Biden dropping out

[strika]

13 minutes ago, Hatfort said:

The shooter missed. Like basketball players miss or hit decisive points. Spiritually speaking, whatever we call god wasn't more present in that event than in everything else happening in the world.

Exactly, and God is always present = God's plan is always unraveling, meaning both Trump's shooting and basketballer missing are both God ordained miracles, it's just that one has a grander impact than the other in the short term timeline.

[Joshe]

Certain things trigger and energize the right more than others. If AOC were vice president on the Dem ticket, I’m pretty sure her record and personality, once properly smeared by Rs, would contribute significantly to high turnout. 

Same goes with Greasy Gavin. California, heroin needles on the beach, sets up homeless camps, wants to tax you at 75%. He would be easy as hell to smear. Easier than Biden any day of the week.

Maybe Leo is saying forget about the R vote and focus on driving D turnout. 

[Hatfort]

16 minutes ago, strika said:

Exactly, and God is always present = God's plan is always unraveling, meaning both Trump's shooting and basketballer missing are both God ordained miracles, it's just that one has a grander impact than the other in the short term timeline.

I'm spiritual to a good extent, I think there are ways to connect or disconnect from a greater being, let's say. But it's not god moving the pieces like a person playing a board game. God didn't make the guy miss the shoot, the guy missed it himself. This happens, it's not part of a plan, at least not more than everything else in the universe.

[strika]

15 minutes ago, Nemra said:

@strika

Why is Trump better than Biden for you?

I won't go into it to not get banned, i was already threatened with a perma ban when i said something on it a couple of months ago despite the fact that a couple of days ago i saw the exact same types of opinions just reveresed (i would say they were much more insane) on that thread about Trump's assassination but i couldn't call out the hypocrisy at the time because i had a ban of a couple of days for something else, point being this forum is closeminded when it comes to speaking about politics outside the politics so i won't be giving detailed pro-anything right releated views anymore to not get banned because i value other segments of this forum, i will just say this to show an example in a more subtle non-detailed way of why i'm more pro-Trump than i am pro-Biden, this is just one simple and short example: The sniper from Secret Services had the shooter Thomas Crooks (who had his rifle with him) under his scope for at least 45 seconds before the shooting occcured. Just this example alone, even if you put it in vaccum, is something that i can't see happening on a Biden rally, ever. I hope i've said enough without having to say much while getting my point across. Of course there are so many more dozens of examples just like this one when it comes to that assassination attempt but i think that giving just this one simple example is enough.

[strika]

2 minutes ago, Hatfort said:

I'm spiritual to a good extent, I think there are ways to connect or disconnect from a greater being, let's say. But it's not god moving the pieces like a person playing a board game. God didn't make the guy miss the shoot, the guy missed it himself. This happens, it's not part of a plan, at least not more than everything else in the universe.

Everything is determined from the lower self perspective, there is no lower self free will.

[Joshe]

41 minutes ago, strika said:

Exactly, and God is always present = God's plan is always unraveling, meaning both Trump's shooting and basketballer missing are both God ordained miracles, it's just that one has a grander impact than the other in the short term timeline.

Are they really “miracles”, or just happenstances that occur within the construct? Also, miracles are unique, not the same as every other thing. Also, miracles are always grandiose, by definition.

The original statement you’re arguing on behalf of was making a mockery of God and the statement invoked ideas from other posts and teachings that, when added up, amount to much more falsehood than what you’re arguing on behalf of. So, while I might agree that Trump is supposed to be happening, I don’t conceptualize it anywhere near this:  it’s a miracle by God Almighty and he wants Trump alive to serve his agenda of righteousness and use him as an instrument of good. 

That’s the status quo Christian take, which is calling evil good. That’s my understanding of why the message was condemned.

Edited July 19 by Joshe

[Hatfort]

5 minutes ago, strika said:

Everything is determined from the lower self perspective, there is no lower self free will.

That doesn't give to what happened in Pennsylvania a bigger relevance, than any other event happening in the world, from the perspective of a greater being. Another thing is what is relevant for the people living today from a geopolitical point of view, and what some people want to spiritually attribute to it, but that would be on them, not on god.

[strika]

1 minute ago, Joshe said:

Are they really “miracles”, or just happenstances that occur within the construct? The whole idea of a miracle is that it’s unique, not the same as every other thing. A miracle is always grandiose. 

The original statement you’re arguing on behalf of was making a mockery of God and the statement invoked ideas from other posts and teachings that, when added up, amount to much more falsehood than what you’re arguing on behalf of. So, while I might agree that Trump is supposed to be happening, I don’t conceptualize it anywhere near this:  it’s a miracle by God Almighty and he wants Trump alive to serve his agenda of righteousness and use him as an instrument of good. 

That’s the status quo Christian take, which is calling evil good. That’s why the message is condemned. 

Obviously i didn't mean in the Christian way, that's why i said in my 1st post that i'm not talking from blue stage perspective when calling it a miracle.

[DocWatts]

It's hard to say whether this is the right call or not, since keeping Biden in and replacing him 4 months before the election both carry quite a lot of risk.

If they do replace him, the Dems need to unite behind his replacement to have any chance of winning - and they need to do it fast. A drawn or contested primary will almost certainly be handing Trump the presidency.

Realistically though, Kamala Harris would pretty much have to be the replacement. Because she was part of the Biden administration, she's the only candidate who has legal access to the millions in campaign funding that the Democratic Party has raised for Biden. If Biden is dropping out, he should resign the presidency as well for health reasons, and spend the next four months uniting the party behind Harris.

A strong VP pick like Gavin Newsom, Gretchen Whitmer, or Bernie Sanders could help, but there's close to zero chance that they'll be at the top of the ticket.

On a tangential note - I'm still scratching my head as to how Trump supporters manage to find thier way to a conscious politics forum, and that they expect their posts to be taken seriously...

Edited July 19 by DocWatts

[UnbornTao]

@strika Conflating two different domains and bringing a fair share of fantasy into the current consideration is problematic. God is on vacation on Venus; best to leave it alone. Anyway, let's keep to the main topic.

Edited July 21 by UnbornTao

[aurum]

1 hour ago, nerdspeak said:

I know someone close to Vance. Hearsay, but apparently his economic nationalism and motivation to re-shore industrial jobs to the US is genuine. They describe his views as basically corporatist and aligned with the Christian Democrats in Germany or Belgium. 
 

So what?

Fascists are always nationalists. More corporatism is exactly what we don’t need.

1 hour ago, nerdspeak said:

We're seeing a realignment in US politics similar to what happened in the 70s after the oil shock. People screamed "fascism" then about Reagan and they're screaming "fascism" now about Trump.

No.

People are screaming fascism because criminal con-man Trump has already conspired to overthrown a democratic election. This alone should disqualify him from ever running again. Not to mention all the news that has come out about Project 2025 and SCOTUS.

Reagan was like a saint compared to Trump. At least Reagan respected democracy.

[Joshe]

49 minutes ago, DocWatts said:

On a tangential note - I'm still scratching my head as to how Trump supporters manage to find thier way to a conscious politics forum, and that they expect their posts to be taken seriously...

Been racking my brain on this too

[nerdspeak]

7 minutes ago, aurum said:

Fascists are always nationalists. More corporatism is exactly what we don’t need

What is your definition of corporatism? 

Corporatism in the European sense brings organized labor into decisions. E.g., in Germany, companies with more than 2,000 employees need to have half of their board of directors elected by the rank-and-file employees. This prevents some of the worst excesses of predatory capitalism. 

Fascism has some corporatist elements but it's different in a couple ways: 

1. It removes the independence of unions from the state 

2. It makes confrontational strike action illegal (all strikes have to basically be approved by the state/ruling party)

3. It's tied to an aggressive imperialist foreign policy. 

I'm not backing Trump or Vance, and probably Trump is a threat to further democratic backsliding, but this Vance in my understanding does not advocate for 1, 2, or 3.  

I'm not sure I'd agree that Reagan respected democracy but that's a side-debate we won't get into for now. 

Edited July 19 by nerdspeak

[aurum]

3 hours ago, strika said:

Is this a spiritual forum or what?

I'm not saying that this makes Trump more special at all, all i'm saying is God moves all the chess figures on the board and this is something i would expect this forum to know by now.

God also made the shooter shoot and made a person die, yes God is behind this too, i don't think this is something outrages to say on this forum.

It is a spiritual forum, not a spiritual-idiocy forum.

If God moves the figures on the board, then God also made me shit today. Is that a miracle?

Where are you drawing a line for what counts as a miracle?

[Danioover9000]

@strika

2 hours ago, strika said:

And to translate this into spirituality: He experienced a massive miracle.

 

[aurum]

3 minutes ago, nerdspeak said:

What is your definition of corporatism? 

Corporatism in the European sense brings organized labor into decisions. E.g., in Germany, companies with more than 2,000 employees need to have half of their board of directors elected by the rank-and-file employees. This prevents some of the worst excesses of predatory capitalism. 

I’m talking about excessive corporate power.

Predatory capitalism is exactly what JD Vance will help bring about. Even if he theoretically sees himself as supporting the little guy, in practice he will end up supporting oligarchy.

3 minutes ago, nerdspeak said:

Fascism has some corporatist elements but it's different in a couple ways: 

1. It removes the independence of unions from the state 

2. It makes confrontational strike action illegal (all strikes have to basically be approved by the state/ruling party)

3. It's tied to an aggressive imperialist foreign policy. 

I'm not backing Trump or Vance, and probably Trump is a threat to further democratic backsliding, but this Vance in my understanding does not advocate for 1, 2, or 3.  

I'm not sure I'd agree that Reagan respected democracy but that's a side-debate we won't get into for now. 

Those are very pedantic points that do not have to necessarily exist for fascism.

And if you don’t like the word fascism because it doesn’t fit a narrow technical definition, then call it something else. Call it authoritarianism.

It’s an attempt to end democracy. 

[strika]

11 minutes ago, aurum said:

It is a spiritual forum, not a spiritual-idiocy forum.

If God moves the figures on the board, then God also made me shit today. Is that a miracle?

Where are you drawing a line for what counts as a miracle?

Yes God moves the figures and God made you shit today, i wouldn't personally call it a miracle because i would use the word miracle for less mundane events and because it wasn't an event that if it went the other way would change the course of world events in the short term despite the fact that God was the one behind that event just like God was the one behind Trump's tilt of the head.

[strika]

9 minutes ago, Danioover9000 said:

@strika

 

?

[aurum]

13 minutes ago, strika said:

Yes God moves the figures and God made you shit today, i wouldn't personally call it a miracle because i would use the word miracle for less mundane events and because it wasn't an event that if it went the other way would change the course of world events in the short term despite the fact that God was the one behind that event just like God was the one behind Trump's tilt of the head.

World changing events like the holocaust? I guess you would consider that a miracle too by your definition.

You are supporting the right’s narrative that trump is some kind of god-appointed savior. Which is absurd.

[Joshe]

1 hour ago, strika said:

Obviously i didn't mean in the Christian way, that's why i said in my 1st post that i'm not talking from blue stage perspective when calling it a miracle.

I know you didn't mean it in the Christian way but you're coming to the defense of a statement that carried a lot of water for that view, although convoluted with some higher teachings. 

Edited July 19 by Joshe