Search the Community

You could make that case. Maybe there's some merit to it. But I wouldn't overblow it. It's being framed as though Dr K killed the guy. What I see is that Dr K was doing his best to help him, and he had a few slip-ups. This is not a good reason to trash him. You guys understand that in real therapy clients can kill themselves too? It's not like the therapist is some kind of savoir. Most people who go to therapists don't improve. In fact I would bet that most therapists are mediocre and harm their clients by over-prescribing drugs. Just because it's legal and "ethical" doesn't mean it helps people truly grow and heal, or avoid suicide. The difference here is that when a client kills himself within private therapy, no one knows about it so there cannot be any outrage. But when it's all live-streamed, it's ripe for a Twitter outrage mob, lead by Mr Girl.

Hello, To contextualize things, let me start off by emphasizing that this question is being asked from a poignantly pragmatic stance, as opposed to some hypothetical armchair or meditative ass-cushion one. In other words, the young-adult persona typing this question is standing on their God-given feet, trying to make life decisions. The essence of this query has to do with how awakening/enlightenment may shift ones relationship-outlook as such (including how it pertains to my particular situation which I'll get into in a moment). To be more specific, I'm asking whether enlightenment/awakening serves* to “enhance/enrich” relationships (making them more profound than they would be in a normal state of consciousness) or whether it actually “ruins/spoils” the spellbinding magic of them. You see, as an introvert who has struggled their entire life with being intimate/romantic (including the cultivation of friendships in general), I initially turned to spirituality with the hope it would help me “get out of my head” and make it easier to actualize my desire for connecting with others. With that being said, upon delving deeper, I inevitably ran into non-dual teachings. These of course talk about the “illusion of otherness” - a message, which I'm afraid has impacted me in the most ironically soul-crushing manner. In short, this news has pretty much capsized my stage-green, interpersonal endeavors and has left me in a sea of crippling depression. Note: My unrest hasn't just merely come from teachings, but also experiences on substances. Given that I have no way of feasibly erasing my memory of my current circumstances that wouldn’t entail committing suicide, I’m frankly desperate for some yellow/turquoise wisdom in terms of moving forward. I say this because I’m doubtful that a therapist, (who would in all likelihood be operating from some limited orange/green paradigm) could offer that much help. At least, this is the way I see it at any rate - especially since my quandary has now inflated to a metaphysical level as opposed to being merely psychological. To be blunt, as a spiritual amateur who has only half-assed the “oneness/awakening game” and as an autistic incel who has no ass in the “social/collective game”, I feel like I'm imbibing the worst of both worlds so to speak. I never could've guessed God would ever dare to have such a dark sense of humor - even in his wildest dreams. Thanks,

@Loba actually this reminds me of the guy who committed suicide not long ago whose name was Soonhei on the forum and the last person who he had a communication with on the forum was Nahm. Not saying that Nahm is in anyway responsible for the suicide. But Nahm's conversation might have had a negative impact on the guy causing him to think what he was doing was right. I mean these are the situations where social acuity gets tested really badly. Plus Nahm was in the position of a mod. That's very influential to some newbie. All I can say the mods here should tread carefully with their advice. It can drive someone over the edge.

IMO it is not a good idea for you to keep watching gore, or to take psychedelics. I had very similar beliefs / thoughts that you have, took around 5 grams of mushrooms, and had pretty much the worst trip one can have. Had to call an ambulance. Negative thought-patterns and (egoic projections) ensued weeks after the trip, and I had to spent time in psych ward. Took antipsychotics. Took me quite literally a year to fully get what happened, and to cut the negative pattern / let go the belief. The thought/belief/pattern that went down was pretty much like this: "God/Universe is pushing me towards suicide, because I have to prove my worth as a fearless, courageous, egoless person who cares only about truth." Today I see what was wrong so to say, what place these thoughts came from, and why they were false. Hope you don't see this as me imposing beliefs on you, but I want to say this directly. Take it or leave it... God is not pushing you toward conquering a fear. This is projection, aversion from emotional guidance. God needs nothing. There is no "your fear", and no fear whatsoever that needs to be conquered. There is nothing you need to do. There is nothing you need to prove. To put it more simply, there is no need whatsoever to watch any gore videos ever again, nor is there a need to conquer/"win" this fear.

It can fool itself into experiencing self-destruction. Like dreaming a life of a suicide bomber. But then the dream ends. In absolute state of God/consciousness there is no "thing" that can be destroyed

from the forum guidelines: "Warning: Spiritual work is inherently risky and dangerous if misapplied or misunderstood. Some Actualized.org teachings are not suitable for people with serious mental disorders. If your mind is chaotic and unstable, these teachings may lead to a deterioration of your condition and even suicide if misapplied." Even though this is in the guidelines, he doesn't really follow this well. If something like realizing god can put someone into a crisis, which absolutely can, and does, he doesn't seem to mind forcing this realization onto someone with no remorse.

“I am a slave to my urges and it makes me suicidal” It’s the beliefs about yourself which feel so terrible. If the thought(s) were true, they’d feel aligned with the love that you are. ? Call and receive help now, don’t put it off. http://www.suicide.org/hotlines/international-suicide-hotlines.html Focusing on thoughts about wanting to stop focusing on discordant thoughts is kind of madness. But there is meditation & expression.

If you are doing basically the same for 20 years... I think it needs a radical change of perspective. One that you think is so far out there and almost suicide. Turn towards something that you always avoided. For example, have you thought of going back to your family and getting married? I'm serious. Doesn't it allow more freedom for you? Freedom which you can leverage towards what you really want? Confess to have come to your senses. I think your parents will be more than happy that you returned to Allah, the old traditions and the family. Instead of swimming against the current, swim with the current to the save shore; if the law works against you, then use the law to your advantage. It's like working a low-wage job and using that extra income to become independent. In your case this "low-wage job" requires you to get into commitment and using that to become independent. Work with that greater freedom towards your true desire.

We are all unconsciously/consciously trying to return to our non-dual essence which is what we all inherently are, free of inner conflict, we are trying to find ourselves. 99% of people you observe are trying to find it in some'thing' - person, object, thought, belief - you can just see it raw and gross and it's beautiful in some ways and you can respect the journey everyone is on and find admiration for all the different ways it is expressed And even in suicide, utter depression, utter agony, you are still looking. You think suicide will return you to a place where you will not suffer. It is just so beautiful it really is. You find such a joy in seeing it and seeing the suffering is always just us trying to find ourselves, merge with who truly are under the layers of what we created, no seperation, no exclusion. It's just the most perfect game - and until you truly confront consciously the obstacles within you will have this restless seeking energy inside of you that nothing, no practice, no one experience, no drug, no person/thing will free you from You will eventually see surrendering to this seeker within is dropping all the acts of ignorance, willing to truly leave decade old patterns, habits, hobbies, beliefs, people, family - all your attachments binding you in seperateness. There is 'knower' that always knows what is good and bad for you and how to return you, the father is within you, you are already the guru, you are the buddha, you are everyone you imagine in your mind to be seperate from you, when you start to be radically confrontational with yourself and facing deep rooted fears There only leaves a compassion within, as you the creator see your creation suffering trying to find what is. Love emerges through giving, give your love to be free.

Pessimism is an emotion directly experienced. It is guidance in regard to the thoughts you’re focusing on and projecting. “You have to let it all go, Neo. Fear, doubt, and disbelief. Free your mind.” Freedom is freedom from thought attachment. If you ‘suicide yourself’, you’ll not be free, you’ll end up exactly right back here, experiencing aversion. Call a trained specialist now. Don’t wait or put it off. https://www.opencounseling.com/suicide-hotlines Attention is presently outward, to concepts, conceptualizations of religions, etc. Reorient inward, and feel, and understand what you are feeling. Start expressing. Find a good therapist or guru. Utilize the internet for your well being, instead of this.

Addition: According to Hinduism, we currently reside in Maya/Illusion. So the precious gift of life is to live in Illusion? If I suicide myself, I’m technically then free of illusion, so why not? I’d be doing the ultimate spiritual good!

From where I am siting right now, "Iraq" I can see that countries are the ultimate dualities. Why people are taking these countries as if they are real? why people are going crazy about that? I am doomed, and I need help before my country Iraqi is set on fire again. It is someone's job to help me get some freedom. I need $120 K in order to purchase a new passport/citizenship and gain some freedom of movement back. It can't be the case that I am sitting here, alone, with no one who can entertain some of these higher consciousness ideas, and I am totally cornered. My sage red-blue society is cornering me, and I am living only physically inside of Iraq. All my life is associated with projects outside of Iraq, I gain money through the internet that's paying my rent, and my friends are foreigners, and I participated in many projects that are originated from outside Iraq. The internet is something that's influencing my life, and the apps within the internet These apps don't take in account my future sometimes, they want to make money, and I have to depend on pure luck. They work for me when their interest is aligning with my interest, which is not the case at all times. I even used to have a chance to post on facebook some of the higher consiousness ideas to my people, but now that is banned, and facebook suddenly banning any political opinion from being advertised without ID verification. Basically the whole world would see who's sponsoring a political opinion post. I can't go out on the street and shout my opinions, that would be a suicide. The world is conspiring to keep the illusion of democracy in Iraq because that serve the oil industry, while the democracy here is a joke. They will just leave iraq to chaos when the oil is no longer needed, and it will become worse than Afghanistan, a threat to the whole of humanity The whole world is conspiring against me. I need to get out to a safer area, at least I would have a chance to speak up without fearing to be silenced. At least I can be able to translate some higher-consciousness ideas to the people of this troubled region without the fear of getting dragged to prisons or murdered. I need $120 K for passport + air ticket + some money to help me stay alive for a year to come until I can find a job. ------ It I ironic, that even if I see this country concept as duality , I need to pay to get a passport and citizenship!

>wouldn’t watch a suicide stream but ready to take on summoning up demons Haha I like this guy

most people will find it weird or creepy, I learned to postpone asking them if they would like to watch Ronnie McNutt suicide stream or showing them gangstalking security agents videos for later, if ever.

When I lived in Korea I got approached by two guys who were very into their religion, or "fake christianity" as they would call it in Korea. Basically they were extremely friendly and wanted to talk to me about God and their view on life, creation etc. So I was just open-minded and listened to everything they had to say while keeping a sceptical eye. We started to hang out some times and they were some of the nicest people I ever met. Almost a bit too nice. They asked me to come join their church, or just check it out. I knew what they wanted to do, they basically wanted to lure me into their church. I went to their church and listened to their whole theory while cringing a bit inside. Still I asked them what they thought about other religions? They just said they respect other religions but this is what They believe in. More and more we started to hang out but they were always peaking for me to join their church even though I didn't want to. I guess they felt that they wanted to kind of save me and that they did something good for themselves and for me. Either way, talking to religious people is really of no use if you wanna convince them of anything. My ex-gf. was a hardcore catholic and I was stupid enough trying to point out the flaws of her religion, and I later realized it was of no use. If something is so deeply enrooted into your childhood/identity it's there to stay. Unless it starts to cause more suffering and you perhaps enter your own spiritual journey to strip away of the religion that's dragging you down. Imagine your gf. having to go and beg for forgiveness after every time you've had sex, frustrating to say the least. Try convincing another person that your language is more valuable/better than theirs, it's not gonna happen. Also I've noticed with religious people that God is above everything, and his judgement is the ultimate thing. According to Durkheim's research on suicide, people of stricter religions like catholicism and judaism are less prone to killing themselves in times of misery than for example protestants. Simply because they are more afraid of not following the way of God than their own suffering, while protestants have more of a "mental freedom/free will" and can decide more for themselves. So that should tell you something about the power it holds over a person's mind. So yeah, a religious person usually don't want to explore. But think about it, does a hard-core atheist wanna explore spirituality and solipsism? Probably not lol. Perhaps even less than a religious person.

@Preety_India Call a trained person who can & very much wants to help. Call now, don’t put it off. https://www.opencounseling.com/suicide-hotlines ?

@Leo Gura Hello Leo Gura! I thought about doing this post for a long time and decided to actually make it. If you have got suicide messages or anything negative about this video I am sad to hear that, but NOW it is finally come time for me to tell my own opinion about this whole case. People get confuced about spirituality all the time and your content can't be somehow special that it wouldn't make that happen. Only reason you have 50k views on your videos and over 1 million followers is that you teach something for us. And if you would stop doing that, then what is the point you existing as "Leo"? Your biggest dream has been to have knowledge of everything and teach people on the way. If you stop doing that then you could just straight go to cave to do your psychedelics ALL ALONE. I am not to hate, but actually youtube, books and other media are full of basic level spirituality and self-help and your videos are just one thing more to this totality. Reason that I have followed the content is, because "Leo's" way of presenting things has always been crystal clear and very holistic. Contemplate which one is more dangerous. A) People get confuced about solipsism, get sad and suicidal and end up understanding that thing wrongly. B) People get confuced about solipsism, get sad and suicidal and end up understanding that thing rightly. (Actually if in this case solipsism would be the best thing ever, there could be decreased amout of sad people after integrating what you said) Remember that if you leave this whole case too open people would get even more suspicious about your words and I guess that this is thing that no one would like neither you nor the people that will live their life in falsehood. Why won't you tell us what was the exact reason to delete that video and why wouldn't you just put that video to your blog so those who are more interested about your content could actually watch it. You have published many other high tier teaching and if in this video something horrible happened then know that this was predictable to happen sooner or later and it could have happened with any other video as well. There is always chance to put high tier video behind paywall and that could also benefit actualized.org financial situation and you could make this everything more broad, have paid moderators, have paid content creators and source reseachers for your videos. The paywall would ensure that people who really are into that content would pay for it and therefore there would be less people who would take these things wrongly. Please concider this, becasue as you have said everyone needs to be open for feedback and you taking action in this would be pretty important for your followers that even you take good feedback. <3 Concider also that do you want to have people having false information on your forum harming other lives or more conscious forum. People will continue talking about solipsism on this forum unless you change rules that its not allowed to talk this topic, but that would make you actually look like a clown. You can only provide high tier teachings for your followers and you don't have any chance to know how it is taken today, tomorrow or after "Leo's" death. Following video has also pretty good points about this case. Comment that had good point about this case. Also there could maybe be rank system in forum that would block newbies to not see hidden content unless they are promoted. That would guarantee that your knowledge wouldn't cause harm, but also that your knowledge wouldn't drain into the well without any benefit. -joNi- Your passionate follower and the one that would be interested helping you on your forum by being moderator for example : )

@BenG I'm not sure, what others say is that the comment section was mostly positive about the video. Something happened in his private life, maybe he's nearing the end of his chapter, or some people pm'd him death threats or suicide threats, or something supernatural happened, I don't know exactly it's all speculative at this point It's a shame some of us missed out on his view of what Solipsism is, and how to handle it.

Those who have had 'normal' parents can't appreciate the fine line between mental health and mental illness. Nor can you ever truly understand a mental illness if you haven't personally lived through it. When I tell people that I grew up with a father who suffered from OCD, most people's reactions are like its not big deal. This just shows the depth of ignorance and misunderstanding. I could go on details how my father's mental illness eroded my self esteem and caused me to develop OCD also.(Now I have recovered from OCD through years of CBT and I am better at handling uncertainty than the average Joe). Or I could tell stories to show the severity of the illness, such as when he would cut my nails, he wanted to make sure he cut the the nails perfectly.(As a result he would cut them so much that I would be in pain for 2 days afterwards). Now I visited my father in another country to make some papers and I currently live with him for a few days. Today he wasted at least 4 hours of my day doing compulsions. He no longer can trust himself and has to check multiple times everything. Imagine being so uncertain that you don't trust anymore that 5 plus 5 equals 10. Imagine getting an answer and having to make sure again and again that you heard the answer correctly. I feel bad for my dad but I can't do much for him. Today I really wanted to sleep so bad but he kept wasting my time on compulsions. The time and energy he expends on these compulsions is just remarkable. I am at awe that after decades of living like that he hasn't committed suicide yet. I lived through ocd for just 6years and I wanted to kill myself at the end because it was constant misery and anxiety. Blessed are those who have had healthy parents. My parents are both dysfunctional. And this has affected me enormously. I feel anger for the card I have been dealt but maybe in the next incarnation things will be much different ?

Survival instinct. Fear of death. Consideration of my parents. A small belief that maybe we are here to learn. So suicide would disrupt the learning process.

Leo himself said: "I am a philosopher. If you don't like it, don't listen to me. No amount suicide threats are going to change the truth. You are not going to fear-monger me out of speaking truth." Leo also grows and changes his mind. He does that which is best for the most amount of people. You're being biased, look.

Leo himself said: "I am a philosopher. If you don't like it, don't listen to me. No amount suicide threats are going to change the truth. You are not going to fear-monger me out of speaking truth." But nope, I guess you actually can fear-monger him out of speaking the truth ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ (Not that it wasn't a justitied and healthy fear nonetheless)

@Yoremo Point of spirituality is to make your life as good as possible and enjoy present moment as much as you can. Spirituality does not make suicide feel right thing to do, but actually what spirituality does is that you won't fear death in your daily basis so much. Also more spiritual and happy you are with your life less logic there is to kill yourself. Most can associate spirituality with suicide, because many people who already have suicidal thoughts end up discovering spirituality as last chance so to speak. And if you want to know more about spirituality - because you actually want to increase your happiness levels overall - there is almost zero risk. Higher risk you have if you wouldn't do spirituality at all so if you want to increase your chances of living then start spirituality right NOW. Trust me, because last thing I want for people is miserable life. I want everyone to find that happiness which I function 24 / 7, because that feels like I am king or something Every sensation feels remarkable, every experience is interesting and I am so happy that I start laughing for the fact that this moment exists right NOW. <3 If you want to do this kind of meditation you should put some limits of how much you can drown into thoughts and feelings, because if you just go closer to "unconscious" that is like you are about to fall in sleep and that's why you should have some point of meditation that you could sometimes come back to. You need to be so conscious of this moment that thoughts actually couldn't come. One tip for that is to let this breathing happen "automatically" and still have awarness in it. That would teach to be concentrated, but not participated in action. Second tip is to be really curious about your point of meditation which in this case is your breath. What is this breath? How does it feel and how do I feel it? Can I recognize it's location? Where does it come and where it goes? -joNi-

@Loving Radiance thank you for that message. I will look into what you said more as I am already starting some other stuff so I need to take it a bit chill. @Kksd74628 thank you @Breakingthewallyeah I recognize that now, the meditations by michael is superior, I feel so loving and caring and good after his sessions and so centered. I have never felt that before. @Ulax I have mainly done breath meditation. But the last couple o´ months or so I started doing some weird "meditation" where I basically just sat and felt good and allowed myself to think whatever thoughts came up. But now I see that wasn´t really helping me as that didn´t increase awareness or anything, that was just a "daydreaming meditation". But you live and you learn right? I have started to keep my eyes open thanks to you and I think that I will continue doing so because that just feels better. And I guess only because michael names his meditations "nondual meditation" maybe I don´t need to worry about that either. I don´t even know what nondual is, and I don´t really know what all this worry is all about. Probably a fear of being suicidal as I have never been suicidal but it scares me a bit that you can come to a place where suicide feels like a right thing to do and I have kind of associated that with going deep spiritually. I guess the increasing connectedness and centerdness and clarity I feel with meditation is basically what it´s all about, atleast in this stage. Thinking about it scares me though, so I guess no intellectual spirituality for me. Embodying meditation feels a hell of a lot better than thinking about the possible changes meditation can bring, that´s my thesis atleast and you can confirm it or change my mind if you wish

Hi! I'm depressed for 7 years now (this feels horrible to acknowledge) . In this time interval I've had ups, but mostly downs. My life went ahead somehow, but I have always felt that something is wrong. I don't remember much of my childhood, especially times in which my parents say that I was happy and outgoing. My memories consist of random (happy/interesting) moments, some dreams (mostly nightmares) and some traumatic events. I have always suffered from "shyness" and anxiety growing up. I was considered a gifted kid and did very well in middle school and early high school, went to different kind of competitions and whatnot. I started being bullied in 8th grade, and it pretty much went downhill from there. High school was traumatic for me... not because I suffered from various impactful traumas such as accidents, but because I suffered from long term stress and anxiety, which I didn't know how to handle. I did not even consciously acknowledged that I had these problems for a long time. Those repressed emotions slowly built up into emotional numbness -> feelings of apathy and generalized anxiety -> chronic depression, generalized anxiety, chronic stress and suicidal thoughts/ideation. I came to the realization that the general cause (or at least the partial cause) of all of these feelings is a lack of feeling seen, valued, understood and loved for who I really am. I never felt important or felt like I should exist. When I was a kid, I remember thinking and saying things to my mother along the lines of "if I wasn't around, you wouldn't have to sacrifice for me". I especially want my depressed, angry, suicidal, miserable side to be seen and loved unconditionally. I have no idea if this is a proper expectation to have of another person. I hate that I'm dependent on other people for my emotional needs. I feel like I'm too fucked up at this point for anyone to love me in any way. People "love" and "like" my façade, which is harder and harder to maintain. Over the years, I couldn't really afford to go to therapy because of financial reasons and the fact that I didn't want to let my family know that I'm struggling. I always felt that I would break them beyond the point of repair. Some attempts were made, but they ended up backfiring. My parents always fought. There was always a silent (or not so silent lol) tension, and I think this is where my anxiety comes from. They hate each other, don't communicate properly and I generally don't trust them to be intimate with me. They are also both depressed or fed up with life at the very least. My father threatened to commit suicide multiple times. My mother suffers in silence but I can see that she also has suicidal thoughts and depression. Won't go further deep into that rabbit hole, but you can see why I didn't talk to them about how I'm feeling. I fear that they might have manic attacks and kill themselves, or physically fight each other or something. Now I'm in college but due to my state of mind and constant thoughts of suicide, manic attacks, chronic sense of loneliness, mental fog I just cracked. I can't go on. I passed the majority of my subjects, but I'll have to repeat a year. I'd like to get a job (I know I could if I really put my mind to it) and save some money, but can't. The only thing that is on my mind is being hugged and appreciated, things which I cannot get. I had some girls show interest in me over the years, but I unconsciously pushed them all away. I'm glad I did that, because it's not fair for them to have to deal with someone so mentally destroyed as me. It's just not fair for the other party involved and I don't want to pull up a bait a switch tactic or be manipulative. I'd love to have a romantic partner, but my unconscious expectation is that they would be my therapist. I don't know what expectations are healthy to have for a partner, but that certainly doesn't make it on the list. Yet, I'm so desperate for any kind of intimate (intimate as in sharing feelings, not sexual) relationship. I'm spending most of days zombifying myself through distractions because I get overwhelmed with negative emotions. No, I just can't sit and be present with them because when I do, I end up daydreaming about suicide or actually researching ways to kill myself. Teal Swan's video on suicide helped me because it felt so validating and made me feel seen. I've grown in some areas over the years, but if I was forced to look at my situation blindly optimistically, I'd say that I've actualized 15% of my real potential that I could have actualized in these years. I've done shadow work, meditation and all sorts of other stuff, but I can't form a habit out of anything positive... The resistance always has a flavor of "I have to change myself so that others will love and accept me". I can't fight through that, I can't work through it, and I can't resolve it due to my fear of irreversibly breaking anyone who comes too close. I'm waiting for therapy right now, thanks to a forum's user. Though I cannot help but feel like it's futile. The wait for getting paired with a therapist is killing me and I don't even have the guarantee that it's going to help me, or that it's going to be a good therapist who can handle me and who know what he/she's doing. I have written all of this because I needed to vent. Also because I want pity, because it feels like love. Yes, a part of me expects pity from anyone reading this. I'm frustrated and ashamed of that part. It feels like that last sentence is a manipulation for pity as well (as well as this one). Oh yeah, for anyone commenting something along the lines of "toughen up" or "gO tRaVeL aNd SeE hOw BaDLy oTHerS hAvE iT", please go find the nearest sharp metallic corner, and smack your head into it as hard as you can.