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I was doing some self inquiry yesterday and was thinking (not through my mind but through experience): Who is aware of my breathing? I am breathing in and out irregularly and sometimes holding my breath so therefore i am not my breath. And i became fully aware of everything in my body. Am i the awareness of my body? sometimes i am aware of my body and sometimes i am not, my awareness shifts from inside my body, to my external surroundings, to my thoughts. You are always aware, so you are 'awareness', but you are not anything you are aware of/observing. But what about when i am asleep? At this point i literally fell asleep. When i am sleeping, i am not aware. I am still me, even though i am not conscious/aware of existence in deep sleep. So i cant be awareness. So if i am not awareness/consciousness, what am i? Thats when i think: i am nothingness, when im sleeping. So now im thinking, is my journey in this life to get me to consciously feel as calm and unatttached as i am when i am asleep? Because when i sleep, i literally merge with reality without judgement and ego. Is this my true self? Your thoughts are appreciated xxxx

Haha I've reread my answer and I realized that there was no point to write it. It's a fun thing to attempt to rationalize, but it is an ineffable thing to explain. You will not understand it by reading explanations, even from those who are truly awakened, and it's pointless to seek definitions to explain it because nothingness is a very abstract thing. It's like attempting to recreate the feeling one has in a new country they visited for another person. It simply won't work until they have been there and experienced it for themselves.

Hello all! So a few weeks ago during my meditation session I started trying to observe things without putting a label on it, I started moving my hand around and looked at my hand to see it as it is, to see the formless thing it was, and then the awareness of my mental sensations shot backward (inward) I felt a huge vast open space and nothingness, it was frightening and i felt a surge of panic, I didn't know who i was anymore, All i felt was a vast ocean of emptiness. It only lasted for a minute and then i lost it again. Since then I ''know'' on an emotional level that I don't exist, because I've experienced nothingness, but somehow it wasn't a permanent transformation like for example Eckhart Tolle went through. Any suggestions to make it reoccur and make it permanent?

Very beautifully poetic, Dodo! Although I'm not asking for more bullshit stories in your catalogue of bullshit stories. I'm asking you to actually look with no preconceived notions in your direct experience. Any question I ask is a focus point to confirm in direct experience, not an opportunity to spew logical proofs, quotes, or something someone else told you. Forget about "unmanifest nothingness" for a second. The I-thought. Is it not just another thought that arises? Just the same as "the sky is blue" or "chicken is for dinner" or "Jesus said ____"? If so, it comes and goes like all thoughts. But what you really are is still there, is it not? That which knows experience, without the need for logical knowledge?

So beyond the I am thought, there is the unmanifested nothingness surrounding it, that the i feeds itself new thoughts from? And if the i thought becomes aware of itself and starts looking in the darkness conciously, it shines its light on the darkness, like a ray of light? Is the I the light of this world as Jesus puts it?

@comp13 It's really quite simple. Thoughts just love to complicate it. Surely there's an I-thought. But it pops out of nowhere, just like all the other thoughts about there being a "thinker," a "chooser," a "doer." You can discover this in direct experience. Once you do, you realize furthermore that the I-thought that claims ownership over any aspect of experience is just another thought, and really, nobody can own experience. The ego never existed in the first place. There is no central experiencer, only experience experiencing itself. Enlightenment is actually your present experience, just overlayed with thought-stories appearing out of nowhere (all false) such as: How can I attain enlightenment? Surely there must be something outside of experience? But science says _____! But Advaita Vedanta says I need to do Karma Yoga for another year so I can become enlightened! I experienced this vast loving openness, so I must stay in that openness and re-experience it to become re-enlightened! But everyone says I'm going to die! Look at all the bodies dying around me! I must be the body! Agh! I need immortality or else my experience is incomplete! But Leo says I'm nothingness! So I must look for that nothingness as if it were an object of experience! There must be such thing as objects. Otherwise I wouldn't exist! Maybe Mooji will have the answers... I'm so unhappy! I'm so upset! I'm so angry! Ooo Benhito Massaro talks about manifestation! That may be of use for ME. They say "Find out who is experiencing," but of course I'm experiencing! And on and on and on...until.....

Thanks, I found your reply very helpful! I can now see how awareness might be the fundamental form of existence that doesn't need anything. I suppose the problem is that it's not possible for science to explain this. It's something that can only be experienced. What if this experience or aware nothingness is an illusion created by the mind in a meditative experience? What if it's just the most basic part of the brain being experienced without all the thought and sense perception parts? I don't know, I just have a lot of doubts. Sometimes I intuitively feel it to be true and I totally get it and don't even doubt it and other times I'm totally unconvinced and skeptical.

I understand that it's not supposed to be something in the brain and that it transcends physicality and rationality. I've watched Leo's videos on it closely. However, I'm not even sure that consciousness isn't produced by the brain. I'm open to the possibility, it would be much more interesting after all but I need to do more research (research includes meditation and so on as well as reading scientific books etc). So if nothingness has no qualities at all how can it be aware? This is where I'm stuck. Surely awareness is a quality of SOME kind. I mean, if it wasn't a quality we wouldn't be talking about it. Or is the word nothingness misleading in this case. Surely it's not actually nothing as it does exist.

@Atticus I think you're thinking that it takes a brain to be aware. It does not. It takes a brain to form thought, memories, emotions, etc., but awareness, is what YOU ARE, not a quality or ability of yourself. It is not a "thing" at all. It's not even nothingness. When you picture nothingness, you probably picture empty space. It's not even close to empty space. It has no qualities at all, other than IT IS. We take awareness for granted, when it is absolutely fundamental for our existence. It actually is existence.. Try to view awareness (being aware) with absolute importance, and deduce what it actually is from there.

These things do inspire me to work on my life purpose with the focus on the nothingness / everythingness (transient morality). Then, I can't think of a better mission in life than to align the life purpose with world peace. Is it possible that these things trigger these kinds of experiences with a combo of meditation / contemplation / self-inquiry? Time to find out. So awesome...

It's one of those paradoxes in the Enlightenment game that's not really reconcilable via rationality. To say that Nothingness is self-aware would be to attribute some sort of quality to it, in this case awareness. So no, Nothingness is not self-aware. That implies a "thing" that's doing something. At the same time, Enlightened people would tell you that Nothingness is self-aware. And I'm guessing that's because that's really just the best way you can understand it with your mind. Anyway, it's not really that important. This is not about learning, it's about un-learning. These kind of questions will reconcile when the time comes.

Nothingness can be better described as formlessness. Reality is in essence a nothingness because it is an endless abstraction of transient forms descending from a common root of subatomic energy. Furthermore, nothingness is not aware in the sense of how we are aware during our daily lives or how a dog or cat is aware of their environment. Rather it's awareness is instantaneous and and integral in all matter. It's awareness is the way in which life progresses and balances harmoniously. I hope this helps.

Those are some words I like to read from time to time in orde to get motivated towards change and enlightenment. And I wanted to share them with you. Tell me which piece of wisdom you like most? Rule 1 How we see God is a direct reflection of how we see ourselves. If God brings to mind mostly fear and blame, it means there is too much fear and blame welled inside us. If we see God as full of love and compassion, so are we. Rule 2 The path to the Truth is a labour of the heart, not of the head. Make your heart your primary guide! Not your mind. Meet, challenge and ultimately prevail over your nafs with your heart. Knowing your ego will lead you to the knowledge of God. Rule 3 You can study God through everything and everyone in the universe, because God is not confined in a mosque, synagogue or church. But if you are still in need of knowing where exactly His abode is, there is only one place to look for him: in the heart of a true lover. Rule 4 Intellect and love are made of different materials. Intellect ties people in knots and risks nothing, but love dissolves all tangles and risks everything. Intellect is always cautious and advices, ‘Beware too much ecstasy’, whereas love says, ‘Oh, never mind! Take the plunge!’ Intellect does not easily break down, whereas love can effortlessly reduce itself to rubble. But treasures are hidden among ruins. A broken heart hides treasures. Rule 5 Most of problems of the world stem from linguistic mistakes and simple misunderstanding. Don’t ever take words at face value. When you step into the zone of love, language, as we know it becomes obsolete. That which cannot be put into words can only be grasped through silence. Rule 6 Loneliness and solitude are two different things. When you are lonely, it is easy to delude yourself into believing that you are on the right path. Solitude is better for us, as it means being alone without feeling lonely. But eventually it is the best to find a person who will be your mirror. Remember only in another person’s heart can you truly see yourself and the presence of God within you. Rule 7 Whatever happens in your life, no matter how troubling things might seem, do not enter the neighbourhood of despair. Even when all doors remain closed, God will open up a new path only for you. Be thankful! It is easy to be thankful when all is well. A Sufi is thankful not only for what he has been given but also for all that he has been denied. Rule 8 Patience does not mean to passively endure. It means to look at the end of a process. What does patience mean? It means to look at the thorn and see the rose, to look at the night and see the dawn. Impatience means to be shortsighted as to not be able to see the outcome. The lovers of God never run out of patience, for they know that time is needed for the crescent moon to become full. Rule 9 East, west, south, or north makes little difference. No matter what your destination, just be sure to make every journey a journey within. If you travel within, you’ll travel the whole wide world and beyond. Rule 10 The midwife knows that when there is no pain, the way for the baby cannot be opened and the mother cannot give birth. Likewise, for a new self to be born, hardship is necessary. Just as clay needs to go through intense heat to become strong, Love can only be perfected in pain. Rule 11 The quest for love changes user. There is no seeker among those who search for love who has not matured on the way. The moment you start looking for love, you start to change within and without. Rule 12 There are more fake gurus and false teachers in this world than the number of stars in the visible universe. Don’t confuse power-driven, self-centered people with true mentors. A genuine spiritual master will not direct your attention to himself or herself and will not expect absolute obedience or utter admiration from you, but instead will help you to appreciate and admire your inner self. True mentors are as transparent as glass. They let the light of God pass through them. Rule 13 Try not to resist the changes, which come your way. Instead let life live through you. And do not worry that your life is turning upside down. How do you know that the side you are used to is better than the one to come? Rule 14 God is busy with the completion of your work, both outwardly and inwardly. He is fully occupied with you. Every human being is a work in progress that is slowly but inexorably moving toward perfection. We are each an unfinished work of art both waiting and striving to be completed. God deals with each of us separately because humanity is fine art of skilled penmanship where every single dot is equally important for the entire picture. Rule 15 It’s easy to love a perfect God, unblemished and infallible that He is. What is far more difficult is to love fellow human being with all their imperfections and defects. Remember, one can only know what one is capable of loving. There is no wisdom without love. Unless we learn to love God’s creation, we can neither truly love nor truly know God. Rule 16 Real faith is the one inside. The rest simply washes off. There is only one type of dirt that cannot be cleansed with pure water, and that is the stain of hatred and bigotry contaminating the soul. You can purify your body through abstinence and fasting, but only love will purify your heart. Rule 17 The whole universe is contained within a single human being-you. Everything that you see around, including the things that you might not be fond of and even the people you despise or abhor, is present within you in varying degrees. Therefore, do not look for Sheitan outside yourself either. The devil is not an extraordinary force that attacks from without. It is an ordinary voice within. If you set to know yourself fully, facing with honesty and hardness. Rule 18 If you want to change the ways others treat you, you should first change the way you treat yourself, fully and sincerely, there is no way you can be loved. Once you achieve that stage, however, be thankful for every thorn that others might throw at you. It is a sign that you will soon be showered in roses. Rule 19 Fret not where the road will take you. Instead concentrate on the first step. That is the hardest part and that is what you are responsible for. Once you take that step let everything do what it naturally does and the rest will follow. Don’t go with the flow. Be the flow. Rule 20 We were all created in His image, and yet we were each created different and unique. No two people are alike. No hearts beat to the same rhythm. If God had wanted everyone to be the same, He would have made it so. Therefore, disrespecting differences and imposing your thoughts on others is an amount to disrespecting God’s holy scheme. Rule 21 When a true lover of God goes into a tavern, the tavern becomes his chamber of prayer, but when a wine bibber goes into the same chamber, it becomes his tavern. In everything we do, it is our hearts that make the difference, not our outer appearance. Sufis do not judge other people on how they look or who they are. When a Sufi stares at someone, he keeps both eyes closed instead opens a third eye – the eye that sees the inner realm. Rule 22 Life is a temporary loan and this world is nothing but a sketchy imitation of Reality. Only children would mistake a toy for the real thing. And yet human beings either become infatuated with the toy or disrespectfully break it and throw it aside. In this life stay away from all kinds of extremities, for they will destroy your inner balance. Sufis do not go to extremes. A Sufi always remains mild and moderate. Rule 23 The human being has a unique place among God’s creation. “I breathed into him of My Spirit,” God says. Each and every one of us without exception is designed to be God’s delegate on earth. Ask yourself, just how often do you behave like a delegate, if you ever do so? Remember, it fells upon each of us to discover the divine spirit inside and live by it. Rule 24 Hell is in the here and now. So is heaven. Quit worrying about hell or dreaming about heaven, as they are both present inside this very moment. Every time we fall in love, we ascend to heaven. Every time we hate, envy or fight someone we tumble straight into the fires of hell. Rule 25 Each and every reader comprehends the Holy Qur’an on a different level of tandem with the depth of his understanding. There are four levels of insight. The first level is the outer meaning and it is the one that the majority of the people are content with. Next is the Batin – the inner level. Third, there is the inner of the inner. And the fourth level is so deep it cannot be put into words and is therefore bound to remain indescribable. Rule 26 The universe is one being. Everything and everyone is interconnected through an invisible web of stories. Whether we are aware of it or not, we are all in a silent conversation. Do no harm. Practice compassion. And do not gossip behind anyone’s back – not even a seemingly innocent remark! The words that come out of our mouths do not vanish but are perpetually stored in infinite space and they will come back to us in due time. One man’s pain will hurt us all. One man’s joy will make everyone smile. Rule 27 Whatever you speak, good or evil, will somehow come back to you. Therefore, if there is someone who harbours ill thoughts about you, saying similarly bad things about him will only make matters worse. You will be locked in a vicious circle of malevolent energy. Instead for forty days and nights say and think nice things about that person. Everything will be different at the end of 40 days, because you will be different inside. Rule 28 The past is an interpretation. The future is on illusion. The world does not more through time as if it were a straight line, proceeding from the past to the future. Instead time moves through and within us, in endless spirals. Eternity does not mean infinite time, but simply timelessness. If you want to experience eternal illumination, put the past and the future out of your mind and remain within the present moment. Rule 29 Destiny doesn’t mean that your life has been strictly predetermined. Therefore, to live everything to the fate and to not actively contribute to the music of the universe is a sign of sheer ignorance. The music of the universe is all pervading and it is composed on 40 different levels. Your destiny is the level where you play your tune. You might not change your instrument but how well to play is entirely in your hands. Rule 30 The true Sufi is such that even when he is unjustly accused, attacked and condemned from all sides, he patiently endures, uttering not a sing bad word about any of his critics. A Sufi never apportions blame. How can there be opponents or rivals or even “others” when there is no “self” in the first place? How can there be anyone to blame when there is only One? Rule 31 If you want to strengthen your faith, you will need to soften inside. For your faith to be rock solid, your heart needs to be as soft as a feather. Through an illness, accident, loss or fright, one way or another, we are all faced with incidents that teach us how to become less selfish and judgmental and more compassionate and generous. Yet some of us learn the lesson and manage to become milder, while some others end up becoming even harsher than before… Rule 32 Nothing should stand between you and God. No imams, priests, rabbits or any other custodians of moral or religious leadership. Not spiritual masters and not even your faith. Believe in your values and your rules, but never lord them over others. If you keep breaking other people’s hearts, whatever religious duty you perform is no good. Stay away from all sorts of idolatry, for they will blur your vision. Let God and only God be your guide. Learn the Truth, my friend, but be careful not to make a fetish out of your truths. Rule 33 While everyone in this world strives to get somewhere and become someone, only to leave it all behind after death, you aim for the supreme stage of nothingness. Live this life as light and empty as the number zero. We are no different from a pot. It is not the decorations outside but the emptiness inside that holds us straight. Just like that, it is not what we aspire to achieve but the consciousness of nothingness that keeps us going. Rule 34 Submission does not mean being weak or passive. It leads to neither fatalism nor capitulation. Just the opposite. True power resides in submission a power that comes within. Those who submit to the divine essence of life will live in unperturbed tranquillity and peace even the whole wide world goes through turbulence after turbulence. Rule 35 In this world, it is not similarities or regularities that take us a step forward, but blunt opposites. And all the opposites in the universe are present within each and every one of us. Therefore the believer needs to meet the unbeliever residing within. And the nonbeliever should get to know the silent faithful in him. Until the day one reaches the stage of Insane-I Kamil, the perfect human being, faith is a gradual process and one that necessitates its seeming opposite: disbelief. Rule 36 This world is erected upon the principle of reciprocity. Neither a drop of kindness nor a speck of evil will remain unreciprocated. For not the plots, deceptions, or tricks of other people. If somebody is setting a trap, remember, so is God. He is the biggest plotter. Not even a leaf stirs outside God’s knowledge. Simply and fully believe in that. Whatever God does, He does it beautifully. Rule 37 God is a meticulous dock maker. So precise is His order that everything on earth happens in its own time. Neither a minute late nor a minute early. And for everyone without exception, the clock works accurately. For each there is a time to love and a time to die. Rule 38 It is never too late to ask yourself, “Am I ready to change the life I am living? Am I ready to change within?” Even if a single day in your life is the same as the day before, it surely is a pity. At every moment and with each new breath, one should be renewed and renewed again. There is only one-way to be born into a new life: to die before death. Rule 39 While the part change, the whole always remains the same. For every thief who departs this world, a new one is born. And every descent person who passes away is replaced by a new one. In this way not only does nothing remain the same but also nothing ever really changes. For every Sufi who dies, another is born somewhere. Rule 40 A life without love is of no account. Don’t ask yourself what kind of love you should seek, spiritual or material, divine or mundane, Eastern or Western. Divisions only lead to more divisions. Love has no labels, no definitions. It is what it is, pure and simple. Love is the water of life. And a lover is a soul of fire! The universe turns differently when fire loves water.

Ah nice, cool man. See I view it in much the same way, but the difference is I don't let it all collapse into my mind as one thing (not saying/assuming you are, just speaking in general)... I protect the nuance of it all from being discarded in the name of simplicity. There is connection, but not as complete fusion or nothingness. Instead I see multiple tiers of ecosystems and sub-ecosystems, all connected, but distinct. SHARING sovereignty, as well as sharing in the ability to be moved and influenced by the confluence of other systems moving and inter-relating near each other. I've devoted myself for many years to studying and living and expanding my senses in regard to the actual "substance" that connects and chains all these micro and macro systems together. The push, pull, and balance of connective tension, which in other words could be labeled as attraction, repulsion, and harmony (a flavor of balance akin to what is known as the goldilocks zone). Working to harmonize greater and greater degrees of inter-connectivity, protecting them from collapse into polarities of extremes with their consequent extreme influences of attraction/repulsion, and expanding deeper from the understandings gained from the details in between these shifting tiers of connection. I don't let who I am be consumed by my connections to the rest of the universe. I am both an individual and a part of a larger system, with my own conatus (innate inclination of a thing to continue to exist and enhance itself), just like the cells and organs and bacteria in my body have their own conatus. But, also I have my own sense of satisfaction in devoting myself to something greater then I am, which I also depend on, much like my organs, cells, and bacteria also do. I balance both. Personally, I feel people who don't balance both and let their identity and individuality be consumed or discarded limit themselves from certain thresholds of development. For instance, internalization is the degree to which new information/patterns/connections embed themselves within our body and mind and is a required part of all learning. However, there are different degrees of internalization and one of the deepest tiers is identity level internalization, where information/skills/abilities become a part of who you are and can be accessed and expressed with as much ease as breathing, due to harnessing the automation of such skills that come when one's level reaches such a threshold of integration. What this means, is self-referencing, identity, and many other things are all system level functions with a purpose that is not to be discarded, because of some story of penultimate oneness people are chasing, but instead it is to be balanced and harmonized. Synergized, for continued expansion and evolution. I can see why a person might think that way, but if such a statement attempting to describe reality crossed my mental landscape, I'd be wary of attributing such a simple generalization to such a wide and deeply nuanced topic as connection/attachment. There are many different kinds of connection/attachment and there are many different kinds of ways to relate to different kinds of connection. Is it the attachment itself that causes suffering or the LOSS of connection that does? Is it really suffering we feel or does that label depend upon a multitude of other things, like abundance/diversity of other connections, individual levels of resiliency, chosen ways of relating to the connection and it's impact on our reality, and the meanings or stories we ascribe to it? How does the connection balance in contrast to other ones? Is it a connection that consumes and shrinks who we are or does it expand and nourish us? For me love isn't pure acceptance... acceptance is kind of meh, it's more comfort than love based when it comes to my personal feels. It helps with engendering ease and aiding flow, but that isn't always a constructive thing, because there are shitty patterns in the world that aren't worth accepting and internalizing, like depression patterns or forms of oppression and marginalization. Just like there are gasses and climates physically speaking that would kill me if I just passively accepted them and allowed them to connect and inter-mingle with my body's system. In my experience, intimate, deep-abiding love is a living thing nurtured and protected over time between people. With all due respect, I'd caution you to hold some space for your view of what unconditional love is until you've built that love over many years with another person in an intimate setting. I'm not trying to belittle you with that statement, but instead share with you the realizations I had that only came after I did experience such a thing myself after many years of devotion... I can feel connection and love with everyone, but it's nothing compared to the deep, intimate love that comes from my connection with my wife. They're both nice of course, but there is a difference and we can have both. @Raquel Our first show is up. I thought we did pretty good, it was a little rough and all over the place in some spots, but hopefully people liked it. If you give it a listen, please let me know what you think

I have watched Leo's video on the Netti Netti method as well as some of his other Enlightenment videos, and I haven't been practicing Netti-Netti yet because of this one hang-up that I'm having. How can I question the self if I already have the intellectual concept in my mind that, " Oh, well Leo and the others tell me that I'm pure awareness or nothingness detached from the identity of the ego- eternal, nondual, etc. etc." So when I'm doing it, that concept always comes up in my mind and I can't shake it. It feels like I can't genuinely question the self because whenever I start to question something such as the sense that I'm in my skull, it always goes something like this. " Am I somewhere in my skull?" " Well Leo said that I'm not because any sensation that you have is not there constantly, you are not aware of the sensation that you are the skull, so at that moment do you disappear?" " I guess not, it also seems like an illusion because it's the center of the senses, but we are not merely a collection of senses." " GAAH what's the point of going on? I already think that I'm nothing or awareness or some crap like that." I don't think that I can genuinely question myself because the conclusion is foregone. I mean, what else can I question other than my senses, my memories, and my mental processes? Or maybe I'm not questioning them deeply enough?

Free will vs Determinism debates have always been weird for me... No free will doesn't imply determinism, it's like forgetting about randomness and my simple theory goes: God is randomness in every direction, and the randomness creates random shit and we are one of that shit that that ball of randomness created. Hurray for randomness! Randomness is pretty hard to produce tho, like even computers can't create real randomness. (If they could, maybe we start looking at real super-AI and that's another story - maybe we get obliterated then) So randomness is everywhere around us and we have no idea how it works. It's an explosion in every direction in every dimension, it's a happening without a cause, because what can be more random! Even the almighty infinity, i.e. god, is probably created by randomness. We create more randomness by every little random decision we do as the captains of our ship (be it ignorant captains) and probably that is something God, being randomness, likes, because we enhance him :D(whatever we choose to do, that's why he always laughin at us, we try to be mean but we always work in his favour! Maybe maybe, who cares tho! x) ) . And then the other God, the boss God, 0, nothingness, will claim us again and we will happen again! If the 1 says so! We just dancing between 0 and infinity, or 0 and 1 - in both those ranges exist infinite amount of numbers inbetween!!!!! OMG!!! One of them is us! Then the gods 0 and 1 and 2 and infinity realize they r 1 god and heaven and hell, and you and me and everything else always exists and is part of this big ass axes (in all infinite dimensions) and then I realize I am rambling too much. And I then realize I do not care because the ppl in this thread say I have no free will so that means i can do whatever I want as the captain of my ship and they will be like he didnt do it! Dont blame the captain, he doesnt even exist. It's the ship that is doing everything on it's own, so why blame the captain. My ego goes unpunished. But don't worry, even the biggest ego doesn't exist if you look at it from the right angle! PS: I am the ignorant captain, I am pointing the way to a machine that I do not understand fully (at all) and I try constantly to take credit for what the machine is doing. Will write a book I feel inspired - or will the ship write the book and me just standing there as the captain showing it the way?? When the captain thinks he is the ship, he can't escape from it if it starts sinking!!!!!! Woah that was sick metaphor lol IMHO randomness stems from the mathematical fact that there are infinite amount of numbers between any 2 numbers, but we can pick and choose which numbers we see, or how far down we zoom and dare to dive into. Start imagining, in your mind going deeper and deeper, more and more numbers after the decimal point, and they keep on increasing and generating infinite amount of new numbers between each of the newly generated infinite amount of numbers - so tiny, but so many! Now think about the big numbers (maybe we are one of those big numbers, multiplications of infinities, growing, as all the other infinities that make us grow from the root stem). That's a hard task, generating all those numbers, isn't it. So The universe itself expands in every direction because at the smallest level, imaginary numbers are expanding as we speak. They can't stop, Change is always there, unless we stay on one number. at the deepest level, beyond what the scientist can see, I think we are expanding numbers, going infinitely deep. Creating infinite possibility. We are children of Mathematics! PS: Ego corner: -trust me i've won math competitions -trust me im a programmer x_x -trust me im not crazy, i just wanted to splash on my keyboard, because of randomness. TLDR: If you read it maybe you will think, oh, that's somewhat interesting if u think bout it - especially the last bit (IMHO), might explain the constant expansion of teh universe n shit.. Are we travelling between 0 and 1? Between Bajjilion and BajillionOne Between nothing and God?... I should stop myself man, before I write another page. ... I mean.... I should tell the crew to stop ship!

@Leo Gura Yes, I do switch my mind to the absolute nothingness. That's what i mean by being detached with "there is no you." That is always the best. Yes, for the most part, I totally agree. Btw, what was that shroom trip for? What were you trying to get a hint of experiencing? Divine love?

@Key Elements There's no you now. There's just an ever-changing flux of phenomena. Doesn't matter what the phenomena is from the point of view of absolute truth. Whether you're sipping a cup of coffee, floating through astral realms, visiting aliens via a DMT trip, meditating your ass off, or whatever, it's all just phenomena and none of it has any permanence. After the body dies, who the hell knows what might happen? But I would conservatively bet my money that it's the same thing as before you were born. Whatever stuff you cling to now, including your "soul" or any aspect of personality, identity, or being, will be gone. But Absolute Nothingness will remain. So it's a good idea to switch your identity to it, otherwise you're screwed.

Again Leo, you're assuming. How do you know that I have not experienced the infinite consciousness? Enlightenment experiences like these are very personal. Unless I say it...ok, here goes... I was one and a half. I saw / am the nothingness. How does this "feel?" Divine love and peace, like you described in your shroom trip when you were in the bathroom. Words can't even describe this properly. (Now comes 'coral stage.') This isn't the end of the story. Then, there was "blackness," the blackness of space. Then, a lot of sparks were all around me--tons of them--my stars. Then, I started condensing, leaving behind my stars, and was stretched out as if pulled through a blackhole. I was facing backwards when I was pulled through the blackhole. Then, I entered my body with massive, massive light. I saw it from a third person perspective. When I awoke, I was jolted up from my bed. I said, "Oh, I'm (my name) again!" Then, I went to the living room to play with my toys. That 'divine love' that you were describing on your trip didn't last long on me. If it happened naturally, it won't last long. That's why I didn't do the things that you did in your bathroom. The transition from no-self to earth realm is much better because it is done naturally. Anyway, my whole life, I just passed this off as a dream--I thought it was just a nice dream--until I met my friend. I described my "dream" to her. She decided to do a computerized Jyotish on me. She's an expert on this. Jyotish is Indian astrology based on the stars and planets. Then, one of the result was, she saw that the experience I had when I was 1 yrs old was recorded on my results. I was surprised. We didn't even call what happened to me an 'enlightenment experience.' Then Leo, I ran into your clips. You were talking about Ox's tail in one of them. Because of your info, I went to Shinzen Young's clips and I saw Riding the Ox Backwards. Yes, I was facing backwards in my experience. All this is cool and awesome, but what's the point to this whole thing? Number 1: Had I called my friend a "cult," "woo-woo," or a "religious whatever freak," she would have not been my friend and would not even bother doing Jyotish on me. It's complex. She's not just someone like you who keeps saying, "Oh, there's just the nothingness / everythingness." Why even bother to call someone weird names if you know she's a nice person? Number 2: What's the point of enlightenment experiences? Peace-cause that's what you experience at an extreme level. What to do here on earth? Align your life purpose with world peace. I can't think of a better mission / ripple effect. Number 3: This phenomenon we call "earth realm of awareness" based on nothingness/everythingness is weird enough to the mainstream. My point is, how do you know that after we die, we are not going to be some other phenomenon or dimension, even though we are aware that we are nothingness / everythingness? I'm not convinced that earth is the only dimension / phenomenon when there has been so many reports of people seeing their "dead" loved ones (including myself, I have witnessed). It's all in the branch of psychology called parapsychology. ....... Anyway, this is all great. The point is, be detached and do good in this world-world peace. Remember Leo, you made a world peace clip, Spiral Dynamics clip (Graves model ), and Radical Open-mindedness clip. Don't go against your words. Practice what you preach.

I just said in my above statement that the coral stage is still "maya" and "illusion." Psychologists put it like that for a reason. I'm not talking about no-self here. I'm talking about coral stage that's presented in the Graves model. So, no I'm not trying to conceptualize. Don't assume. I know that the map is not the territory. There are two different things I said there. I know that "there is no you," "no-ego," "no-self," "Riding the Ox Backwards," "nothingness/everythingness," etc, etc...This is talked about a lot in this forum and by you, and I couldn't agree more. That's not my point though. What if after "death," there is another "maya," "illusion," and "there is no you stage." Called stage coral in Graves model? Have you ever considered that as a possibility and as a direct experience of it? Check out parapsychology. It has to do with near death experiences and afterlives. It's your choice if you want to look into this or not. You did make a clip on Radical Open-mindedness. Why should we label something as "religion" or "cult" without checking them out with radical open-mindedness, but with a critical mind?

Role for what? They rob you of the illusion of roles or goals. There is a very large variety of direct consciousness experiences possible, whether using psychedelics or concentration practices. They range in usefulness for personal development from 0 to infinity. One psychedelic session could be more life-transforming that 10 years of therapy. Although that's not guaranteed. They go way beyond mere motivation. They can produce genuine enlightenment-like insights. For example you can become conscious that life and death are not real. Or that there is no such thing as a separate ego self. Enlightenment can be defined in various ways. A single enlightenment insight or experience is usually not enough to actually become enlightened. I tend to equate enlightenment with a permanent realization that what you are is Absolute Nothingness, and not the body, mind, or personal identity you presently believe you are. And for me enlightenment means that you no longer believe that what you really are can die, because your true nature transcends time, space, and existence.

If you go back to the beginning of "this" thread and see where it all started it doesn't look like Mathew was the first one to rub someone the wrong way here. I'm sure it was the days leading up to this event that got him banned without warning.I thought the guy might actually let a couple cats out the bag. I was excited. Now it's gonna go back to the same old nothingness. I could share a bunch of good links to some truth but I won't. I've watched 100's of videos and I finally think I got it all figured out.

@Ayla I know you have a degree in psychology and had enlightenment experiences. So, I'm just going to say this. I know you felt that peace aka 'divine love' going back into your body. If you see something other than everythingness / nothingness, that's a coral stage experience according to parapsychology. I know that perhaps someone like Leo is looking for a Riding the Ox Backwards type of experience (Shinzen Young talked about it.) where you are going back into your body facing backwards from the nothingness / everythingness. You get to see the coral stages of that experience too. You also feel that peaceful 'divine love' when you awake. All this is lovely and awesome! We get to learn a lot from this. We see clearly what is the fictional ego. However, we have to take it as a lesson and be detached from it. I know we can't keep on obsessing over this. This phase will pass and will always be remembered. What's the real lesson here? To align our life purpose with peace. Mission: to make a ripple effect toward world peace with our gifts/talents. Can you think of a better mission we can all have in common? We are all from the same consciousness after all. Beyond the coral stage is the nothingness / everythingness, no paradoxes, just 'divine love,' just no-self. We can't put a box around it like coral stage. We are all one. Btw..Shinzen Young just told the story in a metaphoric way. Maybe perhaps the story may sound too 'wooo' to most if he didn't? https://youtu.be/x8aN9O73lgg https://youtu.be/0PQonSiGkVE https://youtu.be/Ozca_5ifwQ0

I'm going to ask you a question. It's the only question you need on this journey. It's so obvious and simple, that the ego makes it into something other than it can handle. But I guarantee you, if you keep asking yourself this one question you will become free. The question is this: "Is there any happiness in chasing, or attending to objects?" Objects are everything that is not you. Anything you can perceive or conceive are objects. What is left is you. This is what these people cannot explain, because they do not know this teaching. Is there any happiness in worldly objects? Is there any happiness in subtle objects like thought, feeling, and perception? Ask yourself this during your day. Do it until it becomes obvious. Dont just say "no" there is no happiness in these things. Because just saying no will keep you dreaming. Inquire. Come to the absolute realization by your own experience that there is no fucking happiness in this fucking world, and this includes your feelings, thoughts and perceptions. That is all you need. Forget about nothingness, consciousness and being all that. As long as you can see you are not your thoughts, feelings, perceptions, experiences you will be able to see that there is a Self that is reaching out to those temporary things. The Self is you, your whole, complete, non-dual nature that needs nothing. When you seek, you suffer, when you understand that seeking causes suffering you will begin to just discard seeking objects. Objects one the most subtle level are your thoughts, feelings, perceptions. Letting go of all that is scary, but once you understand what enlightenment is, you will not want to go back to grabbing onto that shit anymore. And that shit includes your precious enlightenment experiences.

Saturday, 16/07/20 Enlightenment Work: 52 minutes of do nothing in the morning, 60 minutes of the guided (edited) neti neti meditation. As I was really trying to find the nothingness in the neti neti meditation and I failed. And later in that sitting after finishing the guided part, I realized that I want to reach Enlightenment too much, and this wanting/attachment prevents me from getting it or experiencing the nothingness. I need to let go of that and of everything else (like success and good grades in school), but that is hard. How should I do this? Life Purpose Work: I prioritized my values again and tried to figure out my new Zone of Genius, but this is hard. I don't know if the answers I am writing down at the work sheet are right... I wanted to code a little bit, but the Internet was gone. And coding without being able to search for solutions on the Internet is not so sensible. School Work: I summed up stuff for chemistry and wrote it down nicely. And I revised stochastic stuff for math and did a few exercises. I love math, but I hate probability stuff. Things I am grateful for: calling my best friend seeing how depended I am on having Internet access seeing that I am too attached Since yesterday evening our Internet and telephone connection was gone. So until this afternoon I only had Internet access on my phone and that was really slow. I had to do things where I don't need the Internet like school work or thinking about my life purpose. I also stopped procrastinating and started to edit the neti neti meditation. I wanted to do this for a long time, and finally I did it. I edited out of the audio file the stuff where Leo explains things about open-mindedness... which just annoyed me. And I added a few breaks with just silence where Leo is to fast for me.