Israel / Palestine News Thread

[royce]

15 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Who are America's rulers in the Middle East? That idea isn't credible.

All the Kings in the Arab Gulf except in Yemen  , the president of Egypt , King Of Jordan , King of Morocco , in Libya , This is in addition to the American bases in Syria and Iraq. 

Edited September 27 by royce

[royce]

18 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

America mostly just does lots of business deals there and America supports who is best for business

They all best for the business  , if the ruler not the best it will be problem for him 

Edited September 27 by royce

[Inliytened1]

59 minutes ago, royce said:

This could happen if the U.S. were to leave the Middle East and the people overthrew their rulers. But if America stays in the region and continues backing the Arab leaders, they would maintain control over their populations, and things would likely stay as they are. In my view, the U.S. won’t abandon the Middle East anytime soon, as their strategy seems to involve building an "Arab-Israeli NATO" to counter Iran, leveraging existing tensions between Arabs and Persians due to conflicts in Syria and Iraq. { between the Sunnis and the Shiites.} 

Well if they're governing the Middle East as well as you say they are then I give them an F.  What about Lebanon.   Israel is clearly operating on its own here. 

[Jodistrict]

If the leaders of Muslim countries were that concerned about Palestine, the most effective strategy would be to form an economic boycott.  How could Israel survive not being able to do business with the countries that surround it?   But they don’t.   America buys off countries like Egypt, and uses its economic power to keep the Arab rulers in line.  These rulers have to be plugged into the global system to maintain their economies and keep from being overthrown by their own populations.   So, of course, Israel couldn’t survive without American power.

[Lyubov]

3 hours ago, royce said:

I completely agree with you, and that’s exactly why Israel is aiming to solidify its dominance in the Middle East. With global dynamics shifting and rising powers like China potentially emerging over the next 20-30 years (in my opinion), Israel is working to eliminate regional threats to secure its position. The Arabian Gulf states are relatively weak, Egypt is struggling economically, and Iraq, Syria, and Libya have been devastated—leaving Iran as the main rival. The events of October 7 have given Israel a strategic opportunity to further destroy  its enemies while continuing to enjoy unwavering U.S. support. If Netanyahu provokes a conflict with Iran to change its regime or destroy its nuclear facilities, and the U.S. intervenes, he might no longer need American support in the same way going forward—that would be the endgame.

I heard that Israel also faces widespread decline from how unpopular this war is. Committing ethnic cleansing hurts investments in their industries which are very important for their economy. They have almost no tourism. Their academia may suffer some from being an outcast. Their current state system creates so much disharmony it spreads deep through their economic and development as well. I try to avoid extreme takes and look at a balance between what I’m hearing. Israel does have a decent army and some natural gas energy. I don’t think these voices saying Israel will fall are correct but I do think this will make the country much poorer and unpleasant to live in, who knows what that can then lead to. Apparently they have brain drain too now with anyone with means leaving. Some huge number of doctors left as well, their medical industry has brain drain. This war is having similar effects as what is happening to Russia, I don’t think either state will just crumble and the country will cease to be but I think on the world stage their power and wellbeing will be greatly reduced to eventual revolution or entire reworking of the state will take place due to the massive amount of internal issues. 

[Nivsch]

4 hours ago, royce said:

exactly why Israel is aiming to solidify its dominance in the Middle East. With global dynamics shifting and rising powers like China

Israel wants to neutrilize the dangerous 'belt of fire' the Iranian regime tries to build around it with its proxies backed by a planned nuclear capacity.

Edited September 27 by Nivsch

[PurpleTree]

2 hours ago, Nivsch said:

Israel wants to neutrilize the dangerous 'belt of fire' the Iranian regime tries to build around it with its proxies backed by a planned nuclear capacity.

I don’t think you can stop iran from going nuclear in the long run.

And killing their scientists etc. will just make them want to nuke you more.

Feels like israel is playing a game against time.

 

[Nemra]

A very short explanation of the conflict.

Edited September 27 by Nemra

[Raze]

 

[Karmadhi]

11 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Something to consider: If the US did not support Israel so strongly then it's much more likely that Iran and Arabs in the region would go to war with Israel because they would have a decent chance of defeating Israel by itself.

Did you forget Israel has nuclear weapons and is the only country in the region that does?

That alone makes it impossible to actually destroy Israel.

 

[Karmadhi]

12 hours ago, Inliytened1 said:

The relationship. 

What relationship?

What does USA get back?

The irony is that Israel provides USA intelligence against terrorism which exists because of USA support of Israel in the first place!

USA gets oil from Saudi, has good relations with most countries there and also buys weapons from Saudi.

How exactly does Israel aid USA so much?

I feel like USA does 10x more than Israel does back.

I do not want to go to theories but I feel like the only rational explanation is the power of the Jewish Lobby (AIPAC) and most of the media being owned/run by Jews/Zionists.

Basically total infiltration.

[Lyubov]

11 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Something to consider: If the US did not support Israel so strongly then it's much more likely that Iran and Arabs in the region would go to war with Israel because they would have a decent chance of defeating Israel by itself. So the US is trying to make sure that war doesn't happen. That war would ruin the whole Middle East and ruin oil exports.

Maybe at one point in time. They have an extremely powerful military and their current borders are pretty well defended with all the expansion they have done. Golan heights from north gives them high ground. Seems like Iran and Arab countries have their own historical beefs too so that would require tremendous cooperation. Borders in Middle East are drawn in a way that makes it very difficult for international cooperation. No way all those countries could work together to make it a success. Their last attempts failed pretty poorly. The war would have to be staged from Egypt, Jordan and Lebanon. And two of those counties are no longer willing to fight. 

[Lyubov]

31 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

What relationship?

What does USA get back?

The irony is that Israel provides USA intelligence against terrorism which exists because of USA support of Israel in the first place!

USA gets oil from Saudi, has good relations with most countries there and also buys weapons from Saudi.

How exactly does Israel aid USA so much?

I feel like USA does 10x more than Israel does back.

I do not want to go to theories but I feel like the only rational explanation is the power of the Jewish Lobby (AIPAC) and most of the media being owned/run by Jews/Zionists.

Basically total infiltration.

The Jewish lobby plays a role and public perception as well. However Israel is similar to the USA , it’s like a little European country. Having an ally geographically situated there gives USA strong influence over the region. 

[royce]

To all the wise and those seeking balance, compromises, truces, deals, and understandings from all sides:

This is not your time. This is a time of madness, stubborn minds, and zero-sum solutions.

This is a time for suicidal courage and reckless bravado.

Netanyahu will not accept anything less than subjugating the entire region.

 

Edited September 27 by royce

[Karmadhi]

36 minutes ago, Lyubov said:

However Israel is similar to the USA , it’s like a little European country. Having an ally geographically situated there gives USA strong influence over the region. 

Did you read my previous post here?

I literally said USA gives Israel FAR MORE support than ANY other European country.

Why so?

Compare the unconditional support Ukraine gets compared to Israel, especially among Republicans.

Why the America first people say "USA first with Israel as an exception".

I do not see them say "USA first with Ukraine or France or Italy or whatever as an exception".

There is a pure insane Israeli favourism here which I fail to understand why.

There are plenty of non Muslim liberal democracies out there that do not get the same unconditional support Israel gets.

Hence my only conclusion is the AIPAC influence and Jewish influence in USA media and politics.

If there is another reason, feel free to tell me.

Edited September 27 by Karmadhi

[royce]

4 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

There is a pure insane Israeli favourism here which I fail to understand why.

 

Mearsheimer has addressed this; you can look it up for more details.

[Inliytened1]

1 hour ago, Karmadhi said:

What relationship?

 

The US had a lot of sympathy for Israel establishing a Jewish homeland in 1948.   A lot of this was due to the holocaust.

There was a religious and biblical connection that was made with Israel being able to return to their homeland.

The concept of Israel as a democratic state aligned with American values.

The Zionist movement in the US and the large population of Jews in the US.

Jewish organizations lobbying which has been stated already.

Israel was viewed as a possible ally against Russia post Cold War.

 

Edited September 27 by Inliytened1

[Raze]

 

Edited September 27 by Raze

[PurpleTree]

2 hours ago, Karmadhi said:

There is a pure insane Israeli favourism here which I fail to understand why.

 

Lobbies, religious people who think israel is holy, for military and intelligence reasons, common "enemies" and probably even more reasons.

Also now for the US it would be really hard to bail on Israel because of how interwoven they are and the signals it sends to other allies.

[Raze]