Israel / Palestine News Thread

[royce]

Israeli settlers offer boat tours off the coast of Gaza, to watch the bombing and see where they plan to build new settlements.

 

https://x.com/tamerqdh/status/1837909581894193437

[Nivsch]

Tel Aviv is exploding for the release of the hostages and against Netanyahu's policy.

Edited September 22 by Nivsch

[PurpleTree]

6 minutes ago, Nivsch said:

Tel Aviv is exploding for the release of the hostages and against Netanyahu's policy.

 nice

[Raze]

I honestly think they should stop protesting. Peaceful protests aren’t enough and can just be ignored and now there is a risk when Israel starts bombing Lebanon more hezbollah may try to bomb Tel Aviv and it could put protestors in danger, even if the rockets are intercepted there could be a stampede. At the same time continuing the protests could motivate Netanyahu to escalate in the north to distract and accuse them of supporting Hezbollah which is now a more capable threat than Hamas.

They won’t like to hear it but at this point they’d either need to do a complete strike and riot to the point where the idf can’t sustain troops in Gaza and has to do a ceasefire to have manpower left to stop them and guard the north.

Or they’d have to join the anti Israel left and demand Biden condition aid on a ceasefire because if the Israeli population is saying it too the pressure will be too much as he can’t portray himself as pro Israel by supporting the war anymore, and then Netanyahu will have no choice as he can’t sustain the war without the aid and needs it to strike against hezbollah. 

Or, and this is a long shot, start pressuring the courts to drop the case against Netanyahu and publicly saying they are ok with no elections even if the war ends, Netanyahu is possibly refusing a ceasefire because he’s afraid if he does one they’ll have an election and he’ll lose and then get jail time, so maybe if that’s gone he will consider it. 

I doubt they’re willing to do any of these though. But barring that I don’t know what they can do.

Another problem is if Hamas runs out of living hostages they won’t admit it and will try to draw things out as much as possible as they have nothing to lose anymore.  

Edited September 22 by Raze

[Nivsch]

22 minutes ago, Raze said:

Or they’d have to join the anti Israel left and demand Biden condition aid on a ceasefire

They are Israeli citizens who want to live sanely as a western liberal advanced country does and they represent 50%+ of the Israeli population, not the crazy anti Israeli wokies they will never join to.

Edited September 22 by Nivsch

[Raze]

7 minutes ago, Nivsch said:

They are Israeli citizens who want to live sanely as a western liberal advanced country does and they represent 50%+ of the Israeli population, not the crazy anti Israeli wokies they will never join to.

The “crazy anti Israel wokies” are the only ones who are advocating for a practical solution. If Biden tells Israel to take a ceasefire or they get no more aid, they will have to accept a ceasefire. Multiple past US presidents have done this and it worked every time.

Israeli citizens protesting the war but not being against any of the practical means that allow it to continue will not do anything to stop it from continuing. If anything now Netanyahu wants to end the war even less because the second it does he knows they’ll try to throw him out of power and into jail.

Edited September 22 by Raze

[Nivsch]

9 minutes ago, Raze said:

The “crazy anti Israel wokies” are the only ones who are advocating for a practical solution

Maybe in the surface level but in the depth their motives are not healthy.

Edited September 22 by Nivsch

[Nivsch]

22 minutes ago, Raze said:

If Biden tells Israel to take a ceasefire or they get no more aid, they will have to accept a ceasefire.

Bibi will find a way to continue the war or an apparently kind of war to survive. The protest can make some Likud members to retire and get down the crazy government. The change has to happen from inside and not from unhealthy forces from outside who don't really care about Israel and even Palestinian's good.

Edited September 22 by Nivsch

[Leo Gura]

Netanyahu is considering plan to force all civilians out of North Gaza:

https://www.cnn.com/2024/09/22/middleeast/netanyahu-gaza-hamas-expulsions-plan-intl/index.html

All hell will break loose soon.

You Israelis here are in for 50 years of new terrorist attacks. Palestinians will never forgive you.

And even us Americans will get hit.

This is like Bin Laden breeding ground x10.

Edited September 22 by Leo Gura

[royce]

27 minutes ago, Nivsch said:

They are Israeli citizens who want to live sanely as a western liberal advanced country does and they represent 50%+ of the Israeli population

This is a myth , you elected Netnyahu for 20 years and you will continue 

 

14 minutes ago, Nivsch said:

The change has to happen from inside. Not from unhealthy forces from outside who don't really care about Israel

I find it striking how Israel seems to dominate U.S. foreign policy in the Middle East, exerting influence over Congress and having AIPAC everywhere. Yet, there's still talk about Americans not caring about Israel — which is pretty ironic.

[Leo Gura]

5 minutes ago, royce said:

exerting influence over Congress

It's easy when a third of the Congress thinks Muslims are children of Satan.

Edited September 22 by Leo Gura

[Nivsch]

4 minutes ago, royce said:

This is a myth , you elected Netnyahu for 20 years and you will continue 

Read a bit about how our method works, and how much rounds of elections Israel had during last couple of years until some side succeeded to win them and even that after many gymnastics and good luck.

Edited September 22 by Nivsch

[Raze]

14 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Netanyahu is considering plan to force all civilians out of North Gaza:

https://www.cnn.com/2024/09/22/middleeast/netanyahu-gaza-hamas-expulsions-plan-intl/index.html

All hell will break loose soon.

You Israelis here are in for 50 years of new terrorist attacks. Palestinians will never forgive you.

The thing is that Israel relies on US aid, but polls show the majority of young people are against them, so in 20 years time probably US aid will start being restricted unless they do a two state solution or one state solution.

The problem is there are way too many armed settlers in the West Bank now to do a two states solution, (it would be even hardrr than expelling Gazans), and by then the Palestinian population will have been separated for three generations so they will basically be different societies). But if they do a one state solution then the majority Israel population will be Palestinians and if they demand the right to vote then the government will be controlled by Palestinians not Jews.

So what Israel is probably trying to do is cleanse Gaza of most of its population by making it unlivable and eventually pressuring other countries to take them, then they’ll try to cripple hezbollah and either get Lebanon to kick them out or cripple Lebanon as a country, then they can get the US to invade Iran and topple their regime (they really just need one establishment republican to win the presidency for this) , by then there will be enough extremismt in the West Bank for them to do a similar operation there and expel most of their population.

Then Israel can simply turn around and say they were actually wrong and agree to accept Palestinians as equal citizens and give them the vote, and the world which would be mounting pressure on them now will forgive them (people are actually very forgiving, like how Germany was largely forgiven despite everything they did) and take it as a victory for their advocacy. But there will be so few Palestinians left they’ll be able to remain a Jewish state. 

Edited September 22 by Raze

[royce]

1 minute ago, Nivsch said:

Read a bit about how our method works, and how rounds of elections Israel had during last couple of years.

I remember at the start of the war, you supported it and seemed to approve. But now you're sharing photos of people in the streets like they dont want the war, which isn't true. They're angry because they understood Netanyahu doesn't care about the hostages . 

[Nivsch]

6 minutes ago, Raze said:

Then Israel can simply turn around and say they were actually wrong and agree to accept Palestinians as equal citizens and give them the vote

We have already 2 million Palestinians living with us, in Israeli cities, very peacefully.

Were do you live? Would you agree a middle eastern Sharia Law country citizens to erase all of your liberals laws?

Edited September 22 by Nivsch

[Raze]

3 minutes ago, Nivsch said:

We have already 2 million Palestinians living with us very peacefully.

Were do you live? Would you agree a middle eastern with Sharia Law country to erase all your liberals laws?

I know that, but that’s the problem, because if Israel accepts the Gaza and West Bank population the Palestinian citizens combined will outnumber Jews and have more influence over government.

Also a Israeli court itself said it found Israel discriminates against Arab citizens and Netanyahu basically admitted he is trying to reduce their fertility rate.

Edited September 22 by Raze

[royce]

4 minutes ago, Nivsch said:

Were do you live? Would you agree a middle eastern with Sharia Law country to erase all your liberals laws?

which country in the middle east Applies the Sharia ? bro stop fooling the people here 

Edited September 22 by royce

[Nivsch]

5 minutes ago, royce said:

I remember at the start of the war, you supported it and seemed to approve. But now you're sharing photos of people in the streets like they dont want the war, which isn't true. They're angry because they understood Netanyahu doesn't care about the hostages . 

You are right. At the beginning the war was more necessary, but at this stage the hostages are much more important. Long term hamas will fail the deal in some way and Israel can come back to eliminate it but it will take years.

Edited September 22 by Nivsch

[Leo Gura]

1 minute ago, Raze said:

if Israel accepts the Gaza and West Bank population the Palestinians combined will outnumber Jews.

It won't work to accept them. They will not be part of an Israeli state when they believe that Israel should not exist. They will just do endless terrorism from the inside.

[royce]

Just now, Nivsch said:

You are right. At the beginning the war was more necessary, but at this stage the hostages are much more important. Long term hamas will fail the deal and Israel can come back to elimiate it.