Is purpose inherent or created? (Alternative way of looking into purpose)

[UpperMaster]

David Deida teaches that purpose is inherent within us, while Leo, as I understand it, teaches that purpose should be consciously and strategically constructed. I’m struggling to determine if one method is better than the other and would love to hear from anyone who has experience with the benefits of each approach.

Here’s a summary of my understanding of both methods:

David Deida:

• Purpose is not something you either have or lack; it’s something you either acknowledge or ignore.
• To discover deep purpose, you need to sit quietly and enter a state of deep not-knowing until a purpose reveals itself. This might take weeks. Initially, you may feel the urge to pee—that's your purpose then. Once you’re done, you return to your state. Avoid entertaining any thoughts or distractions, as these are seen as forms of the changing or feminine.
• When you realize your purpose, allow yourself to be fully driven by it until you no longer are.
• There’s a distinction between pretending to be in a state of not-knowing while chasing attractive mind distractions like partying, and genuinely committing to a state of not-knowing until purpose arises.

“Finding your purpose is fully sinking into the present moment and letting reality manifest through you as a gift to all.”

More details: https://deida.info/2016/02/14/deep-purpose/

Leo’s Life Purpose:

• Purpose should be carefully constructed based on value assessments, personality tests, and deep introspection.
• It is not inherent but rather created.
• More practical, discusses concepts such as 10,000 hour rule, and addresses ways to actually motivate yourself. Overall seems more holistic and practical. Does not treat purpose as inherent to man, but rather something you should construct.

 

Is purpose inherent to individuals or should it be created?  

[UnbornTao]

Take a look for yourself: What is purpose? Is it found? Where? What makes something valuable and meaningful? We use chairs when we want to sit. When we want to dance, chairs get in the way and are discarded

Prior to purpose and function, what is an object? What's the purpose of a toaster? Is it about how things relate to you? Perceive a small object such as a pencil, book or notebook, as distinguished from thinking or feeling about it. Let an object be as it is, not as it relates to you.

That purpose is created doesn't undermine its value and contribution, which people seem to conclude when first hearing this take on purpose.

Edited July 1 by UnbornTao

[UpperMaster]

6 hours ago, UnbornTao said:

 

That purpose is created doesn't undermine its value, which people seem to assume when adopting this perspective as a belief.

 

Yea but it sounds way cooler if it just comes to you. Like oh idk what my purpose is let me just sit down in my room for 3 weeks in solitude. Boom, you know your purpose. But it seems like Leo talks about this aswell, its just that in David Deida's model, the outer layers of purpose or initial purposes are gonna be materialistic fear driver crap, Leo teaches this as burning karma so I guess both teachings overlap

Edited June 29 by UpperMaster

[zazen]

Perhaps both. If we are not separate from the All, but a living expression of it - then our purpose is a discovery (inherent) and a creation (extrinsic). It's unveiling that which has always been, and a shaping of that which is becoming.

Inherent purpose is that which is, extrinsic purpose is that which is yet to be - which we work towards with what we have (capabilities and environmental opportunities). The feminine path of purpose is surrender (to what is, presence) the masculine path to purpose is striving (to what can be, potential).

[UnbornTao]

On 29/06/2024 at 6:53 PM, UpperMaster said:

Yea but it sounds way cooler if it just comes to you. Like oh idk what my purpose is let me just sit down in my room for 3 weeks in solitude. Boom, you know your purpose. But it seems like Leo talks about this aswell, its just that in David Deida's model, the outer layers of purpose or initial purposes are gonna be materialistic fear driver crap, Leo teaches this as burning karma so I guess both teachings overlap

That is how it occurs--as an activity generated by you--though we have yet to become conscious of that.

What is purpose and how is it created independent of what others say? 

Better to delve into it.

Edited July 1 by UnbornTao

[UpperMaster]

23 hours ago, UnbornTao said:

That is how it occurs--as an activity generated by you--though we have yet to become conscious of that.

What is purpose and how is it created independent of what others say? 

Better to delve into it.

Deida says this: You are your mission, and if you don’t know it, you are not relaxed in the moment. So you don’t have to find your mission, you need to relax in the moment to discover it. It is being shown to you right now. You are being lived by a force deeper than you. Masculine practice is intuitively feeling and identifying with that force so that when you wake up in the morning, you are lived by your mission. If you don’t know what that is, it is because you are thinking. Your mind will never know your mission. You will never feel your mission if you are attending to your thoughts hoping to see what your mission is in the future.

 

So to answer your question, purpose is always there you just have to realise it. Not my words.

[UnbornTao]

@UpperMaster 

I know it is appealing to think that an outside force is responsible for your purpose, as it takes you off the hook. It is comfortable. But is it true? If believing in this helps you in some way, that's fine too. Just don't conflate that wish with finding out what's true in the matter. How is purpose inherent? Where does it show up? Rumors and opinions aside, including your own, what is purpose, for real? 

Purpose is the reason why you take an action or course of action.

For example, consider the different purposes that one might have for going to the gym. Regarding mission, again, where does it show up?

Any form of meaning may arise in or as the relationship you establish between you and events and conditions. Does mission depend on something external that is to be "uncovered" by you or, to be simplistic, is it found in your mind? 

Getting ontological for a minute: What is, say, an object? Could Being (what is) be prior to value and meaning, hence prior to purpose and mission, too? Is purpose somehow inherent in the nature of that thing, or is it instead "projected after the fact"? Is purpose set in stone? What about the possibility of stuff being meaningless and without purpose?

Edited July 2 by UnbornTao

[Emerald]

What I have experienced is that the life-purpose is more innate. 

In one of my Ayahuasca experiences, it showed me that my life's purpose was "mercy".

And it showed me how mercy had been a CONSTANT driving force in my life all the way throughout even back to my earliest memories.

Think of this as like a North Star where it is a constant guiding light... or like the natural flow of the current of the truest deepest will.

But it is deliberately left very open-ended so that you can choose any scale or form to express it in. I could scale it down and just give myself mercy. Or I can scale it up and find ways to give mercy to the whole world. 

And I can choose many different jobs and careers that intertwine with mercy. Or I can choose to not incorporate this life's purpose into my work if that were my choice. 

So, there is also a high degree of choice within it. But if you want to find the life's purpose, look for your most honest and most persistent motivation that shows up in your life CONSTANTLY.

It is subtle but pervasive... and you can spot it if you know how to look for it.

[Yimpa]

@Emerald cool, mine is “exploration”.

[Emerald]

3 hours ago, Yimpa said:

@Emerald cool, mine is “exploration”.

Nice!