Fake vs Real Thinking

[Carbon]

Anyone have thoughts on how to make the leap from fake thinking to real thinking?
 

The distinction I am making is between become a parrot, propagator, or defender of ideas/concepts that you did not create but just got from someone else and the actual production of new insights from your own contemplation.
 

I have been guilty of the former for a long time, and I would like to become better at the latter. Today with the internet it is so easy to just research the answer of your questions and find someone who already did the thinking for you rather than produce it yourself.
 

Without real thinking, no actual progress gets made in the world. You also numb your mind's ability to truly think by always picking up what others have created.
 

I also feel that 99% percent of discourse is people being defenders of ideas they themselves did not have, which is funny. Memetic organisms fighting each other through human proxies. I have also been guilty of this.

[NoSelfSelf]

Yeah thats what learning Game is about being your own everything creating your own from scratch..

[LastThursday]

You're right that 99% of ideas are not new, but it's not all bad. To progress forward you need something to push off of. New ideas aren't generated in a vacuum, you need existing ideas to spark from. And if you want really good and creative new ideas, then you should have mastered the existing ideas first.

The problem I see is that existing ideas are not understood well enough, and people parrot their superficial understanding to others, and they get propagated as half-baked. But it's to be expected, most of the best ideas are complex and nuanced and require effort to understand, which most people don't want to take on. Some ideas are so "out there" that only one person may ever come up with it (e.g. Einstein's Relativity). It's genuinely hard.

[Evelyna]

It is all part of our experience here on earth, as  @LastThursday  said ''you need existing ideas to spark from''. ''Something'' always gets created from or through ''something'' else.

[Carbon]

52 minutes ago, LastThursday said:

then you should have mastered the existing ideas first.

Yes. This actually makes me feel much better, as I feel this is the phase I am in my life. Trying to absorb and deeply understand what’s already here. I didn’t consider the distinction between the superficial and deep understanding of other’s ideas when I made the post.

[rachMiel]

I am with Whitehead and the process thinkers on this: Everything we think and do is grounded in the past, individual and collective. Every event arises from the totality of every previous event. But along with this dependency on the past, every present event has something truly new in it. 

[Norbert Somogyi]

Interesting how I've been thinking about this lately, realizing more and more how guilty I am of this. 

I've come across a reddit post listing a few foundational books which I find suitable for myself to begin this endeavor (which I've been putting off for years, self-deception is a bitch). You can find it here

There are also a couple such books on Leo's book list as well as videos. Videos such as this or this. Finally journaling and contemplating can be really helpful tools as well.

[Human Mint]

4 hours ago, Carbon said:

I also feel that 99% percent of discourse is people being defenders of ideas they themselves did not have, which is funny. Memetic organisms fighting each other through human proxies. I have also been guilty of this.

I don't see this a bad thing at all. Neither a good thing honestly... It is the underlying mechanics of us social creatures. In steping back and seeing it you are already a step ahead. It's like, you could be the most intelligent, but at the end your are going to follow the crowd.

As stated, we always create anything based on what we experience, so the notion of "new thoughts" is already misleading and not the full picture. Embrace the fact that you will always take from the exterior to build your own. No shame on that. Instead you should be encouraged to do so.

In the other hand, it is as important to create the infrastructure as it is to make the thinking... You still need a school building to make the thinking inside the classrooms. Well, nowdays schools are outdated, nowdays the real G is the internet. In that sense, being a construction/technician worker is as important as being a groundbreaking, paradigm shifter researcher.

Society is much more than a copy-paste.

Edited August 30 by Human Mint

[Princess Arabia]

Nothing is all new. No idea, concept or insight belongs to anyone. These aren't things that one possesses. The egoic mind loves to claim things as it's own, when, in fact, it's just information recycled and acquired from the knowledge one has already acquired which stems from generation and generations and generation dug up from the memory bank and being recycled. One cannot come up with anything entirely new because it's all coming from information that has already been stored. 

No such thing as fake thinking. It's just thoughts arising. One can change their thought patterns and learn how to critically think for themselves but it's still from information stored, state of consciousness and level of awareness. Your intuition can guide you and one can raise their frequency to adopt a more advanced mode of thought patterns because certain thoughts doesn't align with certain frequencies. If there's a particular thing one is trying to accomplish through contemplation, that can also be beneficial using the mind. Random thoughts will appear, but one can structure their mind in a way where they're only focused on the thoughts that align with their goals and doesn't give any emotional reaction to the ones that doesn't, which is what charges them and gives them power.

Edited August 30 by Princess Arabia

[Human Mint]

Real thinking is passing through a lot of different ideas and finding flaws thanks to your freshness of thought. We need people to engage in existing ideas because they will always see different things.

[UnbornTao]

Experience what's actual and have insights.

Create a thought you've never had before for yourself, this new experience is what real thinking entails.

Edited September 12 by UnbornTao

[Letho]

Relationality.