Male VS Female spirituality

[universe]

In 2018 I had a similar question.

 @Emerald made a great point that us speculating on female spirituality is just intellectual speculation.

So why not take the inputs from this thread and use them to explore the feminine side of spirituality within yourself? I think a good place to start is with the body. In the end all roads lead to (infinite)-Rome. We turn inwards and deeply fall in Love with all.

❤️

[BlessedLion]

6 hours ago, Lila9 said:

What are the traps and disadvantages of following only feminine or only masculine spirituality?

If you go too Masculine you miss out on the human side of things and definitely miss out on Love. It almost becomes like Autistic. I’ve met these kinda spiritual guys and they are so lacking heart and just a normal socially integrated human side. 
 

If you go to Feminine you get lost in ego games and drama and create a whole personality out of being a spiritual Goddess and most women I know in the path are deeply still attached to their ego and have little interest in the truth of reality. 

[Quader]

@Leo Gura

The differences between Male and Female are significant in most animal species. But what makes them masculine or feminine is not dependent on a species sex. I'm implying there's a bias that's happened here historically due to our species' biological differences granting survival favorable for men  =  the enabling of pursuits beyond baseline surviving (i.e. spirituality pursued),  defining Male and Female's characteristics as a product of primitive survival mechanisms. The different hormone's "reaction" might not be a result of the hormone but of social conditioning and other such programming sort of molding it in a way that survives naturally within the given circumstance provided to it. 

[Salvijus]

8 hours ago, Lila9 said:

What are the traps and disadvantages of following only feminine or only masculine spirituality?

There are no traps. 

It's like this. 

To succeed in science, you have to make your mind so sharp that it cuts through everything in existence. That's one way of arriving at truth. That's masculine

To succeed at art, you have to make your heart so open, that you lose yourself and only God's love and passion is being channeled through you. That's is another way of becoming one with truth. That's feminine

The more you grow in science , the richer your life will be. The more you grow in art, the richer your life will be but in a different way. You can focus on one only, or both, or anything in between. It doesn't matter. Whatever works for you. 

Masculine is about knowing truth. Feminine is about being true. At some point they cross over and become the same thing. It's like getting to the same mountain peak from two different sides. 

The problem with masculine alone is that they can be very arrogant (a simptom of being intellectual) . The problem with the feminine alone is that they can be vary flaky, ungrounded in reality. 

Edited June 17 by Salvijus

[Lila9]

4 hours ago, BlessedLion said:

If you go too Masculine you miss out on the human side of things and definitely miss out on Love. It almost becomes like Autistic. I’ve met these kinda spiritual guys and they are so lacking heart and just a normal socially integrated human side. 
 

If you go to Feminine you get lost in ego games and drama and create a whole personality out of being a spiritual Goddess and most women I know in the path are deeply still attached to their ego and have little interest in the truth of reality. 

Interesting, what is the reason that people keep being too identified with only masculine or only feminine paths even when it sabotages their lives the way you described?

 

[Lila9]

3 hours ago, Salvijus said:

There are no traps. 

It's like this. 

To succeed in science, you have to make your mind so sharp that it cuts through everything in existence. That's one way of arriving at truth. That's masculine

To succeed at art, you have to make your heart so open, that you lose yourself and only God's love and passion is being channeled through you. That's is another way of becoming one with truth. That's feminine

The more you grow in science , the richer your life will be. The more you grow in art, the richer your life will be but in a different way. You can focus on one only, or both, or anything in between. It doesn't matter. Whatever works for you. 

If one wants to be really great in science, don't they have to be a little bit of an artist as well?

If one wants to be really great in art, don't they have to be a little bit of a scientist as well?

Isn't it a bit counterintuitive?

Edited June 17 by Lila9

[Lila9]

6 hours ago, universe said:

In 2018 I had a similar question.

 @Emerald made a great point that us speculating on female spirituality is just intellectual speculation.

So why not take the inputs from this thread and use them to explore the feminine side of spirituality within yourself? I think a good place to start is with the body. In the end all roads lead to (infinite)-Rome. We turn inwards and deeply fall in Love with all.

❤️

I really wasn't aware of this thread. I wasn't even aware of Actualized in 2018, but thanks, I will check it out.

2018 is like 1000 years ago in the era of the internet, so I don't see any problem in discussing it again in 2024

[Salvijus]

18 minutes ago, Lila9 said:

If one wants to be really great in science, don't they have to be a little bit of an artist as well?

If one wants to be really great in art, don't they have to be a little bit of a scientist as well?

Isn't it a bit counterintuitive?

It helps. Yea. 

[eos_nyxia]

For a long time, in many different cultures, being a "witch" (whether this was actually true or not) or a childless, unmarried spinster type was NOT a compliment, and could get you in a lot of trouble too. Your life and livelihood would be at risk. People have also had a hard time conceptualizing the value of a woman who does not lean heavily into her feminine charms (sexualized or otherwise), and who has no interest in either reproducing or centering themselves around the caretaker role. It's a double-outcast role, in that way.

Also, we stopped housing the feminine in an institutionally-sanctioned (in both church and state), feminine-centered way, a very long time ago. For most of human history, really. How could a woman carving out her own space within an unwelcoming, masculinized framework not be an exception rather than a rule?

For example, there were some very prolific female Christian nuns and mystics. (Hildegard Von Bingen was super famous in her day, and only became well known again around the turn of the turn of the century for her music, writings, and visions. Perhaps in that order.) Do you know how much she had to put herself down as a woman to get taken seriously during her lifetime for her visions? That was her "foot in the door", so to speak.

It takes something extra to have masculine-identifying and centered people survive in a feminine-centered world as well, FYI. Let alone thrive.

Not sure why this surprises anyone.

Edited June 17 by eos_nyxia

[Davino]

5 hours ago, Lila9 said:

what is the reason that people keep being too identified with only masculine or only feminine paths even when it sabotages their lives the way you described?

Because they can't go meta. It's hard to go beyond the way you are living into higher synthesis and consciousness.

5 hours ago, Lila9 said:

If one wants to be really great in science, don't they have to be a little bit of an artist as well?

If one wants to be really great in art, don't they have to be a little bit of a scientist as well?

Isn't it a bit counterintuitive?

One breaths into the other, there isn't any sex without polarities. It's impossible to do anything without a combination of both, inhaling calls exhaling and the contraction of the heart beat calls the expansion of the blood. Some situations demand different degrees of masculine and femenine but both are always involved.

[Davino]

18 hours ago, Rafael Thundercat said:

As far as I know women have been allowed to do dietas. I'm most familiar with the shipibo tribe, that IMO, is the most conscious and professional in psychedelic use. For example, Olivia Arevalo was the head of the Shipibo - Konibo people. I think in Brazil women took also a very important roles in medicine healing but maybe not in positions of power. Moreover in mexico we have Maria Sabina, there have always been great women healers, because the shamanic nurturing aspects calls a lot to the femenine.

If you have the opportunity to listen to this videos while tripping, it will be an experience you will forever remember. In the sober state doesn't make much sense, while on psychedelics, it couldn't be more profound.

 

 

[Rafael Thundercat]

@Davino Never participated in Shipibo tradicion. But I can Imagine what is to listen the Icaro she sings under effect of the Plant. The Brasilian Tribes have a different way of singing in only voice and they now added Guitar to their tradicion to add a more celebrative vibe. For me sometimes I feel that the instruments at same time bring a lot of power to the ceremony but also sometimes is to much noise and distraction and the group end up disperse, I would love to do one of this Shipibo full dark ceremonies with only voice.. 

This is an example of their way of work : I prefer more the Huni Kuin way.

I had sitted with many of the main Healers and Singers of the tradition: There is a difference of Healer and Singer, the Healer is specificaly the Pajé and the Singer is called "Txaná" is means, is one that is able to sing but is stil in the path of becoming a Pajé. 

For me among many lessons, I personally find the ceremonies a space to train the capacity to Deep Listening, to be present, to learn Music, to look to the Inner Shadows and of course Sometimes jailbreak a little bit more of the mind constructs. But many times I confess I need to go away from the group not because is to intense but because I acess more Clarity far from the group. Ayahusca circles teach me one thing: Socializing can be derogatory to Realization. No mistake that Shamans live sometimes far from the Main Villages, away from the Tribe, or only in the Fringe. 

[gettoefl]

7 hours ago, Lila9 said:

If one wants to be really great in science, don't they have to be a little bit of an artist as well?

If one wants to be really great in art, don't they have to be a little bit of a scientist as well?

Isn't it a bit counterintuitive?

god is the middle way between good and bad, heart and mind ... but it helps to deeply understands the poles first, to thy own self be true

[Lila9]

13 hours ago, eos_nyxia said:

For a long time, in many different cultures, being a "witch" (whether this was actually true or not) or a childless, unmarried spinster type was NOT a compliment, and could get you in a lot of trouble too. Your life and livelihood would be at risk. People have also had a hard time conceptualizing the value of a woman who does not lean heavily into her feminine charms (sexualized or otherwise), and who has no interest in either reproducing or centering themselves around the caretaker role. It's a double-outcast role, in that way.

Reading this, I feel privileged and grateful that I was not born in that era.

13 hours ago, eos_nyxia said:

Also, we stopped housing the feminine in an institutionally-sanctioned (in both church and state), feminine-centered way, a very long time ago. For most of human history, really. How could a woman carving out her own space within an unwelcoming, masculinized framework not be an exception rather than a rule?

I definitely can see it.

I noticed that the part of the divine feminine that serves the patriarchy (being compassionate, nurturing, and a caregiver) may be the only aspect of femininity that is idealized, accepted, and tolerated in a male-dominant society, especially and mainly if it's for others and not for the woman herself.

Other aspects of the divine feminine, like intuition, emotions (especially negative ones), sexuality (for pure pleasure rather than performance for men), wisdom, and creativity, are less appreciated and considered more intimidating. This might be because they are more "selfish," requiring a lot of solitude, such as in the creation of art and connecting to the inner self for developing intuition.

When women spend time in solitude, creating art, and connecting to their intuition, living from their "being," this is the essence and core of femininity in my opinion, pure Yin.

This is the foundation of womanhood for me.

13 hours ago, eos_nyxia said:

For example, there were some very prolific female Christian nuns and mystics. (Hildegard Von Bingen was super famous in her day, and only became well known again around the turn of the turn of the century for her music, writings, and visions. Perhaps in that order.) Do you know how much she had to put herself down as a woman to get taken seriously during her lifetime for her visions? That was her "foot in the door", so to speak.

I don't like the idea that an intelligent woman had to put herself down to receive the basic recognition that an intelligent man can easily obtain.

This is especially true for a mystic type of person, who may be the least likely to enjoy such political games.

Edited June 17 by Lila9

[Lila9]

7 hours ago, Davino said:

If you have the opportunity to listen to this videos while tripping, it will be an experience you will forever remember. In the sober state doesn't make much sense, while on psychedelics, it couldn't be more profound.

Listening to this sober, it moves something inside me.

[Lila9]

 

6 hours ago, gettoefl said:

god is the middle way between good and bad, heart and mind ... but it helps to deeply understands the poles first, to thy own self be true

What eliminates the resistance to accept both of the polarities within ourselves and others? 

[Davino]

6 hours ago, gettoefl said:

god is the middle way between good and bad, heart and mind ... but it helps to deeply understands the poles first, to thy own self be true

NO!

Infinity is not neutral, nor the middle way or anything like that. It's a huge trap to cognise it that way, it will limit your awakenings. Just beware, I'm just a traffic signal in your path

[Lila9]

6 minutes ago, Davino said:

NO!

Infinity is not neutral, nor the middle way or anything like that. It's a huge trap to cognise it that way, it will limit your awakenings. Just beware, I'm just a traffic signal in your path

If infinity is not neutral, then what infinity is? Because there is no bias in infinity, but only in our minds. 

We must not be neutral for the sake of our survival, but infinity? It has nothing to lose.

[Rafael Thundercat]

2 hours ago, Lila9 said:

If infinity is not neutral, then what infinity is? Because there is no bias in infinity, but only in our minds. 

We must not be neutral for the sake of our survival, but infinity? It has nothing to lose.

You seem to cognize infinity as a sort of dull thing that is unable to have will, or intelligence. Infinity is infinitly intelligent. How do you think you are capable to have will, desires,instincts,heart beat, breathing, digestion,and all that make you body moves? You are made of it, entrenched in it. You mind is in-infinity. 

Infinity finitizing itself. Self imposed limits is possible. If the possobility of breaking limits is possible so the oposite is also possible. Expansion and Contraction. 

 

[BlessedLion]

20 hours ago, Lila9 said:

Interesting, what is the reason that people keep being too identified with only masculine or only feminine paths even when it sabotages their lives the way you described?

 

I think it’s just because that’s what they know. You learn all your spirituality in a masculine environment like Zen, you will naturally close off to the more feminine style of it and vise versa