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It doesn't really matter if you're an avatar or not at that stage. If you're an avatar, great. If you did mahasamadhi great. But if mahasamadhi is the way for you, enlightenment means you accept that and allow it. You've got absolutely no stakes in the game of life. If you would like to call god's will impersonal desires, thats good. But at that stage, there is no desiring, because there's no sense of ego or self. And God doesn't desire, God just does. That's the way of the will. The will manifests so fast that there's no time for the desire to set in. God's already doing what he wants before you've realized. There are lots of things that we do because of interpretations of reality. These interpretations are ego. Ego isnt just sense of self, its all of maya. Its the physical universe itself. You need to be careful thinking enlightenment is just realizing oneness. It goes well beyond that, every sounds, sight and smell has to be recontextualized from a non human standpoint. You can't see food as something you need to eat otherwise you will die. Because you're not a human. You need to recontextualize what food is. You can't see your family or sex the same way aswell. Many spiritual teachers like mooji have sex scandals even though they are apparently enlightened. You don't normally do this with a new recontextualization. But you could id there is still ego lingering around. I've personally done the work to recontextualize food, and through inquiry work stripped away its meaning so its just raw sensations. Eating happens spontaneously and just by allowing consciousness to flow. You really need to do this for everything to fully relieve all suffering. And this is why celibacy and living as a monk has its strong points, because every time an unenlightened person has sex(for pleasure) eats(for pleasure), etc. They reinforce those old, human contextualizations and meanings of being a human, and ego. Every time you have an urge or craving, you need to question it severely and strip away its meaning, or recontextualize it. You don't really do this by binge eating or by having sex IME. For people who are enlightened, it doesnt matter either way, there's no skin in the game for them.

@electroBeam When you are completely fulfilled, happy and at peace and conscious of your true nature. (Everyone is The Self/ Awareness etc just don’t know it) you don’t have “personal desires” to make you happy. You simply have “impersonal desires” as The Absolute as a means to express, share and celebrate this understanding. Life becomes a celebration in every moment. You then won’t need these things that come from like e.g. Excess junk food. There is a huge difference between binging on junk food out of lack and due to say depression, and having a slice of cake to celebrate someone’s birthday at a social gathering. In one without the food you will be miserable, depressed, upset. In the other, if you eat the cake, great you’ll enjoy it and move on, if it runs out and you don’t get any, oh well you’re still going to be happy either way. Be careful not to demonise living life while you’re here. There’s plenty of time to be an avatar once you drop the body, if you have completed your spiritual journey in this lifetime.

@Meta-Man You are explaining this really well. Essentially how Self-Realised beings explain this phenomenon, i.e. Rupert Spira and Francis Lucille. You do things because you want to and as a celebration instead of a need to and to make yourself happy. You no longer “need” sex to be happy, but you may want the celebrate the connection you have with another being through sexual intimacy. you don’t need to play football, but you may want to go have some fun and play a few games of football with your friends, or heck play to a decent level because you enjoy it. And guess what life is about: enjoyment and happiness. When you are absolutely happy you are free to do whatever you want. Although with a true awakening, that “whatever” will always come from love and understanding. Hence Ramana Maharshi wasn’t a child rapist or murderer etc Francis calls tbis “impersonal desire” and I think that is as good as concepts and words can get in explaining this.

Hey everyone, I felt like writing this post on Happiness, and by happiness I mean the happiness inherent in our true nature, the peace and happiness that are the 'side effects' of Self-Realization and realizing the truth of our own being and reality. Happiness. Would life be worth living without happiness? The word is thrown around a lot these days, often marketers promise us happiness in a capsule or in the next product they are selling, but in reality, happiness can never be found outside of ourselves, or even inside of ourselves, happiness IS what we are. I will be honest, suffering and a low level of background depression is what lead me to finding spirituality, and in particular Eckhart Tolle and starting on the spiritual path, so maybe I am slightly biased towards happiness. I believed getting A*s and going to University then getting some high paying job in the city would make me happy, and that happiness was also just in the next achievement or thing, and was always so close. How wrong I was. The realization that you are literally The Self, you are The Absolute, you are all that exists, ever have existed and ever will 'exist' brings a peace and happiness that never leaves, as you have finally found who you truly are. It brings an end to the endless seeking, and allows for the final rest and joy in being. It brings the innate Infinite Love of EVERYTHING as you know everything is YOU, this screen you are looking at is literally God, these words are literally God. But, simultaneously even that is saying too much, for all there is, is THIS. THIS IS IT. Every single moment is simply the spontaneous joy of being alive, and is accepted with open arms, no matter what arises. Even when so called 'bad' things happen, the Peace and happiness of your true nature remain, for it is dependent on nothing and is literally what you are. It is unshakeable, unbreakable and is your birthright. You quite literally are The Absolute, the little I doesn't exist and never did, the illusion of a separate self has been seen through completely, separation is seen as the illusion it truly is. Paradoxically though, you are more YOU than ever before, your personality is expressed wholeheartedly and you are completely free to truly be who you are. The Absolute sucks you in and spits you out as this beautiful expression of itself, it wants YOU to experience what you are experiencing right now. It wants you to be YOU, to embrace your humanity, to love deeply, to express this understanding, to have fun, to enjoy life! It is impossible to put into words, and I cannot say it any better, unfortunately, which is why silence is always the highest teaching, for this understanding can only be known in the silence, in the gap, in THIS, the answer is never another concept or belief, but is simply found HERE, NOW in THIS. Non-Duality, Duality, Spirituality, Enlightenment, Awakening (etc) are all just concepts that help you realize THIS, like all concepts they have their relative uses, but they must be dropped, and let go of so you can jump in the fire fully naked, and experience THIS as it truly is. So you can experience Sahaja. There is no enlightened person, there is simply the realization of the truth of your own being. Awareness becoming aware of itself. It's not Charlie who has awakened, there is no Charlie to awaken, it is simply Consciousness becoming Conscious of itself. Then what is left? If you are completely happy, fulfilled and at peace, what is left after the spiritual search, after you find what you was after, after the seeking is over. After you no longer spend hours upon hours reading and listening to teachers, and trying to understand this concept, and inquiring about this or that. There is simply the expression of this Peace, Happiness, Love and Understanding in ALL areas of life, you simply live life from this understanding, from love. No longer are you looking for a relationship or a business or a hobby to make you happy, everything you do/ partake in is simply then an expression of this happiness, of this love and of this understanding. You are absolutely free to do whatever you want to, to live life on your terms. Want to go and 'help' people awaken? Go for it! Want to go and meditate in a cave forever? Go for it! Want to go and feed the poor? Go for it! Want to go and work in your local coffee shop? Go for it! Want to become a professional athlete/ musician/ artist? Go for It! Want to go and build your business? Go for it! Want to raise a family and get married? Go for it! And on and on and on. I think you get the point! You have absolute freedom to whatever you wish, to whatever your heart desires. Except one thing changes. The desire will no longer be about what 'you' want, but the desire will come from and be about Love and expressing love, happiness and peace in whatever you do. This is sometimes known as Impersonal Desire, which I think is a helpful concept Everything comes from, is made of and literally is Love, living in alignment with that is the most beautiful gift of all. Every day we are blessed to have the chance to deepen and integrate this understanding even further in life, to be of service to so called 'others' (you) and to express this beautiful understanding however we see fit. As Ramana Maharshi said- 'Your Self-Realization is the greatest service you can render the world.' And, Happiness is inherent In that Self-Realization. And, who doesn't want to be happy? It's what we all want. And, I can say one thing. It's worth it. It's worth the hours seeking, the sleepless nights overthinking and contemplating, the frustration, the existential terror, the fear& anxiety you have to overcome, the dark night of a soul. It's 100000000000000000000000000% worth it, and even that isn't saying enough how worth it is. It's here, it's now, it's THIS. You are THIS. Stop looking elsewhere, it has always been right there, when you realize it, you'll kick yourself at how obvious it all was. Have a good day everyone. Go and express some love, peace and happiness. Go and tell your loved ones you love them, go and give your body the nutrition and exercise (love) it deserves, go and do the things in life you love. Go enjoy life.

Can there be the reading of this text right here without the it being connected to ego? Can contemplation, intellectual activity, thinking, thoughts be there without the ego? Without identification, attachment and without the idea or sense of it being done by someone? I can imagine visual thoughts being absent of ego but auditory/word based thoughts seem to be impossible without ego? How would the thought even be there without ego or from an impersonal perspective? Also let me know if this question doesn't even make sense, is voided, is invalid, based on false assumptions, etc.

@zeroISinfinity Rock that imagination like you did the Big Bang, you’ll be right as rain. No use pretending we’re not pretending we’re pretending we’re pretending you know. Also, I think we should both be a bit more mindful of our thread hi-jackings. ? @AlphaAbundance “How would the thought even be there without ego or from an impersonal perspective?” If the thought itself, the ‘matter’ or substance of it, had nothing whatsoever to do with a personal perspective. In the sense, just consider, it never did. Another extreme sounding, but more precise way to say that...what it thought was always for togetherness...but gets hijacked in the spirit of individuality...intrinsically, damn near automatically?

@Ya know Of course it is man, but as others have mentioned sports (like most mainstream industries) tends to reflect the development of Society. I think I said this on another thread but I'm very excited to see the development of these industries that are typically 'Orange' and how they will develop into more of a means of expressing happiness and joy (and fun!) instead of being the 'win at all costs' orange mentality. It's kind of similar to businesses going from 'Q4 profits are all that matters' to lets provide products and services that are actually going to enhance people's lives. @Leo Gura I'm sure we've had this discussion before, however, your biased against sports is pretty clear and I get it if you didn't play sport much when you was young and are looking from the outside, it seems like a Stage Orange mess, which high level sports certainly is to some degree. For example, Football is dominated by money and billionaires own the best teams and spend the most money. However, Sports at their core are an incredible Art form that express Human potential in the body. In terms of 'Devoting your whole life to hitting or catching a ball' I expected a bit better from someone who sells a Life Purpose course lol, these people are following their purpose and showing incredible levels of dedication, mastery and love for their field of expertise. I'm not sure why Sports gets a bad rep in that sense, when you could just say to Musicians are you really going to spend your whole life banging a few sticks on a drum to make some noise that sounds good? Or to an Artist are you really going to spend your whole life drawing shapes that look good? All forms of Art can be expressions of happiness, love and understanding or can be used to further the Ego's desires and needs. Most athletes also don't 'Strut around like cocks' of course some do, tends to be the younger ones who have just come into wealth and develop an arrogance about them, the best humble themselves and don't bother with those shenanigans, just like the best Musicians eventually stop with the Rockstar lifestyle and focus solely on their music, it's sort of a phase some go through. As society becomes more conscious sports will follow, and the 'win at all costs' mentality will evolve. And, the tribalism will develop into more community based that helps the overall sport progress. Of course, currently, like many industries, it's very much plagued by Orange and ravage Capitalism, but I'm sure the break we are going through now will help it evolve further. Sports mean a LOT to many people and communities, and when people are solely playing for the fun, for the love and for the joy of playing the game that is when their best work is produced. Of course you still have to play to win, however, the purpose of playing isn't to win, it is to express the happiness and love for the game that you have, it's going to be beautiful when sports evolve to that. The funny thing is, most children start playing sports because they enjoy it and love it, it is when they get to the higher levels and the competitiveness of our Stage Orange society dominates that the problems occur. I heard stories about Nike athletic teams in America were essentially destroying their athletes bodies with overtraining and poor diets, which lead to worse times and many quitting as the thing they loved had become such a chore. I think this boils down to one of your favorite themes on life- Counter Intuitiveness. The more you focus on winning and having to win, the more anxious and tense you get, the worse results you get. The more freedom from outcome you have, the more free you are to perform at your best and counter intuitively you will get better results. As we develop to Green and Orange we will hear more and more clubs and teams focusing on the processes rather than the results, right now sports is SO dominated by money and results, it's crippling the industries, so I get your issue with it. I just think you've mixed in Stage Orange= Sports when in fact it's stage orange (and red before it etc) that has corrupted sport, as at it's essence Sport is a beautiful art form that can bring communities together and be an incredible way to express happiness. So, in terms of approaching Sport in a high conscious way, I think that would be the way to do it. Coaching with a focus on enjoyment and expression and processes over short sighted results and win at all costs. Although we're probably a long way from that yet. Also, in terms of expressing this understanding in Career, Rupert Spira has a great video on how you can express and share this understanding no matter your job. Oh, and his teacher Francis Lucille plays competitive Tennis and loves it, he often uses it as metaphors for Impersonal Desire, I'll link both videos. At the end of the day, do something you love, and naturally this understanding will pour out of you. (Maybe not Hot Dog eating as that will destroy your body! ) https://non-duality.rupertspira.com/watch/what-is-the-right-job-to-do

Desire is not the cause of suffering lol, without desire you'd die. this was a HUGE mistranslation from Sanskrit, a more accurate term would be craving or more, believing the fulfillment of a personal desire will make you happy. (It won't) When you desire to receive, for the sake of sharing your life will change. The happiest people are always those who are giving, sharing and loving. The issue with modern society is desiring for the self alone, and this is an endless void you can never fill. For whatever reason, desire has gotten a terrible rep in Non-Dual circles, when desire is literally your life force, you're on here due to your desire to awaken, or your desire to share. Also, 'Impersonal desire' can be somewhat misleading, and it doesn't mean you don't take care of your own needs of course. It just means your desire is coming from a place of love, truth and happiness, instead of in search of those. For example, let's say you play sport, and have the desire to play for a Football team. Personal desire would be because you think playing for this team will make you happy, make you popular, and when you win the league you will finally be happy. Impersonal desire would be because you simply love playing football and it's a way you express happiness and joy. Of course, you want to win your games and win the league, but your happiness and wellbeing is not determined by it. Sure if you win the league you'll be elated and ecstatic, but let's say you don't you'll deal with the emotions that come up, and guess what, you'll remain absolutely happy and at peace. Francis Lucille describes this amazingly well, I'll link one of his Q&A answers and vids that explains this well. As well as his website. (sorry his q&a website seems down atm)

If you’re drinking every night you probs won’t feel great very often, and your body won’t thank you much. If you’re drinking here and there as a celebration, why not enjoy yourself? If you’re drinking as an escape and way to avoid what you’re feeling and whatever else, it’s coming from a sense of lack. But, this doesn’t only apply to alcohol- TV, Movies, Sex, Video Games, a lot of other activities. Are you doing them to escape how you feel and from a sense of lack. Or, are you doing them as a means to express happiness, have some fun and enjoy life. That’s what makes all the difference. Here’s a response from Francis Lucille regarding impersonal desire on this matter: The wanting itself comes from the ego. Is this correct? Or is enlightenment, in fact, a way to manifest one’s worldly desires? Ignorance is the problem, not the ego. Our wanting comes from ignorance when we believe that our happiness depends on its fulfillment. Example of desire that comes from ignorance: I feel miserable. I don’t like it. I want to drink some champagne to get out of my predicament. The liquor store is closed, I feel even more miserable. Example of desire that doesn’t come from ignorance: for no reason whatsoever, I feel happy and lighthearted. I have this friend visiting me later today. It would be nice to celebrate friendship with some champagne. The liquor store is closed. No problem, it was just a nice idea, my happiness is not affected. The door bell rings: my friend appears, holding a bottle of champagne to celebrate the reunion. You see the difference??

These are a couple comments I've transferred from a thread about attachment to desire where someone made some good points. Desire is a wonderful thing. But attachment to desire is something else altogether. Attachment to anything is conditioned and dependent. I would have to say either you are or aren't mired by dependent habitual conditioned energies. But mostly it is a matter of gravity and degree. In terms of the most basic necessity, observing the disease of the mind entails suffering. This is an habitual relationship not with the world, but with oneself. It is neurosis. This neurosis is a mental crutch. This is dependency one must acknowledge and cut away from one's life. Keying one's attention to externals without being sidetracked, without abandoning oneself to craving, one learns to deliberately manage following the heart's desire without stepping over the line. The most subtle veils of delusion are of your own making and must be swept away until there is nothing left of your habits. When you don't crave, personal issues of self and other turn into a matter of mutual response because now the situation becomes the context. Sure, no one else knows that— but when you do, you are not at issue with conditions, and you don't get swept away by emotional craving or selfish psychological patterns. So when others seek to manipulate or cling psychologically or emotionally, you detach from their issue, not the situation. The situation may very well go on, but you don’t perpetuate issues relative to self and other and right or wrong. This is itself an expression of compassion, even should it be ruthless. Who can start and end here without further deliberations? Not sidetracked by externals in this regard, one follows the heart's desire without stepping over the line. It is a most curious affair, because, in terms of clarity, you do not go along with the world's momentum— but then you find that the world must have you without exceptions. It is relentless. This is where (the buddhist image of) Mara comes into play. She is relentless. She never goes away …only temporarily recedes from time to time. Even sudden enlightenment only severs the compulsion to follow conditions; stopping without rejecting is always in your power, so harmonizing enlightenment does not depend on the sudden. Whereas creation is fecund— endless manifestations material and mental; enlightening activity is endless transformations according to the time without unknowingly changing along with creation’s phantasmagoria. You have the power to choose going along or not, whereas the norm is going along with Change unawares. As it so often happens, something comes in from left field and one's flow is obstructed, and one naturally stops. Ordinarily, one’s psychological momentum, characteristic of insistence, might seek to push through obstacles— or even assign self-reifying definitions without benefit of objective knowledge. That is stepping over the line— merely seeking definitions relative to self and other is entertaining intellectualism, which perpetuates habit-energies fueling the personality’s psychological momentum bound to creation. Should one admit objective impersonal analysis, the only measure is mutual accord in reality. Beyond the fact that creation is already oneself without beginning, being the partial aspect in the real meaning of unity, mutual accord is the affair of subtle response carried out by virtue of the nature of reality. Working with potential is possible because it is inherent in situations themselves. Admitting objective analysis is really just immediate impersonal knowledge. As one gradually stops using the selfish perspective relative to self and other, the immediate objective knowledge of potential relative to situations gradually becomes apparent. This is mentioned further on as the Dharma Eye. Seeing potential actualizes immediate acquiescence, or virtuous accord in reality, also known as nonresistance or the virtue of the receptive. Just different names to express the arising of enlightening potential. To the degree one follows the heart's desire within unknowing (innocence, that is— not ignorance or cunning rationales), situations are naturally self-refining. This is all made possible because effective self-refinement enables immediate acquiescence. By selfless mutual accord, conditioned situational gravities stop; it's not that you have to stop outside of stopping. It's a matter of seeing reality. Real seeing is spontaneous transcendent seeing. It comes about by not exercising the personality's psychological apparatus habitually. In terms of physics, it is simply an absence of momentum, so one is not carried over into arbitrary action and one stays within the response-body. Enlightening being is the innate quality of subtle response, which is to affirm that sudden realization is not a necessary consideration in terms of expressing effective enlightened qualities. Why? Enlightening being is the quality of being so— it's self-refining, and is therefore selfless action in the world, Using the world's situations for self-refinement, instead of self-gratification, one begins to see reality— not that self-refinement and self-gratification are mutually exclusive, because they’re not. Reality is inconceivable; good or bad is not the criteria of enlightening being(s). This is the means to develop authentic practice. Wielding potential without thoughts of good or bad, enlightening activity is open and sincere unminding response in meeting the created energy of ordinary events. Sudden enlightenment is just waking up to the fact that the light shines (or not) as creation radiates the causeless. The light is like spontaneous enlightening activity adapting to conditions by one who is awake to the activation of innate spiritual function. Subtle spiritual response is natural because Creation and Nonorigination are not different. I've noticed a certain reluctance and trepidation in some to personally own up to the term enlightening. At the risk of appearing glib, I only mention it because people need to know that sudden and gradual are two rails on the same track. They are one continuum. Don't be misled by the analogy of the two rails. The light is one substance and so are its inconceivable functions. It’s like Blues and Country (being music) are Rock&Roll. It’s the Mystery Train and no one knows why. Getting back to momentum, or even further— back to some good points someone made regarding "now." The exquisite realm of now is effortlessness, whereas the perpetually creative realm is beginningless arbitrary ideas arising out of nowhere to upset the weak balance and harmony of those clinging to personal conditions: that's karmically bound evolution. Creative evolution is Karmic. Self refinement is the long process of ridding the aware being of clinging bias and inclination to arbitrary psychological stimulus whereby one’s autonomy in the midst of worldly situations is gradually stabilized. Enlightening being is not a matter of insularity, it is unity coming from within differentiation. Creation evolves by virtue of its conditioned potential. After a long time of gradual practice, seeing reality is recognized as such, but one still loses this again and again when seduced by phenomena. Unbending intent is single-minded determination to avoid following externals unawares. Beginners use renunciatory discipline or precepts; adepts plunge fully into delusion, without differentiating. In practice, one develops discipline first (symbolized by the 3rd I Ching hexagram, Difficulty), then deflects externals (symbolized by the 4th hexagram, Darkness or Innocence). First stopping conditioned stimulus; then seeing situational potential void of one's self-reflective psychological patterning. Stopping is not static and seeing is not relative to the person. Stopping sees the relative (movement), whereas seeing is just awake without bias or inclination. Secure in one's dedication to now, presence is basically being ultimately natural, without hangups. From this vantage, it is easy to see momentum (or conditioned potential) in situations. That's why I say either one is or isn't attached to kinetic (karmic) momentum. One only sees the real by virtue of stillness; conditioned energy is its mass times momentum squared. Not that it matters~ what matters is that in seeing the real from within the false, one gradually enters the inconceivable. One uses delusion to enter reality. This is possible because enlightenment is not different than karma. Enlightening being sees this. Spiritual illuminates match creation by its inherent potential and use it to partner with creation according to the time. Partners of creation do not go along with its karmic evolution, while ever gathering its potential. That's why some have been known to "ascend to heaven in broad daylight." Jesus isn't the only one by a long shot. In many respects, desire is complete in and of itself. Attention is mutual, in terms of self and other in the sense that one necessarily attracts when another is attracted. That much doesn't require deliberation. In terms of application, desire and bliss are coeval. The timing depends of their arising (or their arousal). The point is, it's mutual. This is the direct relationship we have right now within the heart of nonorigination. Relative to the essence of the creative, enlightenment isn't different. When one follows desire with openness and sincerity presently, without anticipatory momentum, one is activating the tao in reality without intermediary. This is enlightening being, but don’t expect the world to cooperate, so don't mention it. If it did, adapting enlightenment to conditions wouldn't be exceptional, and buddhas becoming people wouldn't be a secret— even though it has always come and gone without saying. This is because selfless movement doesn't have mass, only potential, therefore it can't be said to be still or moving. Subtle adaption is like that. The inconceivability just is without any body knowing better or being the wiser. Since it's already your own mind right now, immediate acquiescence is like taking over creation and stealing its potential. Poof. The ancient taoist alchemical classics all tell us to refine the self and await the time. They also say neither rushing ahead nor lagging behind, like a cat watching a mouse-hole, ever vigilant, ever careful not to miss the timing: when the celestial time arrives, human energy is responsive. It's not a matter of helping the tao, it is just in an ever-ready equipoise in mutual respond to situations fearlessly, honestly and without cupidity. Obviously, the timing arises in the situational context. The whole point of this kind of subtle intensity is to follow the breath of creation, which waxes and wanes in intimate accord with the celestial design. Only enlightening beings see this. This is an affair of transcendent living whereby one has no mind in going along with creation which is literally neither here nor there. One clings neither to the falsity of the conditioned matrix nor to the reality of the mystery, because they are not different. It is just as is and no one knows why. The ancients have left this teaching for those who have the affinity to follow in their footsteps to carry out the open secret, and go on …beyond. In the final analysis, the benefit is this: taoism calls it stealing potential. Such is that the spiritually aware potential energy that makes manifestation possible can be gathered by any individual not going along with the karmic matrix of creation. This gathering of potential is real, yet one doesn't actually gather anything. It goes back to following the heart's desire within unknowing: innocence following the heart's desire naturally steps over no line. It is all a matter of seeing. One last thing… it is like the story of the monkeys who do not want 3 nuts in the morning and 4 nuts at night. So the monkey feeder says, "Ok, I'll give you 4 in the morning and 3 at night"— at this the monkeys are very pleased. One doesn’t seek to please because that’s the monkeys’ business. First of all, you adapt to the situation selflessly and respond impersonally to give the universe its arbitrary causeless requirement in each situation as it arises. It is not a matter of logic, but of strategy. Secondly, one uses the current situation as a means to master the 3rd and 4th hexagrams in order to transcend the conditional aspect (without anybody knowing). Since you don't speculate on the conditional manifestation, you naturally cull its essential potential and seal it away void of intellectualism. You see, the way of the world is to get it all backwards— and keep it that way! So the way of all prior illuminates is to foment subtle audacious reversal within the course of creation in order to take it over and steal its potential (back) unbeknownst to anyone. Actually, it is a matter of freeing unrefined potential from its conditioned matrix simply by seeing reality as it really is, as it is. In terms of alchemy, those of you who know the I Ching, know that the 3rd hexagram Difficulty is done before, i.e., in the morning. This is advancing the yang fire. This is effort. This is following desires. This is entering the tiger's lair. The 4th hexagram Innocence should be done after. This is withdrawing the fire when the killing energy of the yin convergence first arises, in order to gather potential and seal it within innocence void of intellectualism. This is non-doing. This is only a possibility by virtue of following real desire without stepping over the line, so to not act on arbitrary ideas relative to the personality. Just the not-doing of intellectual activity is itself stealing potential. Having done so is gathering the medicines of the spiritual elixir. Guard this in the wordless. Spiritual release is spontaneous awakening. Having directly divulged the secret, who can put it to use? ed note: add "without rejecting" in 5th paragraph; put a little in the middle; put "acting on arbitrary ideas" in parentheses in last paragraph

@VeganAwake I am not saying there is a separate individual or any separation, in fact, I repeatedly say EVERYTHING is The Absolute unknowingly or knowingly, so if all is One, how is there a separation? what I mean by 'enjoying Duality' is using Duality in the conventional use of the word. Your right Duality doesn't exist, as all that exists is The Self, nothing else has ever or will ever come into existence, for that is impossible. What I simply mean is embracing life, without resistance and with complete freedom, sorry if it comes across wrong. Yes again, as I keep saying all that exists is the Absolute, since I can't articulate it in words very well, and Francis can, this what I mean. Also, no I don't say you follow Neo-Advaita as a defense, I say it because it's quite literally what you speak on here. 'At the absolute level, everything is unfolding as it should. This “unfolding as it should” includes the fact of ignorance appearing in the world, along with its train of cruelty, ugliness, disharmony and stupidity. However, at the relative level, at the level where there is black and white, day and night, wisdom doesn’t make one blind and unable to distinguish between ignorance and wisdom, cruelty and compassion, ugliness and beauty, stupidity and intelligence. The sage sees these distinctions at the relative level even more sharply than the ignorant. The difference here is that he/she doesn’t see an ignorant individual, or a cruel one, or a stupid one, and that he/she remains unaffected by ignorance and its manifestations, knowing perfectly that “everything is unfolding as it should”. He/she follows the inner light of Presence and, like the Buddha Gautama, Ramana Maharshi, Ananda Mai, Jean Klein and many others, acts from that intelligence, from that love, from that beauty, and not from some theoretical view of non-duality. The intellectual thinks non-duality, the sage is it, and, from being it, thinks it, feels it, perceives it and puts it into action.' Do you think a non-dualistic view of the world leads the individual to passivity in the face of the world’s suffering? 'A non-dualistic view of the world may well lead to systematic passivity in the face of the world’s suffering if it is just that, a mere theoretical interpretation of the world. In this case there will often be a conflict between love and reason. A non-dualistic experience of the world will lead to the proper action, compassionate, practical, non judgmental, or to the proper passivity, depending upon the circumstances. The absence of conflict between love and intelligence is the benchmark of proper, impersonal action. Sometimes reason is too harsh and love wins, sometimes love is too weak and reason wins. It doesn’t matter which one wins, provided they both agree.'

@Prevailer you see believing in god and knowing god are two completely different things, one of it is a quite impersonal experience the other one is a very personal experience. what you belief or not belief is not of much relevance for someone who has seen into it so deeply that there is no doubt about it. your mind can’t grasp it because you are still a believer. although we could also start with the basics in sense of asking if you can know anything at all. or how you could know anything at all?

While I like to say that inherent buddha-nature is simply one’s impersonal enlightening function as it meets the perpetual result of the dharma, intellectuals are very quick to refute this observation and counter with resentments at issue with “claims of realization”. This is what is referred to as the conceit of ignorance, which is patently irrelevant to one’s enlightening function meeting the perennial advance of the dharma. Enlightening function has no position (Panda recently wrote on the daobums forum that I and my threads have no position as a snarky comment (that I absolutely LOVED)— and so she has subsequently removed it from the Recognizing Reality thread). Too bad that Panda, Taomeow and rainbowvein just love to hate this realized woman ~ hahahaa!! Enlightening function having no position is so since it is the antithesis of conditional identities that exist by virtue of the relative position. Ego is a valid function itself, relative to the psychological apparatus of the being that is going to die. It being absolutely empty of identity is naturally effective in terms of its purpose and capacity. That it becomes habituated to “positions” relative to identities of self and other is the root of deluded karmic imprisonment and is hence the focus of self-refinement in terms of the raison d'être of the authentic teachings, not to mention the selfless imprint of primordial awakening— Mind being the singular signifier attributing any relevance of an historic lineage of teaching tradition. Seeing your nature is a pretty major deal, beyond simply being an evidence of efficacy of one’s practical achievement of self-refinement, in terms of setting up the potential permanent stabilization of one’s application of aware potential in ordinary situations. Buddha’s instructions were to refer everything to the self~ why would it be recommended to leave this particular experience out as “not that big of a deal”, quoting Taomeow, who doesn’t seem to be talking much about issues and challenges relevant to the application of subtle operation by virtue of having seen her nature. Touting enlightenment as not that big a deal is what Dogen referred to as “it-doesn’t-matter” Zen. It only doesn't matter after you see your nature. Even so, enlightening activity is not dependent on having already seen one’s nature. Why? The reason being is one’s nature is already thus. Everyone is already just this enlightened mind, but it is necessary to experience it for oneself to gain the power of unified awareness in order to apply it in actual situations unbeknownst to anyone. So, the selfless wonder doesn’t require experiencing sudden enlightenment to begin to develop the perspective attributable to the application of inherent enlightened mind. Mind is itself the universal peerless teacher. One’s own mind stripped of the human mentality is just this mind; just this teacher. As such, it is available to all with the discipline, audacity and selfless open wonder to step over eternity itself. How do I know? By going through this and surpassing thoughts of "the other side" to take up gradual practice once again. This is because the function of enlightening being is itself the endless process of self refinement. Self-refinement freeing the capacity of primordial open awareness from the calcification brought on by the human mentality’s penchant for routine habituation is the gradual process of dissolving the ingrained habit-clusters that perpetuate self-reification. Enlightening activity deepens as self-refinement clarifies the basic mind-ground Honzhi refers to as the Empty Field. One uses worldly situations (the empty field of the world being none other than Mind itself) to the point where sudden realization naturally resonates having reached a critical harmonic point of no return. The "point of no return" is just experiencing nonorigination. One discovers that one has never been but thus: nonoriginated, selfless, aware. The point of no return is selfless knowledge of that which one has never otherwise not been, without ever beginning to be so. It has never begun even now. The reason why the Absolute has no such Buddha is because such a one cannot exist by virtue of nondifferentiated unity. "People turn into buddhas and buddhas turn into people." It's not that there has ever been a separate buddha-nature to awaken to. Even now, one's awareness is not created. Reality is Unborn. Having seen, one then seamlessly returns to the world having achieved nothing whatsoever. Buddha said, “Nothing is gained by complete perfect enlightenment”, All beings are thus". Seamless return to the emptied human mentality now fully empowered as the mind of tao which had always been thus, only now just discovered as thus, proves that there is only one mind, not two. Therefore, enlightening experience of no-mind, empty of voidness, impersonal, uncreated; the essential nature of creation, nonbeing within being, is the result constituting a potential entry actualized outside of time, being, creation, psychological and hence karmic matrices by virtue of fusion with cosmic immaterial primordial uncreated aware reality. Though you are not it, just this is your nature, your mind, right now. By the way, It IS a mystery. Really!! It is inconceivability. It is beyond understanding. Don’t even try. Such knowledge is not by the person, but by Mind alone. This potential permanent stability no different than the nature of awareness itself is the entry-level achievement. Inasmuch as permanent stability of ever-awakening enlightening function selflessly adapting to creation has reached a critical juncture fully dependent on further self-refining activity no different than before experiencing the sudden, is proof of gradual and sudden being a singular continuum. This is why I say that enlightening being functioning impersonally therefore adapting independent of former habits of self-reifying psychological patterns relative to illusory created karmic cycles constituting everyday ordinary situations is not dependent on sudden enlightenment. Enlightened mind is already in place, is already your inherent function; only obstructed by the human mentality unawares. This is the root of beginningless karmic bondage. By becoming aware of one's karmic actions, one learns to respond without employing self-reflexive patterns: thus habit energy isn't perpetuated unawares, and the process of self-refinement gradually proceeds without end transforming through numberless creative karmic cycles. Intellectuals refute reality as Mind, and attribute the basis to the being's psychological apparatus— it is obvious why the ancient discipline of open sincere wonder activating an objectless process of self-refinement leading to authentic entry into the path of complete reality independent of before and after and free of conditional identities is the prerequisite illuminating the positionless perspective that abides as the Unborn: being none other than your own mind right now. The spontaneous power released in terms of one’s own potential by that which is inherent in each situation one finds oneself in proves the basis of aware function as being unity inherent in karmic evolution (conditions/change), awaiting the perennial advance of the dharma as is. This is just stating that selfless unity is inherent, and that karma and enlightenment are therefore actually the same for those who see potential. Seeing potential is simply a matter of not experiencing the world relative to the habitual thought-energy of the person. One awakens to spiritual awareness by intending subtle observation of psychological awareness, over a long long time. Eventually, it craps out and one's heretofore unbroken stream of habitual thought is interrupted forever. Resting in the highest good is floating around within the "center of the compass" without categorizing a separate self identifiable in terms of a relative position. This is itself dispensing with habit-consciousness to impersonally adapt to situations. It is not that enlightening activity requires doing anything. Seeing through phenomena without denying their characteristics, taking over creation and stealing its potential is as easy as turning over one’s hand. If people only knew… It is simply one’s inherent impersonal enlightening function naturally so. Should one discover this function and accept its subtle application, one should then (as Honzhi says), take the forward step, entering the world to adapt the spiritual subtlety freely without admitting one’s own power and generously give of oneself without reservation in terms of entering situations completely without thoughts of survival. ed note:change "because" to "since" in 4th paragraph; typo 12th paragraph; typo 18th paragraph

It's a third person reference or usage of the "you." Which means "You" is used as an impersonal pronoun which can mean anyone at a time. A general usage of "you." The generic you is primarily used as a colloquial or less formal substitute for one. For instance, "Brushing one's teeth is healthy." can be expressed less formally as "Brushing your teeth is healthy. Hope that cleared up

Maybe taking things personally is normal when a person is talking to another person. It becomes impersonal only when one of them becomes deluded that they are something other than a person, above a person. Beyond a person. God isn't beyond a person, god is all inclusive, not anything above or beyond. I am not too attached to anyone. I am attached the exact amount to facilitate within me the grieving process to undergo the transformation that I have been waiting to experience since the moment I opened my eyes in this incarnation. Hahaha This made me laugh so much xD. How dare I... how dare I point out some rather insensitive and abrasive tendencies stemming from arrogance and entitlement, what an abuser am I. Ahaha Thank you for that dear India. That was prescious.

We were having a conversation about truth. The point I thought I made was that even if there is an objective truth, it can only ever be "known" (experienced) subjectively, and only described in words with relative accuracy. In this sense, no concept can be true. With this disclaimer in mind, I think that the concept that "the only truth is your own experience" (more specifically, Roger says "the impersonal sense of I Am") is valuable for dissolving the belief system that causes human suffering. Words are always imaginary and abstract, no? They can only be more or less accurate, more or less useful. In any case, the concept that "Life is predetermined" is really just pointing out that your choices are a result of your design and your conditioning (including the present-moment circumstance), and that Life only ever goes one way. As far as spiritual teachings go, I don't think it gets any less esoteric than this framework. How is "the attachment to the self identity" not an abstract religious concept? ;P Tongue in cheek aside, I would appreciate if you could explain what you meant by that.

There is an ancient taoist fable about a sheepherder boy who transcends the requirements of convention (maintenance of worldly concerns akin to duty), by changing the nature of his duty without violating the basis of what constitutes one’s natural relationship with creation. Yes, one actually has a relationship with Creation. Its activation is the selfless intent of the real human body which has no location. One’s intent beckons an open sincerity of enlightening being by its sustained, unbending quality. This is naturally inconceivable, naturally gradual entry into the nature of Power. Sincere openness beckons the fruition of the selfless intent of the body of reality, which is one’s immaterial center, the locus of one’s aware living potential energy. Beyond nexus, such is Mind. Open awareness is its substance, function, and intent. Sincere openness is the go-between, entering where the elements of the primal organization are not differentiated in the macrocosm nor in the microcosm. It is the most subtle and exquisite vessel of enlightening beings. It is the point where thought arises. It is the door to all marvels. It is just this open sincere intent of one’s real body where the Way alights and wells forth. Enlightening partnership in creation transcends one’s subjectivity to it. In working it, so to speak, one lets go of the small to partake of the great. It is a matter of clarifying the basis of one’s awareness, one’s relationship with awareness, that karmic evolution becomes a partner in oneself, and one is then no longer subject to its changes. Working it is the ability of buddhas, wizards, saints, sages and the enlightening beings of all times. Its active capacity is the inherent spiritual function of enlightening being. Self-reflective activity trapped within desire, form and formlessness is the function of sentient beings. The respective functions are carried out dutifully bound as a matter of course in everyday ordinary situations; the former, before the first thought, and the latter, after the first thought. What is this point of illumination at the cusp of the first thought? Who knows that it is possible to rest here at the point of incipient upwelling of potential before the first thought in perpetuity. Though "subject" to karmic influences, one adapts impersonally along with Creation, or not. Correct concentration and insight into the nature of Mind and furthermore maintaining a subtle continuous extension of mindful observation on this nature of Mind while functioning adaptively in ordinary affairs eventually develops into an unbending impersonal intent of open sincerity subtly harmonizing with the Way. Harmonizing with the Way and its Power is making a bid with its Power, since the essence of the Way is the nature of human being. Power is its source, whereas its nature is our affinity with its Virtue. This is why seeing reality is the Way (in terms of incipient potential) as one's manifest virtuous accord in Reality. Through a long process, self-refinement reaches a natural harmony with the Way, and one’s bid is recognized impersonally as resonance attuned to its Power. From that point on, enlightening being operates by a selfless fundamental reversal of the nature of one’s relationship with Creation hitherto unknown to ordinary people, who, furthermore, have no idea what constitutes their own nature. Ordinary people follow the light of creation within personalistic (selfishly) attuned ignorance, whereas enlightening beings turn the light around to align themselves with its universal undifferentiated source of illumination. There is nothing to understand. This is why it is called entry into inconceivability. No one knows there's nothing to know. The source isn’t anywhere else but here and now. It’s you; though you are not it. Being here and now without employing psychological patterns habitually differentiating before and after, self and other, is already the light turned around. The terminology is only words, not the reality. The work of self-refinement is the dissolution of the mental patterns veiling authentic presence. Negotiating the viscidities of here and now is enlightening being; it is neither different nor the same as before and after, self and others because real knowledge is void of habitual mental patterns of discriminatory consciousness. This is why the nonpsychological is spiritual. This is not a matter of sudden illumination, nor does its effect depend on the sudden. The spiritual is the very nature of the sudden. Therefore, the work of enlightening activity is the activation of the nature of the sudden operating in the midst of the gradual. Not only is this the nature of buddhahood, it is the nature of one’s own unborn awareness right now in the light of your eyes. It’s Mind through and through. This is not a meditative exercise. One does not see light!! The light does not look like lights. Even ordinary light is essentially immaterial. How can the light of awareness be conceived? If you see lights, and instead want to see reality, stop whatever it is you are doing. ”Wonders” derivative of the psychological storehouse are not the light. Seeing the light is a formative reversal of one’s relationship with creation whereby the psychological apparatus of the being that is going to die now reverts to facilitating enlightening activity instead of being its hinderance. As such, all things are just this light. The light looks just like things because the light is the essence of things. So seeing the light isn’t a mystical contrivance at all. It never has been. It’s just that people only see through self-reflective patterns of habit energy and don’t see the light of awareness by virtue of true reality, which is your own mind constituting nondifferentiated unity being the nature of reality alone. Essence is things, yet things are not it. Therefore seeing reality is the basis of not being subject to creation. Seeing is not visible, it is solitary knowledge constituting enlightening being, not the person. Reality is seeing without activation of personalistic patterns of habit energy. Such seeing is the means to absorption of potential. The ancient alchemic manuals state that “whatever can be seen is not to be used; only use that which cannot be seen.” The medicines are immaterial. Fusing them permanently in terms of the spiritual potential of the being that is going to die is the work of alchemy. Those who work with material and plasmic elements will come to an impasse. Clarifying the basis of one’s awareness, one’s relationship with awareness, karmic evolution becomes a partner in oneself, and one is no longer subject to its changes. All things reverting to potential in oneself doesn’t change anything. That’s the point of transcending changes. Changes aren’t potential. Only creation changes. The business of stealing potential is absorbing the stability inherent in one’s essential unborn awareness by virtue of and in spite of things. Partnership with creation is embodying the function of fundamental unity which is the light. The stability of illumination is your nature, which is changeless. One’s partnership with creation is proven by seeing Change. One sees Change by not following its changes unawares. How difficult is that? How difficult is it to not follow thoughts unawares? Not being subject to creation is before the first thought. That’s how close reality is. Before the first thought is Mind. Observing this Mind, how important is correct concentration and insight into the nature of Mind? Furthermore, how is maintaining a subtle continuous extension of mindful observation on this nature of Mind while functioning adaptively in ordinary affairs important to turning the light of this Mind around? In seeing the light, one partakes of the nature of the light and does not entertain acquisitive, speculative relationships with things based on patterns reifying the multifarious personality’s karmic imprint. Why? Because enlightening beings see that things are not absolute in terms of the nature of creation (which is karmic), in turning the light around. It is not a matter of belief, or faith. One does not act as if…(?) Reality is the way it is already. Reality does not depend on seeing. Seeing depends on you. If you see reality, then you do not abide in karmic energy, and the totality of the being that is going to die is the nature of enlightenment. In turning the light around, things revert to unrefined potential in terms of enlightening beings seeing reality. This is how one “steals potential”— it is just a matter of (one’s operating the light in reverse that is) not partaking in the created aspect of karmic evolution whereby one “absorbs” potential. It is not that one takes anything, or that things themselves miraculously stop acting like things overflowing in their foolishness, poisoned, deluded. It is simply seeing for oneself that there is nothing whatsoever to take (in terms of transcendent relationship in the created), that one “frees” potential inherent in any given situational event and then stores it away in secrecy void of intellectualism. The upshot is that one accumulates the subsequently purified primordial energy for enlightening evolution by oneself for the purposes of one’s duty, carried out as a highly-refined relationship with creation based on its (the created’s) uncreated potential. It is found neither in oneself nor in others; it is itself in Reality alone.

Another painful reminder of how fragile one's existence is, and how sudden and impersonal death can be. His determination, work ethic, and mental resilience will always provide great inspiration for me.

"This is a communication that illuminates the paradoxical nature of non-duality and exposes the misconception that it is something that can be appropriated or experienced. There are no personal demands or expectations here, nor is there any intention of satisfying in any way the seeker’s need for progress or a path. This uncompromising message can be both challenging and liberating. The entire personal effort to achieve spiritual progress, more awareness, greater silence, more openness, or even change, can seem to dissolve in the face of this radical revelation. The entire perception of “the self” or “the world” in which “one” seems to live can apparently collapse, leaving nothing to support the illusion of separation, control and continuity. Suddenly there is only emptiness, but paradoxically there is also the abundance and freedom one longs for". - Tony Parsons When this apparent ME fell away, it was like there was nothing left for anything to attach to. The feeling was light and free, but for No One. Simultaneously it's recognized that the individual ME never existed in the first place, it was just apparent energy manifesting as a separate entity within the body. There is no sticky sense of ME left somewhere inside the body for things to attach to. Emotions labels feelings thoughts just fall away. It's a complete impersonal experience now ❤ Existence continues to happen but for No One...it just is what it is. The resistance to what is no longer arises because there is no one left that believes it should be one way or the other. There is no meaning purpose or value to anything. "nothing really matters" Free Will and Choice are an illusion created by the egoic self agenda of the separate self. Once the illusion of the separate self collapses All That Remains is THIS... THIS is Paradise... THIS is Freedom... THIS is Liberation... THIS is Enlightenment, and it was always the case ?

The division of the human mind is four-fold: Sensing Feeling Intuition Thinking It has two perceiving (1 and 3) and two judging (2 and 4) functions. The perceiving functions are how objective, external, information is gathered. The judging functions are how subjective, internal state is created. The [subjective=internal]/[objective=external] dichotomy exists only in relation to will, or creation, of the human mind. Whatever we perceive exists outside of the influence of will of human mind and has to be acknowledged, accepted. (Yin) Whatever we judge exists inside of the influence of will of human mind and can be interpreted however one desires. (Yang) The human will is capable of creating subjective reality that is, or isn't, in accordance with the objective one. Since the objective reality along with human mind is created in the mind of THE ALL, the Hermetic principles can be studied both by studying subjective and/or objective reality. This is why self-knowledge derived from spiritual practices is useful and is the source of happiness - it is, at the same, the highest knowledge about the operation of reality. That is only possible because the human mind is created in the image of the mind of THE ALL and is equipped with the will to create: The mind of THE ALL is not impersonal because it creates.

Someone asked about how orthodox taoism views non-heterosexuality beyond the subtlety that anything that can be named… Is it ok to be gay, bi, amorally disposed, lesbian, hetero, polyamorous, unconventionally asexual, exploring BDSM, or otherwise? I say it is a matter of choice, whereas others insist in mainstream justifications in terms of identifying as if they were born whichever way they are currently preferring to express their potentials as such~ as if it matters. For the record, it doesn't matter. The simple actualization of a sexual preference doesn't make anyone special~ unless that preference is a delusional ego-trip based on an erroneous misunderstanding of sexual equality, which is not a term of identity, but one of reproductive functionality. Obviously, only a biologically organ-based hetero-sexual act results in reproduction. It's not supposed to to be an identity issue, unless socialized medicine and tax deductions are the motvation. At any rate, detachment is key. Sex is sex. Learning to adapt psychic energies relative to vitality in the elementary processes of taoist practice is the means to spiritual (nonpsychological) evolution. "Find the one and your work is done"; and your psychological nature will follow suit~ along with the clusters of circumstantial patterns of preferential sexual expression relative to the personality. All situations are essentially sexual. The nature of basic existence is dual. It's in the air. Sex is sex. Sex is another word for duality. Emotions are emotions. Psychological identity is what is it. These all relate to ego, the personality's valid functionary; these being an ultimately formidable illusion of created human being. The expression of human refinement in terms of taoist parlance is the sage. Who is the sage? Taoist teaching states that the world is the sage. It's not that far-fetched, but to see reality as such requires a monumental change of perspective of one individual (at a time). And who might that be? The point of taoism is to discover spiritual essential unity by virtue of the differential characteristics of karmic evolution. Its effect does not depend on sudden enlightenment– selfless realization only proves the point. In the aftermath of realization, one must still return to tend social obligations. That being the case, why not start now? Using sex is a brilliant strategy. Situations are themselves the access-point of self-refinement. Situations are each created cycles in and of themselves. Yang builds and switches to yin. Likewise, yin's convergence goes through it's incremental process and the cycle is completed. One yin and one yang is one change. That is the essence of taoist science. That's all there is to taoism in a nutshell. Does anyone believe that the ancients left it at that? Universal potential is hidden within change. In fact, it is hidden as change. Those who can see Change do not go along with karmic/creative/eternal changes. That's what immortality is. What does this mean? It means that those who see Change gather its potential— which is the point of the taoist sciences of essence and life which is perfected in public everyday ordinary situations, not by special applications of meditative technique or by psychosomatic manipulation through energetic exercises done in private. All cloistered regimens are beginners' points of entry, being modes of discipline to align the individual in terms of harmony with the unseen. One should always be wary of cultivating attachment to so-called methods of comfort, i.e.: formal constructs of meditation geared toward the vagaries of personal preference relative to the personality. In the midst of these "special" exercises, always keep a keen eye on objective awareness overseeing subtle attachment, as in the case of habitual practitioners of meditative regimens prolonged for 20 or 30 years, or more, without resultant shedding of the skin-bag. Those clinging to such habitual practice eventually turn into occupational ghouls attached to teachers, teachings and traditions without ever leaving the zero-point of the intent of such institutional contexts beyond which spontaneously actualizes a passing through into authentic entry of real potential. In terms of taoist alchemy, potential is recognized by virtue of situations themselves, where initially it is base metabolism which is refined. Emotional equilibrium is essential, hence the admonition for detachment. If one can avoid clinging to others as well as one's own psychological patterns, then the natural process of refinement works spontaneously from vitality> energy> spirit without involving psychological emotionalism and intellectualism. Ultimately, detachment (not denial) serves as an inconceivable, empty vessel which can be said to facilitate sealing the natural alchemic development of potential until it is ripe for release. So "gathering" potential is only a symbolic euphemism relative to seeing. As well, it is entry-level in each instance of situational evolution in terms of refining oneself by virtue of created cycles of yin and yang. Analogous buddhist teaching states that we use the disease as the medicine. At the penultimate end of each cycle, release of potential is where spirit is emptied out into openness. None of this entire process requires doing. Taoist teaching states that that which is seen is not to be used; that which is unseen is what is used. In each case it is a matter of non-doing. Sexual preference is immaterial. But sex must come from somewhere. That place is what Chuangtzi calls the "homeland of nothing whatsoever." He says to rest there. When you see your nature, you realize the erotic spark IS your nature— or at least it is the created aspect of its light when yin and yang fuse. It's no wonder so many people (with the fabulous energy to do so) chase after sexual encounters with zeal and crave sexual unity in whatever guise it is manifest. What matters above all is impersonal (open) sincerity. Granted, what I have presented here is quite a stretch for most people. It's not a bad thing to hear it, though. Some day there are those who will assume the will to enlightenment as the endless journey to realize the totality of the being that is going to die. So if anyone just wanted to know if it's ok to have homosexual relations~ your guess is as good as mine …heehee!!❤︎❤︎ ed note: change the word "justification" to justification(s), in 2nd paragraph; add second paragraph; typo 7th paragraph; add "applications of meditative technique or by psychosomatic manipulation through" to last sentence of 9th paragraph; add last sentence to 10th paragraph

@Serotoninluv @Identity Was just reading this.... thought it seemed relevant Genesis 1:1: “In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.” The first mistake people often make in reading this verse is to consider the words “heaven” and “earth” as literally the globe we live on and the idea that heaven is a physical location out there somewhere. Divorce your mind of that idea. The kingdom of heaven is within you, and you are the earth. But what does this mean? Heaven and earth universally symbolize spirit and matter. The true you is a spirit having a material existence. “Heaven” and “earth” are simply terms to help the intellect grasp the unfoldment of the ONE abiding reality, which is neither spirit nor matter. In ancient philosophical terms, spirit is active while matter is receptive. Think of spirit as energy, and matter as lifeless form that is receptive to this energy. Matter is simply the vehicle of form, which is ultimately illusory because it is subject to change.The spirit side of God is masculine / male, while the feminine aspect of God is female / receptive. They are both eternal. Matter receives spirit, and life commences through a spirit-matter interaction, the first Logos (consciousness). Spirit must have a body / mother / matter / earth to experience through. Genesis 1:3: “And God said, let there be light: and there was light.” In verses one and two, the unmanifest, unconscious, and impersonal Absolute (God) has begun the process of it’s own self-realization. How does this self-realization of its potential become actual? Through his right hand (symbolizing power and potential becoming actual), which is also the New Testament concept of Christ. Light, God’s light, symbolizes the dawn of self awareness or individual human consciousness. This was in the philosophical mind of the writer of the Gospel of John when he states, “In him was life, and that life (individual consciousness) was the light of men.” It is the spark of individuality, which must be built up through the experiences on each plane of existence (expanding its sphere of realization), through the physical (senses, sensations), the emotional (feelings), the mental (thoughts), the spiritual (intellect allied with intuition, wisdom and love), and finally, the fullness of Christ where he becomes all in all, in us. And this act of light symbolizes the impersonal God becoming personal as a self-aware, conscious soul through mankind. Genesis 1:27: “So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.” What does it mean to be created in the image of God, both male and female? We are not speaking of literal sexes. Rather, the male-female principle which is found in nature of the lower planes is a reflection of the higher nature found on the upper planes in a spiritual sense. Male / female signifies spirit-matter, love-wisdom, mind-emotion, and intellect-intuition. Being created male / female in the image of God is the higher nature ruling completely over the lower nature. This ONENESS becomes dual when Adam and Eve partake of the tree of knowledge and become physical beings outside of the Garden. The mind becomes split, dual, and the mind and emotions, even intellect and intuition, are separate. God tells man to have dominion over all creatures of the earth. Remember, the earth is us, and all the living things in the earth are within us. We must have dominion over the lower nature where all these creatures are symbolic of thought, emotion, sensation, desire, etc. Many Christians have taken this verse to mean we are to literally rule over all animals. Try to tell a polar bear, lion, great white shark, or whale what to do. You can’t. The only power you have over them is your intellect, which can make or build things to contain animals or kill them. But even animals are a part of the human soul, and your physical evolution upon this earth was dependent on them. American Indians understood this truth, and they called animals their brothers, for which they had great respect. (from spiritofthescriptures.com)

If that's the case then the illusion wasn't completely seen through. THIS turns into a completely impersonal experience

I've enjoyed reading this thread. I want to post some relevant quotes that are to the point and in my frame of reference resolve some disparities which have been expressed. In case anyone finds it of interest. Relating Without Object Relations The Pearl beyond price can relate in a personal way without the need to activate past object relations. So its capacity is not only innate but also natural and spontaneous. It is Possible to Experience Egoless Beingness Thus it is possible to experience egoless beingness, to be, as a substantial presence that is not a mental construct, and still live a human, personal life, in which love, work, knowledge, creativity and accomplishment make sense, a human sense. This true existence, this presence, this being beyond time that makes sense of human and personal life, is the Personal Essence. It is the reality of which ego is only a reflection. It is the truly integrated and developed human being. This is the beautiful presence that the traditional literature of work schools calls the “pearl beyond price.” The experience of universal impersonality of ultimate reality occurs when the separate individuality is transcended, when the separate individuality is seen not to be our true self. But this is the result of transcending the personality in its totality. Something different happens when we investigate the personality’s manifestations in more detail, exploring the hidden essential truth within it. The ego is a reflection of this true element of Being, the Personal Essence, and exploring the characteristics of the reflection can lead us to the reality being reflected. By isolating and understanding the elements of the false, we can begin to approach the elements of the real. The Essential Structure that the Soul Develops as She Metabolizes and Transcends her Ego Structure The pearl can also be seen as the essential structure that the soul develops as she metabolizes and transcends her ego structure. Ego structure gives the ego-self the sense of being an autonomous and unique individual. But this structure is constructed through fixed mental impressions in the soul; hence it both dissociates her from her essential ground and limits her development because of its rigidity and fixation. The essential pearl provides the soul with a sense of individuality and personhood that does not depend on fixed impressions, but on spontaneously arising forms of essential presence that structure her experience of herself and give her the capacity to function as a person. The soul matures and transforms into a person of essence. However, the qualities and actions of this person are quite fluid and flexible and are objective responses resonant to the needs and inputs of the environment. The Pearl is an Ontological Presence The pearl is the real, complete, balanced, and rounded personality that psychologists believe they are talking about when they are discussing the ego. We must remember that the ego is a structure, or structured process, whereas the pearl is Essence, which means the pearl is an ontological Presence. We call it the Personal Essence because among all the essential aspects it alone is personal. It is experienced as having a personal flavor to it, in contradistinction to impersonal. All aspects of Essence, even love and kindness, are impersonal. But the pearl is personal. And this is its miraculous quality, totally unexpected and unfathomable. From https://www.diamondapproach.org/glossary/refinery_phrases/pearl-beyond-price I posted 4 out of the 12 quotes from this web page in the Glossary.

@Nak Khid Man, I really hope one day you change. Now there's no talking with "we". If you really want to be so close to Truth stop using pronouns at all and make every sentence impersonal. "The post was written.", "The soup was eaten".