Israel / Palestine News Thread

[Gennadiy1981]

5 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

ahahahahhaahahahahahahahahha i love this

But what if the Arabs refused to take them?

Would you declare war on them?

You know Israel wanted to do this from the start but the Arabs refused so the Gazans were stuck there.

How would you solve it?

First of all we did not started first, they did, and the politicians around the world know this, thank God for that.

Second of all, what I speak is transfer of population, so you should know it was done in the past many times, like after WW2 8 million Germans from Poland and 4 million from Chehoslovakia were removed. In 1946 India and Pakistan transferred 20 million people, in 1923 Greece and turkey transferred population and etc.

Look if I would be in charge of it I would make it very humane. All the money that are pouring to Palestinians are ending up either in PLO Fatah or Hamas. I would reallocate the funding and use that to purchase homes for the people who will be leaving. I would go even a step further and compensate for their property here from our funds, by the way when they locked us out of their Arabic countries in 1950’s they didn’t give us Jack for our properties, but that’s fine I will be a better man. For example Saudi Arabia is one of the most under populated countries on earth, we can build cities there or whatever the UN would decide and negotiate, besides those people are of the same ethnic background (Arabs) speak same language and share same religion.
 

Again so much money is being poured down, that I would be built schools and infrastructure in the Arabic states and say other countries who would volunteer to accept them, by the way like in the past, few South American countries did. I would do that in the most humane way possible.

Again stating on this forum many times, by keeping those two people together, you will only have bloodshed and violence. And you know by reading those posts form most of you, I come to realize that you want to see bloodshed and violence, somehow that makes your day.

if you truly care to stop you would be ok for solutions. Now, it’s no secret that one nation has to go. Look Arabs have 21 states and there are 56 Muslim states out there, there is only one Jewish state. So we just have no where to go.

[Rafael Thundercat]

1 hour ago, Gennadiy1981 said:

First of all we did not started first, they did, and the politicians around the world know this, thank God for that.

Behaving exacly as a child. The kid of one friend keep bulling his young brother with micro-violence and provocations and humiliations. The young boy tired of oppresion figth back, the older figth back even stronger make the younger cry. When parent interviene, the older say: He started first. 

I saw this in front of me and called the older to truth saying. But the older resfuse to admit he started. 

For me Zionist are just copying kids games. Playing the all rigthous when they started first many years ago with Jewish Funds, Manipulation and Lies. This thing started long ago. And you know it. Make a unbiased reasearch and you will find. 

 

[Karmadhi]

1 hour ago, Gennadiy1981 said:

like after WW2 8 million Germans from Poland and 4 million from Chehoslovakia were removed. In 1946 India and Pakistan transferred 20 million people, in 1923 Greece and turkey transferred population and etc.

True but keep in mind that the countries themselves still existed. With your solution, Palestine will cease to exist. A better comparison would be for all Greeks going to Turkey and Greece ceasing to exist.

1 hour ago, Gennadiy1981 said:

All the money that are pouring to Palestinians are ending up either in PLO Fatah or Hamas.

Praise Bibi for funding Hamas via Qatar.

1 hour ago, Gennadiy1981 said:

For example Saudi Arabia is one of the most under populated countries on earth, we can build cities there or whatever the UN would decide and negotiate, besides those people are of the same ethnic background (Arabs) speak same language and share same religion.
 

Again so much money is being poured down, that I would be built schools and infrastructure in the Arabic states and say other countries who would volunteer to accept them, by the way like in the past, few South American countries did. I would do that in the most humane way possible.

Look, personally I do not have much personal affection to any piece of land so your solution seems ok.

I would maybe agree to it personally.

Issue is most of the world sees it as theft and ethnic cleansing.

They will never agree to it.

By your logic, Russia should kick out all Ukranians and take their land.

Ukraine is not any less Russian than West Bank and Gaza are Israeli.

Yet the whole world defends Ukraine.

Why these double standards?

Also, why not flip the script for a moment.

Take all the Jews in the US and they can live happily there.

Why should Jews have priority over that land?

It is not any more Jewish than Arab Muslim.

So your solution is not bad from a purely humanitarian sense if you have 0 attachment to land, but in the real world it cannot work.

Also, you are not willing to do it yourself, yet you wish it on others.

Your logic is: I will take your home and buy you another one, but I would not move out of my home if someone offered to kick me out but buy another home.

Hope it is clear.

[Danioover9000]

@Gennadiy1981

1 hour ago, Gennadiy1981 said:

First of all we did not started first, they did, and the politicians around the world know this, thank God for that.

Second of all, what I speak is transfer of population, so you should know it was done in the past many times, like after WW2 8 million Germans from Poland and 4 million from Chehoslovakia were removed. In 1946 India and Pakistan transferred 20 million people, in 1923 Greece and turkey transferred population and etc.

Look if I would be in charge of it I would make it very humane. All the money that are pouring to Palestinians are ending up either in PLO Fatah or Hamas. I would reallocate the funding and use that to purchase homes for the people who will be leaving. I would go even a step further and compensate for their property here from our funds, by the way when they locked us out of their Arabic countries in 1950’s they didn’t give us Jack for our properties, but that’s fine I will be a better man. For example Saudi Arabia is one of the most under populated countries on earth, we can build cities there or whatever the UN would decide and negotiate, besides those people are of the same ethnic background (Arabs) speak same language and share same religion.
 

Again so much money is being poured down, that I would be built schools and infrastructure in the Arabic states and say other countries who would volunteer to accept them, by the way like in the past, few South American countries did. I would do that in the most humane way possible.

Again stating on this forum many times, by keeping those two people together, you will only have bloodshed and violence. And you know by reading those posts form most of you, I come to realize that you want to see bloodshed and violence, somehow that makes your day.

if you truly care to stop you would be ok for solutions. Now, it’s no secret that one nation has to go. Look Arabs have 21 states and there are 56 Muslim states out there, there is only one Jewish state. So we just have no where to go.

   Technically this started about 80 years ago in the Al Nakba and a few years after it. Why I say about 80-100 years is that's about a generation and a half ago, more relevant than when that Israel defense lawyer was whataboutism on history and stretching this conflict all the way back to 3,000 or so years ago, or jumping from one conflict to another in that ICJ trial. No that case is specifically focused in on at least the first 80 years, and all the events within that timeline and which pertains to genocidal acts and genocidal events. Even soft genocide like displacement, extreme difficulty returning to your own property, high controls on food and water supplies in Gaza, segregation within Israel society and very marginalized Arab or Muslim representation within Israel, and how there's a pattern that matches up to Apartheid in South Africa. Yes it's not exactly like Africa in every detail, but there's a very similar pattern of thinking, genocidal language from Netanyahu, disproportionate death toll of civilians and unarmed combatants to armed combatants, and displacement.

[Gennadiy1981]

@Karmadhi thank you at least for understanding. So let’s entertain your idea, hypothetically for Jews to move to USA, so will USA allow is a Jewish state with Jewish laws, don’t forget US is a Christian state where their Sabbath is Sunday. Look I want to have a state where Kosher food is mandatory, for example I don’t want to be at a work where they throw a party and I don’t have food to eat. Look I am staying at both places so I know US culture very well. I want to have laws of Sabbath, that on Saturday no bitch would ask me to work. Oh and Sabbath begins on Friday sundown, and according to Shulhan Aruch one should stop working by midday, will US tolerate such behavior. I just gave you two out of I would say billion more things but I will spare you as some are complaining I give way too examples. The bottom line is I bet you, America won’t bent for us, especially if they will give us Nevada, Leo will be the first one taking arms in his hands. That’s why people need to be with those who share the same culture.
 

Look, if there was 21 Jewish states in the world, you know, I may have negotiated with you and would be the man to leave, I would have to think about it but that could have been on the table, but we only have one Jewish state and they have 21 states. They have 600 times more land mass than we do, so as I said we have no where to go and to make another Jewish state, and no I don’t mean secular state, I want a Jewish state where the laws of Torah govern it, as much as Muslims have the right for Shariah state I want the Torah to be the governing body. Now by no means I advocate for forceful obedience but today Israel does follow such laws where the holidays from Torah are the national holidays, where the majority of food being sold is under Kosher supervision, where the public transportation does not operate on Sababth and etc. We didn’t survive for two thousand years in exile to all of a sudden to loose our identity, sorry it’s not happening. 
 

P.S. as far as Russia and Ukraine, I have no skin in the game and I would not be commenting on it. Now from my history lessons what I have learned in the past, Russian and Ukraine were always two separate countries. Ukraine was always smaller state and asked Russia for protectorate to avoid being captured by Poland. However Poland did capture half of Ukraine while Russia was able to hold to eastern Ukraine. The western Ukraine was exchanging hands by other European countries until WW2 when then Soviet Union took entire and made a socialist republic. In the interim many Russians actually immigrated to some parts and politically the borders were also redrawn by taking some land form Ukraine and some from Russia (but Russia kept all of them) and took away Crimea which was Russian land but was land swapped, hence most Russians live there. Again this is just what I learn in history but I don’t know so much about it and hence will not be choosing side.

Edited July 14 by Gennadiy1981

[Nivsch]

The real picture is more complicated and bi directional.

[Hatfort]

7 hours ago, Danioover9000 said:

@Gennadiy1981

   Technically this started about 80 years ago in the Al Nakba and a few years after it. Why I say about 80-100 years is that's about a generation and a half ago, more relevant than when that Israel defense lawyer was whataboutism on history and stretching this conflict all the way back to 3,000 or so years ago, or jumping from one conflict to another in that ICJ trial. No that case is specifically focused in on at least the first 80 years, and all the events within that timeline and which pertains to genocidal acts and genocidal events. Even soft genocide like displacement, extreme difficulty returning to your own property, high controls on food and water supplies in Gaza, segregation within Israel society and very marginalized Arab or Muslim representation within Israel, and how there's a pattern that matches up to Apartheid in South Africa. Yes it's not exactly like Africa in every detail, but there's a very similar pattern of thinking, genocidal language from Netanyahu, disproportionate death toll of civilians and unarmed combatants to armed combatants, and displacement.

Also, South Africans who have visited Palestine claim that the apartheid that's happening there is even worse than the one that they suffered. A two-tier system that benefits the settlers, and is hostile to the Palestinians. The judicial system for example, but not exclusive.

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/02/20/world/middleeast/icj-south-africa-palestinian-israel-un-court.html

[Loveeee]

Guys it's ok at least Israel is safe now 

Real safe

This genocide will never backfire

Ever 

[Nivsch]

@Gennadiy1981 The root of the argument is the unfamiliarity with our society and a sense of strangerness due to, among the rest, the more different and less common religion it has, what in turn creates a very significant negativity bias in how Israelis are seen to some people, and everything it does is automatically being examined through those negative to begin with lenses. While the other side because being grasped as "poor, simple, childish, uneducated" is automatically being exempted from responsibility under an opposite positivity filter everything he does being soften and twisted to the other side fault much more easily. What makes even the same stage (for example blue) to be seen as much more guilty when it comes to one side, and much more victim when it comes to the other side. In this way reality can never be reached.

Edited July 14 by Nivsch

[Loveeee]

[Gennadiy1981]

2 hours ago, Nivsch said:

@Gennadiy1981 The root of the argument is the unfamiliarity with our society and a sense of strangerness due to, among the rest, the more different and less common religion it has, what in turn creates a very significant negativity bias in how Israelis are seen to some people, and everything it does is automatically being examined through those negative to begin with lenses. While the other side because being grasped as "poor, simple, childish, uneducated" is automatically being exempted from responsibility under an opposite positivity filter everything he does being soften and twisted to the other side fault much more easily. What makes even the same stage (for example blue) to be seen as much more guilty when it comes to one side, and much more victim when it comes to the other side. In this way reality can never be reached.

Thanks. I understand, however if you apply this parallel to other historic events with other countries it does not work in such a way but only does with Jews. I guess maybe it is the prophecy after all because rational vice you can’t really explain, because take inquisitions for example or even Nazi Holocaust when we were extremitied daily and I don’t remember any mass stage rallies or blocking roads for our freedom and by the way then, we did not had army or guns or tunnels, we were just walking like sheeps to the slaughter house. 
 

In the former Soviet Union there was a small poem about Jews guilty for everything like one line red it was Jewish fault for shooting at Lenin (it was a Jewish Menshevik lady) and antler line read that Jews on purposely missed (the White Russian army wanted him to be gone). 
 

It’s like no matter what we do we will always be guilty. 
 

But what you say to apply for the world politics in general actually is correct and does hold true, so it’s a very smart analysis. 
 

Also for you personally, when people are asking same questions differently posed and you give the same answer on and on, don’t you feel like it’s much easier to tell them to F*** off? It’s so simple and straight to the point then creating intelligent arguments that regardless people will not understand or I would say refuse to understand you as their ego mind dictates them. Of course, with high consciousness people you do want to give an intelligent explanation but with low conscious ones, replying that Bible is right I personally think does the answer.

[Karmadhi]

15 hours ago, Gennadiy1981 said:

thank you at least for understanding. So let’s entertain your idea, hypothetically for Jews to move to USA, so will USA allow is a Jewish state with Jewish laws, don’t forget US is a Christian state where their Sabbath is Sunday. Look I want to have a state where Kosher food is mandatory, for example I don’t want to be at a work where they throw a party and I don’t have food to eat. Look I am staying at both places so I know US culture very well. I want to have laws of Sabbath, that on Saturday no bitch would ask me to work. Oh and Sabbath begins on Friday sundown, and according to Shulhan Aruch one should stop working by midday, will US tolerate such behavior. I just gave you two out of I would say billion more things but I will spare you as some are complaining I give way too examples. The bottom line is I bet you, America won’t bent for us, especially if they will give us Nevada, Leo will be the first one taking arms in his hands. That’s why people need to be with those who share the same culture.

You seem very spoiled and entitled. Basically you are denying basic rights to millions so you can have the official holidays and food you like.

Try living as a Palestinian in the West Bank where they live like Jews did under Nazis meanwhile you complain about first world issues.

15 hours ago, Gennadiy1981 said:

Look, if there was 21 Jewish states in the world, you know, I may have negotiated with you and would be the man to leave, I would have to think about it but that could have been on the table, but we only have one Jewish state and they have 21 states. They have 600 times more land mass than we do,

Why should that Jewish state be there though? If Saudi is so sparsley populated, they could have made it there, nobody would be kicked out. Everyone happy.  And thing is, if your country gets wiped out, you will not care that there are 21 other Arab states, you care about YOUR state.

It is like saying, lets wipe out Serbia because we got 100 other Christian states. Or 6 other Balkan states. Flawed logic in my opinion.

Your population transfer argument does not apply here because you want Palestinian state to be wiped out, not just change populations. Greece, Poland for example were not gone as countries. They still exist.

15 hours ago, Gennadiy1981 said:

I want a Jewish state where the laws of Torah govern it, as much as Muslims have the right for Shariah state I want the Torah to be the governing body

This is stage blue fundamentalism which is below the level of development of Leos work and this forum. I will not argue with you on it.

15 hours ago, Gennadiy1981 said:

P.S. as far as Russia and Ukraine, I have no skin in the game and I would not be commenting on it. Now from my history lessons what I have learned in the past, Russian and Ukraine were always two separate countries. Ukraine was always smaller state and asked Russia for protectorate to avoid being captured by Poland. However Poland did capture half of Ukraine while Russia was able to hold to eastern Ukraine. The western Ukraine was exchanging hands by other European countries until WW2 when then Soviet Union took entire and made a socialist republic. In the interim many Russians actually immigrated to some parts and politically the borders were also redrawn by taking some land form Ukraine and some from Russia (but Russia kept all of them) and took away Crimea which was Russian land but was land swapped, hence most Russians live there. Again this is just what I learn in history but I don’t know so much about it and hence will not be choosing side.

Your logic is that what happened 2000 years ago is relevant for today.

1000 years ago, Russia and Ukraine were 1 country, Kievan Rus. Google it.

If we go with the land origins of 2000 years ago (which is when Jews lived in Israel in mass as they say), then Russia and Ukraine also 1000 years ago were 1 state. So lets merge them again.

 

[Gennadiy1981]

@Karmadhi first to start with Russia, no you are wrong on it, the KievRus was not Russia, it was a separate kingdom that was never on Russian territory. They were called similarly but were totally two independent states. The Russian kingdom was a merger of three smaller kingdoms, the Novgorod, the Moscow and I believe a smaller one something called Volga, but they were totally independent of KievRus, they were never as one country. 
 

As far as religious freedom goes, I have full rights as many people have it around the world. If we ban all religions and we ban all borders then we can have a conversation but until you have a dedicated Christian countries and dedicated Muslim countries where the law of the Bible is being practiced then it’s fair for me to have my own practice and my own borders. Now about food and holidays it’s not being spoiled, it’s a biblical mandates and those who defy according to Bible will go to Hell.

Look I respect people’s religious beliefs so you need to respect my religious beliefs. 

Finally, I never didn’t eradicate Palestine from the face of the earth, all I am saying that it cannot be within Israel and by the way I can bet you all my money that it never will, and I don’t count Gaza is its own country as it is not. They are welcome to make it in Saudi Arabia or they may live under Saudi Arabia, that’s not my business how it will be called, it’s up to the Arabs and their choice. 
 

You keep mentioning that Jews migrated from diffent countries, but so did Arabs migrated from different countries because until 20th century Israel was a desolate land with only few cities being populated, so my argument with population transfer stands as Germans moved to Poland within 200 year spam and within six month left the country. And in my previous threat I gave sources from famous books how desolate Israel was and for miles not a single soul could have been found, when we speak of 1800 hundreds. 
 

Again, the reason I speak of population transfer is that I know all other solutions will fail, maybe realistically the close solution you can have is binational state but historically they don’t last for a long time, take for example Northern Ireland or Lebanon, when you have two major entities you will have a civil war, it’s typically one ethnicity that is dominant and others minority or you don’t have any major ethnicities like USA, Canada and Australia. All other binational states failed, look what they tried to do with Cyprus and UN tried to hard but it failed. 
 

Look there is fantasy and then there is reality. Again I am telling you for billionth time Israel is here to stay and you will not have Palestine inside Israel just geography itself is not feasible. At least I have a solution. Or we can go with your plan, let’s keep two peoples next to each other, let Arabs once in a while make terror attack and let Israel retaliate and then have you posting videos on this forum. You like that option? Ok be my guest, of course that is also an option, that I will not argue with you on that.

[enchanted]

 

 

Edited July 14 by enchanted

[Raze]

Quote

IDF spokesman says Hamas can’t be destroyed, drawing retort from PM: ‘That’s war’s goal’

Hagari calls Hamas ‘an idea rooted in the hearts of the people,’ also says it will stay in Gaza unless alternative found; PM reiterates war aims, amid divisions with defense brass

https://www.timesofisrael.com/idf-spokesman-says-hamas-cant-be-eliminated-will-remain-in-gaza-if-no-alternative/

Quote

Mass graves from 1948 uncovered in Jaffa 

Six graves hold remains of over 200 Arabs killed in Israel's 1948 War of Independence; exposed by builders doing renovation work on site

https://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4387115,00.html
 

 

[Raze]

Quote

Former Mossad chief Pardo says Israel enforcing ‘apartheid’ system in West Bank

Ex-spymaster, now an outspoken critic of his former boss PM Netanyahu, warns Israel faces existential danger if it doesn’t decide borders with Palestinians

https://www.timesofisrael.com/former-mossad-chief-pardo-says-israel-enforcing-apartheid-system-in-west-bank/

[Karmadhi]

20 hours ago, Gennadiy1981 said:

first to start with Russia, no you are wrong on it, the KievRus was not Russia, it was a separate kingdom that was never on Russian territory. They were called similarly but were totally two independent states. The Russian kingdom was a merger of three smaller kingdoms, the Novgorod, the Moscow and I believe a smaller one something called Volga, but they were totally independent of KievRus, they were never as one country. 

Bro they are the same ethnicity, Slavs. Same religion too. Even langugages are similar. They come from the same place, wherever it is. Too similar they are. We call them different now because things change throughout the times.

20 hours ago, Gennadiy1981 said:

until you have a dedicated Christian countries and dedicated Muslim countries where the law of the Bible is being practiced then it’s fair for me to have my own practice and my own borders. Now about food and holidays it’s not being spoiled, it’s a biblical mandates and those who defy according to Bible will go to Hell.

Bro no Christian countries left. Only some hardcore Islam ones like Iran and Saudi. Even countries like Egypt, Morocco etc are secular. They have civil law, not Sharia law. And all Christian countries have civil law.

20 hours ago, Gennadiy1981 said:

ou keep mentioning that Jews migrated from diffent countries, but so did Arabs migrated from different countries because until 20th century Israel was a desolate land with only few cities being populated, so my argument with population transfer stands as Germans moved to Poland within 200 year spam and within six month left the country. And in my previous threat I gave sources from famous books how desolate Israel was and for miles not a single soul could have been found, when we speak of 1800 hundreds. 

There were like millions living in the land called Palestine which Jews kicked out in mass in 1948.

 

20 hours ago, Gennadiy1981 said:

Again, the reason I speak of population transfer is that I know all other solutions will fail, maybe realistically the close solution you can have is binational state but historically they don’t last for a long time, take for example Northern Ireland or Lebanon, when you have two major entities you will have a civil war, it’s typically one ethnicity that is dominant and others minority or you don’t have any major ethnicities like USA, Canada and Australia. All other binational states failed, look what they tried to do with Cyprus and UN tried to hard but it failed. 

Two state then. Sure

 

20 hours ago, Gennadiy1981 said:

Look there is fantasy and then there is reality. Again I am telling you for billionth time Israel is here to stay

Never claimed otherwise. I just challenge your proposals that is all.

20 hours ago, Gennadiy1981 said:

Palestine inside Israel just geography itself is not feasible.

Gaza and West Bank are not Israel. Israel has clearly defined borders. If you want to expand them, then you are breaking international law and are an invader.

You think other countries do not have land that historically could have belonged to them?

Half of Poland was given to USSR, half of my own country was stolen by our neighboors and the natives got kicked out or assimilated.

We are not starting wars and illegally annexing land.

Nether is Poland.

Israel is fine as it is.

Edited July 15 by Karmadhi

[Vrubel]

59 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

Bro they are the same ethnicity, Slavs. Same religion too. Even langugages are similar. They come from the same place, wherever it is. Too similar they are. We call them different now because things change throughout the times.

The two have different national histories. Crucially Ukrainians are historically more familiar with the democratic tradition, for Russians democracy was always an alien concept. They always had a deeply hierarchical society where the authoritarians commandeered the common folk around like disposable peasants. 
 

1 hour ago, Karmadhi said:

There were like millions living in the land called Palestine which Jews kicked out in mass in 1948.

Barely a million Arabs and 400,000 Jews at the time, with the establishment of Israel, also came a population explosion for both sides. 
 

1 hour ago, Karmadhi said:

Nether is Poland.

Poland lost Lands in the east but gained German, formally Prussian lands in the West. So they don't hold a grudge in that regard. 

1 hour ago, Karmadhi said:

Israel is fine as it is.

I get your point. The question is: can we trust the Palestinians with independence and healthy leadership. Will the Arabs create a beautiful and functioning state or will they lash out at us and start wars and larger 7/10's from a new supremely strengthened position as some kind of Iranian puppet? 
A demilitarized Palestinian state where Israel retains control over major settlements, the airspace and the border with Jordan is the only viable solution and a reasonable compromise for both sides. But this not happening for at least another 10 years as trust is so low now. 

[Karmadhi]

12 minutes ago, Vrubel said:

The two have different national histories. Crucially Ukrainians are historically more familiar with the democratic tradition, for Russians democracy was always an alien concept. They always had a deeply hierarchical society where the authoritarians commandeered the common folk around like disposable peasants. 

You are talking about last 100 years, I am talking stuff from 1000 years ago. Since for Israelis, history from 2000 years ago is relevant, I am using that time frame. Obviously in the last 100 years Ukraine and Russia are not the same thing.

But at 500 AD from what I saw they were same tribes.

12 minutes ago, Vrubel said:

Barely a million Arabs and 400,000 Jews at the time, with the establishment of Israel, also came a population explosion for both sides. 

And why did Jews get like 60% of the land when they were 2x less?

Why not give them 30%?

Also in 1947 there were tons of Jews put there, if you see in 1920 for example the ratio was like 10 to 1.

But even if we use 1947 demographics, it is still an unfair split.

 

12 minutes ago, Vrubel said:

Poland lost Lands in the east but gained German, formally Prussian lands in the West. So they don't hold a grudge in that regard. 

1 hour ago, Karmadhi said:

I think tons in Poland were salty about it but could not do anything. Also I saw they list slightly more than they gained. Including historical Polish cities.

12 minutes ago, Vrubel said:

The question is: can we trust the Palestinians with independence and healthy leadership. Will the Arabs create a beautiful and functioning state or will they lash out at us and start wars and larger 7/10's from a new supremely strengthened position as some kind of Iranian puppet? 

It is Israel fault for that. They funded and pushed for Hamas and tried to sabotage the more moderate Palestinian parties. There is concerte proof of that. So maybe ask Bibi to start supporting moderate Palestinians over Hamas. He did that so you can tell me here that "Palestinians are violent and they do not want peace blla blla".

https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/

 

12 minutes ago, Vrubel said:

A demilitarized Palestinian state where Israel retains control over major settlements, the airspace and the border with Jordan is the only viable solution and a reasonable compromise for both sides.

A compromise is a proper Palestinian state within 1967 borders. If they start war again as a soverign state, then we will not cry here about war crimes as much.

Your logic is: Let Palestinians live in terror and oppression so Israelis can live at peace.

Not only that is super biased, but that attitude leads to terrorist attacks and Israelis do not leave at peace even.

Loss loss.

Support a Palestinian government that is pro co existance and two states, give them full independence and support and you will have a proper solution. 

But that will entail tons of illegal settlers being kicked out which Israel does not want.

They want peace and to steal land.

You cannot have both.

Edited July 15 by Karmadhi

[Nivsch]

5 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

Palestinian state within 1967 borders.

67 aren't secure borders physically, let alone that it is unrealistic to evacuate the settlements at this point. The western third part of WB has to stay under Israel control.

Edited July 15 by Nivsch