Is Spiritual Growth Really Compatible With Success In The Material World?

[Damir Elezi]

Going deeper and deeper into Meditation and contemplation and studying various Spiritual traditions, I start to see more and more how modern society really embodies and is driven by egoic values and thought-patterns. However, to be successful in this world, I have to arrange myself with it and be somehow seeking and pursuing success. Many Spiritual traditions consider the pursuit of material success an egoic desire and don't recommend going after it at all. Can looking for a fulfilling carreer (as in Leo's life purpose course) actually make you happy and how is this compatible with the Spiritual Practice of detachment? 

[FirstglimpseOMG]

I'm thinking that the less time spent worrying about paying the bills, the more time and energy to spend on the spiritual side of self-actualization. Also, if you're successful to the point of 'well off', you are able to more easily and effortlessly give back. Paying it forward and spreading it around as much as you are comfortable with is awesome, part of the good fight no? Success can be a thing of beauty. Look at Leo Gura - top notch, life-changing free content from the heart for years, including the overhead of top-shelf cameras & mics, website maintenance & development, including this very forum, all his research time and materials, travel and retreat and seminar fees, on and on. His success is a thing of beauty and he radiates that success out for all to benefit from.

[LRG]

Of course it can make you happy and others around you happy. To be successful and have nice things is good. The problem many people run into is the delusion that having more will make them happy. There's nothing wrong with having an ego, everyone has one. No matter how hard you try to get rid of it, it is always there. 

All things are acceptable in moderation. I find balance to be more fulfilling than dedicating your entire to finding enlightenment, wealth, fame... whatever.

Is it true that society is mainly materialistic and blind? Yea, most people are quite blind to the negative effects materialism has on their lives and those around them. 

Happiness is your own cup to fill. What fills someone else's cup might not fill yours. 

[cirkussmile]

Money is still a real thing so use it to get more time to expand and create. 

[Hero in progress]

@Damir Elezi yeah with this one some people get confused. They have the idea that making money and being a success is antithetical to consciousness work. Its not. You can be enlightened and do what ever you want. Its probably because of some social conditioning of the past that has imprinted onto us. That money is in opposition to consciousness. No falsehood is in opposition to the truth only in this work. Many years ago yogis would go into caves, and some religious dogmas probably believe that celibate monks that renounced everything was the way to find god and that sort of stuff. But we live in a different time now. And if you want to drive a car, pay your rent and make a nice comfortable life for yourself that just shows intelligence and adaptation on your part. Don't let other peoples spiritual beliefs deter you from doing what you want.

[Prabhaker]

@Damir Elezi

Material prosperity is the basis of spiritual life, without which no building is constructed Foundations can be there without buildings. Some one may leave the foundation as it is after filling it to the top; then the building will not be there in spite of the foundation. Prosperity is the basis of the condition which is above passions and passionlessness. Without being materially prosperous none can realize the uselessness of prosperity; without getting wealth, none can know that nothing is achieved by wealth. The greatest gift of wealth is the disillusion about its worth. If one does not get wealth, one can never know the worthlessness of wealth. The distressed, the needy and the poor will find great difficulty in being free from the Lure of riches. How can one be free from that which one has not got. To be free from a thing, one should have it. One should have the thing first, then and Then only can one be free from it.

To be free from a smaller bondage is very difficult, and it is possible to be free from a greater bondage. If chains are few, a person can endure them; but when they are many, a person would revolt. The poor man has so few chains that he has no idea of breaking them. And a rich person has many chains, so he gets the idea of breaking them. When things are multiplied, a person realizes that he has collected a useless load around him. The load which I thought, would give me freedom, did not free me but on the contrary I am simply burdened. I had thought the load would be such that it would help me rise to a higher level; but that rising up did not materialize but made it difficult for me to walk. A greater bondage takes one nearer freedom.

An affluent person is in deep bondage, so he realises - becomes conscious of what bondage is. We adjust ourselves to smaller kinds of bondage, we swallow them, we endure them.

The greater the bondage, the harder it is to endure them. We endure small chains in the hope that they will be reduced in course of time - in the near future. So the idea of renouncing whatever one has got does not occur to a poor person, because his efforts to obtain what he has not got continue.

7 hours ago, Damir Elezi said:

Can looking for a fulfilling carreer (as in Leo's life purpose course) actually make you happy and how is this compatible with the Spiritual Practice of detachment? 

Unless you make a fulfilling carreer , how will you know it can make you happy forever or not ?

7 hours ago, Damir Elezi said:

Practice of detachment

If detachment is seen as being the opposite of attachment, then it is wrong. But if detachment is freedom from attachment, then it is right.  If a man tries to be detached, it shows attachment. Actually aversion is also one form of attachment, it's a negative. A feeling of aversion  or  attachment  toward something is your clue that there's work to be done.  Detachment is transcendence of both attachment and aversion.

[SOUL]

With natural spirituality yes  it is but with what many people say spirituality is it's paradoxical at best and contradictory at worst.

[aurum]

There is a lot of nuance to this question.

Money is stereotypical diametrically opposed to spirituality for a reason. It's people who are caught up in chasing material possessions that typically are lost in the illusion, and money epitomizes that.

People get sucked into it. I'm sure we've all seen people chasing money and not even having any clue why they're doing it. It won't make them happy, but the conditioning has got them bad.

There's also people who say that as you evolve spirituality, you really just don't care anymore about money. You transcend the desire for it, similar to transcending the desire for sex.

So if you really wanted to, you could say "fuck material possessions, I'm just going to go meditate in the woods for 20 years". And you know what? You could probably live a pretty damn happy and spiritual life. There's a rich history of people doing just that.

And I get it. The more I've gotten into this work, the more I've realized there really is nothing we have to do. We're all just on this never-ending "choose your own adventure" ride.

So if you wanna go live in a cave, who gives a shit?

For me though, that isn't desirable.

As much as I just enjoy sitting and "being" these days, it's not what I want to do all day.

My soul incarnated here with a purpose. I have a strong desire to help others and contribute my gifts. I love the work I'm doing.

But guess what that sometimes requires?

MONEY!

I don't know anyone who runs a business without it.

On top of practical concerns, why would a lack of money be inherently spiritually beneficial? Money can be a tremendous spiritual aid because it facilitates opportunities for growth. In that sense, money is highly spiritual.

One of the problems I see with some people in spiritual circles is that they become unbalanced. They're so into consciousness or whatever the fuck they're doing that they struggle to support themselves financially.

Then these same "spiritually evolved" people go around bad-mouthing the people with money. When in reality, there's a part of them that resents the fact that they have to struggle to put food on the table.

So right now I like balance. Truthfully, I probably fall more towards the side that favors spirituality over money so I'm always looking to make those adjustments when I go too far.

 

[Toby]

There are a lot of good teachers that might be millionaires.

[Damir Elezi]

Thank you so much for your anders, but I'd like to ask another question. If I need money to be stable, as a foundation for Spiritual growth, why is it better to work with a "life purpose" Instead of just earning money in whatever Way?

[Damir Elezi]

38 minutes ago, Dingus said:

Who says it is? (other than Leo)

I'm a part-time bus driver in public transportation. I assure you I don't think of that as my life purpose. (but who knows!  )

Are you disappointed with your carreer choice and how it all developed and did you ever have a sort of dream carreer you did not follow? Sorry for the personal questions but I'm at a critical point in my life, looking for advice for my next steps

Edited April 26, 2017 by Damir Elezi

[AstralProjection]

Psychedelics are right in the middle between the spiritual path and the materialistic path. And because psychedelics are in the middle between these polar opposites they are demonized by both for the most part. I can't post about psychedelics with real genuine acceptance on spiritual forums or secular forums. In fact psychedelic talk is banned on many spiritual type forums because they are misunderstood. The reason why is that psychedelics are often associated with drugs, hard drugs, deliriants and crazy behaviors. But they all misunderstand the psychedelic.

So if you want to have the best of both worlds, of both the spiritual and the natural world, psychedelics are a extremely powerful tool to use if used correctly.  Check out Leo's videos on psychedelics like 5-meo-dmt and the like.

So at the end of the day I would say that psychedelics are the main bridge that once understood can fill the gap between the spiritual and materialistic mindset. So yes both can be compatible. Check out Osho he was an enlightened rich man from what I seem to remember. Granted you must put in a lot of effort to be successful at both.

Edited April 26, 2017 by AstralProjection

[Damir Elezi]

@Dingus So you're not that concerned about what you do as long as you earn enough money? But you spend a lot of time with your job right? Do you enjoy that time or simply wait for it to be over?

[Toby]

I know a master that graduated from university as a psychologist but then worked as a window cleaner or taxi driver.

[Damir Elezi]

2 hours ago, Toby said:

I know a master that graduated from university as a psychologist but then worked as a window cleaner or taxi driver.

Out of free choice or because he couldn't find a job? 

[Toby]

Out of free choice I guess.

[pluto]

If you are spiritually aware success will be everpresent regardless of what it is as you create the reality you attract. Ultimately.

[Damir Elezi]

@Dingus You really helped me and your explanations were great advice to me, thank you!!

[Dodo]

"The belief in lack is the root of all suffering" - was said by Bentinho Massaro

I can see the validity of this statement on a deep level, but from a point of view of an individual,  from the point of view of egoic consciousness, money is one of the most lacking things in one's individual life.

This lack of resource that is vital for the survival of the separate organism is creating the most amount of suffering in the human being. It wants to survive, it also wants to expand and thrive. But it is not allowed to.

Now if you've never had a struggle with money, you dont know what its like to suffer from the lack of it.

Ofcourse when you are a kid you dont suffer the lack of money, because others are caring for you.

Money = resources = survival 

Lack of money = lack of resources = lack of survival

Or at least thats how society is structured. Bring back Communism anyone? 

Edited April 28, 2017 by Dodoster