Can we define an awakening once and for all

[Sugarcoat]

I feel many people describe it vaguely .
Not saying there is one correct definition or one version of it, can probably mean different things. I’m not afraid of conceptualizing either, it doesn’t hurt anything, I don’t hold onto ideas, no thought is able to exactly grasp at anything anyways. 

I had one massive shift which I would describe as a permanent dissolution of my mental self/mental reality. It was like my sense of self was permanently detached from my mind. I remember I stood in my kitchen and boom my entire being was released from attachment in the mind and it was permanent. 

I don’t consider myself enlightened because I have a sense of self still but it’s not a self attached to the mind/mental self. im just sharing this description based on direct experience

Edited June 4 by Sugarcoat

[Breakingthewall]

I would say it's pretty obvious that it's possible. And it's possible permanent awakening too. Many have done it, and more and more will do it. It is a gradual process but it requires intention and effort, order, intelligence and seriousness. Once you detach yourself from the mind, you perceive what reality is, or rather, reality perceives itself as what it is. mental structures are perceived as what they are: mental structures that occur in this dimension of existence, which is one among infinite ones, then the attachment to these structures is relativized. They are relatively real. Absolutely only formless reality is real, everything else is relative. Relative does not mean false, it means that it is real in a certain circumstance, not in all.

You cannot leave the form that you are but you can perceive your formless substance that is potential of all forms, and be one with it 24/7. then the form, although relatively important, passes into the background. to a relative plane. You don't want your family to be skinned alive and then be eaten by hungry rats, but it's a relative horror, not an absolute one. The only absolute thing is your infinite substance, and if you perceive it clearly and fully, it is total perfection, fullness. So the smart business is to move more to the absolute side and less to the relative, because being attached to the impermanence means suffering by definition .

In short: awakening is seeing through the relative and perceive the absolute reality that you are. 

Edited June 4 by Breakingthewall

[Princess Arabia]

2 hours ago, Sugarcoat said:

I don’t consider myself enlightened because I have a sense of self still but it’s not a self attached to the mind/mental self. im just sharing this description based on direct experience

That is still the mind saying it's not attached to the mind/self. There's no way for the "I" to detach from the mind/self because the "I" isn't already there for it to detached. What you have described here in this quote is still thought addressing thought. 

What you have described in the whole OP is the "I" having an experience which is a part of the "I" dream, which never really happened and is only an appearance. There's no way to awaken out of a dream that's not really happening but only from the dream itself which is still a part of the dream. 

[Sugarcoat]

5 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

I would say it's pretty obvious that it's possible. And it's possible permanent awakening too. Many have done it, and more and more will do it. It is a gradual process but it requires intention and effort, order, intelligence and seriousness. Once you detach yourself from the mind, you perceive what reality is, or rather, reality perceives itself as what it is. mental structures are perceived as what they are: mental structures that occur in this dimension of existence, which is one among infinite ones, then the attachment to these structures is relativized. They are relatively real. Absolutely only formless reality is real, everything else is relative. Relative does not mean false, it means that it is real in a certain circumstance, not in all.

You cannot leave the form that you are but you can perceive your formless substance that is potential of all forms, and be one with it 24/7. then the form, although relatively important, passes into the background. to a relative plane. You don't want your family to be skinned alive and then be eaten by hungry rats, but it's a relative horror, not an absolute one. The only absolute thing is your infinite substance, and if you perceive it clearly and fully, it is total perfection, fullness. So the smart business is to move more to the absolute side and less to the relative, because being attached to the impermanence means suffering by definition .

In short: awakening is seeing through the relative and perceive the absolute reality that you are. 

im with you mostly, at first it sounds like you are describing what happened here for me, but then when you say  how reality perceives itself, and to be "one with" the formless substance, it sounds to me like it would be a total absence of sense of self, which is not something ive "experienced", because I still have a sense of self, but I can kind of "see" or intuit everything youre saying  at the same time. So in one way it sounds like we are talking about the same thing and in another not.

Edited June 4 by Sugarcoat

[Sugarcoat]

3 hours ago, Princess Arabia said:

That is still the mind saying it's not attached to the mind/self. There's no way for the "I" to detach from the mind/self because the "I" isn't already there for it to detached. What you have described here in this quote is still thought addressing thought. 

What you have described in the whole OP is the "I" having an experience which is a part of the "I" dream, which never really happened and is only an appearance. There's no way to awaken out of a dream that's not really happening but only from the dream itself which is still a part of the dream. 

I mean I still have a sense of I, so its not gone completely, that's why I can talk about it because the sense of I is still here, and I can describe a profound all encompassing shift in this I sense, in the same way I can describe another experience , its just description ofc, but if I can talk about the weather why can't I talk about this, if there is no separation with that non dual reasoning you can't even talk about anything because all talk is dual 

[Kuba Powiertowski]

@Sugarcoat imagine a world without strict definitions of anything. If you like it, live in it

[zurew]

6 hours ago, Sugarcoat said:

I feel many people describe it vaguely .

People like to be very vague here, unfortunately.

[Salvijus]

Enlightenment is when there is zero internal conflict inside you. And all internal conflict boils down to fear (ego) versus love (your hearts true desire). The more a person becomes aware of their heart's desire and follows it, the more aligned they become with their True Authentic Self which is without any internal conflict. When you're fully in alignment with your heart and true self, you're in alignment with the whole universe. When you're in alignment with the whole universe you experience infinite love. When the intelligence of infinite love is the only thing that moves your body and mind, you become a Messiah on earth. Ggwp. Game over. 

Edited June 4 by Salvijus

[Sugarcoat]

14 minutes ago, Kuba Powiertowski said:

@Sugarcoat imagine a world without strict definitions of anything. If you like it, live in it

Maybe my title wasn’t the best since im open to any descriptions

my world is kind of like that if I can say that 

I like to conceptualize tho but it’s quite fluid 

Edited June 4 by Sugarcoat

[Sugarcoat]

14 minutes ago, zurew said:

People like to be very vague here, unfortunately.

I don’t know how much is intentional or not. Sometimes it can sound grandiose too 

[strika]

7 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

Enlightenment is when there is zero internal conflict inside you. And all internal conflict boils down to fear (ego) versus love (your hearts true desire). The more a person becomes aware of their heart's desire and follows it, the more aligned they become with their True Authentic Self which is without any internal conflict. When you're fully in alignment with your heart and true self, you're in alignment with the whole universe. When you're in alignment with the whole universe you experience infinite love. When the intelligence of infinite love is the only thing that moves your body and mind, you become a Messiah on earth. Ggwp. Game over. 

I agree with this one

[Sugarcoat]

7 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

Enlightenment is when there is zero internal conflict inside you. And all internal conflict boils down to fear (ego) versus love (your hearts true desire). The more a person becomes aware of their heart's desire and follows it, the more aligned they become with their True Authentic Self which is without any internal conflict. When you're fully in alignment with your heart and true self, you're in alignment with the whole universe. When you're in alignment with the whole universe you experience infinite love. When the intelligence of infinite love is the only thing that moves your body and mind, you become a Messiah on earth. Ggwp. Game over. 

That sounds beautiful. Do you experience it where did you get it from?

[Salvijus]

@Sugarcoat it's from "the way of mastery" , the very first thing I shared with you but you never watched it, it's from there. 

7 minutes ago, Sugarcoat said:

Do you experience it

If this was live, I would just look at you and smile and don't say anything.

[Sugarcoat]

4 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

@Sugarcoat it's from "the way of mastery" , the very first thing I shared with you but you never watched it, it's from there. 

If this was live, I would just look at you and smile and don't say anything.

“But you never watched it” lol exposed 

 

not say anything why? Because it can’t be spoken or? Or you mean your smile explain it all

Edited June 4 by Sugarcoat

[Salvijus]

The smile says it all... 🥲

2 minutes ago, Sugarcoat said:

“But you never watched it” lol exposed 

[Sugarcoat]

1 minute ago, Salvijus said:

The smile says it all... 🥲

That’s beautiful 

[Yimpa]

Perfectly Meaningful-less ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 

[Sugarcoat]

6 minutes ago, Yimpa said:

Perfectly Meaningful-less ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 

The “emoji “ lol

 

[Inliytened1]

9 hours ago, Sugarcoat said:

I feel many people describe it vaguely .
Not saying there is one correct definition or one version of it, can probably mean different things. I’m not afraid of conceptualizing either, it doesn’t hurt anything, I don’t hold onto ideas, no thought is able to exactly grasp at anything anyways. 

I had one massive shift which I would describe as a permanent dissolution of my mental self/mental reality. It was like my sense of self was permanently detached from my mind. I remember I stood in my kitchen and boom my entire being was released from attachment in the mind and it was permanent. 

I don’t consider myself enlightened because I have a sense of self still but it’s not a self attached to the mind/mental self. im just sharing this description based on direct experience

No self (you're not the self you thought you were)  is awakening.   All subsequent awakenings spawn from that.   

Edited June 4 by Inliytened1

[James123]

@Sugarcoat enlightenment is simply being where you already are. That's it.