

1 minute ago, Leo Gura said:

The only way is to just be more conscious and more intelligent.

And you have to own your own sovereignty of mind.

If you can't stop doubting yourself then you will never reach God, because God is beyond self-doubt.

Your words resonate deeply (;

[tuku747]

As far as I can recon, for a circle to be a circle, it's circumference must always, always, always be ~3.14 times its diameter. How could it be any other way?

Edited September 3 by tuku747

[LastThursday]

47 minutes ago, Reciprocality said:

begun the way it did and not in another way

If you keep asking why, eventually you exhaust yourself and realise that everything you experience is arbitrary. It could have been any number of different ways and still worked (say a self-aware infinite void). Or a different way to look at it, is that there is ultimately no meaning to the universe. It's true that there appears to be great intelligence in its content (experience, qualia, material, whatever), but that intelligence itself is arbitrary even if it's intricate and infinite.

It's also quite possible that the universe never began, it's always been churning away.

[Ishanga]

2 hours ago, Spiritual Warfare said:

I value this response, but who ultimately decides what defines greater intelligence in comparison to something else?

No body in particular decides, and its not about a Comparison, because the Intelligence that is the Universe and Reality is not a Calculating type of Intelligence, its a Creator type of Intelligence.. The simplest way to look at it this, Tell me the complete make up of an Atom, what is is exactly, how it is there to be, what created it and exactly how does it work?

Can we explain, can modern science explain it completely, does modern science have a complete understanding of the Atom? I use the Atom as a simple example since it is one of the smallest objects in existence, now if we do not have a complete understanding of the smallest object, then what does that mean? It means the sophistication of the Atom is beyond our understanding, so therefore it must be very very complex, doesn't that translate to a sort of intelligence? To me it does, whatever created existence as we know it, created very small things like the atom and very large things like planets, stars and huge Galaxies, so we cannot nor ever will understand it in any significant way, its too complex, sophisticated, intelligent, and I venture to say Alive!

Reality, God, Absolute is not Love or anything like that, its a Grand Intelligence, that allows the Wind to blow a leaf around in the air right in front of our eyes, if You are intelligent You will Realize this is a Miracle! Everything, including Yourself, is an Absolute Miracle!

Edited September 3 by Ishanga

[Someone here]

8 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

The reason is something like: the universe is how it is and not otherwise because it is the most intelligent way it could be.

If it was otherwise it wouldn't be as intelligent.

You would need to infinitely conscious and Omniscient to understand universe's structure in detail.

But you can realize that it is maximally intelligent.

Leo ..why is the universe so complex?  Not intelligent but complex..like literally my little lamp in my house is composed of copper wires and iron chips which came from some factory in some distant country which took hundreds and thousands of engineers and labor workers just to get me this little lamp.  And ofcourse none of this were possible without the sun and the water and the soil etc. It seems like everything is interrelated in infinite cycles . Like literally you can trace back your teapot to the big bang and even before where there Is nothing but formless  godhead . Why is that ? I don't really get it . It boggles my mind thinking about the complexity and intelligence of reality . Just oh my fucking god !

[Loveeee]

9 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

The reason is something like: the universe is how it is and not otherwise because it is the most intelligent way it could be.

If it was otherwise it wouldn't be as intelligent.

You would need to infinitely conscious and Omniscient to understand universe's structure in detail.

But you can realize that it is maximally intelligent.

Objection

Your name could be Teo and that wouldn't diminish intelligence 

Or could it ? My explanation is that the idea that the present moment could be different is just another idea, a concept, not actually true 

I discussed this very question a few weeks ago 

What do you think ?

 

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, Someone here said:

Why is that ? I don't really get it

Because that's the most intelligent way for it to be.

When you realize consciousness literally has no limits, then you realize you can have infinite intelligent design for free. And when you have it for free, why would you settle for anything less?

[Someone here]

52 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Because that's the most intelligent way for it to be.

When you realize consciousness literally has no limits, then you realize you can have infinite intelligent design for free. And when you have it for free, why would you settle for anything less?

Great! So you are saying it doesn't cost God a penny to compose an infinitely intelligent complex system (like this universe) and manifest it directly out of thin air . And since that is the case ..then here we are in this universe!. Did I understand this correctly? 

Because im asking why is that the case in the first place? Am i just pushing back the proplem one level and this is answered by infinity and groundlesness ? I mean If you take a simple object. A rock. This rock alone can be looked at in many different ways which can get extremely complex. What's the composition of the rock? What's the history behind it? How was it is formed? How did it end up at this exact spot? You can even put it under a microscope and look at how its particles are made up. Then furtherdown work out its atoms. Then you can go smaller than even an atom. And when does it end? 

[RendHeaven]

11 hours ago, Reciprocality said:

It is the mystery of why the whole thing that exists, which we call the universe, begun the way it did and not in another way, even if the only alternatives are quantitatively different (how could they be anything else?).

You're right, this is a domain beyond conventional science or philosophy.

You are inquiring into cosmic design principle, which is only comprehended by Consciousness as Consciousness.

As Leo says in his answers above: Simply become more Conscious. And you will have your answer.

[Ishanga]

2 hours ago, Someone here said:

Great! So you are saying it doesn't cost God a penny to compose an infinitely intelligent complex system (like this universe) and manifest it directly out of thin air . And since that is the case ..then here we are in this universe!. Did I understand this correctly? 

Because im asking why is that the case in the first place? Am i just pushing back the proplem one level and this is answered by infinity and groundlesness ? I mean If you take a simple object. A rock. This rock alone can be looked at in many different ways which can get extremely complex. What's the composition of the rock? What's the history behind it? How was it is formed? How did it end up at this exact spot? You can even put it under a microscope and look at how its particles are made up. Then furtherdown work out its atoms. Then you can go smaller than even an atom. And when does it end? 

In my observation Your question, a Why question, is only coming from Your Intellect, it want to break things down, discern btwn this and that, separate, divide up the Universe, dissect it to find the answers, it doesn't work like that, You won't find the answers Your looking for... From what I know, everything breaks down from Gross to Subtle, our bodies are Grossness, Atoms are much more Subtle, Energy is even more Subtle, Kundalini even more so, so it goes like that, but there are no details to know, and even if You knew them they would not help You in anyway because another Intellectual question will arise, it turns into a cycle of really not knowing anything!

[Breakingthewall]

13 hours ago, Spiritual Warfare said:

I value this response, but who ultimately decides what defines greater intelligence in comparison to something else?

Nobody decides it, if it could be more intelligent, would be more intelligent. The infinity is perfection, that's why it's intelligence, intelligence is a consequence of the infinity. 

[Davino]

14 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You have to ultimately recognize doubt as itself a self-deception.

You fucking blew my brains out here. I contemplated deeply doubt but never made the connection with it being a mechanism of self deception.

This is extremely profound 

Edited September 4 by Davino

[Dan502]

To me it seems a bit like when a baby sees its reflection in a mirror, and then says to the mirror "Mirror?! Why do you look like a baby!?