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@Leo Nordin the awakened have already died. They realize that this is merely an infinite dream by infinite Consciousness. Nothing more. These attachments and finite identity which we have are an illusion. This is realized by the awakened. The ego and its attachments will want to pull the awakened one back into the illusion but he knows better. He knows that any clinging to such attachments is a clinging to an idea within the Mind of God which will dream infinite ideas. He can go on teaching and or doing what he was going before. Nothing would really change. That something would change is yet more imagination.

Maybe the point of life is living? Why did you create life in the first place? Steve Taylor has done research on awakening; you might enjoy some of his books. Not everyone that has a terminal diagnosis becomes awakened. For those that do, it is transformative. Even in a weakened state, every second they have left is vibrant. The news of their imminent mortality shocks them out of the conditioned mind into a different state of consciousness. Everything that seemed mundane before suddenly becomes beautiful. Their realized purpose is not to avoid boredom, but to embrace the stunning beauty in everything and everyone, and go out of the world singing.

Death is that full awakening i suppose right? I mean, you can't get more awakened than total annihilation. I think with the term "guaranteed" here you mean that god creates time and starts all over again. Because with "guaranteed" it supposes that it's not in your control. Again, i know you said that god really isn't free. That you are locked in being nothing and love. So it will create the highest love. But if "create" implies an intention, and intention implies to be free to choose... But i guess the concept of "free" and not "free" will be only understood by awakening, and we are lost in dualities at this point.

Your mind is not to choose. Your being/your consciousness/your highest self or what you want to call "being yourself" is the one choosing. First lets take enlightenment, if you let go too deep into ecstasy and vibrance of life you will leave the body (die), enlightenment will mean death. I quess awakened beings might be a better word if we want to talk about this. This being will to the highest amount appropriate follow their higher or true self. What it chooses to do on this world before it leaves it could be called life purpose. It's the purpose of your entire being before leaving this world and attaining enlightenment. Or rather it's not the purpose of your being but the specific way your consciousness choose to work towards it which is referred to as life purpose. The purpose will be a goal much higher than yourself and will not be achieved in a lifetime. In a way life purpose might be the opposite of enlightenment. I believe it is the only thing that keeps awakened people that follows their souls from attaining enlightenment. The highest goal is being yourself and the end of the journey is enlightenment. Many on here though believes enlightenment to be awakening as in understanding reality. It is a word that is pretty disrupted, there are many many flaws to language. Especially when we talk about life. You wouldn't be able to guess how many times my choice of words on here has created unnecessary discussions. I hope I used my mind well this time to explain something about life.

I don't need ecstasy nor enlightenment. Ecstasy will anyways come from time to time. It was not long ago I awakened so I've now realised some things since then. Though enlightenment will be my death when I choose it. My consciousness will choose what it chooses, I (the mind) am not to interfere if it's not necessary. Because of my early awakening experience I did not eat nor do anything, I just went deeper into life. I thought that was all my consciousness wanted to do and that all other activity was either for my survival or selflessness for the world. Now though, I believe I am experiencing the next phase. My whole being wants not to sit in ecstasy or go for enlightenment but do certain things which I (the mind and body) haven't subcome to so I don't now what it is. I am using my mind to control the highest self if you want to call it that. Before I let go I first need to use my mind independently at least this last time to ensure some kind lf comfort when I let go. By building a van, whether I will give up the van that I am to build I don't know. When the higher self chooses it will do what it wants to do at all times, but some mind is necessary, like clothing yourself or eating. @mmKay I intended vanlife. Whether I will give up my van at one point I don't now. It might be a hazzle to take with me everywhere, I heard of someone sleeping on their motorcycle, that might do what do I know.

My statement is purposefully aggressive and angry sounding in tone because you need fucking wake up call. Your asleep to your own baggage and your taking a tole on yourself and others until you fix it. I know where your at because I've been there and back. I've walked the spiritual path alone with your exact mindset and I know all the ins and outs of it. It's so damn obvious to me it looks like a giant shit stain in the middle of the sidewalk. My comments come from a conscious place of care for you. Not demonization. I only know this too well because I've been through the same shit and held the same trashy narcissistic individualistic perspective that claims you are this 'ultimate awakened person who is soooo developed and conscious' that you don't need anyone and that anyone who seeks relationships is automatically needy. Well thats just a front. You've closed your heart off so much you can't even imagine being intimate with someone yourself anymore. If you were really so conscious and awakened in that area you wouldn't be bashing others on the forum. Your projecting here.

How would I know, I'm not awakened It was horrible yes, the next day I had flashes of it when I was walking in town. I had so much fear to turn streets and to see it again

@Moksha Delightful & I could not agree more. ? I suppose when Siddhartha & Eckart believed they awakened they were also questioning what drives awakened people to do what they do. Maybe they also chose ego. They probably also thought their consciousness, and their awareness was telling them to do things. Maybe they also questioned if this was because of their time, or their advancement. Maybe they also sought to understand how guru’s are motivated, maybe they did make that intellectual choice. Perhaps they were also in the body and knew they would leave it in the future when enlightenment comes. I suppose they also asked other people what is normal for awakened people. I mean, how the heck could I know really.

What drives awakened people to do what they do? The same thing which drives a river to flow.

Yeah of course? I am sharing the experience with you and would like to see if there is some good input. It's just that pior awakening I thought awakened people choose to do good because by having to use willpower. Then now I really think that the truth might be that their and my whole existence seeks doing something more for this world. Early awakening I would gladly just sit blissed out for long times. Now there's the want to do something more during my time on this world. The reason I am skeptical of this new experience is because action takes energy. And earlier I conserved didn't use my energy to reach higher fulfillment. Interesting.. I will share the journey with you all. I just realised, my other thread on how awakened people divide meditation and working for the universe. If doing activity based on your minds choice only then you wouldn't be able to balance it well I dont think. That's why I made that thread. But if your whole consciousness strives to do it then your being creates the balance, now I can meditate again earlier I used ego to stop the will of "the world" which tried to make me do things. It was all about the choice of existence and I'll let existence do it's thing more and more now. What the world will turn around for the people around me. My friends, my family the whole society hasn't gotten any much of clues from me for what change I am about to bring on my lifestyle and what I do. Mohahahahahah lol.

I've started writing some random shit in my spare time relating to awakening & what not, mainly for myself and just a way to journal, but I thought I'd share this as I think it could help some people (hopefully) Self-Help (Self-Actualization) & Awakening ARE Compatible… Wait a minute, isn’t Self-Realization the realization that the separate self / little me / ‘Ego’ you believed yourself to be all these years is a bunch of bollocks, a mere concept & thought that you’ve kept running for X amount of years. It has never existed in it’s own right & never will. Yes. Put simply, it’s not only the realization that Awareness / The Self / The Absolute (I will use these 3 synonyms throughout these writings to refer to the un-nameable truth of your being, the ‘good’ Voldermort if you will) is what YOU are, but it is what literally EVERYTHING is, The Self is quite literally ALL that exists, for nothing but the Self could exist, when you investigate this deeply. BUT, that doesn’t mean you suddenly become beyond human, or float off into space (maybe if you went for Mahasamadhi ?), no if anything it makes you more human, and more able to authentically express your individuality & your personality. Except you no longer identify as them. In fact, the concept / function of an ‘Ego’ is actually very beneficial for the practicality of living. I mean without the ‘Concept’ of Charlie where would employers know where to send your money, who would the delivery driver to deliver your Food to? You get my drift. The problems arise when we then entangle this with who we essentially are, then the I-thought is born, and as they say the rest is history. Only when we investigate this I-thought, it’s source & return it, to its source as we then able to bask in the joy of our true nature, while living as an authentic, unique, human that this understanding, happiness & love expresses itself through. Anyways, returning this to the topic at hand, on why they are compatible. See, ‘Self-Help’ is so broad, I actually recommend this video for realizing the breath and depth of the topic- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJXthKsytpE As you can see, 35+ subfields of Self-Help! Awakening alone isn’t going to make you a master of money, a health expert, an athletic beast, a productivity dynamo, a sex god, a tech wiz, a marketing master and so on and so on. Awakening can certainly help with many topics related to Self-Help, but to think you won’t need further guidance and help on many of these, is simply naïve. What genuine awakening will do, is stabilize you in genuine peace & happiness, absolute fulfilment. Meaning, you will no longer use any external means- money, people, objects, knowledge- to try and fill that existential void we all know so well. For example, when teachers say ‘the end of Desire’ (Buddha, Francis Lucille often says the end of Fear & Desire) they mean the end of seeking fulfilment & happiness as a separate entity which is perpetuated by endless desire. Then, desire simply arises from fullness, from happiness, as a means to express itself and have some fun! Oh, and of course from love, think of how many people (unenlightened as well) eventually turn to a ‘life of service’ which is unique to each body / mind, but comes from Love! Life simply becomes a fun game, and unless you want to go and live your days in some sort of monastic community, or in a cave in the Himalayas, Self-Help will prove to be a great help to you, no matter where you are on the path. It will help you not only integrate your awakenings deeper and deeper through work such as Shadow work, releasing trauma, overcoming addictions etc but used in conjunction with true spirituality can literally create the life of your dreams. BUT, be careful not to use Self-Help for devilry, for example using the Law of Attraction so you can get a Bugatti to show off to your friends & make them jealous. (Nothing wrong with fast cars & nice houses, as long as they aren’t being used to fill a sense of lack!) And, since awakening leads to true happiness & the end of the sense of ‘lack’ and ‘resistance’ that we became so accustom to, it actually makes Self-Help SO much easier. It makes life effortless, because you are doing things simply because you want to, not because you feel you need to, to find happiness or fulfil yourself. In fact, I would also say, realization of the Self makes ‘you’ MUCH more powerful in your abilities to create your dream life, become the best version of yourself & be a force for good in the world, since you are no longer depending on a non-existent personal entity for your motivation & drive, but quite literally have the Universe at your disposal. One catch though, you won’t get away with a lot of the shit ‘normal’ people do, as your actions come from Love, Happiness & Truth, So, don’t think that awakening means an end to the game of life, in fact it is only the beginning. And, it doesn’t mean Self-Help becomes useless, although maybe we could come up with a better term, since ‘Self’ tends to get a bad rap in spirituality, maybe ‘Life-Skills’ as that’s precisely what Self-Help is teaching, the valuable life skills & lessons that will help you live your best life. But, remember to live as & from the Self, not on behalf of a separate entity. Example 1- Earning money selling shitty products, then spending all of this money on prostitutes & shallow pleasures alone. Or, earning money consciously through a business / career that helps people & that you enjoy, making smart investments that creates financial freedom for you & those around you, sharing your wealth & being generous, becoming in touch with the natural law of abundance & desiring for the sake of sharing, not simply for the self alone. Using money not just for yourself, but also for the greater good. Self-Help can help you do both of them scenarios, they are 2 extremes, but it illustrates how different living from The Self is compared to living on behalf of a separate self. How Self-Help Helps Before Awakening While awakening can happen to ‘anyone’ at any time, many beings quite simply are not ready for a true spiritual journey, in fact the majority of people aren’t. Go up to someone on the street and tell them the separate self they believe themselves to be doesn’t exist, and that they literally are Pure Awareness, and that you are them, and no other has ever, or will ever exist and they will call you crazy and carry on about their day. However, go up to someone, tell them they can use the LOA to manifest their dream life, that you can teach them to start a business, quit their job, optimize their health and find their dream partner and they’ll be over you like a rash. We’re all after happiness, and to find the source of true happiness we need to realize where happiness is not found first. But, while getting rich, or getting in shape won’t make us ‘absolutely’ happy, they certainly will make someone feel better, relatively speaking, compared to being obese & broke. Also, many topics of Self-Help are often infused with quote on quote ‘Spiritual Practices’ such as Meditation, Gratitude Journals, Overcoming Addictions (12 steps is VERY spiritual / religion based, just look at Russell Brand), releasing Trauma, dealing with emotions, Mindfulness etc etc. Practicing these will help someone ‘get in touch’ with their True Nature on a regular basis, and will help them progress on the path so to speak. Not only that, there are many foundational habits that I believe really help someone on their own spiritual journey, and just in life in general as I have outlined above. Not only that, having these solid foundations in place, gives someone the inner space & outer freedoms to pursue awakening wholeheartedly without extreme anxiety, worrying about paying their bills, or weight issues troubling them. So, Self-Help can act as a great pre-requisite for awakening. Then, post-awakening, this incredible life that Self-Help has helped one build can then be evolved to become a true expression of The Self, instead of a means to fulfilling a separate self, and can become an expression of love for life. The Business / Career, Relationships, Psychology, Fitness, Health etc can all be used in service of truth, and be used to not only better one’s life, but to help others. For there are MANY ways to express this understanding that goes way beyond the token ‘Spiritual Teacher’ role. In fact, as many more people awaken, we will begin to see awakened Personal Trainers, Therapists. Addiction Specialists, Businessmen, Relationship Therapists, Sexuality Coaches etc etc and having awakened beings at the forefront of these fields will only better them, to say the least. So, when people say it’s either Awakening or (Insert typical thing here) or that awakening means to end to any form of Personal Development, answer them, well you might see it that way, but I’m going to have both! As a quick aside, this doesn’t mean it has to be like that for everyone, each being is unique and has their own path, and many crave the quiet life, or the hermit life, or whatever life it is they want, and may not be interested in Self-Help at all, and that’s fine too. This is simply meant to show you, how you can pursue these if you wish, and how awakening & Self-Actualization are 2 sides of the same coin, and beyond that actually fuse into one epic coin ? Also, here's a link to the GOAT of this topic, Nahm's thread, he's the living legend in this realm-

Are there examples of enlightened people who are at Stage Green? It seems everyone who is a spiritual teacher of any caliber gets placed at Turquoise, but Leo has also said that Enlightenment doesn't automatically mean you're at Turquoise, yet it seems practically every example I've seen on this forum does indeed have Enlightened folks at Turquoise. So, are there examples of Green or Yellow people who are awakened?

Richard Rohr is one example of a Yellow thinker who has also awakened to some degree. Ethan Nichtern is another example perhaps. @Megan Alecia Jim Carrey is a good one. Brand is definitely Green, but I'm not sure I'd considered him enlightened. Don't know enough about where he's at in his inner journey, though.

@integral I understand the difference, just pointing out that on this forum specifically nearly every enlightened person (including all the ones mentioned so far above) are frequently mentioned as Turquoise. It seems like there's a default assumption that anyone who wakes up also has grown up. Wilbur and Leo would say this is not a direct correlation, and yet, again, it seems as if nearly every example of someone who has awakened is pegged at Turquoise. Was curious to see if there were other examples that were strongly grounded in Green or Yellow.

I am the creator of everything and I choose my experience of life. I dont have any physiological problems when I let myself be in a ecstatic state. "states of consciousness" is just me trying to use language with you. If there are no states of consciousness, and you are consciousness, how is there a you which lets or doesn’t let a myself be in or not be in, a state? Not otherwise either because I chose the ego to do what's needed. I dont get where needs or wants come in. If you are consciousness, and consciousness is choosing the ego, what is the ego, and how is consciousness choosing it? How does consciousness and or ego arrive at what’s needed, as distinguished from what’s wanted? This will become of major importance if you awaken, some that has gone into the bliss too deep really struggle to eat and do whats needed. I don't get where needs or wants come in. Is it possible that there are factors in regard to their experience which you are not aware of, and are thus attaching the importance as relative to their awakening? There is no need for activity when in high states of consciousness. "states of consciousness" is just me trying to use language with you. I don't get where needs or wants come in. If states of consciousness is only semantical, how can the states be the determining factor of need & activity? Dam hahaha, isn't it obvious to the awakened mind? Nahm have you awakened yet? You see when you have awakened often what you do on this world will only be what is needed. I don't get where needs or wants come in. If one were to have an awakening experience, yet still believe in or identify with mind (such as awakened or unawakened mind), one might derive one has ‘an awakened mind’. This also could be semantical, but does not seem so as it is followed with asking another mind (?) if it has awakened yet. Again, could be semantics, but being awake in this instance is being said to be the cause of only doing what is needed. Or if I even should use such unpleasant ego that I am using. I don't get where needs or wants come in. What is the ego and how are you using it? What makes it pleasant or unpleasant to you? Again, you might initially see this to be semantical, or due to English being a second language, but the ego is specified as something you are using, while being said to be unpleasant. I wanted to see, are you doing this for the greater good of the world as the highest unselfishness with no real personal gain or fulfillment from it. Or are you doing all this work to get something out of it, because when you are experiencing ecstasy why choose activity over that, for your survival yes but then what. This is where gurus come in, serving the world. I don't get where needs or wants come in. If states of consciousness is just semantics, and you are self aware consciousness, who are you talking about in regard to selfishness (or selflessness), personal gain, fulfillment, doing work, and getting some thing out of it? This would have to be yourself. If this is recognized, how does this relate to ecstasy being some thing experienced, which comes & goes relative to activity?

I often am misleading when I teach or share knowledge. For me what you wrote is obvious but you wouldn't understand before awakening. The reason of activity is way different between an enlightened being and the common man. Though for me in enlightenment you leave this world. Awakened beings is my word for people like buddha etc. Your post is beautiful? Because what you say is true and you conducted your sentences well. If you want to share more knowledge here please do, the potential readers might benefit? By replying I intended new readers might join the thread. Though no one has as of yet. We have gone off topic.

I awakened some time ago, I am very young but had prepared my body/mind for awakening for a long time. Now I can let go of ego at any moment and experience life to the fullest. Tho this gave me a strong sense of the need to secure survival in such a way that it takes minimal effort and won't be disturbed by me living to the highest capability of the human consciousness. As we now ego is good only for survival. As of lately I've used a lot of ego almost all the time to develop knowledge to be able to make money on the go. I've had some anti ego backlashes and they have brought even more desire to use my ego even more now so that I don't need to later. What would happen if I let go of ego for a year, would I naturally attract enough attention to make money out of my work for the greater good, aka life purpose? Or is that not realistic. Because I deemed that a big risk and instead am using ego only to get knowledge for survival which is a very ineffective way to use your mind/consciousness. The safest idea might be to secure some kind of income that I can have on the go as I habe been trying to do as of lately. If I continue this path is it a good idea to use ego to the fullest or should there be some kind of balance that would be more effective. A day in awakened states of living I need 4-5h less sleep each night and now when I use a lot of ego I need a lot of sleep. Because I am stretching my minds capability in an unnatural way, with ego. When I live in ecstasy you do what is needed for the world aka the greater good. This is what I wonder after a year if people would be there to support my survival. So I have two questions, would I living to the fullest be supported after living for the greater good for a year? If not and I need to secure an income first, what's a good balance between high states of experiencing life and ego for survival?

"states of consciousness" is just me trying to use language with you. I dont get where needs or wants come in. You always live in this present moment. Is your experience pleasant or unpleasant, high states of consciousness refer to high states of living in the present moment very pleasantly. That's kinda what I wanted to explain, you cannot really explain the experience. I would give my advice, probably in terms of explaining how life works. That everything you experience is created from within. How if you master yourself as a life you will be in balance between the mind and the body and everything in between. That way stress fear anxiety anger or whatever you dont want won't be created within your experience of life. Etc... And spreading joy is easy when your blissful isn't it. I know. No I have already gone past this, I am not trying to solve this it's solved already. I was impressed by your dedication haha. I only see one awakening for me there is not being as awake as someone or less. I took it up to continue a discussion, I might have knowledge that you would benefit from?. You see when you have awakened often what you do on this world will only be what is needed. I wanted to see, are you doing this for the greater good of the world as the highest unselfishness with no real personal gain or fulfillment from it. Or are you doing all this work to get something out of it, because when you are experiencing ecstasy why choose activity over that, for your survival yes but then what. This is where gurus come in, serving the world. If you have awakened then you probably have way more knowledge than me because I only awakened as of lately and I am young. I am also Swedish and English isn't my first language do my vocabulary is way more limited then you would think. Language is a big part of this forum and the world, it is difficult to use language to explain things in a manner that fits a wide variety of readers.

This is only half the circle of the awakened one. Going full circle is realizing that you give meaning to the dream and then returning to it.

Yes. You'll plunge into the Dark Night of the Soul, a phase where the meaning of life is no longer valid. All of a sudden you're depressed and can't stop looking for the meaning of life. You're so discouraged that you start to believe it's a non-escaping phase. You're deluding yourself, of course. Don't act on it and be patient. It will pass. Then you step into awareness and everything falls into place. Life becomes meaningful once again. But it has a a different kind of meaning; an awakened one. The bottom line is this: spirituality is good for the individual until he gives up on society and stops making contributions to those around him. When people become passive, no longer maintaining an ordered society, it's guaranteed that everything will in fact crumble.

My goal was always to feel confident however I looked. As long as I look socially acceptable. Took some time of self improvement but it was totally worth it. In the end it won't matter, if you will look better after a surgery that's nice. You will anyways have to remove all insecurities and fears if you want to experience life the best way possible. If this helps one stepping stone then do it. I just felt I should do it the right way and overcame it all. I couldn't have been prouder of myself. Today in not a long time ago I can finally experience the highest forms of happiness whenever I want to. I have awakened. Reason people aren't in this actual natrual state is because of all the fears etc.

It seems to me a lot of people on this forum think they’ve awakened and have the answers to all of life’s questions.

People on here usually take every word I say very serious and try to snatch out how I am actually not awakened or something like that lol. Try to not make to many assumptions based on how I conducted my sentences haha. And yeah because people here fluctuate a lot in knowledge or experience this is common. Karma or the consequences followed by action will always be there. For everything you are involved in on this world this matters very much depending on what you are trying to do. The idea to choose between ego now and not ego later or never ego. Ofcource I mean limiting ego as much as possible. Will I have to use a lot of ego in the future or is an awakened person able to support his survival without it. I don't know the capabilities of my true potential but I know its way more than what I could do before. Interesting, please share an interesting response, arguments over every single detail isn't my thing. Thanks?

If you saw a student laugh/smile and not do any work all lessons or any engagement what would you do as a teacher? There is no need for activity in when in high states of consciousness. If I were to be engaged I wouldn't be engaged in the lesson rather in that which will help everyone in their futures or spread joy or something like that. I would just disturb the lessons. And I certainly wouldn't get a passing grade or enough attendance if I get kicked out. You have done 20k posts?!? On here. Dam hahaha, isn't it obvious to the awakened mind? Nahm have you awakened yet?

Dissolving desire doesn't mean dissolving joy. Desire is the misalignment of what is with what you want it to be. Joy is embracing what is, and realizing that you are what is. There are people with terminal cancer that have awakened, and every remaining moment of their life is filled with joy.