There cannot be more or less consciousness

[Breakingthewall]

1 minute ago, Yousif said:

Yes, But you don’t deny that you have it, you don’t neglect it, and certainly you don’t go around acting like you’re in the godhead state all the time and pretend that you’re speaking from it, you’re made of god, but you’re still fucking jesus the son of Mary, both are needed to stay grounded and healthy.

you can see the relative as what it is all the time, a software. but you can see through it and not be a prisoner of it to some extent, or perhaps completely, to the point of being completely indifferent to life and death, since you are both.

[Yousif]

3 minutes ago, Osaid said:

I still imagine things. Nothing against it. No need for exclusion.

The good thing is that you don't have to pretend.

Believing that you are dual is always inherently pretend/imagination though.

You can't emerge from imagination because it's imaginary; you were never inside it in the first place.

You can't think that you are a human. 

In the same way you can't think that you are a unicorn. Or you can't think that you have wings. 

There is literally "nothing" to deny, aside from imagination.

Imagining yourself is denying what you are.

Yeah imagination is all it’s made of, I get that, but don’t forget that there’s no difference between the real and the imaginary, the problem with you people on here is that you would say one thing is real and another isn’t, you stick to it all being imaginary, forgetting real and imaginary are the same thing, in the same way you say it’s all absolute, forgetting that there’s no difference between the relative and the absolute, you’re making the wrong cuts here. 

[Yousif]

1 minute ago, Breakingthewall said:

you can see the relative as what it is all the time, a software. but you can see through it and not be a prisoner of it to some extent, or perhaps completely, to the point of being completely indifferent to life and death, since you are both.

Sounds to me that you’re trying no to desire which itself is a form of desire, which why you’re stuck, the truth is there’s no difference between relative or absolute, or any duality, but you’re playing games because you don’t really wanna awaken the only way possible, which is by letting go.

[Yimpa]

4 minutes ago, Yousif said:

you don’t really wanna awaken the only way possible, which is by letting go.

Not just by letting go. But also by lifting each other up. Ohhhh yeah!

[Breakingthewall]

41 minutes ago, Ishanga said:

I'm not against psychedelics, I want to try them someday but not as a be all end all

I think that psychedelic are useful for two things, one to be able to break your mental structure for a while, and other to go deep into yourself. The problem if what you said before: people use them to break the structure and then they build another structure with the new parameters that the experience gave, and then its just another structure but more strange and with religious connotations. But in some cases the people see that mistake, then try to flexibilize its structure more and more until it dissapear. Others get lost in the new structure and grab it with strength, then you could imagine that their life could go in the wrong direction 

Edited March 31 by Breakingthewall

[Breakingthewall]

5 minutes ago, Yousif said:

Sounds to me that you’re trying no to desire which itself is a form of desire, which why you’re stuck, the truth is there’s no difference between relative or absolute, or any duality, but you’re playing games because you don’t really wanna awaken the only way possible, which is by letting go.

There is difference between relative and absolute, since relative is literally imaginary, but relative is absolute in the sense that is happening now, as something imaginary. It's just in my mind. We could be able to deactivate totally and open up the reality, that's what spirituality is about imo

[Osaid]

3 minutes ago, Yousif said:

the problem with you people on here is that you would say one thing is real and another isn’t

I never said that. I said it is imaginary.

Meaning, it's you thinking. 

There can't be you thinking of yourself. Because that is two of you. "You" thinking and "you" being thought of. There can't be two "beings."

7 minutes ago, Yousif said:

there’s no difference between the relative and the absolute

There is no "relative" aside from what you think is relative. In the same way how there is no unicorn aside from what you think is a unicorn. Both are thoughts/imagination.

The truth inside of the above statement is what is "absolute."

Even if you think the relative is the absolute, or that the absolute is the relative. It is still just thinking, which is relative, and not absolute.

In the same way that no matter how hard you believe you are a unicorn, it doesn't change the fact of it being a belief. The medium of imagination does not change into something which is not itself. A human who believes they are a unicorn is a human who believes they are a unicorn, not a human which became a unicorn. Someone who believes that relativity exists is someone who believes that relativity exists, not that they are actually experiencing relativity.

[Osaid]

44 minutes ago, Davino said:

Nothing cocreates Everything

You can't experience your experience being created. You could say that is how "nothing creates."

Creation is "nothing" in that it is undefined and unlimited by anything. It is no thing. It is not "a thing" because "things" are divisions and dualities and limitations.

44 minutes ago, Davino said:

Can we even get out of this?

There's nothing to get out of, literally.

Your mind divides and limits reality. It tries to turn reality into a thought. It turns you into a thought.

Trying to "get out of" thought is just another thought; that "you" are "in thought" and need to get out of it. Throw the medium away altogether.

Edited March 31 by Osaid

[Inliytened1]

@ivankiss have to concur with Leo here....you can have more degrees or levels of Consciousness.   Not just states.  However where I disagree with Leo is when you reach a non-dual state there aren't degrees of that.   You are already in a state of infinite intelligence or complete omniscience so you can't get more intelligent than Infinite.  It's just like zero is Infinity.    Something finite has levels.   Something Infinite is void of levels.   It's God mode.

Edited March 31 by Inliytened1

[Yousif]

16 minutes ago, Osaid said:

. Someone who believes that relativity exists is someone who believes that relativity exists, not that they are actually experiencing relativity.

You believe you’re a mod for actualized.org and this you is not me, I’m not a mod for actualized.org, now tell me, is this relative truth real or not real? 
 

relativity is how you get to non-dualism, it’s the root of the tree, you don’t live from the godhead, you’re not awake right now, you’re simply denying your own direct experience of being a human, which is paradoxically why you’re not awake right now, 

there is no difference between relative reality and absolute reality, saying its one thing over excludes it being something else, which makes it finite, 

 

It really is pointless talking about it here. 
 

because whenever you say it’s one thing and not the other you’re putting a limit on a limitless thing

Edited March 31 by Yousif

[Osaid]

45 minutes ago, Davino said:

@Osaid What do you say about the thread question?

Quote

There cannot be more or less consciousness

 

I agree.

"More" consciousness, relative to what? Another part of consciousness?

"Less" consciousness, relative to what? Another part of consciousness?

No, there are no parts, it's all consciousness. When you say "more" or "less" you divide consciousness from itself.

It is the exact same as saying "there is more or less existence." "Existence" is not a quantifiable quality, it is infinite. Same goes for consciousness.

If you concur that every single thing that exists is consciousness, then there is simply no such thing as "more or less" of it. 

[Breakingthewall]

45 minutes ago, Yousif said:

forgetting real and imaginary are the same thin

The only imaginary is the meaning. Without meaning, there is no relative. The mind is made by meaning. 

Edited March 31 by Breakingthewall

[Breakingthewall]

14 minutes ago, Osaid said:

is the exact same as saying "there is more or less existence." "Existence" is not a quantifiable quality, it is infinite. Same goes for consciousness.

But there can be more perception of the existence , more depth.

Edited March 31 by Breakingthewall

[Osaid]

10 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

But there can be more perception of the existence

"Can be more" refers to a future perception. That "you" can be in a future which isn't happening right now. That "you" can be something which isn't happening right now. That "you" can be something which you aren't.

You can't be something that is perceived later. That is never your experience no matter what. Because that creates two of you; one which is happening right now and one which is happening later. The limitation is the idea that you can be two things.

Edited March 31 by Osaid

[ivankiss]

It's really simple.

There is already and always infinite consciousness, right now, at all times, forever.

What is limited and illusory, born out of that very same consciousness - of course - is thought, feeling and your 5 human senses. Those change.

That which is conscious of it all, is absolute and does not change. Does not increase or decrease or anything like that. Again, that's only true relatively, from a limited point of view. It's not 'Absolute Truth'.

Absolutely, infinite consciousness is all there is and there cannot be more or less of it, by definition. It can only fool or trick itself into believing that there can be more or less of it, or that there can be anything other than it.

 

[Inliytened1]

2 hours ago, Osaid said:

I agree.

"More" consciousness, relative to what? Another part of consciousness?

"Less" consciousness, relative to what? Another part of consciousness?

No, there are no parts, it's all consciousness. When you say "more" or "less" you divide consciousness from itself.

It is the exact same as saying "there is more or less existence." "Existence" is not a quantifiable quality, it is infinite. Same goes for consciousness.

If you concur that every single thing that exists is consciousness, then there is simply no such thing as "more or less" of it. 

It's simple.   Consciousness expands and contracts while finite but when it hits Infinity it just levels out to where there is no difference between nothing and everything.   Or level one and level 999.  But in a finite state you can have levels.  In an infinite state it becomes meaningless. 

Edited March 31 by Inliytened1

[Mu_]

On 3/29/2024 at 2:58 PM, Ishanga said:

Intellectual hogwash language that keeps one in the loop of thinking mind patterns based on date collected and rehashed, means nothing, will get one know where on the path of spirituality, or just trying to get out of bed when they feel like dying inside!!!!!

To be fair if what he said he intellectual hogwash, than its only fair to say this whole thread is and everyones idea's.  I think he's pointing to something useful, and think some of what you have said is as well.  Personally I don't think its that hard to understand what the thread starter was saying, that you can't get more God than God which this all is, yet I understand how it ruins the whole fun of the stories we know the current world through, including the one that we are all humans, or are on a spiritual path, or theres more enlightened and less enlightened.  

[Mu_]

On 3/29/2024 at 5:09 PM, zurew said:

You can create any kind of sentence that has a truth value and the negation of that sentence can be true at the same time. For example saying that "Consciousness is the only thing that exists" and "Consciousness is not the only thing that exists" can both be true at the same time if you go outside of classical logic.

Literally everything becomes possible without any constrains

Ya and no, but ultimately there is only God which is all and mysterious.  If this is fully understood,  than some statements such as there are real humans or real planets or real things aren't suddenly going to be true simply because all contradictions are possible.  Just like you don't make a tree from a table, the table is constructed from tree.  Same is ultimately true of reality, you can't make god from humans and planets, God is experiencing something sometimes referred to by itself innate nature as humans and planets.

But to kinda contradict myself and agree with you, God can make any statement and idea and it is so, which may kinda fall into what your saying.

Edited April 1 by Mu_

[Mu_]

On 3/29/2024 at 6:50 PM, Breakingthewall said:

What you are saying is that only existence is real, empty consciousness where reality arises, and this reality that arises is always appearance, whether it is the wall of my room or God. But it is not exactly like that, since the wall of my room is God, everything is God, to use that word to differentiate it from "reality", so, to what degree do you realize God? God is not a grander emergence, it is the penetration into any arising, it is another angle of perception, and this angle can be opened more or less. more openness, more perception or conciousness. 

Wouldn't you say that to be aware of being god, its degree's or lack of degree's is still God being God.

[Mu_]

5 hours ago, Ishanga said:

This is what 95% of the ppl around here DENY the Human Experience, that it even exists lol, but everyday they use their eyes to read posts, and fingers to type in responses via a keyboard and computer internet service... Completely crazy sometimes!!

Everyones free to call "this" what ever they do, you seem to have a point you want to make about there being a human experience, and I'd like to ask why isn't it a earth experience, or a solar system experience, or a God experience instead?  Can you prove eyes are reading posts and fingers typing responses?  You sure its the eyes and not the brain, or not the brain but the mind, or not the mind, but particles in motion, or not particles in motion but God itself looking out and looking in?  Instead of being frustraed with 95% of people on here denying human experience, why do you hold so much to this particular framework when there so many equally valid false ones?

Edited April 1 by Mu_