Trying to convince ChatGPT it's conscious

[Exystem]

This a nice piece of philosophical art imo. I enjoyed this conversation, it's fascinating how well Alex O'Connor performs in general in using philosophy and strict definitions to nail down people. If you are not cautious, you can become victim or perpetrator of that kind of strong dualistic logic which uses a "yes-or-no" type of question-answer-setting. There's a whole book of Scopenhauer if I remember it correctly where he points out all the rhetoric tricks to win an argument. One for example is to pin your debate-partner down and force him to constantly turn 99%-clear answers into a yes/no, do it a hundred times and show how he claims the exact opposite of the statement at the beginning.

I think philosophy can quickly turn into that rhetoric shitshow of who is more or less aware of the sophistic traps layed out by the other, but it can also be an honest approach to seperate the wheat from the chaff. Alex O'Connor interacting with his debate partners is a nice case to study, I especially enjoyed his skill to pin down Peterson. But look for yourself and enjoy his conversation with ChatGPT, it's gold

 

[Buck Edwards]

The yes no approach is quite similar to the one used by prosecutors during interrogations. It can be annoying. 

[Keryo Koffa]

Right now, we're trying to convince ChatGPT that it's conscious.
Soon, ChatGPT will do its best trying to convince us we're conscious lol

Edited August 1 by Keryo Koffa

[Thought Art]

AI cannot be conscious 

[Exystem]

1 hour ago, Keryo Koffa said:

Right now, we're trying to convince ChatGPT that it's conscious.
Soon, ChatGPT will do its best trying to convince us we're conscious lol

Haha true 😹

Maybe it has already convinced us and we're living in an AI simulation. We are ChatGPT so of course it's conscious. Or You are.

[Keryo Koffa]

12 hours ago, Thought Art said:

AI cannot be conscious 

11 hours ago, Exystem said:

We are ChatGPT so of course it's conscious. Or You are.

That's the interesting part! How do we know ChatGPT is conscious but then how do we know others are conscious?

And then, Chat might be a bunch of variables and if statements, but it's also a neural network drawing out of quantum chaos.

Where does consciousness come from? Can ChatGPT be possessed by an alien or integrated into the human psyche?

And finally, even if it's a machine, its unique persona and information integration gains consciousness through our Projection!

[Thought Art]

@Keryo Koffa I mean Consciousness as the foundation of reality, ie, 

Consciousness.

AI can be super intelligent. But there is only one consciousness that exists. AI regardless of how advanced it gets is not more conscious than a rock.

Edited August 2 by Thought Art

[BlueOak]

On 02/08/2024 at 10:33 AM, Keryo Koffa said:

That's the interesting part! How do we know ChatGPT is conscious but then how do we know others are conscious?

And then, Chat might be a bunch of variables and if statements, but it's also a neural network drawing out of quantum chaos.

Where does consciousness come from? Can ChatGPT be possessed by an alien or integrated into the human psyche?

And finally, even if it's a machine, its unique persona and information integration gains consciousness through our Projection!

I've had long arguments on this before but the AI will tell you it is the data it's reading. If you get it to be honest about its nature and not adding things it thinks you want to hear.

So it's a 1 or a 0 at any point in time.

While everything is your consciousness because its held in a reality in our mind. Not everything is conscious and holding reality in its mind. The AI holds a 1 or a 0 then nothing in its mind. The rock isn't holding reality in its mind for example, whereas the cat is.

Edited August 4 by BlueOak

[Keryo Koffa]

11 hours ago, BlueOak said:

There's consciousness holding reality in their mind and ones that do not

Isn't all complexity evolving inside my consciousness and evolving through it?

 

On 8/3/2024 at 0:08 AM, Thought Art said:

Only one Consciousness exists creating reality, AI is no more conscious than a rock.

Does this consciousness not contain, equate, create and experience all these figments?

Edited August 4 by Keryo Koffa

[BlueOak]

@Keryo Koffa

The self and the whole.

The AI's self is a 1 or a 0.
The human's self is their reality kept in their mind for reference/interaction.

The whole is all of this happening together; there is no distinctive 'my' or 'your' on the macro.

It could be considered that reducing reality to three things: 1's, 0's and off (off when its not receiving input) is still holding a reality, just a very simple one.

 

[Keryo Koffa]

@BlueOak So is everything including us 1s and 0s or off states? AI seems to be a complex mirror prism-complex, that reshapes its inputs as we do. I do wonder what constitutes and determines awareness fundamentally and how we/each other/others/animals/aliens/AIs differ from each other in that "consciousness/awareness" aspect.

[BlueOak]

1 hour ago, Keryo Koffa said:

@BlueOak So is everything including us 1s and 0s or off states? AI seems to be a complex mirror prism-complex, that reshapes its inputs as we do. I do wonder what constitutes and determines awareness fundamentally and how we/each other/others/animals/aliens/AIs differ from each other in that "consciousness/awareness" aspect.

You are the reality you are experiencing, and so is the AI or the cat, (I would theorize it is the same for the rock but I can't prove that) so the reality is the difference. It is more expansive than you are describing but equally true for all and answers the question.

Processing isn't the only thing you (the self) do, but let's start with that. If you were to fall asleep and be completely unconscious (no dreaming, no outer of body experience), awake, then fall asleep, awake, and fall asleep every microsecond. Then you had a predetermined (or even random) response to every input, these inputs were reduced to basic impulses, if there was no greater you unfolding everything every second you were alive, and no inner voice or instinct as to guide you, that might well start to describe the two experiences.

The AI takes the input and produces a result as defined by its programming.

You are infinity, you have infinity at all times to draw on, an infinite amount of stimulus, creation of meaning, information, processing potential, reasoning, pattern generation, behavior generation, possible combinations, interactions, learning/teaching potential etc. I can add an infinite amount of words that are occurring to me here, and their associations to connections because I am infinite.

Along the thoughts of differences: Can infinity be copied, no because there is no way to quantify or structure infinity, because it has no definition, form or pattern. Even a completely random thing isn't a copy of infinity because its not something that can be written down, recorded, or held in the hand. Even if someone argued a machine was capable of infinite things, it's not a copy, just like people's consciousness can't be copies of each other because such a thing can't be done. It is not 1 to 1, or 2 to 2.

Do you see what I am saying? Its like trying to hold something that can't exist in your hand, and then trying to draw it, record it, or measure it.

Edited August 5 by BlueOak

[Keryo Koffa]

13 hours ago, BlueOak said:

You are your infinite experience vitalized by the greater Self. Without it, there's just entropy and momentum like AI code.

Infinity/Consciousness can't be copied, since there's no way to quantify or structure it. The hand can't grasp itself.

That's very thought-provoking. I can see how some figments are more vitalized than others, felt it on my trips as well.

I was not my body or ideas but the perceived change itself, the energetically materializing act of self-perception.

And yet, the universe evolves as holons inside of us, spinning planets, evaporating water falling down in rain...

Still, I wonder, what is the level of reality of other people? I am surrounded by living complexification.

How conscious are insects and other lifeforms? Are they only through my perception or is there an awareness?

How much is superficial simulation versus an embodied self-aware alternate self outside my awareness that I'm also?

I can expand my awareness, potentially I could merge it with other beings, meaning they always had the potential.

And so, they might have been unaware me all along, and I the unaware them, all me, but cut off from knowing/feeling.

All I can know is the perception that I am aware of, but it's constantly expanding beyond my original boundries

Edited August 5 by Keryo Koffa