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What are you doing then? This is what the work is about. A concept is a concept. You must know permanently, so to speak. This isn't a state, though. Perceptive abilities remain the same. Your experience of yourself, the world, others and emotions remains largely the same, except that now you are free from them. You can be bored and enlightened. It's clear to me you're holding some ideal about this. Monks experience despair, desire, jealousy, joy and pain. Awakened warriors throughout history killed people. Enlightened people aren't suddenly able to walk on water. If you cooked amazing omelets before enlightenment, after it you would still be able to do so. See? Solutions to what? What is self-serving might conflict with what's true.

Yeah the forum has definitely evolved. In the past, people were still talking about book like Think and Grow rich and how to be successful. And then, people move on to law of attraction. And then to non duality. And now so many people are on psychedelics and so many are claiming to be awakened.

I thought this would be a fun thing to try. I will not claim to be fully enlightened, but I will be honest about what I have experienced. I have had satori experiences, God Consciousness three times, and other less normal awakenings. Ask away.

I’d like to introduce you to the foundational concept/“doctrine”/dhamma of Buddhism which distinguishes it from essentially all other forms of spirituality. This is the concept of dukkha (suffering, stress, dissatisfaction) and dukkha nirodha (the cessation, or end, of suffering, stress, dissatisfaction). This is by far the primary focus, teaching, and practice of Buddhism. You will find this simplified way of explaining the aim of Buddhism in a bit more complexity when looking at “The Four Noble Truths” which is also seen as a foundational aspect of Buddhism. I will use my own words for simplicity’s sake, but you can research the four noble truths in more depth on your own. 1. There is dukkha in existence/experience/life. 2. There is a cause for dukkha. This cause is a combination of clinging to what we think we truly want which will make us feel better AKA stop feeling dukkha in the moment, being aversive to what we do not want AKA what we believe causes dukkha for us, and the ignorance (avijjā) or lack of wisdom paññā AKA perception of a stable, real “self” which can be threatened or which must find peace for itself, failing to understand the nature of dukkha, and failing to see the transient nature of both pleasure and pain (anicca — impermanence). 3. There is a real and obtainable end to dukkha. There is a real and obtainable end to suffering which at least thousands of human beings have already realized. 4. There is a path to become a human being who has realized the end of suffering in their own life. There is a clear path, method, guide manual, and practice to ending suffering. This can be seen, at least in part, to be The Noble Eightfold Path which are eight steps or necessary requirements which acting in unison lead to the complete end of suffering if they are developed to the necessary degree. Hinduism talks about Liberation, and in many ways Liberation in Hinduism also means an ending of suffering. You can think of Buddhism as a later evolution of Hinduism which focuses primarily on this goal whereas Hinduism has a bit of a different approach and less clear or emphasized end goal when it relates to suffering. The whole idea of what it means to be fully awakened, or an Arahant, in the models of Theravada Buddhism (the original school based directly on the teachings of Guatama Buddha) is that you have freed yourself from the grips of suffering. The first important step is to see that this is an actually obtainable goal for us. You will likely not believe that this is possible whether consciously or in more hidden parts of your psyche until you reach an experience which clearly convinces you of this possibility being a reality for yourself. That moment is adequately called “stream entry” or the moment one has entered the stream which carries one to full awakening in the definition of the Theravada model. This is also the moment it is literally impossible to doubt the efficacy of the Buddha and the teachings he gave on eliminating suffering. Ending suffering is different from ending pain. Ending pain is not the goal of Buddhism. Pain is a reality of embodied life. Suffering is the amplification of pain into a much worse thing to bear. Suffering is mentally-created dissatisfaction and a lack of accepting the experience you are having. This can be eradicated. Freedom from suffering is in part about non-resistance, but true non-resistance has very little to do with allowing rape, allowing injustice, or perpetuating pain through a lack of action. True non-resistance is dissolving the false view of an actual self as an entity and arriving at the point in which you turn from a person who is alive to life itself. The human experience has built in preferences and in turn preferred modes of action. A lot of that is about reducing pain and increasing pleasure. There’s nothing at all wrong with that. The issue comes when you create a false view of an individual who can fight against LIFE IN THIS MOMENT AS IT WISHES TO BE EXPRESSED. Stop fighting, and allow life to live as it lives. There’s a hell of a journey in front of you to get there in a consistently experienced sense, but you will thank yourself immensely once that journey has been completed.

I like Snoopys perspective on these not so happy transitionings from this life to the next: ... and the end of suffering is possible, as stated by every spiritual tradition since millenia. Thousands of Realizers over the centuries stating that. And the recipe is transcending the illusion of the separate self-contraction, becoming the Nondual Totality/Reality, and then finding out what is aware of all of that... or the real You, Reality itself. And before talking about keeping that final Realization while being nailed at the cross, it is a good start maintaining some Awakening during everday life. There have been prominent cases who have had challenges with staying in the awakened perspective during these unfortunate transitions (Jesus on the cross “My God, My God, Why Have You Forsaken Me"). But since the Real Nature of every being has no moving parts or anything else objective/material that could be "damaged", apparently "IT" didn't get damaged while suffering that procedure. Or any other of the lovely mishaps you mention. But Nightmares are possible in the dream for sure. IT never changes, because it is empty pure Impersonal Awareness itself without any core, mechanism or objective/material anything. And it is also all of manifested/imagined Reality in a nondual way. Worst case you can have is a nightmare. Although a veery realistic one. That is why Karma is so important: Its all a dream, but one can have a nightmare, and Karma works with mathematical precission. So, anyways, just take up some hopefully efficient practice and see for yourself concerning the topic of the end of suffering. Selling Water by the River

@UnbornTao That is the issue. You are putting labels on to the gurus and assuming they are Awake as a trophy. You think being Awake is having a certain experience that leaves you "Awakened" for ever. It does not work like that. You can only be Awake in the Now. You can not grasp, hold or "save" in a closet the Awakening and claiming that a person is Awake for life. Awakening is not an understanding that you come, or a conclusion. Is an opening in your energies, and activation, a boundless state. If you lose it, that's it. The end. You can't be cheating saying "Nahhhh I'm awake but I do have some addictions here and there, damn, let me go smoke some blues...but all is alright, I'm awake! I'm God and everything is a mind yada yada". ??? You guys just don't get that having an experience and building a conceptual knowledge around it can be done by anyone. That is certainly not being Awake. Unfortunately I suspect Leo's supposed "Awakening work", is built around this structure, seeing he kinda of thinks about this topic in the same way as most of you.

GPT-4 script about a movie of a dmt cult ChatGPT Title: The Elysium Experience Setting: A secluded compound deep within a lush, wild forest. The area is dotted with ornate tents and communal spaces. A large wooden temple stands at the center. Characters: Lea: A journalist seeking to expose the truth behind the mysterious cult. Elder Cyrus: The charismatic leader of the Elysium cult. Believes in unlocking higher dimensions of reality through DMT. Raven: A cult member who befriends Lea. She's torn between her loyalty to the cult and her budding relationship with Lea. Jonas: A skeptical ex-member on a mission to rescue his younger sister from the cult. Act I: Lea infiltrates the Elysium compound under the guise of a seeker. She's introduced to the rituals, mainly the DMT ceremonies led by Elder Cyrus. Lea experiences a DMT trip and it's unlike anything she's ever experienced, causing her to question her original mission. Raven befriends Lea, sharing her personal story and why she joined. Act II: Jonas sneaks into the compound, sharing with Lea the dark side of the cult – how they exploit members for money and how some members never return from their “trips”. Lea and Jonas discover that Elder Cyrus has been altering the DMT with other substances, making it more addictive and easier to control members. Raven confronts Elder Cyrus about the real intentions behind the DMT ceremonies after overhearing Jonas and Lea. Cyrus, feeling threatened, decides to accelerate his plan: a mass ceremony where everyone will ascend to a "higher dimension" together. Act III: Lea, Jonas, and Raven plot to prevent the mass ceremony. The climax of the movie is a dramatic confrontation between Elder Cyrus, armed with his enhanced DMT, and our trio. Raven, caught between her loyalty and her newly awakened skepticism, ultimately sides with Lea and Jonas. this cult is southeast asian in the Han Dynasty ChatGPT 2 / 2 Title: The Cult of the Mystic Orchid Setting: Southeast Asia during the Han Dynasty. A secret enclave in a hidden valley, lush with tropical vegetation and a striking, ethereal beauty. The central focus of the cult's compound is a massive temple made of stone, adorned with colorful orchids. Characters: Min: An adventurous and curious young Han official who has heard rumors of a mysterious cult. Shan: The mystical leader of the cult, who claims to have knowledge of the ancient arts and the ability to commune with higher realms through DMT. Zhen: A loyal cult member who befriends Min. He has a quiet skepticism and is more aware of Shan's manipulation than others. Lin: Min's elder sister, a renowned healer who uses natural herbs. She's concerned about Min's obsession with the cult. Act I: Min, intrigued by the tales of the cult, disguises himself as a local and infiltrates the enclave. He witnesses the mystical rituals, where members consume DMT extracted from local plants to induce visions and altered states of consciousness. Min experiences a DMT trip and is profoundly affected, believing he has glimpsed a different world. He becomes enamored with the cult's teachings. Zhen, wary of Min's rapid devotion, takes Min under his wing, showing him the daily life of the cult members. Act II: Lin arrives in the area, looking for Min. She discovers the cult and, pretending to be a seeker of knowledge, gains entry. Lin witnesses Min's increasing involvement and becomes concerned about his well-being. Zhen confides in Min and Lin about his growing doubts regarding Shan's intentions. Together, they uncover that Shan is exploiting the members for their labor and resources, enriching himself under the guise of spiritual enlightenment. Act III: Min, Zhen, and Lin confront Shan, demanding an explanation. Shan admits to his exploitation but defends his actions, claiming that he it's about a family, their daughter, and their relationship to the cult ChatGPT Title: Beneath the Blossoming Trees Setting: Southeast Asia during the Han Dynasty. A tranquil village on the edge of the majestic forest, which conceals the hidden valley where the Orchid Cult resides. Characters: Ling: A headstrong and curious young woman who becomes entranced by the Orchid Cult. Mao: Ling's protective father, a local blacksmith. Mei: Ling's mother, wise and intuitive. She has a deep connection to local folklore and traditional remedies. Shan: The mystical leader of the Orchid Cult. Zhen: An older member of the cult who becomes Ling's guide. Act I: The family leads a harmonious life in their village. Ling often listens to Mei's stories of spirits, other realms, and traditional legends. Ling encounters members of the Orchid Cult in the village market. Their tales of enlightenment and other realms captivate her. Against Mao and Mei’s wishes, Ling ventures into the forest to find the Orchid Cult. Act II: Ling is initiated into the cult, introduced to its rituals, including the consumption of DMT extracted from rare orchids. Mao and Mei discover Ling's absence and set out to retrieve her. Ling's experiences with the Orchid Cult make her question the values and lessons imparted by her family. She becomes more distant, drawing closer to Shan. Zhen, witnessing Ling's transformation, feels a bond with her, reminding him of his own daughter who he lost touch with after joining the cult. Act III: Mao and Mei infiltrate the Orchid Cult, disguising themselves as seekers of truth. Mei, tapping into her knowledge of folklore, quickly discerns the manipulations of Shan. Zhen, recognizing Mei’s wisdom, confides in her about his past, expressing regret and the wish to help Ling see the truth. Mao, Mei, and Zhen form a plan to show Ling the true nature of the Orchid Cult. Act IV: Mei challenges Shan in a public display of spiritual knowledge, drawing upon her vast understanding of local legends and traditions. As Mei’s wisdom unfolds, many cult members begin questioning Shan's teachings. Mao finds Ling and pleads with her to remember her roots and the love of her family. Ling, torn between the two worlds, has a profound vision during a final DMT ceremony. She sees her ancestors and the spirits Mei often spoke of. They remind her of the importance of family and the dangers of blind faith. Act V: Ling, with renewed clarity, decides to leave the Orchid Cult with her family. Zhen, inspired by the family’s bond and Mei’s wisdom, decides to leave as well, seeking to reconnect with his own family. The cult disbands as members, disillusioned with Shan, seek genuine spiritual paths. Shan, defeated, contemplates his future as the forest reclaims the hidden valley. Closing Scene: Back in their village, Mao, Mei, and Ling sit beneath a blossoming tree, a symbol of renewal. Mei tells a story, one that Ling has heard many times but now hears with new ears, about the strength of family bonds and the enduring spirit of ancestors. The scene fades as Ling places an orchid in her hair, symbolizing her journey and growth.

You're conflating consciousness with the way you live and with emotions, which are relative. Enlightenment doesn't change anything. Examples of awakened individuals doing silly (and human) things abound. Because they still have to act like a person. Nissargadatta smoked, zen warriors killed people, etc. You could be enlightened and stream games. And certainly get bored, angry, jealous, etc.

Where do you stand on your Life-Purpose? If you meet this 'ideal woman' tomorrow and she asks you 'What contribution have you made to the world that you're the most proud of?', what would your answer be? This is your problem right here. If you can't answer this question, the conscious women see you as a guy practicing 'new-age pop spirituality' and they don't take you seriously either. That's why you meet those kinds of women yourself! And, to give you an idea of how things could work with someone who's genuinely awakened and who genuinely has integrity, she will be interested in what your Life-Purpose is, she will see whether it aligns with her values or not and if it does, she will fully support it. An unconscious woman will hold you back from following your passion if it means that the profit goes down for a month. But, a conscious woman will not nag you when that happens and she will support you instead.

By the way, there is no such thing as be an awakened person, there is access to awakened states. if you are awake, you are awake, if you are asleep, you are asleep, now.

Let's see, @Javfly33 is right, awakening is the end of suffering, and whoever says no is not awake and has never been awake for a second. what happens is that it is extremely difficult to be awakened and you return to dream state, then you suffer. but that is not why you are going to say that awakening is not the end of suffering, it is, completely. mental suffering is like physical suffering, it pushes you to withdraw from a harmful situation. if you succeed, the suffering ceases. If you are awake, you are out of suffering, and whoever says no does not know what awakening is, equates it to knowing things, which is precisely the dream

@Sugarcoat I've watched a couple when I first found God and even then I was like these people are saying absolutely nothing they are just repeating the same phrase over and over again. I don't think they know what they are talking about or they are so awakened they have become drones of reality. I will see comments under the video saying stuff like 'wow this is really deep and eye opening' I can't beleive it.

I swear to god. I downloaded tik tok a few weeks back to see what’s up and have barely opened it since. Such social media can be nice tho if you closely curate exactly what you follow so you create this specific feed for yourself . And the Awakened subreddit has golden nuggets once in a while too but this place is something else

@Javfly33 don't burn yourself friend , Just expose your thing, there are those who appreciate and understand it, and others who don't. My opinion: you're right, when you're awake to a certain degree there is no boredom or suffering. but you can be awake now and not be awake in half an hour, when I come into your house to tell you that you will be impaled tomorrow, you will get into deep sleep with nightmares. I mean, It is not easy to maintain awakened states. we're on it, at least we get awake moments. for something one starts In general, I agree with a lot of what you have said.

she leads the awakened drones. they just ramble on saying the exact same thing over and over and over. They have 40 minute videos repeating the same sentence in different ways

This type of awakened person you’re describing probably wouldn’t write such a post so I don’t see the point of this on who’s behalf are you even speaking on

Thanks for describing your experience. I do agree with that, based on my own experience. And thousands of others in all cultures and centuries described it like you do. That is a very important element of the path. It probably sounds quite a bit nuts, boring and strange. At least I would have interpreted it like that a few years ago... But that is exactly how the Impersonal (Silent/Pure/Empty) Infinite Consciousness perceives all of its manifestation in certain awakened nondual states, watching itself, perceiving itself, being itself and the world, by itself, for itself. (1) That starts to happen when the self-contraction/separate-self is seen through, transcended and cut off either with high enough speed & proficiency, or with some more energetic state-change techniques. So the resulting flow of bliss makes it no longer possible for any grasping/contracting thought/feeling-arising to grip & contract the focus/attention (and cut the nondual field into two, or duality), and create bad emotions/stop the flow of bliss. And motivating the separate-self with that resulting suffering again for searching or avoiding certain experiences to eradicate the suffering, and relax the contraction again. That process you describe is the natural way that leads the transition to the deep identity level change to ones True Nature, the Infinite Silent and peaceful/blissful Abyss of Pure Consciousness without location or any kind of objective appearance... When not finding IT (or Consciousness, or oneself), at some point the localization of consciousness dissolves, making every appearance (thought, feeling, cloud, tree, the whole world including ones "small self") just an appearance arising in the Infinite, silent & empty and not-personal Eternal Reality of Ones True Being, Infinite Consciousness, or Reality itself. (2) And when it is seen that even the "Understander" of this Nondual and Awake Realization is nothing more than a bundle of "understanding"-thoughts arising WITHIN THAT, then Full Enlightenment is finally seeing that there never was a separate-self besides an illusion, and nobody (besides) an Illusion actually woke up. Pure Infinite Consciousness/Being was there throughout, undisturbed, just containing some illusion-arisings. And yet, that Realization or waking up of that perspective of Indras Net makes all the difference in the dream of that perspective, finally dissolving the self-contraction/separate-self illusion even of the "Understander" of all of that for good. Selling Water by the River PS: (1) are the stages of dissolving the separate-self into nonduality, and (2) is going from Nonduality/Unity towards even relaxing/dissolving the "Understander"-separate-self-illusion of that into Infinite Consciousness/Reality itself. More on that in this post: PS PS: For Infinite Reality to create a separate-self/self-contraction/ego and to maintain it, there are just two emotions needed that have to regularly occur in cycles (not permanently, that would also kill the separate-self) : 1) suffering (in the meaning of non-satisfied-ness, or "non-bliss" , and 2) boredom. That starts all of the projects for getting back again the bliss via certain experiences (whatever that may be varies a lot). A bliss that would be there if not the separate-self-contraction would stop its flow via contracting. Of course, that can only be seen after having touched the natural bliss of ones True Being, because if that would be seen earlier the whole process would be shut off immediately. But if there is no technique available to just cut off the contraction/suffering, one has to stick to grasping for certain experiences, because that is then all one has...

Is not about kidding myself. Is about setting the bar to a level that is enough high so the word "being Awake" means actually something real. I do not consider anyone to be awake if he falls into ego. Since Reality is always Now, if Now you are not awake, that's it, you lost. You might as well say that you awakened 10 years ago, but the previous 9years you have been a crack addict with a miserable life in very poor and compressed states of consciousness.

You really think god will put someone in that "awakened" state for a long time? God wants people to live life and suffer. I was once in this childlike state where everything was magical and new but it didn't last very very long, it was a high state induced by psychedelic. You can't control your state of consciousness

Yeah, well, life is a dream. So what? The power of the dream should not be underestimated. If you think awakened people can't get addictions I think you're kidding yourself. You still have to be vigilant against bad habits otherwise you will end up like Alan Watts, an awakened alcoholic who drinks himself to death. Awakening is not a get-out-of-jail-free card.

Beautiful post! Exactly what I needed to hear. I recently had an experience that changed my way of thinking about things. It was such an intense understanding that I knew I had to start living my life this way. Every day I am improving on integrating that understanding into my life and my anxiety has really improved because of it. During this process.. I am realizing awakening is such an individual experience and that challenging myself to think in a different way is not always easy. And that's okay! So long as I can recognize and improve every day. Sometimes reading some of the posts on here can be disheartening because so many people hold on so tightly to what they believe is awakening. It made me question if I am just losing my mind or if I am actually on a journey of awakening. What I have come to understand is that we all have different experiences with our journey and are at different stages. There is no right way to become awakened IMO. Yes . there are things to do that definitely support advancement in your journey but those things are there for when each individual is ready to use them. I commend any and all that even show curiosity in awakening because I feel it means they are on their way in their own time. My focus should be on my journey and not to worry about what other people are doing. I can learn from those people and pick out the advice that resonates with me. For me..u know when I feel something in my heart then that is something I may need to consider utilizing in my own journey. Thank you for posting this! ❤

@Leo Gura i really dont understand the correlation between: "everything is perfect, there is no death, reality is Infinity so It is exploring all of its possibilities...etc" And "There is so much danger going down that path, maybe you never reach the end, some people have paid the costs and never awakened..."

Good observation. It is easy to think that you are awakened when you are living in a peaceful environment. If you send them to a hard environment, their socalled awakenedness would come to end, haha.

Anybody else read this guy Meher baba? one of the most pure teachings I have found. Lots of stuff on God-realisation and Love. Have a look at his God speaks book. Here are some quotes from him: "Love has to spring spontaneously from within and it is no way amenable to any form of inner or outer force. Love and coercion can never go together; but though love cannot be forced on anyone, It can be awakened in him through love itself. Love is essentially self communicative; Those who do not have it catch it from those who have it. True love is unconquerable and irresistible, And it goes on gathering power and spreading itself, Until eventually it transforms everyone whom it touches." “What is the meaning of God-Realization? It means to become one with God. By thinking and imagining, one can never become one with God. Union is possible only after the death of thoughts and imagination — the mind must die." “How does a person know that he has realized God? It is automatic. You are a human being. Do you ever think to yourself, `Am I a human being?´ You do not ask yourself this because you are a human being. In the same way, once a man realizes God, he spontaneously knows that he is God. He has the full experience of it by personal experience.” “About the New Life Meher Baba wrote: This New Life is endless, and even after my physical death it will be kept alive by those who live the life of complete renunciation of falsehood, lies, hatred, anger, greed and lust; and who, to accomplish all this, do no lustful actions, do no harm to anyone, do no backbiting, do not seek material possessions or power, who accept no homage, neither covet honor nor shun disgrace, and fear no one and nothing; by those who rely wholly and solely on God, and who love God purely for the sake of loving; who believe in the lovers of God and in the reality of Manifestation, and yet do not expect any spiritual or material reward; who do not let go the hand of Truth, and who, without being upset by calamities, bravely and wholeheartedly face all hardships with one hundred percent cheerfulness, and give no importance to caste, creed and religious ceremonies. This New Life will live by itself eternally, even if there is no one to live it.”

THIS^^^....my loved ones....started to look unreal....I died inside when I saw it. For awhile I became so indifferent to it all, then I learned to love it. Then Reality informed me that Solipsism is only one way to perceive Reality and that my previous way of looking at reality was just as valid as the waking up to it being purely imaginary. Then Reality showed me it could put everything back to how it looked before with me still able to break out and return it to unreality as well. Basically once you wake up, you can put yourself asleep again but do it consciously, and you can wake back up fully as well. So basically there is NOTHING TO FEAR. Once you fully awaken, you are awakened permanently.