How important is a 5MEO facilitator?

[BlessedLion]

I’m reading Martin Balls books and he really stresses the need for a facilitator to manage the energy. Is that true? 

[Leo Gura]

No.

But it really depends on how mature you are.

Risk increases if you are alone and you get a bad trip.

Edited May 24 by Leo Gura

[BlessedLion]

@Leo Gura Thanks. Is the risk like self harm or something? Or just going off the rails?

[Leo Gura]

5 minutes ago, BlessedLion said:

@Leo Gura Thanks. Is the risk like self harm or something? Or just going off the rails?

Both and more.

[Davino]

19 hours ago, BlessedLion said:

I’m reading Martin Balls books and he really stresses the need for a facilitator to manage the energy. Is that true? 

You are a kundalini yoga practicioner, why are you doubting yourself like that? Of course you'll be able to manage the energy. Just start with a low dose and work your way up, maybe for newbies with a smoked breakthrough dose a facilitator is necessary but you should be fine.

Do your spiritual practice before the trip and if kundalini gets triggered during the experience, just flow with it; that's what I do.

I would be more concerned about mind, psyche and consciousness rather than energy in your case, also integration is crucial.

Edited May 24 by Davino

[OBEler]

18 hours ago, BlessedLion said:

I’m reading Martin Balls books and he really stresses the need for a facilitator to manage the energy. Is that true? 

He is probably doing a bit marketing for himself.

But for beginners it can be helpful.

[halfknots]

The reason people say you must have a facilitator for 5-MeO-DMT is that, at high enough doses, everything you have come to know as reality will fall away. Completely.

At a certain level not only will you leave your body, you will leave the concept of bodies behind. At these levels it is important to have someone present to make sure your physical body is safe from thrashing about, choking on vomit, or jumping off of a balcony.

If you start with low doses and work your way up very mindfully and slowly, you can get away without a facilitator. With high doses, especially vaporized, especially early on, a facilitator/trained sitter is non negotiable.

 

[Davino]

18 minutes ago, OBEler said:

He is probably doing a bit marketing for himself.

Don't think so, he still wrote books recommending facilitators after he stopped offering such services.

My thoughts are that he discovered a very niche niche form of energetic therapy that comes from non-egoic consciousness. I've experimented a bit with it and there's a lot of potential for healing no doubt, but as I said it's very niche. 5meo can open a million other doors for exploration.

 

[Schizophonia]

19 hours ago, BlessedLion said:

I’m reading Martin Balls books and he really stresses the need for a facilitator to manage the energy. Is that true? 

I know he did books about Salvia too, have you read them ? 

I have some x15 in my closet.

Edited May 24 by Schizophonia

[Davino]

1 hour ago, Schizophonia said:

I know he did books about Salvia too, have you read them ? 

There are only two good books written about salvia for Awakening. One is his book and the other is Salvia Divinorum: Doorway to Thought-Free Awareness by J. D. Arthur

It's not like you have much to choose from, so read both plus a bunch of trip reports and become ready for all that to be skull fucked by a an elf.

So in the end, forget all and surrender everything at the feet of Salvia before tripping.

 

1 hour ago, Schizophonia said:

I have some x15 in my closet.

Pray a Hail Mary and inhale

Edited May 24 by Davino

[Leo Gura]

Martin has a very specfic, narrow process for using psychedelics which aligns with his personal style and personality type.

5-MeO need not be done in that fashion AT ALL.

It's as if someone told you that rice should be eaten in a white bowl with soy sauce, and that is the only proper way to eat rice.

Edited May 25 by Leo Gura

[BlessedLion]

18 hours ago, Davino said:

You are a kundalini yoga practicioner, why are you doubting yourself like that? Of course you'll be able to manage the energy. Just start with a low dose and work your way up, maybe for newbies with a smoked breakthrough dose a facilitator is necessary but you should be fine.

Do your spiritual practice before the trip and if kundalini gets triggered during the experience, just flow with it; that's what I do.

I would be more concerned about mind, psyche and consciousness rather than energy in your case, also integration is crucial.

Cheers, appreciate the advice. I also feel mature enough to handle it but always try to be extra cautious with psychedelics especially first time around. It seems the verdict is that it’s not necessary 

[BlessedLion]

10 hours ago, OBEler said:

He is probably doing a bit marketing for himself.

But for beginners it can be helpful.

You think he’d actually try to pump himself up in his books? Seems a bit unnecessary and he actually quit serving a while ago

[BlessedLion]

9 hours ago, Schizophonia said:

I know he did books about Salvia too, have you read them ? 

I have some x15 in my closet.

Haven’t read those but he says Slavia helped him a lot in his journey

[BlessedLion]

27 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Martin has a very specfic, narrow process for using psychedelics which aligns with his personal style and personality type.

5-MeO need not be done in that fashion AT ALL.

It's as if someone told you that rice should be eaten in a white bowl with soy sauce, and that is the only proper way to eat rice.

Ya it’s super specific almost to a point where it’d be impossible to find a facilitator who follows all those rules. 
 

That said, he really knows his shit and would probably be an amazing guide. I’d feel safe doing a massive dose with him around. 
 

He also has a new book which addresses this and he explains multiple ways to facilitate and do 5 MEO, maybe bc a lot of people have him this exact feedback. 
 

 

[Leo Gura]

Doing a massive dose just because someone is in the room with you is not gonna save you or remove the danger.

You should not be doing massive doses at all since it can be physically dangerous.

Edited May 25 by Leo Gura

[OBEler]

2 hours ago, BlessedLion said:

You think he’d actually try to pump himself up in his books? Seems a bit unnecessary and he actually quit serving a while ago

That's not unnecessary. From a marketing perspective this is great, because it generates customers. When he said that he was still in service.

Also back then he was one of the only few 5 meo facilitators out there. So people who think about a facilitator will find him.

.

Edited May 25 by OBEler

[OBEler]

56 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Doing a massive dose just because someone is in the room with you is not gonna save you or remove the danger.

You should not be doing massive doses at all since it can be physically dangerous.

Can you tell, if high doses (not massive doses) are still valuable to explore? 

[Grateful Dead]

If you want to get your first breakthrough, then I would recommend a trip sitter. But if you've already had breakthroughs on other psychedelics, you'll usually be fine on your own.

[Leo Gura]

40 minutes ago, OBEler said:

Can you tell, if high doses (not massive doses) are still valuable to explore? 

As high a dose as you can safely handle is valuable.

But there's no way to know for sure what that dose is, so err on the side of caution. You can always do a higher dose later. But you cannot undo an over-dose.

It's like you're fishing with dynamite, and you never quite know how close you can throw the dynamite next to your boat before it will injure you.

Edited May 25 by Leo Gura