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The attention economy. A good way to exploit that economy is: divisiveness and sensationalism. (Historically), two things will happen during times of war or great conflict: suicide rates plummet, and newspaper sales surge. People get invested in crisis. The modern day media runs on stoking the fires of any crisis. They'll invent a crisis if they need to. "What changed in the 2010s was not so much the arrival of new technology as the rapid evolution of a business model, the monetisation of attention. This wasn’t a recent invention; indeed, it dated back to the “yellow journalism” of the 19th century, which used sensationalist stories and cheap cover prices to build big audiences that advertisers would pay to reach. But ubiquitous high-speed mobile internet has sent the attention economy into hyperdrive, plunging us into an online world structured to prioritise not the truth, or what matters most, but whatever’s most compelling, which often means whatever makes us angriest."

ness, you will not be capable of thinking God knows better than you, or that you were thrown into this existence because God has as a fundamental principle for itself to explore everything including absolute inescapable suffering. God is merely evil. And the only reason for me calling the forces above humanity "God" is because of the countless slam dunks atheists like Epicurus have had against religion. The smallest bit of Justice, Truth, Fairness, Universality etc. is so poisonous to the nature of reality that it attempts to stifle and destroy these things. Just one drop of them would cause reality to instantly dissolve into the perfect wish fulfillment fantasy for the victims of the world. Exhibit A: You think this is negative, that this is UGLY, distasteful, bitter, resentful etc. You are a thrown blameless being, but you choose to play the role of victim and brat and blame others for their own circumstances into which they themselves have been thrown into, this now makes you the opposite of blameless, but you need to keep going otherwise you would feel deep guilt for your ideological insanity and brainrot, you would start viewing the nature of your soul as worthless. Imagine being forced into the most limited experience of the meaninglessness of the world possible. With your prospects of suicide facing attempts at being destroyed from every side. If we go back to our fairy tale that I am God and simply forgot, for the sake of a hypothetical, we see that just the most miniscule possible experience of this would cause God to not even just go back to it's previous state, but to self-destruct. I am a construct of a fabric made of infinite wrongness and suffering. If this hasn't been made clear enough before, I have complete empirical proof that exactly what I think should not happen, happens, proving me right in my metaphysical assertions about how it shouldn't have happened better than any theory: in reality itself confirming it. How should one live knowing this? There is absolutely no right way to live or right way to enlightenment. If you are detached you risk suffering from extreme boredom and meaninglessness. If you don't detach you will be subject to the limitations of the hamster wheel. You can't do anything right or anything wrong. Now since it's not your choice what to feel or how pleasurable of a life to live, what is it about you which can remain and have it's own being, despite being molded out of suffering? Only complete scorn and refusal to believe things will be better or to play the game. Not even hope that this will yield results. I believe a Christ-like figure who is capable of living in their own complete lack of vice in this reality, and regardless of it, is possible.

In this clip Leo talks about suicide and the challenges around it. He says in the absolute sense, suicide is not morally wrong. I somewhat agree. Then Leo proceeds to say - death is infinite love, this is where I suffer a temporary moment of mindfuck. How is death supposed to mean infinite love? Then he says the absolute purpose of this work is to recontextualize everything around you in the here and now and be able to see the beauty in the present moment. But my question is that if this present moment represents all the beauty and infinite love, then why can't death also represent same? How does death become any lower in value than the experience of the present moment and why should death not be on the same plane as living in the present moment? Is it not possible to love this challenge that entails loving the present moment and love death at the same time? Also as Leo says to make a commitment to suffer it out no matter what, I guess it's easier said than done. Would this imply that suicide is un-spiritual?

I committed suicide before and I know I'm past that shit now but there is a deep fear in me that I'm capable of doing it again despite the fact that I know I wouldn't do that and I don't have any reason to do that but I'm afraid specially when I take psychedelics that if I get stuck in negative thought patterns I would kill myself it's a twisted shit and I haven't discovered how to deal with it yet I know it's stupid intellectually because I don't wanna do that but then again I'm afraid of doing it I would appreciate other perspectives on this situation

Yeah, I think extremism is something any human is capable of tapping into but that the majority don't. Religion and certain beliefs can definitely nurture extremism as can extreme situations. Extremism can also be non religious and motivated by ideology, politics or nationalism - but those are treated religiously. Communist extremists come to mind, or Kamikaze fighters in Japan who would commit strategic suicide based on the cultural code of Bushido which emphasised honour, sacrifice and loyalty to the Emperor. With Islam in particular, the idea of martyrdom is predisposed to extremism as it can be too easily distorted away from a defensive interpretation to a offensive interpretation. The situation doesn't help that the world recognises Palestinians to be occupied as this gives the extreme factions among them justification, they can simply say - ''Look, we aren't going to them (proactively, offensively), they have already come to us and we are occupied, so any action we take is defence (reactive) thus justified.'' This is where even if all our beliefs are constructs and subjective, subjectivity still has objective real world affects. Subjectivity in a sense literally matters because it can matter-ialise in reality. Racism is biological extremism, fanaticism is psychological extremism, totalitarianism is political extremism, fundamentalism is religious extremism.

Firstly, this going to get a lot of stick & some guys might call me pathetic especially anyone shorter & I'm sorry, I am just being honest about how I personally feel. This isn't intended to whine or be all woes me, I just have such a strong ambition to be a ladies man & I am about 5 foot 8 - 5 foot 9, (somewhere between 173 - 175 CM) & I refuse to measure myself because I'm scared it's even 172-173. I am from European countries where young people are very tall, I'd say male average is normally about 5 foot 11, but I continuously see men 6 foot plus & see plenty women my height I spent most of my life thinking I was average height, but now I realize I am short & I am too short for women's standards. I'm not here to moan or hate women but I will admit that I want to date & have casual sex // relationships too with women I find attractive. But I just don't measure up & my chances in pick up are extremely slim. I've been ripped in perfect shape & I still can't compete with skinny or fat guys if they are 5 foot 11 plus, they are tall enough I am not end of story. I didn't care about height but that didn't change the fact that women really do. I don't mind if a girl is 5 foot tall or 5 foot 9. Now I come to the dark truth of how challow & specific society is. Society loves their specific preferences & measurements ... It's ashame beacause I'm not that picky, girl doesn't have to have a huge ass or tits, or be a certain height, as long as I feel attractive then thats enough for me, but the girls always so picky I can get the number sometimes but they always end up ignoring me. I have all the other qualities apart from height, don't say "it's your attitude" because I have litterally been extremely confident before,acted happy, funny in the moment, ripped physique & social and still couldn't get the girls. I have lost all motivation to live & I am considering suicide. I really value relationships & for years & years I have wanted at least 1 decent looking women (with good personality), but who actually wants me & find me attractive & wouldnt cheat or look down on me for being short I feel insecure walking on the street & in my city there are tons of beautiful women, always walking around with tall handsome men. No I don't want to move to indonesia or somewhere & that isn't practical for me right now. I can't focus on my work & business goals right now and all my thoughts get constantly devoted to this I get obssessed with it & have obsessive mind I go to clubs but it's hard to hide my insecurity, even when i'm feeling confident I can't stand out at clubs because height is everything & the only obvious thing I am going to drink alcohol becasue I can't take the pain & probably commit suicide. I don't want sympathy or your polite bullshit or white lies or "go see a psychologist", they won't make me taller & give me a big dick. So no. Why am I posting this? Because I might as well post this first before I give in in defeat, but I don't think anything will change. Realizing that society is so chimp like is depressing. If only I could get girls with my charm & my skills or my sense of style or my phsyique, all things I have & develop but they just want the bigger chimp with the bigger cock.

In 2008, I believed I was trapped in an abusive relationship. Believed the only way out was suicide. My third attempt was successful, clinically died. NDE brought me back, my life became mine. Reincarnation is a man made concept to help cope with death in my perspective. However, it is also true that all that can be imagined is permitted so your perspective can coincide and contradict while both are true and false...lol. You created your answers when created your questions. It's your ego that wants the answers right away, so if you kill your body...you kill your ego. And never get answers. lol Are you suffering? Are you able to see suffering while suffering without judging it? I know it can be hard to let go of suicidal ideations when they take hold, that energy is ancient. Be mindful and breathe, know you are safe, your are loved, all is well if your mind tells you otherwise. From suffering comes immense peace is your not afraid to curiously look in real-time experience. Take care, friend! XOXO

I always think about a suicide without material suicide. Like, when i meditate i imagine to fall into another state of consciousness and end this life without the dream of harming my body. I think that you don't need to actually commit suicide...

There are many practical ones, but the most important are the subjective ones. The subjective/epistemical ones can be a life and death question at some point in your life whether you have that underestanding or experience to even enjoy basic things in life or just not commit suicide in my opinion.

Most people don't commit suicide because the known is more comfy than the unkown. If that balance is perturbed the jump is done to the other side 💥 Oh, there is just one side 💥 Maybe being a human wasn't that bad after all. I kinda miss it 💥 Most people don't commit suicide because the known is more comfy than the unkown. If that balance is perturbed the jump is done to the other side 💥 Oh, there is just one side 💥 Maybe being a human wasn't that bad after all. I kinda miss it 💥

You kind of are though. If you believe that your actions have no effect on others then that paradoxically leads you straight into victim thinking and depression. If you choose to accept that you have responsibility in life then it does lead to guilt for bad actions but also for hope that you can influence others positively and thus also yourself and your life. This is coming from also a depressed person but powerlessness is the most depressing thing I could ever imagine. Creating a worthwhile life unfortunately takes a while but you do have the power to do it. And you know that because you could use the opposite power of destruction to achieve much quicker results, not even in the case of suicide but think about neighbourhood vandalism and how quickly that would have a negative effect on people's realities.

ABSOLUTLY it is not because we experience ourselves as separate INDIVIDUALS that it means that we are separate INDIVIDUALS. The LEVEL where we experience ourselves as separate INDIVIDUALS is closer to the foundation of MAYA - the Great Illusion. The LEVEL where we experience ourselves as ONE BEING - ONENESS without any separation is closer to REALITY and Truth. SUICIDE inevitably affects others - as we are doing this journey TOGETHER - we 'create' this experience TOGETHER.

The only possibility of suicide that I consider legitimate is the case of a terminal illness that places a burden on you and other people. There you have to be brave and speed up the process. In any other case, I see it absolutely wrong. You have to fight while you can.

@Something Funny My response would be.. since you haven't awakened enough from my view it's better to do that than "suicide". You could find out more or less what you are going to end up being "on the other side" with some mushrooms for example.. The other thing is about love, anytime someone commits suicide it has a ripple effect on the people around them. There will for sure be people saddened by the loss and your presence/way of leaving this world. Though yeah technically I think most people basically "suicides" when they leave here when their body is at its "end use" or some other karmic determination.. but it's different to me when a young ish person tries to do that especially if they're still healthy. That would be a circumstantial thing more or less that could be improved.

I think for most people suicide is just NOT an option they are willing to consider. And why is that? Well that is more obvious than not. As Leo pointed out, some are so overwhelmed with some form of suffering, that continuing to exist as a human is an option they want out. In my life I have been aware of a couple of suicide cases - where everyone was dumbfounded by it. One was a white male that had a loving wife, children, a successful career, a prominent position in his community, he was appreciated and liked by most people, and many, many looked-up to him for having such a successful life. No one including his wife and children and best friend had a clue he was considering killing himself... Suffering is not always what it seems.

In my own post about suicide a long long time ago, one of my first posts on actualized from 2016, @Leo Gura touched on the idea of the difference between big and small ego death drive. It may be beneficial to mention. Here is the thread https://www.actualized.org/forum/topic/2727-my-ego-wants-to-die/

I have been studying NDE's (Near Death Experiences) since the end of the 70's. I have read, and listen to a few hundred testimonies. I also read many books on the subject, especially those written by researchers. There are a few NDE testimonies from suicide attempts. The first thing I would like to explain which result from all that research on the subject of the afterlife - is about Karma and Judgment. A phenomenon reported by great number of NDE'r is the phenomenon of the Life-Review. In almost all cases when one is having his Life-Review he/she is in the presence of a very Loving being or Beings - who maybe is a Guide or an Old friend or a Family member that has been on the other side. The experience of receiving unconditional Love from that Being or those Beings is remarkably consistent in testimonies explaining their experiences of the Life Review. During the Life-Review the only source of Judgments is You as in the one who is reviewing his life. This is important to understand. It is your Judgment that determines not only if you are to experience a karmic-debt but how one is to find peace with himself as a result of his action in this lifetime. The concept of paying a karmic-debt is only the means chosen by You to achieve Peace with yourself. Karma is not just about reincarnation - you can process your Karma without experiencing a human life again. We are here experiencing human-life as an effective mean to LEARN - a learning process that we usually plan before our birth. After we leave this body, our spiritual evolution is not any different than before we left the Earth-plane - so for most of us it means we still have some LEARNING to do in the afterlife. 'Learning' is one of the main activities of the afterlife. As far as suicide is concerned - the consequences will depend on you and how you will judge the 'decision' you made of cutting short your human journey. What is different about the Life-Review and how we see our life here while in it - is that during the Life-Review we experience every feeling and emotions of OTHERS. How our words and actions impact others - we not only feel every feeling but also in some cases experience how their life would of been different if we had not said or done a certain action. Suicide is usually very bad for those you leave behind - and even if you are old and alone - suicide has a very negative impact on others in your community; those that find your body; neighbors; etc... Of course this is a generalization, and today we have more and more legal euthanasia - which in this context of the Life Review - would be different than a suicide.

@Leo Gura I think parents are told that their child is at higher suicide risk and that transitioning is best for them. And if you are scared, confused, you always do what the autority tells you.

Multiple Points: 1. Spiritual Perspectives: Seth: No one dies who does not want to die, this experience is a choice on another plane Sadhguru: The emotions at death matter immensely, suicide is detrimental Ra: This realm is an evolutionary catalyst and learning ground to evolve faster Hindu: As we learn to embody higher forms, we naturally evolve Buddhists: You will keep incarnating until you realize yourself in true essence 2. Ego-Blindspots to the beautiful sides of the Experience To get yourself into this complex form needed immense holarchies of evolutionary pressures Your life yields tons of opportunities that the state of mind obscures from itself There is much appreciation that is unrealized and overlooked that psychedelics can tune you into While alive, there are countless paradigms to be transcended and learned from You are the anchor of your own experience, just need to learn to arrange it 3. Personal Experience and Desire I felt/feel just like you, I want to evolve and morph my form at will and create realities to inhabit My trips taught me much, but my intuition tells me that I'm not ready to transcend/ have unfinished business My intuition also tells me that it's my psychology that I need to change and time on earth is short anyway That there is much to do/discover/engage in/ find meaning through, that each day recontextualizes my whole life And that each experience collected can be expanded and incorporated into the after-life so collect as much as you can 4. The Conscious Will Paradigm I have personally adopted a "Conscious Leaving" paradigm I will only allow my physical self to die if it is through Mahasamadhi and I can see the after-life I transition into There is much to learn until death, we don't know what comes after and if dying through crude means is detrimental It's also really sad to kill oneself that way, I think that sadness alone is of immense pressure I think once we attain enough conscious awareness, it will in fact become an educated choice to make without pain or suffering Ultimately, I think we ought to evolve body alignment to the degree that we won't need external means to fulfill desires or die if we want to but that our psyche consciously tunes into another reality leaving this body in full cooperation with each part and organ, same as becoming aware of everything that keeps us from health, it's a belief of mine of course but so intuitive and powerful that I'll take it as true. That is the highest goal I see, to become 100% Consciously Internally/Awarely Psychedelic and in 100% control of one's experience and in control of every detail of one's self-materialization.

You do not know what happens after suicide don't just think or assume it would all only be good after death.

That is the only real hard break to suicide. The unknown of what to come next... I guess almost anything is worth bearing through because it could always be worse than what it is right now. But even so, if you get kidnapped and tortured, you could say in that case suicide is really the best option, but that's still a belief because a miracle could happen and you get rescued or something. And if you can maintain an open mind and surrender, all the bad shit will end and you might be better in the future because of what you've endured. @Leo Gura This ties with your ego not having control over what the next dream will be, but when you lose the ego, is it totally out of your hands and form will just simply keep changing and morphing? Is God an infinite ocean of forms moving without control? Here's where shit gets really scary...

Umm again I say this with all humility, I know really nothing of Death because I haven't Died:) But I trust the sources I researched, so from what they say, if You are in a Suffering of sorts at the moment of Death, then that is what You will feel in the afterlife and it could be for a long time.. The only time You don't get that, is when You die a Happy Person, then in afterlife You feel very happy, and to have Union or Liberation, Not like heaven stories from Bible, but non individuality, then that is Muhkti or Dissolution, like a drop in the ocean going back into the ocean, its no longer a drop but merges with the entire ocean, its the same with this.. You are just a Bubble, the lining of the Bubble is Your Karma, you think You are this lining/karma, but Your what is inside the Bubble (LIfe itself), Spiritual practice and its ultimate goal is to burst the bubble completely, not reform it again and become another bubble (reincarnation).. So Suicide although I can see why ppl do it (I have experience with it as a family member died by suicide in 06') does not end the suffering sorry to say!

Even if what you say is true, it does not mean that giving them hormones and transitioning is the answer. Edit: by doing a quick google search, i see that there are some studies that show the increase risk of suicide. Which is not the same as what you are claiming to be: that gender dysphoria is leading to many kids committing suicide. Your position actually cannot be serious by default, because here you are claiming my position is unscientific, while dismissing science as myth in other cases. And no, you are not avoiding self-deception by cherry picking science, you are just as prone to it as anyone else. I have seen it time and time again from you.

Haha, no it's not different. You cherrypick science that confirms your own biases, just like everyone else does. And if these same studies were to show otherwise, you would be the first one to dismiss them. You might think that you are different (or special), but you are not in this regard. The reason why I mentioned driving, alcohol, nicotine, serving in the army, etc is not to equate them, but to point out the seriousness of the decision. And if you don't trust your child to be left alone with adult supervision, to drink, to drive, etc, how can you trust them to make a sane decision that will impact their entire life in the future? So far there has not been evidence to show that children as committing suicide in significant numbers due to gender dysphoria, so not sure where are you even getting this from. Perhaps you should consider the amount of kids that regret later in life that they transitioned? Accusing me of not being interested in the substance of the issue, just shows your attachment to this ideology that you hold and wanting to defend it. Cherry picking science and then telling me that my approach is not scientific is also beyond funny. Until you start being consistent and non-contradictory yourself, you are in no position to tell anyone else when it comes to being empirical or not.

Absolutely! I cherrypick science to weed out the shit. This is not a bug, this is crucial to avoid self-deception. And you should not confuse meta-scientific matters with distrusting of what appear to be solid clincial results. These are totally different things. Gender dysphoria is a disease-like condition that warrants treatment, whereas drinking and smoking are just bad habits which no one needs. Kids aren't suffering from not having access to alcohol and tobacco. Kids are not commiting suicide from lack of drinking and smoking. Your whole approach here is non-clinical and non-therapeutic because you are not interested in the substance of the issue, you are interested in defending a cultural attachment. You are not even asking or wondering: What is empirically the best method to help reduce the suffering of trans kids? You already assume you know even though you did zero clinical work.