ICC Prosecutor seeks arrest warrants for Benjamin Netanyahu, Gallant and Hamas leader

[Karmadhi]

https://www.theguardian.com/law/article/2024/may/20/icc-prosecutor-seeks-arrest-warrants-israeli-pm-netanyahu-hamas-officials-war-crimes

The chickens have come home to roast  

"Self defense" my ass.

Edited May 20 by Karmadhi

[aurum]

My guess is that it's unlikely there will be any serious consequences for the Israeli leaders. Symbolic move more than anything else.

[Karmadhi]

12 minutes ago, aurum said:

My guess is that it's unlikely there will be any serious consequences for the Israeli leaders. Symbolic move more than anything else.

Probably, but it shows Israel is a criminal state.

It greatly damages their reputation, especially among European countries that actually take ICC into account.

Also It might affect US elections now that USA is basically backing up a criminal state.

Being put on the same basket as Putin (who has also an ICC warrant) is a big blow to Israel.

One might say that BiBi is responsible for more crimes than even Putin.

Edited May 20 by Karmadhi

[aurum]

1 hour ago, Karmadhi said:

Probably, but it shows Israel is a criminal state.

Not legally. There would have to be a trial for that.

1 hour ago, Karmadhi said:

It greatly damages their reputation, especially among European countries that actually take ICC into account.

Also It might affect US elections now that USA is basically backing up a criminal state.

Being put on the same basket as Putin (who has also an ICC warrant) is a big blow to Israel.

Maybe. It’s certainly not a good look for Israel. But given that there will be no trial, I suspect ramifications will be relatively minor.

[Danioover9000]

@Karmadhi

On 2024-05-20 at 3:37 PM, Karmadhi said:

https://www.theguardian.com/law/article/2024/may/20/icc-prosecutor-seeks-arrest-warrants-israeli-pm-netanyahu-hamas-officials-war-crimes

The chickens have come home to roast  

"Self defense" my ass.

   Good luck to him for seeking to prosecute that bi-bi prick. I hope he makes history.

[Basman]

It rings a bit hollow to me when Western-European countries denounce Israel while relying on the US to provide the majority of military power via NATO (the US supports Israel meanwhile).

[DocWatts]

2 hours ago, Basman said:

It rings a bit hollow to me when Western-European countries denounce Israel while relying on the US to provide the majority of military power via NATO (the US supports Israel meanwhile).

As an American citizen, seeing our NATO allies criticize the US for enabling Israeli's war crimes is a good thing, even if they don't have the power to change the prevailing geopolitical security arrangement. International condemnation is completely deserved here. The US wields immense power to influence events in Gaza, which it is currently using to support Israeli's far-right government, rather than calling for an immediate ceasefire.

Edited May 21 by DocWatts

[Karmadhi]

26 minutes ago, DocWatts said:

As an American citizen, seeing our NATO allies criticize the US for enabling Israeli's war crimes is a good thing, even if they don't have the power to change the prevailing geopolitical security arrangement. International condemnation is completely deserved here. The US wields immense power to influence events in Gaza, which it is currently using to support Israeli's far-right government, rather than calling for an immediate ceasefire.

Why does USA support that far right government? Since it is so powerful, cant it influence Israel into ditching them and putting a moderate pro peace government instead? I mean they have toppled regimes in the past so many times.

I do not see how Bibi with company benefit the US in any way.

Since you are American I would like to see your POV.

When they say "Israel is our biggest ally", what do they really mean?

How so?

Edited May 21 by Karmadhi

[DocWatts]

1 hour ago, Karmadhi said:

Why does USA support that far right government? Since it is so powerful, cant it influence Israel into ditching them and putting a moderate pro peace government instead? I mean they have toppled regimes in the past so many times.

I do not see how Bibi with company benefit the US in any way.

Since you are American I would like to see your POV.

When they say "Israel is our biggest ally", what do they really mean?

How so?

The interesting and unfortunate thing is that the US funnelling billions of dollars towards Bibi's illegal war isn't of any benefit to US strategic interests.

It's more a matter of the right wing in Israel being very good at understanding and leveraging US domestic politics for its own ends. Basically selling its colonialist war in Gaza as a 'war on terrorism'. When in actuality Bibi's far right government is fueling Islamic extremism, and the Israeli government is responsible for the rise and continued existence of Hamas.

And leveraging support from the religious right in the US (many of which subscribe to a type of scriptural literalism, which foretells that Israel is necessary for the Christian rapture to take place - sadly I'm not joking).

It also sells itself to the US as the 'only democracy in the middle east', when in actually it's regime is probably closer to the apartheid government of South Africa than a contemporary Western European style democracy.

If the US made continued military and financial support to Israeli conditional upon an immediate ceasefire in Gaza, the war might not end tomorrow but it would put tremendous pressure on the Israeli government to agree to the UN ceasefire.

Edited May 22 by DocWatts

[zazen]

Good points above. In regards to US self interest this clip is enlightening:

Alon Mizrahi:

"Let us not forget what this day means for Israel and Israelis, because today has cataclysmic legal, political, financial, and normative implications: What this day means is that a number of important countries (with many more forecast to join them) see Israel and Israelis, soldiers and civilians alike, as illegal invaders in the sovereign state of Palestine when they are in the West Bank, East Jerusalem, and Gaza. This is what this really means, and this is a huge, tectonic departure from the previously acceptable diplomatic approach to the issue of Palestine.

This recognition needs to be understood as a formal expression of complete and final distrust in Israel in everything relating to Palestine and Palestinians. Ireland, Norway, and Spain tell the world: Israel must no longer be treated as a party to solving or addressing Palestinian matters. This is also saying to the US: you and your approach have become not only irrelevant, but obstructive to justice.

The era of playing softball with Israel, at the expense of Palestinian lives, dignity, and property, is reaching its much-delayed end. Zionist politicians can clamor and stomp their feet all they want and all day long: Israel's legitimacy and standing are being severely degraded, and there's no coming back from this. Israel will not know how to treat this, as it didn't know what to do before or after October 7. Excessive American support has made it delusional in assessing its actual powers. So I expect this process of delegitimization to intensify in years to come.'