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Appreciating the kind words everyone, thanks. ?? We’re probably more on the same page than you’re thinking. Nonduality means not two, so imagine reincarnation in the sense you describe, that which people attest to, just, not two.

Survival is selfish but you have a self to take care of. Love yourself. Nonduality means Oneness. Shareness. Connectedness. The world is so complex.

Yes, that's the key: selfishness is so radical. It's important that you realize that. Not everything, but 99% of what you do is. It would Being. A rock is perfectly selfless. A living organism cannot be selfless without dying. But there is an even higher truth: selfishess IS selflessless and Love! But realize what that means: rape and torture is Love. Hard for a self to accept that, especially when it is happening to you. That's the rub, all lines you draw are arbitrary and selfish. YES! YES! Now you got it. All language and thought collapses into silent nonduality. When everything is ONE, everything is understood and nothing more can be said or asked about it. The mind is creating all these divisions and perplexities, getting in its own way. The mind cannot ever grasp ONEness. By grasping it, it makes one into two.

@Tim R ? wanna start a nonduality war?

That's all imagination in zooming. Before zooming there is two separate colors. Anyways nice thought. But nonduality is not more true then duality.

TL:DR Received Dzogchen oral transmission. Became aware of Awareness itself, which is Empty, Boundless, Vast and ever-present. Started entering nondual state of consciousness. Progression Received Dzogchen oral transmission. Turned on the music, and started ascending. After the first plateau, there was no sense of self. I tried to sense IAMness, but in vain. This may correspond to the stage of "Self and Ox transcended". There were 6 more, radically increasing in intensity. Then, after focusing awareness on itself, realization came. I have become aware of awareness itself. This realization is in fact so incredibly obvious, but, paradoxically, it's hidden in plain sight. Very hard to speak of this. Awareness of Awareness is now only available when things are relatively still, but it is clear that this is trainable. Now I know what I am, and what I have always been. Empty, Vast, Open Awareness. It is indeed Nothingness. It is also not located anywhere in space. The mind is still. I do not experience any intense bliss, or feel an alternation of consciousness in the previous sense - this is not necessary. This is a place of no desires, no needs, and no suffering. This is the first fruit of Dzogchen. Now, this state of knowledge has to be explored and sustained throughout movement of Form. This to me is the ultimate path. This is a place of true happiness, peace, and tranquility. How do you go from realization to confidence? It's by entering into that flow of pristine awareness knowing itself, and then sustaining that. Sustain the flow of mindfulness and awareness without distraction, without grasping. Maturity and confidence arises as the practice continues. Awareness is open like the clear sky. The moment I try to conceptualize or grasp it, it is contracted. But when I looked at the sky, it became clear that this Vastness is the true attribute of Awareness. Sometimes, I get spontaneous bliss, arising from moments of clarity and equanimity. Every experience is arising in this Emptiness. Awareness is not located in space, much like emotions and thoughts. There is often a strong knowledge that reality is a dream. When you identify with Awareness, there is no suffering. Pain and pleasure are seen as the are - without labelling them as good or bad. They are just what they are. There are degrees to this knowledge state - the more you practice sustaining rigpa, the less suffering you experience. Way to enter this state Relax into the Vast, Empty, sky-like Awareness, which is IAMness. Rest in IAMness without grasping or clinging. Further investigation Rigpa brings inner stillness, peace, equanimity, confidence, and freedom. I am slowly starting to disidentify with the mind and body, and identify with Empty Awareness. Because I know that this is my True Self. It is so fucking vast. You can take as much bliss as you want from it, but it is not that desirable anymore. When in rigpa, good and bad fade away - there is just a play of Form. Every experience is seen for what it is, without background conceptualization and labelling as good/bad. Old egoic habits are seen through, and slowly dismantled. That includes self-image, judging, resisting and looking away, demonizing, grasping/clinging. Every Form is, and has always been impermanent. On the other hand, Emptiness is unchanging and ever-present. Obstacles BUT, currently: Awareness is still restricted by individual consciousness There is a duality of Emptiness and Form This state does not arise in sleep. That will come later. For now everything given is more than enough, and the practice continues. Dzogchen could be defined as a way to relax completely. And this is true. This is the way to the ultimate relaxation, under all circumstances. Pristine Awareness is much like a mirror. A mirror reflects objects, but it is not affected by them. Pristine Awareness can be aware of an infinite number of forms, and it remains unchanged. I also realized that reality I experience is completely arbitrary. Over the last week, when abiding in rigpa, when I am aware of thought, sight, feeling, it is seen it for what it is - a form - and it doesn't move me, because it is neither good or bad. Glimpses of nonduality There is an ability to see Awareness as clearly as ever before. Now its effortlessly seen as Vast, Empty and present in every experience. Also, it is clear that every Form is reflected in it. What is different is that now, the boundary between Emptiness and Form can be dissolved. In this state, instead of awareness of form, there is just seeing/hearing/touching. There is an experience, but no experiencer. In fact, this duality is constructed by the mind, an can be stopped. Woke up and immediately relaxed into awareness of Awareness. And then slipped into nonduality, by stopping producing duality. Next steps Abiding in nonduality, and seeing what happens. By now, it is rather restricted in the sense that I am one with what I currently experience, and the knowledge comes after experience. But there are further stages to this process. The main practice is to explore nonduality, and look where it leads me.

@Gesundheit All notions are dualistic. But since you asked for a new explanation, that's all I can give to you. Beyond all these words there's Love. I'm not talking about this dualistic form of acceptance/love of any "you" or "me". When I said "forget the self", I meant that. The only one who's hung up on dualisitc notions is you, since you think there's an explanation that could reveal the actual secret. I can only point towards the nondualistic nature of what I'm talking about, I can never, never ever show it with words. To explain nonduality with words is a completely meaningless issue and therefore impossible. Stop thinking that there's somebody who "does" the accepting or that there's somehow the possibility of there being a separate self who can "reject" anything. It's not like that at all. It simply turns out that "acceptance" is the best word I have. Of course I'm going in circles, what did you expect?? That's the whole problem about trying to explain something like that and I'm very aware of it. Love is indiscriminate! That's the whole point! This existential non-discrimination is Love! Let go of the notion that Love is an emotion, it's more than that. It's much, much, much more existentially fundamental than having extreme affection for something/-one (love) or accepting / rejecting something. If you see it for yourself, it becomes glaringly obvious. Too obvious. And then you'll be in the same situation as me, trying to use a broom to sweep the darkness out of a room. Idk, maybe someone else here is better with words than me and wants to give it another shot.

I am starting a career as a novelist exclusively in Nonduality Fiction. Stories with themes in Spiral Dynamics, God, Infinity, Solipsism, etc. Got about 40 great stories I'm working on. Some are full length novel, the rest will be collections of short stories. Though it might be a couple years till I finish them all and have them published. It's one of my main life purpose.

I watched D'Angelo Wallace's video on Leo. I watch D'Angelo's content every now and then and found his content entertaining. I think his video is a good representation of how any normal person who hasn't really looked into Leo's channel will view Actualized.org. I remember having these same exact thoughts when I first discovered Actualized.org. If you are the average person and then you encounter a series of videos on how this guy claims to be god, how you are god, and how you need to take this illegal and potentially dangerous substance to realize that, I think it is healthy to be skeptical of that. I went in to this mindset of skepticism but I still continued watching Leo's videos because I found them interesting and useful. I still take things with a grain of salt and I try to rely more on direct experience and additional sources before jumping to conclusions. But you have to understand, most people don't know about nonduality. Once you start learning about nonduality as a concept, even if it is only on theoretical terms instead of direct experience, Leo's videos make more sense. It becomes less about some crazy bald guy who claims to be the bearded man in the sky who you should worship and do everything he says and more nuanced because your understanding of god changes. Also, most people who do psychedelics don't do it with the intent of actualizing or for spiritual reasons. So I can see why someone would be concerned with people becoming addicted to it recreationally. I will admit that I did feel a little triggered when I saw D'Angelo make that video. But I think it's because I really like Actualized.org and as a result part of me identifies with it. Consequently, when someone critiques it, a little bit of defensiveness can get stirred up. For the most part I thought it was kind of funny to watch someone who doesn't have much exposure to spirituality freak out over this. I just brushed it off afterwards tbh. It's not that serious. I'm not saying D'Angelo is right or that I agree with him but I understand where he is coming from and why he would be freaked out. Also, don't try to convert people or change their opinions. There is already a perception of this place being a cult and pushing people to think a certain way will further cement the idea of this being a cult in their minds more IMO.

Enlightenment doesn't mean anger doesn't arise. You're just not identifying with the anger. The experience of nonduality removes certain unnecessary mental loops revolving around the fictitious I-thought, but it doesn't mean stuff ceases to piss you off. That would mean enlightenment rendered the brain non-functional. It doesn't matter if all is one, some of the all is asleep to it and its behavior can certainly piss you off.

So today i had a very interesting meditation experience. First of all i haven’t been meditating for almost a year now because of various reasons. But i have meditated and contemplated in the past a lot. So i think i have a pretty good understanding of nonduality. Also i had my first awakening experience about three months ago while tripping on mushroms. But thats another story. word counter VidMate Mobdro Basically just today i decided i really want to start meditating again. I created a to do list for 100 days of meditation. After that i sat down and started meditating and not even 10minutes have passed when my consciousness started shifting in a very way it wasn't like anything i have ever experienced during meditation. I started to feel this presure on my eyes and then everything started to feel much more lucid. Suddenly i wasn't simply aware of the things in front of me but all consciousness around me. It is kind of difficult to explain but yeah... And then i started getting excited and it faded. i think this was a slight taste of nonduality through meditation. But I never thought your state of consciousness could shift in such a significant way just by meditating. Very crazy I also find it very interesting that i had the strongest experience through meditation after more than a year with no meditation and basically no conscious lifestyle. I think this might me because when i meditated daily amd contemplated constantly i always wanted this awakening soo bad but this was probably the biggest obastacle to it. Anyways i just wanted to share this experience i had with yall.

Advaita means nonduality. As a teaching it points to the original teachers and resources (ramana maharshi.. Rama Krishna.. The vedas etc) all the teachers you mentioned above are neo advaita.

If you’re arguing about nonduality, you aren’t actually talking about nonduality.

If someone had argued nonduality with you before you realized nonduality, what would your response have been? People only learn when they are ready to learn, and the motivation has to arise from within themselves. The best teaching you can offer is to simply be present. Do not share this wisdom with anyone who lacks in devotion or self-control, lacks the desire to learn, or scoffs at me. Those who teach this supreme mystery of the Gita to all who love me perform the greatest act of love; they will come to me without doubt. No one can render me more devoted service; no one on earth can be more dear to me. - Bhagavad Gita 18:67-69

Yeah. The Law of One material, if you accept its premise, totally blows up the ideas frequently bandied about on this forum and those of conventional nonduality teachings. I mean, sure, you have "Zen Devilry" ("enlightened rogues") but that's typically considered a passing stage on the way to full enlightenment. But here the fundamental premise is that you can be enlightened yet Service-To-Self (i.e. control/power as opposed to love-others-oriented. The split is 95% to self for the first and 51% to others for the second.) Now, most spiritual seekers and enlightened people are, in my experience, Service-To-Others oriented. But definitely not everyone.

So i figured that i haven't spent enough time contemplating, and this post is meant as an exercise,and also to see potential holes in my understanding. Since the first times i took acid, but especially after my 600mcg breakthrough (i've posted the trip report for anyone interested) i can access lower levels of psychedelic-like understanding all the time. My imagination just explodes with insight especially when i smoke weed but also when i'm sober (yes it's weird). This skill grows the more i become conscious, the cleaner and healthier my body gets and the more i take psychedelics. So the following is my attempt at putting into words my current experience/way of seeing things. Of course Leo's videos have influenced me A LOT, but this is all just from the top of my head. SO You/Nothingness - is like this infinitely big "room". But because it's infinitely "big" although it's Nothing, it kinda becomes an infinitely dense, infinitely complex "THING". But it's only ONE "thing", so it's not big or small, relative to something else. It's Absolutely big, and yet it's like a DOT. It's Absolutely small, and yet it's like an infinitely complex geometrical figure. it kinda lives in these two paradoxical simultaneous states of being a thing and not being a thing - infinitely complex AND infinitely simple, and every. single. fucking. distinction. anyone could possibly make AND MORE AND MORE AND MORE to infinity It's indistinguishable from nothingness, that's why science will never FIND "it". Nothingness is the floor and the ceiling of Existence all at once. And so it seemingly has two "sides" - The infinite, ever-expanding "space" and the infinite, ever-contracting "dot" (which is the inverted whole "viewed" from within-without (i'm not going to even try to explain stuff like within-without. i hope you get it) This is nonduality = duality! because we have the two parts - the whole, which is one, and the seemingly separate, which has itsef two sides - "nothingness" and "everythingness" mirroring the whole - which paradoxically creates three things, and that by the same logic it creates a fourth thing and a fifth and so on, and infinity is "born". But it's all One. Now, the tendency is to say that "here" we are INSIDE the Universe but it's nature is such that each square centimeter is infinitely filled with the ENTIRE Universe in each infinitely small point wherever you can possibly point to. it has this sort of infinite, BUT CIRCULAR geometry thing about it. So you are always inside AND outside of it (yourself). EVERYWHERE IS OUTSIDE/INSIDE YOURSELF... holy shit language just falls short anyway... Just from this perhaps you can see how something like death is false. Because it's the only thing, nothing can stop it from "running" in any dimensional direction possible. And because "outside" itself is actually "inside" itself, it actually CAN go outside itself too. It's infinite and thus It's SO FUCKIN FAST that it "catches" ITSELF and it can stand next to itself !!! And of course it positioned itself in every possible place - everywhere. And this is really where PERSPECTIVE is born. What we call "i" is standing, for lack of a better term, in the "middle", in between all of the extremes of Nothingness/Consciousness. Here we see the Infinite Pixel of God simultaneously penetrating all dimensions, being Space and every infinitely small nook and cranny of Space, occupying the entirety of Infinity. Balance. But there is also "IT'S" "perspective" which is Oneness, Stillness, Everthingness - Truth! , which is all of itself at once, which is utterly incomprehensible because from it's point of view it doesn't have to "run" anywhere or "do" anything because it is everywhere and it is everything. It's just right now it's accessing a limited part of itself, and the best we can do to kinda get that with "regular human consciousness" is that perfect "nothingness" that spiritual teachers are so in love with, and see the Oneness and Everythingness and blaaaaa but even that is so distorted and sounds so cringe to me because In order to SPEAK Absolute Truth with "human language" one would have to speak forever, for infinity! So therefore everything we say will always get stuck in an extreme of sorts.) And i see there is an ongoing Consciousness balance act or dance between that nothingness and everythingness, an that is what i would call enlightenment, even though actually, that also falls short. i have no idea what enlightenment actually is. Everything is just me/God/Infinity. With the higher dimensions (seemingly) closed, everywhere we look will always (seemingly) be duality/relative, therefore only HALF of God, so to speak (except that they're never really actually closed) In my experience, psychedelics allow access to higher/wackyer dimensions and allow you to fold language (or anything, you're ultimately folding consciousness) in a higher dimension, you get to a HIGHER Truth - relatively speaking. More information. And that Higher knowledge from the infinite library gets more and more complex in all directions, in all colors, in all sounds, all manners possible. Each more creative and innovative than the one before. SERIOUS STUFF!!! it gets more beautiful, but also more dangerous, more pleasurable, but more painful, more ugly, more blissful, more intense, more and more and MORE and MORE of EVERYTHING. To infinity... You can for example speak "languages" where one "letter" or "thought" or "artifact" is the entire possibility of human language. Trying to "obtain" this through meditation and self inquiry but never taking psychedelics is like having a knife, sharpening it everyday but never using it to cut anything ever, and saying that you don't NEED TO, because the purpose is just having a sharp knife... ok, not the best analogy but it's like wtf? So as long as you're viewing yourself from a human body, the whole Thing is mechanical it has pieces/holons - REASONS - so infinite causality is why you CAN'T access psychedelic states without psychedelics - The *reason* for the existence of this dimension is for the other ones to make sense - through contrast! So realize that everything is just the dot (you) everywhere, masqueranding as the atoms, the light, the bed, the body, the thoughts, the sounds etc. etc. and that it can anytime "stop" what it's currently doing (distorting itself, sticking it's head up it's ass thus creating YOU, jk) and see that you are the dot, radiating into your infinite self (falling in love) and you are viewing yourself, pretending to be "things" aka "not you". This is how God hides in plain sight. It won't show itself to you not because it can't, but because you won't let it, because it's you and so you're not letting yourself - because you're not open enough for infinity. Again. All this that i'm saying is not TRUTH! TRUTH can be accessed directly, and you kinda cannot speak of it, other than to say that it's Absolute, or Infinite, or Love or God or Perfect or stuff like that, and even those are distortions, that's how radical it is/you are. So where psychedelics meet self-actualization, consciousness work, spirituality, health and fitness and sex and all aspects of your life is this: In order for psychedelics to work the best with the body, it must be in a certain pristine state - this is what "spiritual purification" is partly about. This is also what "spiritual healing" is all about. It's not that consciousness work heals the body - it indirectly heals the body by making you more aware of the shit that isn't working well and it makes you open and wise and proactive in making things better in every aspect of life, so you go and research your ass off and you fix your gut issues, get the heavy metals out of your brain, feed the body an abundance of CLEAN SOURCES for ALL the vitamins, minerals, essential polyunsaturated fats, water, exercise social&sex stuff, LP etc. etc. etc. And you get all your metaphysics of God/You/infinity/Love in order, you meditate, do inquiry etc. and multiply to infinity, accelerate accelerate accelerate and *then* psychedelics will show you stuff that is truly next level, because it reflects just how amazing and next level you already are (infinite acceleration). And in this way of being that i just described, you're living life in such a divine reflection of your true Being - which is just ... infinite beauty it's so... IT'S SO BRUTALLY BEAUTIFUL!!!! lmao Can you see the dot everywhere? I'm not saying that the point is to see the point everywhere. In fact, at this point i could go on about the point of the point, but i see no point in that, since believe i made sufficient points about the point of the point of the point analogy. (even the letter "i" is a point with a line, that is made out of points... ) Ok ok ok so now everything that i just said i fold in a higher dimension and it becomes a single non-verbal thought, and i forget about the dot and i just see infinity in everything. I see the linear-circular-ness of everything. See how every single little "thing" is simultaneously the biggest/smallest thing. See how no thing is actually A thing, but THE thing - God/You/etc. And something very funny happens, Everything people say suddenly has something strange, something personal about it, every sound, everything that enters "awarenes" is so special and intelligent and deliberate and Perfect! And it's always like this, except that when you're not uber conscious of it, it doesn't seem this way at all. I'm gonna stop there really hope that this helps some of you. You can do anything. Cheers! (see you on the other side!)

This topic wasnt meant to be about nonduality, but about integration of no-thinking state to practical life. This debate just turn into who has better understading of nonduality, we just start debate about words and definitions i had glimpses of nonduality and basic undestanding of it too, i am not enlightened and i am not saying that i dont have an ego. I have lot of work to do to embody insights of nonduality and i am aware of dualistic nature of language wich is a reason we disagree even we are talking about the same thing

You're just not getting what I'm asking. I get Nonduality, so I don't need that explained. I'm asking a specific question within Nonduality.

A really interesting episode. @Leo Gura You used similar terms borrowed from mathematical logic, such as tautology, to describe reality as Christopher Langan, who's the reputation for being smartest man in the America. Have you acquainted yourself with his work and his theory of everything (CTMU) that claims to prove existence of god with these kinds of tautological cognitive models? I think that based on his youtube interviews, he seems to be tier 2 stage yellow with ideas that resemble nonduality, but the idea that reality could be proven from logic and mathematics, i.e from the ruleset/content of this dream is his blind spot as a hyperlogical person.

Oh man that's one hell of a question. There's so much to say about it I don't even know wehere to start. Religion had and still has a multitude of functions. Those functions are (or are not) required depending on ones situation in life regarding various aspects such as psychological development/maturity, philosophical (i.e. metaphysical, epistemological and ontological) sophistication and perspective, morality (which is 1. probably the largest chunk of them all and 2. not only a distinction between good and bad but mostly a directive for action(which itself depends on many factors)), but also potential for abuse in order to gain power or money and so forth... All these functions and motivations are intricately connected and interdependent. Many people today say that religion is outdated, but that's waaay to simplistic. People who say such things a) don't know very much about religion and b) are in most cases dogmatic about their own philosophy (which is funny and ironic because their behavior basically resembles religious behavior structurally). So to answer your question - you're gonna have to look into it yourself. There's so much to learn about religion, really, it's such an enormous field of study. Check out the Biblical Series on YouTube, it's about the psychological significance of some of the stories from the bible, it's quite eyeopening. That can give you a hint of how deep this can go. And of course Peterson doesn't go as deep as he would have to go because he doesn't understand nonduality or mysticism. Alan Watts was a priest so he has also a lot of content on religion, but he of course understood nonduality and mysticism. Have fun going down the rabbit hole

It's not just Your Mate tom..almost everyone I've met on meditation retreats, ayahuasca circles, and doing bufo have no idea about nonduality.

Just had a thought that was relevant to this thread. All forms are an illusion and part of the ego because everything is one from a nondual perspective. However, nonduality still contains duality. Consciousness explores duality and separation through different forms. You can honor those forms without having the ego latch on to them. In fact, paradoxically, to honor these different forms also requires you to not latch on to any one of them because latching on to one thing prevents you from exploring other things. It's ok to have preferences so long you know they aren't absolute and applicable to everyone or thing.

Julian has no clue what enlightenment or nonduality is. And if you take him seriously, neither will you.

The mind has very serious limits as to what it is able to understand no matter how hard it works because the bottleneck ends up being one's state of consciousness. So releasing that bottleneck becomes the key after a certain point. And the more you invest in the mind the harder it can be to release that bottleneck. The mind ends up trapped in itself and digs its trap even deeper. That is the biggest trap for intellectual people. Daniel needs to hit a bunch of DMT, over and over again to break his entire mind open. He has intellectualized nonduality/awakening, but I sense he has no experience with what it really means to awaken. A very dangerous aspect of Ken Wilber's work -- which I feel Daniel has imbibed a lot of -- is the idea that 1st person phenomena and 3rd person phenomena are two equally valid domains. But this is not true. 1st person phenomena is the only real thing. All 3rd person phenomena is pure illusion, and I don't see Daniel recognizing that. There is still too much attachment to science in him. He does not understand how deeply wrong the science paradigm is. It's utterly, foundationally wrong to the point of not being fixable. You cannot use science to understand the core of reality. Something like evolution does not even exist. It's just a figment of his imagination. Idealism is not a mirror to materialism. Both these guys are profoundly misunderstanding idealism, nonduality, and spirituality. Materialism is hallucinated by Infinite Consciousness. This point is so simple and clear. There is no doubt about it whatsoever. Classic problem here of "So smart he's dumb". This is why I tell people to do psychedelics because you won't get it otherwise. Your consciousness will not allow you to get it no matter how smart you are. But I still admire his intellect. If you want to learn how to think clearly, he's a great role-model.

Frankly, I'd say you are sort of talking about the two axes of self-actualization and enlightenment... they are more like parallel and complementary. If you want to be a happy, whole, actualized, and effective person AND know the absolute truth, you'll need to do both. Neither axis have an "endpoint", though if you get through the Buddhist paths you will be "dwelling in perceptual nonduality," which I suppose is considered enlightenment or liberation or whatever. I think the meditative path is necessary to make this a permanent condition, as the separate self is incredibly entrenched in every aspect of our psyche and sensations, and doing the thousands of hours of work is necessary to really root this out at a physiological level. Ralston-style contemplation (or Kriya yoga) may offer glimpses of enlightenment, and 5-MeO may offer utterly deep peak experiences, but ultimately both fade into "memory" and therefore concept, and thus not the "real thing" per se. But, since it's a journey, obviously those things are very helpful as you progress and probably very necessary steps.