Grifting political streamers

[bebotalk]

What can be done to stop this?

Hasan for instance admitted he was a socialist grifter. 

As he is getting mainstream appearances now (on Piers Morgan, amongst others), isn't he just dangerous?

 

 

[Leo Gura]

Hasan is a good example of what happens if you get radicalized by the left. That's certainly a trap.

But at the same time, honor free speech and don't try to shut sich people down. They have the right to their perspective.

Edited May 14 by Leo Gura

[bebotalk]

15 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Hasan is a good example of what happens if you get radicalized by the left. That's certainly a trap.

But at the same time, honor free speech and don't try to shut sich people down. They have the right to their perspective.

Freedom of speech isn't absolute right. It doesn't exist on private platforms. We often deem necessary limitations to such in light of the public good. Grifters are not aligned with the public good. 

Maybe read up on what freedom of speech is. Google/Youtube aren't the state.

[MediumKahuna]

22 hours ago, bebotalk said:

Hasan for instance admitted he was a socialist grifter. 

When did he do such a thing? I find most people barely watch any of Hasan's content enough to know his actual views. They have a caricature of him being wealthy and therefore not a socialist, which is absurd.

[Leo Gura]

3 hours ago, bebotalk said:

Freedom of speech isn't absolute right. It doesn't exist on private platforms. We often deem necessary limitations to such in light of the public good. Grifters are not aligned with the public good. 

Maybe read up on what freedom of speech is. Google/Youtube aren't the state.

Free speech is also a broader principle. If you want to cancel or shut down perspectives just because you disagree with them, that's going to become a problem for you.

Hasan is not violating YT guidelines.

[bebotalk]

With respect, you miss the point, and quite widely.

With a big platform, one has influence. if one is doing it just for clout, and forging a community of like-minded people, then this is dishonest. Said advocacy also has real-world effects. Hasan has been on huge media platforms like Piers Morgan, debating a pro-Palestinian position alongside his uncle Cenk Uygur. Whether he is breaking Youtube or Twitch TOS is immaterial. It's about the effects of streamers who grift, and the real-world implications of such. 

If Hasan actually believed i what he advocates, then who gives a shit? We all have our beliefs and worldviews. But if he doesn't, that's dangerous. 

[bebotalk]

On 15/05/2024 at 3:36 PM, MediumKahuna said:

When did he do such a thing? I find most people barely watch any of Hasan's content enough to know his actual views. They have a caricature of him being wealthy and therefore not a socialist, which is absurd.

He himself says he was a socialist grifter. He openly says as such here.

 

[Hatfort]

He's not a grifter, he has been pretty consistent in his views since he was poor and now that he's rich. Was he supposed to change his views once he became a successful streamer and made big money? People can change and some views can too, but this is not what happened. He has an expensive house, LA is expensive anyway, but more than average people, no doubt about that. But he is not litching others buying houses and renting them, that is something he denounces frequently. He lives from his work and that's fine for the left. He does acknowledge he is privileged but speaks in favor of those who are on the bottom.

He still defends his core beliefs like public social safety networks, a better housing system, universal healthcare, a fair tax system, and a better expenditure of these taxes, among other left-leaning socioeconomic issues. He's been very vocal in defending Palestine, he was doing that before too, not as much, but he was. This has cost him sponsors and opportunities.

He is funny and well-educated about many issues. He has also a big mouth and sometimes hurts the feelings of the right-wingers mostly, but that's part of his charm. I don't watch him live, just the clips that are uploaded on YouTube. You don't agree with his views and want him canceled? Well, he didn't break Twitch and YouTube rules, so he can stay. I'm surprised because others have been demonetized on YouTube for being critical of Israel and journalists have been fired from mainstream media like Mehdi Hasan even an actress like the girl from Scream, who was as both-sided as you can be on this issue, but not good enough. So there's something going on, but they still want Hasan in their platforms, for now.

[bebotalk]

37 minutes ago, Hatfort said:

He's not a grifter, he has been pretty consistent in his views since he was poor and now that he's rich. Was he supposed to change his views once he became a successful streamer and made big money? People can change and some views can too, but this is not what happened. He has an expensive house, LA is expensive anyway, but more than average people, no doubt about that. But he is not litching others buying houses and renting them, that is something he denounces frequently. He lives from his work and that's fine for the left. He does acknowledge he is privileged but speaks in favor of those who are on the bottom.

He still defends his core beliefs like public social safety networks, a better housing system, universal healthcare, a fair tax system, and a better expenditure of these taxes, among other left-leaning socioeconomic issues. He's been very vocal in defending Palestine, he was doing that before too, not as much, but he was. This has cost him sponsors and opportunities.

He is funny and well-educated about many issues. He has also a big mouth and sometimes hurts the feelings of the right-wingers mostly, but that's part of his charm. I don't watch him live, just the clips that are uploaded on YouTube. You don't agree with his views and want him canceled? Well, he didn't break Twitch and YouTube rules, so he can stay. I'm surprised because others have been demonetized on YouTube for being critical of Israel and journalists have been fired from mainstream media like Mehdi Hasan even an actress like the girl from Scream, who was as both-sided as you can be on this issue, but not good enough. So there's something going on, but they still want Hasan in their platforms, for now.

He himself admitted he is. Do you know better than him, or can read his soul?  So a person on a video says he had a socialist grift, but you disbelieve him.

 

 

[bebotalk]

Moreover, Hasan is a wasteman who has bad logic, shit points, and only has a profile due to his familial connections, familial upbringing, and his looks. 

If he were female, then the accusation of him getting where he is due to looks would be way more prominent, which is wrong and misogynistic. A "mental heavyweight" like him wouldn't say that racism is wrong but then. justifying calling white people cracker. It's like saying theft is wrong but then justifying stealing clothes off people's washing lines. 

[Hatfort]

39 minutes ago, bebotalk said:

He himself admitted he is. Do you know better than him, or can read his soul?  So a person on a video says he had a socialist grift, but you disbelieve him.

No, I don't know in what context he may have admitted something like that, maybe you can provide the quote. The thing is, I watch his videos and he often talks about these grifting accusations and he says he maintains the same positions from before he was successful, which he does.

He indeed worked for his uncle in TYT, he didn't do a bad job, I've watched some of his videos from back then. He does not hide this, but it's also true he went on his own when Twitch streaming was not very big and he built his viewers with consistent work, entertaining content, and pretty good values. That's on him, he took a route and a risk, and it worked well for him.

He has some bad takes, like the cracker thing. I don't think it's the same as a slur that has another history in society of oppression. Nevertheless, cracker refers to white men who used to lash with whips black people's backs, so unless you are telling this to a white supremacist racist, I don't think it's an appropriate word to use lightly, like he does. I can give you that.

[bebotalk]

I posted the video above. Granted, it's long but he definitely admitted to being a socialist grfiter in the past. 

[Hatfort]

1 minute ago, bebotalk said:

I posted the video above. Granted, it's long but he definitely admitted to being a socialist grfiter in the past. 

Well, do the job and bring us the quote or the part that he admits it, at least. He often talks about this, because it's often brought up to him, whatever you say he said, that's not his position. He is not a secret right-winger and passing left-leaning views for success. He is just a left-winger sharing his views and doing it successfully.

[MediumKahuna]

11 hours ago, bebotalk said:

With respect, you miss the point, and quite widely.

With a big platform, one has influence. if one is doing it just for clout, and forging a community of like-minded people, then this is dishonest. Said advocacy also has real-world effects. Hasan has been on huge media platforms like Piers Morgan, debating a pro-Palestinian position alongside his uncle Cenk Uygur. Whether he is breaking Youtube or Twitch TOS is immaterial. It's about the effects of streamers who grift, and the real-world implications of such. 

If Hasan actually believed i what he advocates, then who gives a shit? We all have our beliefs and worldviews. But if he doesn't, that's dangerous. 

Hasan has been espousing exactly the same views since before anyone even knew who TF he was. Again, nowhere has he ever said he grifted. He openly talks about how if he wanted to grift he would just become a right-winger and latch onto culture war issues and sell fear.

The fact is you are just pulling this out of your ass and then labelling someone dangerous because you don't like their positions.

The 'cracker = slur' thing is an absolute joke too. The N-word has far reaching racial implications to black history of slavery, subjigation, torture, rape and executions. No insult you can say to a white person even comes close to being in the same category. The whole thing is utterly disengenous.

Edited May 17 by MediumKahuna

[DocWatts]

On 5/14/2024 at 0:27 PM, bebotalk said:

What can be done to stop this?

Hasan for instance admitted he was a socialist grifter. 

As he is getting mainstream appearances now (on Piers Morgan, amongst others), isn't he just dangerous?

 

 

Right wing grifters (deservedly) attract more criticism, but it's important to acknowledge that this sort of thing happens on the Left as well (TYT is another good example of this).

A good rule of thumb is if the 'socialist' streamer you're watching owns a $200k sports car, it's time to look elsewhere for political opinion and analysis.

Grifters like Hasan will talk a good game as far as drawing attention to the systemic injustices of capitalism, while eschewing any personal responsibility for thier consumption habits (typically under the guise that there's no ethical consumption under capitalism, so 'fuck it').

It's the political equivalent of 'if you meet the Buddha in the road, kill him.' 😄

Edited May 17 by DocWatts

[Leo Gura]

20 hours ago, bebotalk said:

If Hasan actually believed i what he advocates,

Hasan believes his own leftist ideology. He does not see the limitations of his own perspective and he has turned it into a career. This problem exists across of YT and media at large. So I don't see why Hasan should singled out.

This isn't a grifting problem, this is a developmental and epistemic problem. These people are not mature enough to understand what they are doing. But if you start banning people for being immature you will have to ban 90% of the internet.

Edited May 17 by Leo Gura

[bebotalk]

so calling out the negative facets of drifting, especially with views that by design seek to reform society, is bad? lol.

Not all people on the Internet are out to push values for the purported purpose of restruting society. Not all views a person states is political. 

Edited May 18 by bebotalk

[Danioover9000]

   An even bigger poll of grifters:

   Including most big name streamers, like Destiny.

[Danioover9000]

@Leo Gura

On 2024-05-18 at 0:34 AM, Leo Gura said:

Hasan believes his own leftist ideology. He does not see the limitations of his own perspective and he has turned it into a career. This problem exists across of YT and media at large. So I don't see why Hasan should singled out.

This isn't a grifting problem, this is a developmental and epistemic problem. These people are not mature enough to understand what they are doing. But if you start banning people for being immature you will have to ban 90% of the internet.

   Sure, but I think OP was just making the case, and had to pick an example, in this case he uses Hasan. If I was OP I'd include more examples, or if I had to pick one perfect example, it's Destiny. When a person makes a claim/statement/assertion, they have to provide some justification an at least one example so I don't see anything unusual from OP here.