God paradox?

[Spiritual Warfare]

2 minutes ago, Ishanga said:

It depends on how one wants to portray it, in the culture of today Light is positive, Dark is negative, but this is culturally based ideology.

Existentially, when we look up in the sky, the way our vision is set up, we notice the stars more than the blackness/darkness, but in reality there is more darkness than light, as with everything, even an atom which is mostly empty space, that space is dark..so most of reality that we can perceive is dark, not light, light is the absence of dark, and light comes then goes, darkness always stays...

You make a very compelling argument. I agree that our perception of light as positive and dark as negative is deeply rooted in cultural and historical contexts. Existentially, when we look up at the sky, we are naturally drawn to the stars because of their brightness, but it is true that the majority of the universe is darkness.

Darkness can be seen as the fundamental state, while light is a temporary deviation. This can be applied to many aspects of reality, as you mentioned with atoms being mostly empty space. Light is like a temporary presence that breaks the darkness, but darkness is always there as a constant backdrop.

Personally, I find this duality between light and darkness fascinating. It reminds us that our perceptions and values are often constructed and can change depending on our perspective. Both light and darkness have their unique properties and meanings, and they exist in a dynamic balance with each other.

[hugoalfven]

Maybe God is a sadistic, masochistic, psychopathic monster, who really knows. Sometimes it feels like God isn't love at all or maybe doesn't exist at all.

[Spiritual Warfare]

Just now, hugoalfven said:

Maybe God is a sadistic, masochistic, psychopathic monster, who really knows. Sometimes it feels like God isn't love at all or maybe doesn't exist at all.

That’s strange that you said that, because you are in fact God

[Leo Gura]

4 minutes ago, Davino said:

How difficult it is for both to coexist?

I'm facing inmense challenges to excel at both. Something inside me still believes I can pull it off

Pretty difficult since most people cannot even do basic philosophical inquiry because they are so absorbed in survival.

You can do both if you prioritize your time well and don't screw around. You gotta get serious about each in turn. Set your goals and then work towards them.

Edited August 25 by Leo Gura

[Leo Gura]

1 minute ago, hugoalfven said:

Maybe God is a sadistic, masochistic, psychopathic monster, who really knows. Sometimes it feels like God isn't love at all or maybe doesn't exist at all.

God is Everything.

[Vibes]

5 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

You can't be at peace from the default human state of consciousness. A change in your state is the missing key.

So only free in high states and / or dead. And since we can't stay in higher levels, I'll struggle until the day I die.

[Ishanga]

1 minute ago, MarioGabrielJ said:

You make a very compelling argument. I agree that our perception of light as positive and dark as negative is deeply rooted in cultural and historical contexts. Existentially, when we look up at the sky, we are naturally drawn to the stars because of their brightness, but it is true that the majority of the universe is darkness.

Darkness can be seen as the fundamental state, while light is a temporary deviation. This can be applied to many aspects of reality, as you mentioned with atoms being mostly empty space. Light is like a temporary presence that breaks the darkness, but darkness is always there as a constant backdrop.

Personally, I find this duality between light and darkness fascinating. It reminds us that our perceptions and values are often constructed and can change depending on our perspective. Both light and darkness have their unique properties and meanings, and they exist in a dynamic balance with each other.

What comes first Perception or Experience? I think they are related, if Your Experience is Blissful, would that change Your Perception, as well if Your Perception is Enhanced, via no identifications of any kind filtering You, would that not change how You Perceive? 

 

[Leo Gura]

3 minutes ago, Vibes said:

So only free in high states and / or dead. And since we can't stay in higher levels, I'll struggle until the day I die.

You could have some permanent shifts in your state. Be open to that.

But also, perfect freedom isn't necessary. 99.999% of humans live without such freedom and many of them are reasonably happy.

Don't go chasing some God-perfection, enjoy life now.

Edited August 25 by Leo Gura

[Ishanga]

1 minute ago, Vibes said:

So only free in high states and / or dead. And since we can't stay in higher levels, I'll struggle until the day I die.

Why can't You stay in high states? We are meant to be in high states, everything about us is enhanced when in high states, but maybe for other reasons, like situational circumstances, place of residence or something else is holding You back?

[Davino]

1 minute ago, Leo Gura said:

Pretty difficult since most people cannot even do basic philosophical inquiry because they are so absorbed in survival.

Yes, I understand. We are not free from it either

2 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

You can do both if you prioritize your time well and don't screw around. You gotta get serious about each in turn. Set your goals and them work towards them.

Yes, I get it. I need to find a balance. Usually I oscilate, I get sucked in too much in God and then survival pulls me out and then I clean all that and when I can breathe I take a deep plunge again. I hope to stablish a good routine and honestly an evolution of myself to find harmony.

Just for context, I've been dealing with this my whole life. So your comment was like a clock alarm

[Vibes]

Just now, Ishanga said:

Why can't You stay in high states? We are meant to be in high states, everything about us is enhanced when in high states, but maybe for other reasons, like situational circumstances, place of residence or something else is holding You back?

I really doubt that you can be in a state that you see torture and cruelty as beautiful ways of God no matter what the circumstances. That's something beyond, not just a ligther way of seeing things and bullshitting yourself about it.

[Spiritual Warfare]

2 minutes ago, Ishanga said:

What comes first Perception or Experience? I think they are related, if Your Experience is Blissful, would that change Your Perception, as well if Your Perception is Enhanced, via no identifications of any kind filtering You, would that not change how You Perceive? 

 

Perception and experience are indeed closely intertwined. 

Perception can be thought of as the lens through which we interpret our experiences. If your experience is blissful, it can certainly alter your perception, making you more likely to see things in a positive light. Conversely, if your perception is enhanced and free from any biases or identifications, it can transform how you experience the world around you.

In a way, perception and experience feed into each other in a continuous loop. A blissful experience can lead to a more positive perception, which in turn can lead to more blissful experiences. Similarly, an enhanced perception can lead to richer and more meaningful experiences. So, they are both essential and mutually influential in shaping our understanding of reality. ♾️ 

[Ishanga]

14 minutes ago, Vibes said:

I really doubt that you can be in a state that you see torture and cruelty as beautiful ways of God no matter what the circumstances. That's something beyond, not just a ligther way of seeing things and bullshitting yourself about it.

Yes of course, I wasn't talking about being in situations like that, I'm just referring to Your statement of "And since we can't stay in higher levels, I'll struggle until the day I die", we can stay in Blissful states... If ppl can be in constant Depressed states, why can't ppl be in constant Blissful States, if one is possible the other has to be, its just a matter of maintaining it, but its natural for us to be in at the very least Peaceful state of Experience... Now even in war like messed up situations, one can maintain a sense of Peace.. Peace does not mean being a pacifists, it means Your inner experience is in a state of non resistance/acceptance to what is, its a place of no stress response and your at Ease (not lazy or lethargic), this brings about an enhancement in all areas of Your Capability, Intellectual, Physical, Emotional an Energetically as well, Depression does the opposite, so how do You want to be within Yourself when the shit is hitting the fan and its a warzone outside?? You choose, I choose to be at Peace within, then do what I have to do to make things better and more Empowering for all around Me!

Edited August 25 by Ishanga

[bambi]

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Here's an extremely simple proof that will stump any theist:

1) God exists

2) Child rape exists

3) God is Creator of the Universe

Conclusion: God created child rape.

There is zero argument with this logic. The only thing you can do is to deny that God exists.

But God obviously exists.

Now, here's the trick you're missing: you honestly believe that you are wise enough to judge God's Creation.

There are only two possibilies here:

1) You are wrong for judging God.

2) God is wrong for creating child rape.

Which do you think it is?

Nah this isnt correct at all

1) God is all that exists

2) Child rape exists

3) God can exist in anifninte number of forms, from highly selfish to selfless

Conclusion: selfish instatiations of God enacts rape

The type of monolithic entity you propose would be nothing more then a passive possibility machine. You could say God enabled rape, but that isnt the same as causing it, thata deeep fallacy you are making

[Leo Gura]

16 minutes ago, Davino said:

Yes, I understand. We are not free from it either

Yes, I get it. I need to find a balance. Usually I oscilate, I get sucked in too much in God and then survival pulls me out and then I clean all that and when I can breathe I take a deep plunge again. I hope to stablish a good routine and honestly an evolution of myself to find harmony.

Just for context, I've been dealing with this my whole life. So your comment was like a clock alarm

Get your basic life and career in order so that later you have time for philosophy and spirituality.

[Leo Gura]

2 minutes ago, bambi said:

Nah this isnt correct at all

1) God is all that exists

2) Child rape exists

3) God can exist in anifninte number of forms, from highly selfish to selfless

Conclusion: selfish instatiations of God enacts rape

The type of monolithic entity you propose would be nothing more then a passive possibility machine. You could say God enabled rape, but that isnt the same as causing it, thata deeep fallacy you are making

There is no fallacy. God is cause of all and rape is part of all.

Look at all the mental acrobatics you do just to avoid facing a simple truth.

[bambi]

1 minute ago, Leo Gura said:

There is no fallacy. God is cause of all and rape is part of all.

Look at all the mental acrobatics you do just to avoid facing a simple truth.

No I would even argue nothing is caused by God, its enabled by God. Causality is a fasle paradigm

To me you are making gross simplificaitons and reductions which obscure the truth.

You are posiitng God to be a type of entity with an agenda and bias, this just isnt the case

[Leo Gura]

It could not be more simple:

If it exists, God created it.

Now you wanna claim God is not a creator because it no longer suits your silly morals. See what games you play? I cornered you into denying that God is Creator.

Edited August 25 by Leo Gura

[bambi]

1 minute ago, Leo Gura said:

It could not be more simple:

If it exists, God created it.

Now you wanna claim God is not a creator because it no longer suits your silly morals. See what games you play? I cornered you into denying that God is Creator.

Not really, like I said its an oversimplificaiton, missing nuance and explanatory power. It also creates a false seperation between God and the creaiton.

If it exists, its a manifestation of God. -> This is accurate, but it isnt equivalent to what you say

 

And no, please stop projecting your preconcieved notions. This has literally 0 to do with morality to me, its about logic and accuracy

[Davino]

3 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Get your basic life and career in order so that later you have time for philosophy and spirituality.

I see this is the wise way to go.

I just don't want to be building infrastructure so much that I die of spiritual thirst. 

Nor to be so divinely drunk I cannot satisfy my needs and live the good life.

In my ideal world, I know what I would do, but I gotta play by the rules. I like what being human has to offer but it's not Infinite Consciousness. I know you get me.

I feel I'm walking on the right direction overall.

Thanks Leo, this was the straw that broke the camel's back