Israel / Palestine News Thread

[Alex4]

I believe that if the ground is fertile, as @Atb210201 mentioned—meaning a big percentage of the population is favorable to foreign intervention—then it could be successful. Didn't the Americans, Russians, and other Europeans enter Germany at World War II? Yes, and to this day, no German has opposed that foreign intervention.

The same with the Romans when they entered Gaul. A few years of uprisings followed, but in the long term, they adopted Roman culture and progressed to stage red.

There are rotten regimes where the society is so frightened that it only takes a little stirring of the hornet's nest for them to collapse.

In any case, I recognise that very favorable conditions must be in place for a foreign invasion to succeed in the long run.

 

[Starlight321]

4 hours ago, Atb210201 said:

Yes but right now they are not thinking like that.

Right now all they think about is how to get rid of this Islamic regime.

Whoever says these kinds of stuff to them they will just say anything is better than this.

And Persians are not that much of Muslims anymore maybe in the past we were much more of a Muslim country but after the Islamic Republic regime it has changed drastically for most of the people.

Lot of them even say we want zoroastrianism back and because Muslims have evaded our land Persia in the past and they were arabs and we were persians and they forced Islam on us we don't want Islam anymore we have our own rich culture and religion.

That's at least what lots and lots of people say.

These liberals I'm talking about don't even give a damn about Palestinians anymore either; whatever happens to them they say is not our concern we want our own nation to become secular and thrive.

And keep in mind these are most of the Iranians and the people in Iran right now.

1) The regime might be very unpopular but the truth is that most alternatives if not all are worse for the iranians. It's like in egypt in 2011 or libya and at this developement level it is too hard to keep a country with this geography and diversity together. Every border province that's right now united in opposition to the regime would start to seperate and bad faith actors from the outside would try to take advantage of it.

2) If we would give you a liberal democracy you people would be outraged over the from their pov perceived sexualisation and disrespect for cultural norms. Also unrestricted capitalism would pillage your country and make living more expensive because in your country it would lead to olligarchy like structures and a exploitative transfer of wealth and your huge oil reserves probably wouldn't be of help because the country is too big and the opec would try to restrict the oil production to keep the balance and it is also likely that the big share of it would end up in someones pocket due to corruption

[Nemra]

47 minutes ago, PurpleTree said:

Why? 🤔 

It could be related to the climate.

[hundreth]

35 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

Dude.. who attacked who here.  Iran backed the attack on Israel.  Just live with the fact that Israel can now stand up for itself and has a superpower behind it.  You guys can cry all you want but it isn't you that sheds tears when entering a Holacaust museum.  If you've even been to one I'd be surprised. 

It was blurry which side of the fence Leo was on, but it seems more like he's oscillating between extremes depending on which book he's read most recently. Now he's on his satanic zionists grind. 

This too shall pass 

[PurpleTree]

3 minutes ago, Nemra said:

It could be related to the climate.

I’m confused 

who do you mean with caucasian? Because in the US it’s just a synonym for white people.

[Atb210201]

19 minutes ago, Alex4 said:

I believe that if the ground is fertile, as @Atb210201 mentioned—meaning a big percentage of the population is favorable to foreign intervention—then it could be successful. Didn't the Americans, Russians, and other Europeans enter Germany at World War II? Yes, and to this day, no German has opposed that foreign intervention.

The same with the Romans when they entered Gaul. A few years of uprisings followed, but in the long term, they adopted Roman culture and progressed to stage red.

There are rotten regimes where the society is so frightened that it only takes a little stirring of the hornet's nest for them to collapse.

In any case, I recognise that very favorable conditions must be in place for a foreign invasion to succeed in the long run.

 

It might be successful.

But then again it might not be successful which is more likely at least I think.

Fundamentalists are just way too much in Iran still and it has even broadened it's ideology outside of it's borders to other Islamic countries as well.

Iran now has supporters all over the world as a good enemy of the west whoever is against the western world is an ally of Iran it's a huge audience.

Edited Thursday at 02:19 PM by Atb210201

[Inliytened1]

1 minute ago, hundreth said:

It was blurry which side of the fence Leo was on, but it seems more like he's oscillating between extremes depending on which book he's read most recently. Now he's on his satanic zionists grind. 

This too shall pass 

Haha.

@PurpleTree i hope it doesn't come to that but it is what it is 

[Atb210201]

34 minutes ago, Starlight321 said:

1) The regime might be very unpopular but the truth is that most alternatives if not all are worse for the iranians. It's like in egypt in 2011 or libya and at this developement level it is too hard to keep a country with this geography and diversity together. Every border province that's right now united in opposition to the regime would start to seperate and bad faith actors from the outside would try to take advantage of it.

2) If we would give you a liberal democracy you people would be outraged over the from their pov perceived sexualisation and disrespect for cultural norms. Also unrestricted capitalism would pillage your country and make living more expensive because in your country it would lead to olligarchy like structures and a exploitative transfer of wealth and your huge oil reserves probably wouldn't be of help because the country is too big and the opec would try to restrict the oil production to keep the balance and it is also likely that the big share of it would end up in someones pocket due to corruption

I'm not pro regime change anymore myself I do think that it's good for now as it is let it be there.

But people are not that tolerant and content as me though.

Sooner or later there may come another revolutionary Uprising if the situations were appropriate enough.

I don't know we'll just have to wait and see.

Edited Thursday at 02:35 PM by Atb210201

[Nemra]

@hundreth, if you judge Leo based on a one-dimensional axis, then of course he will shift from one side to the other.

[Nemra]

44 minutes ago, PurpleTree said:

I’m confused 

who do you mean with caucasian? Because in the US it’s just a synonym for white people.

Caucasians, the people from the Caucasus.

The real ones! 😋

Edited Thursday at 03:00 PM by Nemra

[Stovo]

5 hours ago, Atb210201 said:

Yes but right now they are not thinking like that.

Right now all they think about is how to get rid of this Islamic regime.

Whoever says these kinds of stuff to them they will just say anything is better than this.

And Persians are not that much of Muslims anymore maybe in the past we were much more of a Muslim country but after the Islamic Republic regime it has changed drastically for most of the people.

Lot of them even say we want zoroastrianism back and because Muslims have evaded our land Persia in the past and they were arabs and we were persians and they forced Islam on us we don't want Islam anymore we have our own rich culture and religion.

That's at least what lots and lots of people say.

These liberals I'm talking about don't even give a damn about Palestinians anymore either; whatever happens to them they say is not our concern we want our own nation to become secular and thrive.

And keep in mind these are most of the Iranians and the people in Iran right now.

Western liberals act the same way but when Russia invaded Ukraine they all suddenly pulled out their Ukrainian flags and overwhelmingly supported military aid to Ukraine. 

[hundreth]

22 minutes ago, Nemra said:

@hundreth, if you judge Leo based on a one-dimensional axis, then of course he will shift from one side to the other.

Good thing you're so multi dimensional.

[Atb210201]

9 minutes ago, Stovo said:

Western liberals act the same way but when Russia invaded Ukraine they all suddenly pulled out their Ukrainian flags and overwhelmingly supported military aid to Ukraine. 

Well, Western government is mostly liberal in it's approach so that would make sense that liberals would support their liberal government there and who they back.

Edited Thursday at 02:44 PM by Atb210201

[PurpleTree]

41 minutes ago, Alex4 said:

I believe that if the ground is fertile, as @Atb210201 mentioned—meaning a big percentage of the population is favorable to foreign intervention—then it could be successful. Didn't the Americans, Russians, and other Europeans enter Germany at World War II? Yes, and to this day, no German has opposed that foreign intervention.

The same with the Romans when they entered Gaul. A few years of uprisings followed, but in the long term, they adopted Roman culture and progressed to stage red.

There are rotten regimes where the society is so frightened that it only takes a little stirring of the hornet's nest for them to collapse.

In any case, I recognise that very favorable conditions must be in place for a foreign invasion to succeed in the long run.

 

Germany had a lot of the workd as enemies.

Germanys military was already overextended and decimated in other countries like Russia. And then more than 2 Million german civilians were killed etc. 
 

I don’t think most countries/armies in this say and age are willing to kill so many people.

[Nemra]

7 minutes ago, hundreth said:

Good thing you're so multi dimensional.

Thanks for the acknowledgment.

[PurpleTree]

11 minutes ago, PurpleTree said:

Germany had a lot of the workd as enemies.

Germanys military was already overextended and decimated in other countries like Russia. And then more than 2 Million german civilians were killed etc. 
 

I don’t think most countries/armies in this say and age are willing to kill so many people.

And then after the war there was the marshal plan, economy boomed, german brand became very successful etc. same with Japan so people had jobs and a positive outlook and were tired of wars and ideology.

[Inliytened1]

1 hour ago, Alex4 said:

I believe that if the ground is fertile, as @Atb210201 mentioned—meaning a big percentage of the population is favorable to foreign intervention—then it could be successful. Didn't the Americans, Russians, and other Europeans enter Germany at World War II? Yes, and to this day, no German has opposed that foreign intervention.

The same with the Romans when they entered Gaul. A few years of uprisings followed, but in the long term, they adopted Roman culture and progressed to stage red.

There are rotten regimes where the society is so frightened that it only takes a little stirring of the hornet's nest for them to collapse.

In any case, I recognise that very favorable conditions must be in place for a foreign invasion to succeed in the long run.

 

Thats accurate.  I noticed you left out Iraq but some could argue that too was good in the long run despite some of the reasons behind it turned out to be false.   In the end it was still a rotten regime.  But there were still negative consequences.

Like in Germany after WW1 you had a very bitter Germany that came back ten times worse. 

So to me a foreign takeover, even with good intentions can end up backfiring.  But not always as you point out so it shouldn't be ruled out completely.  There are times when it will be warranted.

The future cannot be fully predicted and the immediate threat at hand still needs to be addressed.

Edited Thursday at 03:04 PM by Inliytened1

[royce]

If Israel attacks Iran once again, the Iranian response will be swift and devastating, unlike before, where there were delays of a month or two.

The reason for this is that before carrying out the strike yesterday, Iran had prepared a "response to the response" plan, and satellite images revealed that the Revolutionary Guards had already set up their missiles. This led some to mistakenly believe that a second wave of strikes was imminent.

Israel was significantly damaged by yesterday’s strikes, and the evidence for this includes the following:

1. **Noticeable Reduction in Air Strikes and Flights**: There has been a clear reduction in Israeli air force operations. Before the Iranian military strike, Israeli air forces were highly active around the clock. However, this activity has now partially decreased, indicating potential damage to Israel's air force capabilities.

2. **Satellite Imagery of Targeted Airbases is Blurred**: Since this morning, satellite images of the targeted airbases have been unclear. Experts believe this is due to an artificial electronic cloud placed by certain companies over these bases to prevent the extent of the damage from being revealed. Notably, this cloud did not exist a few days ago.

3. **Lowered Morale Among Israeli Soldiers**: The morale of Israeli soldiers has declined, following the drop in morale among their leaders and the Israeli public. The direct result of this has been Israeli soldiers falling into easy ambushes in southern Lebanon—four large ambushes so far. Before the Iranian military strike, the morale of the Israeli army was high, and they had a significant amount of confidence and arrogance, positioning themselves as the strong and assured attacker carefully choosing their targets.

Yesterday and today, Israel lost what it gained last week. This is the nature of battles, meaning that it is possible for the Israelis to regain their strength, but they will not be able to achieve this while facing the readiness and vigilance of the opposing axis.

Iran is ready to respond quickly if Netanyahu decides to take a risk. As mentioned yesterday, the Israeli file is now in the hands of the Revolutionary Guards, not President Bazashkian, who prefers diplomatic solutions.

The commanders of the Revolutionary Guards are angry over the killing of their colleagues and now have an opportunity for retaliation, especially with Israel embroiled in a ground war with Lebanon and Palestine, scattering its forces and exposing them to attacks, as demonstrated by the recent strike on a tank gathering near the Gaza border.

It is not far-fetched for Israel to resort to the Samson Option or act recklessly, whether by assassinating a prominent Iranian commander or bombing nuclear sites. We are facing perhaps the most reckless and arrogant Israeli leadership in its history, and the coming days will reveal more about the nature of this conflict, of which we are living through one of its most significant chapters.

- Sameh Asker

2/10/2024

Edited Thursday at 03:15 PM by royce

[Inliytened1]

@royce for a minute i thought you wrote that. Lol.

Silly me since you can barely finish a sentence properly. 

Well, I'll respond to him.  

Israel hasn't lost it's momentum.   This is all propaganda.  

Right now it clearly has the upper hand.  

 

Edited Thursday at 03:32 PM by Inliytened1

[royce]

28 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

Well, I'll respond to him.  

 

No, you're too simplistic to respond.