Is marriage a trap?

[Butters]

This thread escalated so fast 😭

[Yimpa]

6 minutes ago, Butters said:

This thread escalated so fast 😭

 

[Salvijus]

honestly this is exciting because Nemra's intellect is so sharp. It's like mental jujitsu for me

[Princess Arabia]

8 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

honestly this is exciting because Nemra's intellect is so sharp. It's like mental jujitsu for me

I love me some Nemra.

[Nemra]

4 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

I was not asking a question. I was making a point. 

You didn't because you think there is no such thing as gaslighting.

There is nothing wrong with gaslighting as long as you aren't aware of it.

When I say that gaslighting is the truth, I don't mean it has to represent some part of reality 100%. Even if it does, when you gaslight someone, you are making them believe in a misrepresentation of their reality. This all assumes that a person knows what's actually happening in their reality.

[Salvijus]

@Nemra what is the definition of gaslighting for you? 

[Princess Arabia]

5 minutes ago, Nemra said:

You didn't because you think there is no such thing as gaslighting.

There is nothing wrong with gaslighting as long as you aren't aware of it.

When I say that gaslighting is the truth, I don't mean it has to represent some part of reality 100%. Even if it does, when you gaslight someone, you are making them believe in a misrepresentation of their reality. This all assumes that a person knows what's actually happening in their reality.

The shit humans invent. How can you make someone believe something they don't already have an inclination to believe. Is this gaslighting, because I'm not aware of it. Is that gaslighting trying to come off as innocently unaware. Is that gaslighting trying to understand gaslighting. Is that........lol

[Salvijus]

8 minutes ago, Nemra said:

you think there is no such thing as gaslighting.

I'm not saying gaslighting doesn't exist. I'm saying truth is never gaslighting. In fact truth removes all gaslighting. It's antidote against all gaslighting. 

[Princess Arabia]

1 minute ago, Salvijus said:

I'm not saying gaslighting doesn't exist. I'm saying truth is never gaslighting. In fact truth removes all gaslighting. It's antidote against all gaslighting. 

Truth, according to our teacher, is "that which is the case", so if you got gaslit, that's truth. Is that gaslighting. Let me stop before I get a point for gaslighting that I'm not aware of.

[Salvijus]

@Nemra you're just gaslighting me with your gaslighting philosophy lol

[Applegarden8]

Works out great for some of the minority I see. For others, not so much. Doesn't stop people from cheating, weaponizing children aginst one another, abusing each other and extracting money and power. With such a short attention span we have an option to marry, blows my mind, if you think about it. Marriage certainly didn't save my parents from divorcing and it didn't solve any of my either grandparents mental and physical abuse though. So I am not getting married probably. Idk it's like verified icon on Facebook or something for me. The thing is that your private association between you two people is what matters and the world shouldn't really care. But we have it the other way around that you have to have the status otherwise you feel displaced and the goverment is involved, because it fails to provide for the individual with the basic necessities. Now that's a collective insecurity.

Edited July 25 by Applegarden8

[DianaFr]

I guess 'the why' also matters. I always wanted to get married because experiencing life with somebody who is my person has always felt way more desirable than the freedom of doing it solo or in a low-commitment way. I get attached to people easily and I seek emotional security, so being married is healing for me. It's not a trap for me but a safe place that is the foundation of my life. I don't think my husband feels trapped either. We support each other, cheer each other up, we know each other's deepest fears and desires and we push and pull each other when needed. I'm the first person my husband calls when good and bad things happen and he is mine. It took a lot first to learn to trust each other and we had to go through some hard stuff but that brought us closer eventually. Nobody's going anywhere for the time being. It could be a trap for some or many, but for others it's a way of life. 

[Princess Arabia]

12 minutes ago, Applegarden8 said:

Marriage certainly didn't save my parents from divorcing and it didn't solve any of my either grandparents mental and physical abuse though. So I am not getting married probably

I see you're living in the past. Realize that this is a conditioning and unconscious thinking not pertaining to your life. You have let the unconscious mind (not low-conscious) run the show. We all do it, so I'm not pointing you out, just observing. Doesn't mean it will happen to you because there are still plenty of happily married people around. This is how I learn and help to spot my own unconscious behavior by observing others' and applying the spiritual intelligence i've acquired.

[Basman]

I think marriage can be a great thing. Apparently marriage benefits men more even. At least health wise for whatever reason.

Marrying the wrong person certainly is a trap though.

[Basman]

22 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

It certainly CAN be.

Gotta be very careful with it.

How do you tell if someone is worth marrying? Or vice-versa, when is marrying a trap?

[gambler]

2 hours ago, Basman said:

How do you tell if someone is worth marrying? Or vice-versa, when is marrying a trap?

Someone who shares your values and has a strong emphasis on commitment is a good starting point.

[QVx]

10 hours ago, DianaFr said:

I guess 'the why' also matters. I always wanted to get married because experiencing life with somebody who is my person has always felt way more desirable than the freedom of doing it solo or in a low-commitment way. I get attached to people easily and I seek emotional security, so being married is healing for me. It's not a trap for me but a safe place that is the foundation of my life. I don't think my husband feels trapped either. We support each other, cheer each other up, we know each other's deepest fears and desires and we push and pull each other when needed. I'm the first person my husband calls when good and bad things happen and he is mine. It took a lot first to learn to trust each other and we had to go through some hard stuff but that brought us closer eventually. Nobody's going anywhere for the time being. It could be a trap for some or many, but for others it's a way of life. 

You didn’t have to be married to receive your experience.

I feel the distinction between experience and the idealism of marriage is important to explore.

If marriage is a trap, would that make a romantic relationship a trap?

What are people’s thoughts on polygamy as an expression of love within the confines of both a relationship and marriage?

Do we say the ideal, and its manifestation through direct experience, of relationship and marriage is the trap? If not, at which point does one break free of the chains of idealism and transcend beyond a new way of being as previously delivered by humanity over the past 1000s of years?

 

[DianaFr]

11 hours ago, QVx said:

You didn’t have to be married to receive your experience.

I feel the distinction between experience and the idealism of marriage is important to explore.

If marriage is a trap, would that make a romantic relationship a trap?

What are people’s thoughts on polygamy as an expression of love within the confines of both a relationship and marriage?

Do we say the ideal, and its manifestation through direct experience, of relationship and marriage is the trap? If not, at which point does one break free of the chains of idealism and transcend beyond a new way of being as previously delivered by humanity over the past 1000s of years?

 

Without being married this wouldn't be a complete experience. As a woman, I like to be owned or claimed by my husband. It's like a declaration by him to me and everybody else that I belong with him. We share the same surname and we are legally bound to each other. This feels like a safe container to me, I definetely prefer to be a wife instead of a girlfriend. On a deeper level we both share a similar abandonment trauma from childhood, so securing our connection with the ultimate means possible actually provides that sense of safety we both crave. There is something about the physical things like the ring on my finger or wedding photos or having a new signature that serves as a daily reminder that this is all real. It's a big deal for someone like me who is mostly withdrawn in her inner world and quite distant from the real one.

Speaking about idealism, I'd say it has no place in marriage. You marry a real person, not an extension of your own illusion. Yes, it often starts with this but as you progress and mature and get bruised and disappointed and heartbroken again and again, the idealism strips away layer by layer, until you meet your core truths and can finally perceive them in your partner as well. Then you can love him for who he is, not for the image you assigned to him. It comes with a pleasent sense of liberation because you finally realize you get to be yourself - as flawed and weird as you are - and have that safe connection with your partner - as flawed and weird as they are - at the same time. It's quite nice, albeit very very far from ideal. 

[Tenebroso]

Marriage is a trap because women usually end up settling for average men they resent. The most attractive men have so many options that they have no incentive to commit to a woman, woman will break all their rules and standards to be with them without the promise of commitment.

Eventually women get frustrated and put the need to be in a stable relationship over raw desire. The women resent the man they married and can barely conceal it, the men realize that nothing they do will ever be enough, the goalpost for what it means to be a good partner will always be moved and the result is marriage sucking for everyone.

It's better for women to stay single instead of settling and men should stop asking women to lower their standards, you don't want to be in a relationship with a woman who settled for you. Woman are free now and we can see through their actions that a very small number of men are actually attractive to men. For all the complaining about fuckboys and players, women when free to choose naturally create a polygynous society where a few men have all the women.

[FourCrossedWands]

Marriage on its own is not a big trap. You can always get divorced and make the money back. The biggest problem is when the kids are involved. You will either become a slave of your partner and kids, or end up divorced only seeing your kids once a week...

You can idolize being married and having kids as you like, but the truth is that you can never control how your partner and kids will behave. I know countless people in their late 30s who regret getting married and having kids with a wrong person. They will never ever be truly happy in their life.

A lot of the kids then have social problems and need to visit a psychologist regularly. Facts.

For most of the people in this day and age, getting married and a having kids is selfish and irresponsible.

Edited July 26 by FourCrossedWands