Why are left-wing policies generally more popular than right-wing policies?

[Hardkill]

I get that most Americans are either moderates or conservatives and usually fear radical change.

So, then why have left-wing policies been more popular than right-wing policies for many years?

Edited August 12 by Hardkill

[aurum]

A couple different perspectives we could take on this:

1) Leftists policies can sound nice on paper, which then creates a kind of a surface level agreement. But these policies are also much harder to implement in practice and can easily be used as a nice-sounding smokescreen for lower development survival agendas, e.g Nazi "socialism". 

2) Leftist policies generally favor populism over a minority of elites. But the elites have the power and can bully the majority

3) The left is actually winning the culture war, and Blue conservatism is losing. Especially among younger people

4) Many right-wing policies have been disasters when tested in real-life policy scenarios, and people who are informed understand that.

[Hardkill]

19 minutes ago, aurum said:

A couple different perspectives we could take on this:

1) Leftists policies can sound nice on paper, which then creates a kind of a surface level agreement. But these policies are also much harder to implement in practice and can easily be used as a nice-sounding smokescreen for lower development survival agendas, e.g Nazi "socialism". 

2) Leftist policies generally favor populism over a minority of elites. But the elites have the power and can bully the majority

3) The left is actually winning the culture war, and Blue conservatism is losing. Especially among younger people

4) Many right-wing policies have been disasters when tested in real-life policy scenarios, and people who are informed understand that.

I get your first two points, which is what Leo has talked about before. 

However, regarding your second two points, you're saying that even though American is primarily center-right culturally, left-wing policies still tend to be more popular than right-wing policies because the country has always kept becoming more and more liberal/progressive in the long-run since the very beginning of the country.

You also say that whenever left leaning policies that aren't too far to the left for most Americans get enacted they generally stay as popular and well-respected policies for good, whereas most right-leaning policies that get enacted generally never stay popular for long and most people eventually see how bad they've been for themselves and for the country. 

Do I have all of that right?

Edited August 12 by Hardkill

[aurum]

11 minutes ago, Hardkill said:

However, regarding your second two points, you're saying that even though American is primarily center-right culturally, left-wing policies still tend to be more popular than right-wing policies because the country has always kept becoming more and more liberal/progressive in the long-run since the very beginning of the country.

It's complicated.

I'm saying American culture continues to move more Green. 

Look at how badly unpopular the social conservative agenda from Project 2025 has turned out to be. Most people do not think we should be banning porn and premarital sex. We've moved past that.

11 minutes ago, Hardkill said:

You also say that whenever left leaning policies that aren't too far to the left for most Americans get enacted they generally stay as popular and well-respected policies for good, whereas right-leaning policies that get enacted generally never stay popular for long and most people eventually see how bad they've been for themselves and for the country. 

Perhaps most people wouldn't consciously understand it if you ask them. But yes, sometimes right-wing policies fail badly and get weeded out as a result.

Too much deregulation of the market is a good example of this. 

[Leo Gura]

Because leftist policies are aimed at increasing equality and most people suffer from the inequality that conservatives rationalize.

[Hardkill]

20 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Because leftist policies are aimed at increasing equality and most people suffer from the inequality that conservatives rationalize.

But if most people in America like equality or fairness, then how do you reconcile that with the fact that most americans are pro-status quo and are tradition-oriented?

[Emerald]

2 hours ago, Hardkill said:

I get that most Americans are either moderates or conservatives and usually fear radical change.

So, then why have left-wing policies been more popular than right-wing policies for many years?

The center of the American political system and the way we think about it in the government establishment is CENTER RIGHT because both Democrat and Republican politicians serve the interests of corporations.

And the partisan way that people are conditioned to view politics in terms of Democrat = left and Republican = right... favors a CENTER RIGHT perspective because there is nothing more than a millimeter left of center in the establishment. (The same is true in other countries... only with different party names.)

I forget who came up with the quote, but the reality is that the American government is a lame bird with two right wings.

So, from the establishment's perspective... someone in the "center" is like Joe Manchin. So, that's what the establishment and news media call a moderate.. when his views don't actually reflect the actual will of the people.

But politicians whose views do reflect the will of the people are quick to be labeled a radical socialist. 

And the center of the populace is CENTER LEFT in their values if you poll them on specific policies and viewpoints. 

But most in the populace are low-information, under-informed voters.

So, they will often vote along party lines without knowledge of policies. And they will take as gospel the partisan characterizations as opposed to looking at actual policy positions.

And even if 70% of the American populace agrees with the policies of someone CENTER LEFT like Bernie Sanders on paper, most people will view him as a radical leftist because he has been labelled that from the perspective of the establishment.

Ultimately, it has to do with people not being very well educated about politics... and low information voters being conditioned to believe that candidates that are the most in agreement with the populace are crazy liberal radicals... while the center right politicians in the establishment like Joe Manchin are the moderate normies and "the adults in the room" representing the average person, even though their views are unpopular in the eyes of the people.

When in reality, all these so-called "moderates" in the establishment want to do is to cut taxes for billionaires and slash Social Security and Medicare.

[Hardkill]

1 hour ago, Emerald said:

The center of the American political system and the way we think about it in the government establishment is CENTER RIGHT because both Democrat and Republican politicians serve the interests of corporations.

And the partisan way that people are conditioned to view politics in terms of Democrat = left and Republican = right... favors a CENTER RIGHT perspective because there is nothing more than a millimeter left of center in the establishment. (The same is true in other countries... only with different party names.)

I forget who came up with the quote, but the reality is that the American government is a lame bird with two right wings.

So, from the establishment's perspective... someone in the "center" is like Joe Manchin. So, that's what the establishment and news media call a moderate.. when his views don't actually reflect the actual will of the people.

But politicians whose views do reflect the will of the people are quick to be labeled a radical socialist. 

And the center of the populace is CENTER LEFT in their values if you poll them on specific policies and viewpoints. 

But most in the populace are low-information, under-informed voters.

So, they will often vote along party lines without knowledge of policies. And they will take as gospel the partisan characterizations as opposed to looking at actual policy positions.

And even if 70% of the American populace agrees with the policies of someone CENTER LEFT like Bernie Sanders on paper, most people will view him as a radical leftist because he has been labelled that from the perspective of the establishment.

Ultimately, it has to do with people not being very well educated about politics... and low information voters being conditioned to believe that candidates that are the most in agreement with the populace are crazy liberal radicals... while the center right politicians in the establishment like Joe Manchin are the moderate normies and "the adults in the room" representing the average person, even though their views are unpopular in the eyes of the people.

When in reality, all these so-called "moderates" in the establishment want to do is to cut taxes for billionaires and slash Social Security and Medicare.

(Sighs)…..I wish our country could go back to being dominated by the liberal era of politics like it was during the New Deal era and the mid-1900s.

[Emerald]

2 minutes ago, Hardkill said:

(Sighs)…..I wish our country could go back to being dominated by the liberal era of politics like it was during the New Deal era and the mid-1900s.

Oh no! Someone's a radical Marxist Communist who's coming to trans your kids and let migrant criminals into the country to blow Fentanyl in everyone's faces!

Someone must stop this crazy guy!  

[Hardkill]

33 minutes ago, Emerald said:

Oh no! Someone's a radical Marxist Communist who's coming to trans your kids and let migrant criminals into the country to blow Fentanyl in everyone's faces!

Someone must stop this crazy guy!  

Most people didn't perceive FDR, Truman, JFK, and LBJ to be radical left commies back in their days. Only right-wing Republicans accused them of that.

Hell, you might as well say that Teddy Roosevelt or Woodrow Wilson were socialists or communists because of their progressive policies.

It's time to stop apologizing for being a liberal or progressive as long as you're not an extreme left-winger.

Edited August 13 by Hardkill

[Emerald]

Just now, Hardkill said:

Most people didn't perceive FDR, Truman, JFK, and LBJ to be radical left commies back in their days. Only right-wing Republicans accused them of that.

That's certainly true. Back then, it was right off the back of the Great Depression. So, my suspicion is that back then, people were more tuned in to specific policies because of how much they were looking to the political sphere to solve the economy crash and how influential the New Deal was.

Plus, they weren't so identified with partisan distinctions between parties and it wasn't as stark of a contrast in social values.

Like both Eisenhower (Republican) and FDR (Democrat) were focused on a lot of policies that would be considered economically left-wing nowadays.

[Hardkill]

6 minutes ago, Emerald said:

That's certainly true. Back then, it was right off the back of the Great Depression. So, my suspicion is that back then, people were more tuned in to specific policies because of how much they were looking to the political sphere to solve the economy crash and how influential the New Deal was.

Plus, they weren't so identified with partisan distinctions between parties and it wasn't as stark of a contrast in social values.

Like both Eisenhower (Republican) and FDR (Democrat) were focused on a lot of policies that would be considered economically left-wing nowadays.

That's true!

I think if we can eliminate the stark contrast in social values between both parties then I think our government could go back to being a much more functional and beneficial institution for the people.

Edited August 13 by Hardkill

[Emerald]

33 minutes ago, Hardkill said:

That's true!

I think if we can eliminate the stark contrast in social values between both parties then I think our government could go back to being a much more functional and beneficial institution for the people.

Part of the issue is that people tend to see politics only as social values, as those are the things the average person feels tuned into on an emotional level. And it can't be removed from consideration of course because human rights are wrapped up in it. But when people only have that association, it creates a situations where people end up voting against their own economic interests to 'keep the kids from being transed.'

[Hardkill]

35 minutes ago, Emerald said:

Part of the issue is that people tend to see politics only as social values, as those are the things the average person feels tuned into on an emotional level. And it can't be removed from consideration of course because human rights are wrapped up in it. But when people only have that association, it creates a situations where people end up voting against their own economic interests to 'keep the kids from being transed.'

Yeah, the Republican party ruined all of it. They used to be for all of the same social values as the Democrats have been.

Edited August 13 by Hardkill

[enchanted]

Video of three British conservatives discussing the topic of traditionalism and conservatism.

Their view is because left-wing is more hedonic and people are drawn to what's feels good in the moment.

 

Edited August 15 by enchanted

[Schizophonia]

On 8/13/2024 at 2:54 AM, Leo Gura said:

Because leftist policies are aimed at increasing equality and most people suffer from the inequality that conservatives rationalize.

lol

Says the guy who lives in a state where income tax does not exceed a few percent and who has plenty moderators do not having to pay them.

 

Edited August 15 by Schizophonia

[ICURBlessings]

This topic starts with this statement "I get that most Americans are either moderates or conservatives..." 

I have spent more than half my life living in the US - and I also lived in other cultures and country and paid attention to them. Half my relatives live in Europe... So here is my take on the so called Left and Right positions in the US.

First I must clarify that this is a GENERALIZATION.

In the mind of most voters there is a concept of what consist the Left and the Right WITH a RANGE in between. The half-way point being in the middle.

If you compare where this MIDDLE-Point falls in the mind of Americans and compare it to lets say the French, or the Swedes, and many other cultures - it DIFFERS. In other words the Middle between Left and Right is not consistent from culture to culture. And this shifting point also occurs over Time. Therefore in theory the Middle between Left and Right should be different in America in the 1930's versus today.

Shifting the MIDDLE point also means shifting the Left and Right side.

So generally speaking the MIDDLE between Left and Right in the US is more to the Right in France and many other cultures.

What Americans in general consider extreme Left - in many other cultures it is considered more 'Center-Left' and not extreme.

Also what Americans may consider Center-Right in some other cultures it is viewed as Extreme-Right.

 

Such an analysis become interesting when we consider how this Shift unfolds as a civilization advances. As a Nation evolve the Middle-point between Left and Right naturally shift towards the Left. Again this is a GENERALIZATION without details.

[BlueOak]

The last couple of decades:

Leftwing Policies:
What do you need?

Rightwing Policies
Who do we hate?

Obviously, there is more to this, the right wing generally favored the wealthy and business, and the left generally favored the working class and worse off. That used to be true.

Most are substandard policies because they are afraid of the word socialism, for example.
https://www.politicalcompass.org/

Recently, the supposed left in most Western cultures have become center-right or rightwing parties, which explains dumb things like this:
 

For something to be stable, it needs: Authoritarian, Socialist, Capitalist, and Libertarian pillars; the more of these it has in balanced quantities, the more effective it will be. Obviously the balance tips depending on the issue, but it still needs a balance.

For example, the balance here in the video no matter the goal, is way off. Think about all the steps you could go through for an internet site or group, before you make a law. From social engagement with communities or therapies to closing the website or group, to better understanding the problem and helping individual people. (Teaching family values) No it's a law, and it's stupid. 

*This puts aside my bias of wanting to hear all views BTW, which is far preferable. If no calls to violence are being made,  or criminal damage of some kind, then people should be able to express any opinion.

Edited August 22 by BlueOak

[Chadders]

@Hardkill are they though? I’m not so sure because if they were why do we not see progressive leaders in america? 

Most people are conservatively minded ergo prefer more conservative aligned policies such as tougher sentences on crime, or fiscal conservatism. They’re sold the bullshit idea that fiscal conservatism means cutting social security whilst cutting taxes for the rich 

Edited August 22 by Chadders

[Hardkill]

5 hours ago, Chadders said:

@Hardkill are they though? I’m not so sure because if they were why do we not see progressive leaders in america? 

Most people are conservatively minded ergo prefer more conservative aligned policies such as tougher sentences on crime, or fiscal conservatism. They’re sold the bullshit idea that fiscal conservatism means cutting social security whilst cutting taxes for the rich 

Well, that's why I am still not 100% clear on that yet.