Does anyone know a lot about Jesus? I have some questions

[PurpleTree]

Not that it matters really 

 

but according to scripture 

 

did jesus believe in free will?

did jesus believe in guilt and responsibility? Or did he believe we are inherently non-guilty?

 

[gettoefl]

to be awake is to see that no sin is ever possible (because separation is impossible)

(if unseparate you would be sinning against yourself which of course nobody will do)

if i see that you have sinned it simply means i projected those actions onto you and judged you for what i in fact did

i must forgive myself first for my silly projections and thereby i can walk up to you and say all your sins are forgiven

Edited August 26, 2024 by gettoefl

[Keryo Koffa]

Jesus called people to repent and appealed for moral choice, inviting people to follow Him (e.g., Matthew 4:19, Mark 8:34)
In parables like the Prodigal Son (Luke 15:11-32), Jesus illustrates personal choice and the possibility of a return to God.
All that inherently implies the freedom of choice.

"I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sister will be subject to judgment" (Matthew 5:22).
Jesus emphasized people's responsibility for their actions.

Acknowledging human sinfulness, Jesus emphasized forgiveness, God’s grace, and the possibility of redemption. (e.g., Matthew 4:17)
In the story of the woman caught in adultery (John 8:1-11), He did not condemn her but told her to "go and sin no more,"
He recognized that people are guilty of wrongdoing, but offered a path to forgiveness.

Jesus did not explicitly teach the doctrine of original sin, which was later developed by theologians like Augustine.
He acknowledged that people's need for salvation (e.g., John 3:16-17).
He did not teach that people are inherently non-guilty.
Rather they can be forgiven and made righteous through faith and repentance.

He preached hope, inviting people to repent and receive God's grace.

[Spiritual Warfare]

Jesus often spoke about the importance of making choices and following God's will. An example is in Matthew 7:13-14, where he says:
Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it."

This suggests that Jesus believed in the human ability to choose their path.

Regarding guilt and responsibility, Jesus frequently preached about repentance and forgiveness. In John 8:11, when Jesus encounters the woman accused of adultery, he says:
Neither do I condemn you. Go now and leave your life of sin."

Jesus also spoke about human nature and the need for repentance. In Mark 2:17, he says:
It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners."

 

[Keryo Koffa]

11 minutes ago, MarioGabrielJ said:

In John 8:11, when Jesus encounters the woman accused of adultery, he says: Neither do I condemn you. Go now and leave your life of sin."

31 minutes ago, Keryo Koffa said:

In the story of the woman caught in adultery (John 8:1-11), He did not condemn her but told her to "go and sin no more,"

@MarioGabrielJ Toché 😁🥰

[Spiritual Warfare]

Just now, Keryo Koffa said:

@MarioGabrielJ Toché 😁🥰

I love you

[Atb210201]

All Abrahamic Religions say you have free will and therefore you are responsible if you did something wrong and you should accept your responsibility as a free willer who has freedom of choice

And if I did something wrong I should feel responsible and guilty about it

That's where there can be some potential for me to make it right

Edited August 27, 2024 by Atb210201

[Yimpa]

This is what happens when the message of Jesus is corrupted

 

[Ramu]

This isn't a site for theism

[DLH]

The crucifixion of Jesus occurred in 1st-century Judaea, most likely in AD 30 or AD 33.   "Wikipeda."

Like the rest of the New Testament, the four gospels were written in Greek.[32] The Gospel of Mark probably dates from c. AD 66–70,[5] Matthew and Luke around AD 85–90,[6] and John AD 90–110.[7] Despite the traditional ascriptions, most scholars hold that all four are anonymous[note 1] and most scholars agree that none were written by eyewitnesses.[8] A few scholars defend the traditional ascriptions or attributions, but for a variety of reasons, the majority of scholars have abandoned this view or hold it only tenuously.[34][33]   "Wikipeda."

The Gospel of Mark was written approximately 33 to 37 years after Jesus death, Matthew and Luke, approximately 50 plus years after Jesus death, and John approximately 60 plus years after Jesus death.

Fact!   Mark, Matthew, Luke and John never had the opportunity to hear one word from Jesus directly!

It is also widely believed that all four were to young, or not even born during Jesus life time! 

Nothing has ever been found, written down on paper or otherwise from Jesus that Mark, Matthew, Luke and John wrote! 

It's all hearsay and word of mouth beliefs passed down from multiple people over the years!

Food for thought!

  

Edited August 27, 2024 by DLH

[ICURBlessings]

One of the most powerful way of learning Jesus true teachings in far more details than the Bible:

Spend a few years studying A Course in Miracles

Here is the first Page:

1. This is a course in miracles. ²It is a required course. ³Only the time you take it is voluntary. ⁴Free will does not mean that you can establish the curriculum. ⁵It means only that you can elect what you want to take at a given time. ⁶The course does not aim at teaching the meaning of love, for that is beyond what can be taught. ⁷It does aim, however, at removing the blocks to the awareness of love’s presence, which is your natural inheritance. ⁸The opposite of love is fear, but what is all-encompassing can have no opposite.

2. This course can therefore be summed up very simply in this way:

Nothing real can be threatened.
Nothing unreal exists.

Herein lies the peace of God.

 

[El Zapato]

5 hours ago, ICURBlessings said:

One of the most powerful way of learning Jesus true teachings in far more details than the Bible:

Spend a few years studying A Course in Miracles

Here is the first Page:

1. This is a course in miracles. ²It is a required course. ³Only the time you take it is voluntary. ⁴Free will does not mean that you can establish the curriculum. ⁵It means only that you can elect what you want to take at a given time. ⁶The course does not aim at teaching the meaning of love, for that is beyond what can be taught. ⁷It does aim, however, at removing the blocks to the awareness of love’s presence, which is your natural inheritance. ⁸The opposite of love is fear, but what is all-encompassing can have no opposite.

2. This course can therefore be summed up very simply in this way:

Nothing real can be threatened.
Nothing unreal exists.

Herein lies the peace of God.

 

I read that book, thinking I would hear an explanation about the disappearance of the universe.  I wasn't disappointed, just surprised.

[El Zapato]

On 8/26/2024 at 7:52 AM, PurpleTree said:

Not that it matters really 

 

but according to scripture 

 

did jesus believe in free will?

did jesus believe in guilt and responsibility? Or did he believe we are inherently non-guilty?

 

I think Jesus was quoted as saying that all sins were equal in God's eyes.  It makes sense if one considers our experiences as only facsimiles of reality.  Lessons to be learned for progression to a higher consciousness.

[ICURBlessings]

5 minutes ago, El Zapato said:

I read that book, thinking I would hear an explanation about the disappearance of the universe.  I wasn't disappointed, just surprised.

What  book are you saying you read, ACIM or "The disappearance of the universe"?

[ICURBlessings]

On 8/26/2024 at 8:52 AM, PurpleTree said:

Not that it matters really 

 

but according to scripture 

 

did jesus believe in free will?

did jesus believe in guilt and responsibility? Or did he believe we are inherently non-guilty?

 

I recommend you learn to distinguish the Bible from Jesus - 99% of the people that are claiming this and that about Jesus teachings are actually talking about the Bibles teachings.

I have studied the Early History of Christianity, and the history of the Bible and to a much lesser degree the History of Judaism. I also have been a student of ACIM for well over 20 years. So I am in a position to know his teachings and to differentiate them from the Bible's teachings.

One basic important fact about the Bible is the differences between the Old Testament and the New Testament. Only the New Testament speaks of the teachings of Jesus. If you look more or less closely, it is very obvious that there is a fundamental clash between the Old and New Testament - which explains why Christianity has such a tyrannical history.

What DLH says in his post above is generally correct - maybe a few details are omitted - but the general gist is factual. The Bible represent a series of books elected by a group of early 'Christian' as 'proper' to the Church of Christianity. How this group of Christians became the dominant group is very significant to how Christianity and the Bible was shaped. The choice of incorporating the Old-Testament (Which is literally a section of the Jewish Bible) was motivated by political interest. You have to remember that 99% of the early Christians were Jews. And Christianity was considered a newer sect of Judaism. The Gnostics (a very large group of early-Christians would of never incorporated the Jewish Bible into Christianity because of how it clashes with Jesus's teachings.

The Gnostic were disseminated by the group that form the Church over a long period of time. It was so difficult to disseminate the Gnostic that at the end if you were caught being involve as a Gnostic you were killed. It is interesting how to Gnostic movement was not entirely disseminate, as during the Middle Ages it resurfaced and reformed itself. But again it was disseminate by the Church.

Edited August 27, 2024 by ICURBlessings

[ICURBlessings]

On 8/26/2024 at 8:52 AM, PurpleTree said:

 

 

did jesus believe in free will?

did jesus believe in guilt and responsibility? Or did he believe we are inherently non-guilty?

 

Now that you have a hint of my background I will answer your questions:

did jesus believe in free will?

• Free Will is not a question of belief but of "understanding" of 2 Basic attributes of God. His Will and Freedom which is inherent to Love. Jesus would say a will that is not free could not come from a Loving Creator or a Creator Who is Love.

did jesus believe in guilt and responsibility?

• Guilt and responsibility are completely different things. Jesus explains that Guilt is a fundamental effect to the experience of the Separation. The Separation is the state of Consciousness were the Absolute becomes hidden via its replacement with the experience where Consciousness is immerged within Perception.
• Jesus teaches that you are 100% responsible for everything that happens to you - he would explain this as being responsible for the entire experience that you have of Perception. In ACIM you learn how shift your experience of fear to one of Love - both states as within Perception. 

Or did he believe we are inherently non-guilty?

• Jesus teaches that you were Created by God Not-Guilty and that this fundamental Nature of your soul or Spirit is untouchable by sin or evil. Sin and evil, he teaches are products of the thought-system from which perception arises.

[PurpleTree]

thanks guys mostly great answers 

I was wondering about nonduality/all is one and jesus teachings etc grew up non religious 

was listening to this recently  

probably will listen to some of these later

 

[Keryo Koffa]

@ICURBlessings

I summed up ChatGPT's sum-up of ACIM
Does it accurately represent the gist of it?

The perceived sensory world is an illusion ("dream"/"ego world")
True reality is the realm of spirit, an eternal formless unity with God

The ego believes in separation, creating fear, guilt, and conflict.
The spirit represents our true, unified nature: love, peace, forgiveness.

Forgiveness recognizes that all wrongs are part of the illusion.
True forgiveness leads to ego-dissolution and return to God.

Miracles shift perception from fear to love and heal the mind.

Atonement corrects the belief in separation.
It's already accomplished; our task is to accept it.
Jesus is the role model, having fully transcended ego.

We must relinquish ego-distorted perception for true knowledge.

Inner peace is aligning with the Holy Spirit and releasing the ego's hold.
Peace is our natural state, obscured only by ego-based thoughts.

The Holy Spirit acts as a guide, helping individuals reinterpret experiences.
It is the voice of God, contrasting the ego’s, and serves as the internal teacher.

God is depicted as pure love, and creation is an extension of God’s love.
God did not create the world we see, as it is part of the illusion
Our true home is in the eternal, formless reality of God’s love.

365 practical daily life-lessons aim to shift thoughts, reprogramming the mind.

Relationships are opportunities for healing and spiritual growth by recognizing oneness.
Salvation is seen as awakening from the dream of separation and returning the awareness.

Awakening is inevitable for all, as it reflects the true nature of reality.

ACIM presents a non-dualistic view and emphasizes love and forgiveness.
The radical perceptive shift encourages readers to see beyond physicality.

[ICURBlessings]

2 hours ago, Keryo Koffa said:

@ICURBlessings

I summed up ChatGPT's sum-up of ACIM
Does it accurately represent the gist of it?

The perceived sensory world is an illusion ("dream"/"ego world")
True reality is the realm of spirit, an eternal formless unity with God

The ego believes in separation, creating fear, guilt, and conflict.
The spirit represents our true, unified nature: love, peace, forgiveness.

Forgiveness recognizes that all wrongs are part of the illusion.
True forgiveness leads to ego-dissolution and return to God.

Miracles shift perception from fear to love and heal the mind.

Atonement corrects the belief in separation.
It's already accomplished; our task is to accept it.
Jesus is the role model, having fully transcended ego.

We must relinquish ego-distorted perception for true knowledge.

Inner peace is aligning with the Holy Spirit and releasing the ego's hold.
Peace is our natural state, obscured only by ego-based thoughts.

The Holy Spirit acts as a guide, helping individuals reinterpret experiences.
It is the voice of God, contrasting the ego’s, and serves as the internal teacher.

God is depicted as pure love, and creation is an extension of God’s love.
God did not create the world we see, as it is part of the illusion
Our true home is in the eternal, formless reality of God’s love.

365 practical daily life-lessons aim to shift thoughts, reprogramming the mind.

Relationships are opportunities for healing and spiritual growth by recognizing oneness.
Salvation is seen as awakening from the dream of separation and returning the awareness.

Awakening is inevitable for all, as it reflects the true nature of reality.

ACIM presents a non-dualistic view and emphasizes love and forgiveness.
The radical perceptive shift encourages readers to see beyond physicality.

@Keryo Koffa All statements are correct - No errors. Of Course these are statements in need of explanations to be understood in accord with ACIM's teachings.

Thanks for this AI search - good job!

[Keryo Koffa]

28 minutes ago, ICURBlessings said:

@Keryo Koffa All statements are correct - No errors. Of Course these are statements in need of explanations to be understood in accord with ACIM's teachings.

Thanks for this AI search - good job!

Glad you like it, what I'm really trying to do, is to connect the dots across multiple teaching
And ACIM seems deeply connected with Jesus' message, Ra's Law of One and Non-Duality
According to Chat's summary, it has a strong Ego Illusion focus reminiscent of Leo's Solipsism
It also mentions God through the Holy Spirit a lot, I'd like to learn more about such a guide
I am not sure, however, how deeply it connects to Christianity and conventional heaven ideas
I'd also like to explore how it connects to NDEs and what existence looks like beyond the Ego
I've yet to deepen my understanding of other books & models like Wilber to see how they relate

Edited August 27, 2024 by Keryo Koffa