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You stand infront of a cliff and think "I will die if I take one more step.", or you stand infront of a cliff and think not at all. Taking another step forward, which of these two states of consciousness captures the truth? Or in other words, what will happen once you step forward and fall down the cliff? It may very well be that the thought does not describe what will happen, or that the description itself is not really what will happen. But does the absence of thought hold any more truth? And wouldn't any investigation of truth within the mind always lead to nothingness, because the mind is inherintely uncapable of fabricating truth?

But as I said, all of these findings that you guys describe are completely explainable by rational means. You don't have a body, because whatever the mind thought the body was, was simply an expirience of the mind. As I said, everything is the expirience of the mind, from the perspective of the mind. If I look at a tree, whatever I expirience the tree to be is not really the tree. It's simply another expirience, an illusion. But that doesn't mean that whatever that I am refering to does not exist. We have zero access to the outer world whatsoever, not even a glimpse of it. We have so limited access to the outer world that infact, whatever we think the outer world to be is always part of the inner world. The inner world is everything we expirience, and I understand that. Even the "body" that we expirience as "body" is part of the inner world, so it's an illusion. But that doesn't mean that whatever the inner world is referring to as "body" doesn't exist at all. If it doesn't, go ahead and test it. Let's see if the body is an illusion after you cut off your arm. Let's see if "death" is an illusion once the expirience of your mind completely stops. I can recognize that we have no idea what the mind is. That we are completely clueless, and always will be, what exactly consciousness is, alteast in a conceptual manner. And yes, consciousness is the ONLY thing we have access to. But why do we assume that everything is consciousness? It's obvious that the mind will have the expirience of "everything" being "consciousness", because for the mind, everything in it's existance is consciousness. A good example is 5-MeO-DMT. I mean, 5-MeO-DMT is an illusion. It's simply a concept of the mind that is completely generated by the mind. But yet, once you take 5-MeO-DMT, you will alter the expirience of the mind is such a way that the structures that create the ego suddenly disappear. And once that happens, the mind has access to the entire expirience of itself, and that expirience is literally unlimited in every way imaginable. Previously the mind limited itself in a way to expirience itself in a specific way, but once you alter that, the entire reality of the mind alters. I mean, how can we just ignore that with rational means, the expirience of absolute infinity is easily explainable? There is no great mystery about it, it's simply how we know the mind works. Yes, we don't know what exactly the mind is, because the map is not the territory. But it's like you guys just say the territory doesn't truly exist, because after all all we have is the map. Yes, the map is part of the territory. The "expirience" is part of the territory. But the expirience is evidently not the territory itself. And with expirience I mean everything the mind could possibly expirience, even "infinity". My biggest question here I guess is, why can we trust the "expirience" just because it's everything we have? Why do we trust the expirience of enlightenment, or the direct expirience of god. How is that a good idea? I mean, look at us. Right now, for our mind, the ego is part of it's reality. But, you can alter the mind in a way where it becomes obvious that ego is just a structure. But then the mind thinks it's everything because you still expirience everything the mind is capable of expiriencing. Sure, nothingness is an expirience, but how does it apply to actual reality that we don't even expirience in any shape or form? I can have the expirience of nothingness, but I will still die of starvation if I don't eat. So, is "eating" not real? Is "hunger" not real? Yes, what we expirience as hunger or as starvation is not real, or rather it's just an expirience of the mind. But as I said, it doesn't change the facts whatsoever. I don't doubt for a second that if I take 5-MeO-DMT, whatever I think reality is right now will change in such a drastic way that I will be left with a completely different reality, so different that I can't even imagine that it's part of the mind. But what if, what if the mind is actually capable of generating an expirience of absolute infinity? And, isn't for the mind the expirience of absolute infinity nothing more but the expirience of it's own, entire reality? The problem I seem to have is that, right now I have a very specific feeling of reality, and yes, if the ego disappears I will suddenly realize that the mind is that expirience of reality. But what if that expirience of reality, of infinity, is just a fabrication of the mind? We can never proof that it isn't to ourselves, because the MIND is EVERYTHING we expirience.

@eskwire It was one of Leo's new insights, they are on the actualized site, first tab....this it was just as much of a mind-fuck for me as this roles thing because I'm one of those way too into symbols type people...lol.... @Nahm that might actually help...and I do like a good ceremonial burning release too!...is that more symbols? @Leo Gura, thank you, I think I have to read that a number of times to absorb it all, but the art reference alone clarifies! @Trond the potato reference is surprisingly helpful - to get this concept, I'm just not evolved enough to "believe" it yet... @aryberry Have you seen those musical instruments where you sing into a tube, and a layer of sand makes amazing geometric patterns? I can't remember what they are called just now, but I think you'd like them. (I am likely perpetuating the symbol significance here again) @Soulbass this is so true, on so many levels...and I know you are right...but I'm also so deep into the symbol and energetic thing...that book, as an object, although most beneficial when read....seems to me like it may still have an energetic/symbolic benefit based on it's history, composition, visuals on the cover, etc...I know, I'm terribly lost in "symbol", "underlying perceived meaning/ energy" crap...wanting to be more in reality, also wondering if I'd loose some wonderland beauty in life, and be left with dull nothingness ....but also trusting Leo is likely on to something, and my wonderland is probably only 1% of the real deal... @Whywolf Thanks so much! Yes, discerning is my like my greatest nemesis and my greatest teacher right now!

So every now and then I think about what I know about enlightenment, and my rational mind comes to the conclusion that it is entirely explainable with simple rational means. Of course, this will not keep me from investigating myself, but from time to time it creates confusion within me. So, when we look at the mind, or at my mind in particular, I can say that everything that exists and that I exist. But ironically, everything that I believe to exist, everything that from me is everything, solely exists within my mind. It cannot exist anywhere else. But of course, the mind creates a dualism within itself. It differentiates certain aspects of the expirience from others. For example, there is a very particular feeling when someone "else" is in the room. That other entity is a very specific expirience within the mind. Entity itself is an expirience. Now as far as I know, the path towards enlightenment is disassambling that very specific expirience, so the entity disappears and all that is left is the direct input of expirience meaning color, sound etc. But if I look at it from a rationalists perspective, all of it makes complete sense. The mind is a simulation of the brain. All of the mind, which is all of the expirience, happens nowhere else than in the brain. The irony here is that the mind itself thinks that the "outside world" exists, even though the outside world is simply part of the simulation. Everything the mind thinks exists is part of the simulation. So, one way to look at enlightenment would be simply disassembling the expirience of "I" and "something else", so that everything becomes I. In the moment that happens, the mind will believe that it is everything in existance. Because previously it wasn't aware of the fact that everything the mind thinks exists is part of the mind. That includes everything, the simulation of time and space, the simulation of object and subject, the simulation of nothingness and everything. All the mind is left to recognize is that infact, even the simulation of the mind itself is part of the simulation. So, of course the mind will first think believe it is god. God is everything, and because what the mind thought everything was, was now revealed as part of the mind, the mind is in the disbelief that it is infact everything. It is not just what previously was defined as "me", it is what previously was defined as anything whatsoever. But here comes the trap. The mind, from this perspective, is an isolated expirience. The fact that this is the case is that noone can be part of someone elses expirience. If that was truly possible, that we would have easily provided proof for that. But yet, there is noone on this entire planet that can access someone elses expirience. But here comes the confusion. Me, and I am kind of talking to myself here, is still operating within that simulation. So, I have no clue wether or not anything at all exists or not. The mind cannot be aware of anything outside of the mind. The illusion here though is that "revealing" the truth is nothing more than revealing another illusion. If I look at it from a rationalists perspective, someone saying that "He is god" or he is "Infinity" is completely explainable. Yes of course he is infinity, of course he is god. He is literally everything within his expirience. But, if the expirience of that person ends, that infinity is gone. God is gone. Everything that person thought or believed, or even expirience as "absolutely everything" is no gone, because inherently it was nothing more than his mind playing another trick on himself. The mind recognized that it was an simulation after all, and that it was able to alter itself. Infact, the mind is inherently nothing at all, it simply is what it is, the expirience itself. And as far as I can tell, I cannot explain even the most simply thing. I cannot explain the color red, or the sound of my fingers tapping on the keyboard. There is no explanation for that, because explanation is concept. But what I do know is that the mind is capable of anything. It can simulate absolutely everything. It can even simulate the expirience of absolutely everything. Infact, it is simulating that expirience at all times, because from the perspective of the mind, whatever is within the mind is absotutely everything. So, when Buddah sat down and discovered the true nature of the self, didn't his brain literally just discover that it was a simulation? That, the "me" is no different from what the mind thinks the "everything else" is. That infact, the "me" is nothing at all, because it is a simulation? That infact, everything in existance (within the mind) is nothing at all? Now, the confusion within me is mainly that I am trapped within the simulation, so everything I think is part of the simulation, even the rational explanation I just gave for the phenomena of enlightenment. And here comes the explanation for why people stop trusting rationality. Because once you realize that everything you believe is rational, there is no reason to trust rationality. Infact, how can you trust rationality if it is part of the mind. How can the mind possibly explain itself? But yet, every expirience that I have heard of so far is explainable with rational means. Unconditional love for example is the obvious choice of the mind for recognizing that all of the simulation is the mind. And of course, the mind likes to take care of itself, so it will love everything within it's simulation. But what if the mind lacks one step. What if the mind is not recognizing it's own limits? What if the mind is capable of simulating whatever we might belief to be "infinity", an expirience so incredibly that it completely transforms the mind, but yet the mind is uncapable of recognizing that even everything, or nothingness, is simply the mind. That, yes, whatever the mind thought was the "outside world" was infact part of the mind, but that what truly is the "outside world", will for the mind always be a mystery, because it inherenitely cannot access any of it. Yes, everything that enlightenment is still is true from the perspective of enlightenment. You are "everything" and yet "nothing at all". Infact, the "you" does not exist because it's simply the expirience. But what I fail to understand is why one takes the step further and says that "expirience" is everything that exists. I mean, what if it isn't? Yes, from the expirience perspective, everything is expirience, so obviously it will assume that everything is expirience, but what if the expirience is simply limited. What if whatever one beliefs to be everything is simply a very limited part of the true nature of reality, which the mind might not be able to access even on the most basic level. Yes, if I sit down and do enlightenment work, I will have the expirience of god and being everything and being nothing. But why do I assume that this expirience actually is everything and nothing? Yes, it might be a direct expirience of everything and nothing, but what if that direct expirience is an illusion? We cannot forget that the mind is capable of simulating EVERYTHING that we think exists. It is literally the simulation all of your entire reality, even the part that you think is not part of your reality. Literally everything that exists within or "outside" of you is your mind. But that doesn't change the fact that it might just be the mind, whatever we call the mind. We can call the mind god, of infinity, but what if it's not what the mind beliefs it is? What if the expirience does not correlate with actual reality, whatever that might be? I hope someone can understand my doubts. I know thinking is not the way to expirience truth, but what if thinking is the only thing that will keep me from "thinking" that infact expiriencing the "truth" is nothing more that expiriencing the truth of the mind, which is obviously that it is nothing at all, and that it is everything within the mind... If one has an expirience of infinity, isn't it simply the expirience of what the mind would think "infinity" is, or even what within the mind infinity is? I'm so confused.

Could you use affirmations to speed up this process? For example "I am nothingness". Could it be possible to program the false sense of self out of your mind this way? Proubably not since words are symbols.

@Telepresent Thanks for reminding . This is definitely something that has been bothering me a lot in life. I can sometimes see an incredible importance in something and a few hours later its all gone.. Not to mention the uncountable times I have laid in my bed before sleep and found things in my mind to be incredibly important, desparately trying to keep them in mind, even writing them down so I can remember in the morning, but even then, I read them and they dont seem as important afterall. I think I try to use emotions alot to remember or set myself back in the state I was but even that does not work. Now then, I have done a lot of reading today to eliminate some of my fear of ego-death. How I understand it I will not completely and forever be sucked into it if I reach it again during meditation. I think ego always comes back or "re-builds" itself unless we have been experiencing enough to understand it and unless we can keep the mindfull state of mind throughout the day, which requires lots of training i suppose. The existential fear from the first glimpse has somehow let me to think that if I let go again, a bit more, it would just "click" and I would never get my ego back. This thought is keeping me from trying again and bothers me alot as I want to try and stay a while in that nothingness without worrying never to be able to come back to my ego. I think its possible to go in and out of nothingness isnt it? And the ego dissolving is just the symptom of staying in nothingness for longer and seeing more and more how false it is, am I right?

Trying to chat with an enlightened person: Me: Hi, how are you? He: I'm nothingness and eternal. Me: So what are you doing these days? He: Practicing non-doing. Everything happens... Me: How do you do it? He: By not doing. Me: Easy job for you I guess? He: I'm not the doer, so can't say. Me: What's your plan for your coming birthday? He: I was never born. Me: Oh, btw I'm sorry to hear about your mother's death. He: There is no death. Me: Wtf? He: Look within for an answer to that. Me: Well, I'm outta here, see you later. He: Self cannot be seen, its the seer. Me: FU !$#^%#$%

Ok, so let's not forget about this. You know why? Becuase memory is going to make it a different thing that it was. So any thought you have about it or remembered sensation about it or remember idea about it will have swung and shifted. But a little while ago this seemed incredibly important to you. As little ago as a few hours ago. As a burning brand from someone who isn't there... you can't feel relation with that nothingness. Such is paradox

Background: I'm on the non duality path for 1.5 years I meditate, do self inqury, I read a lot and wached a lot of videos (Leo, rupert spira, mojiji, ramana, robert adams, nakad reality, gjurdieff, eckart tolle and others) I try to eat healthy, I do sports, evan wim hof breathing and cold baths Two-three years ago I've had panic attacks- anxiety but now I dont- I evan now hope to get them because I think this is an emotional outburst, a way to deal with the core ishue, the perfect moment to surrender, to let go, to meet your emotions etc. but no more panic attacks 4 me (because I don't feear them any more and I accapet reallity much more, and I learned a looooot from psyhology and non duality - so I'm equiped and relaxed) still here Is the problem: I've never had an emotional relase (like those folks on holotropic breathing (I've tyed that too,,,,, btw. I'am doing the wim hof course too-and no results) but i feel tightness in my chest, i feel there is some anxiety (similar to the period when i had panic attacks and took sometimes benzos (2-3 years ago but weeker -because I don't panic about the anxiety), I'm not totaly relaxed, i get tensed. Sometimes i have to go in a meditative state to relax it or to try to bring it forth, but then it just gets little bitt weaker and nothing... Now the question? Bonus: When I smoke marihuana I never get relaxed, just more tens, more nervous, the chest senzations get stronger, had evan two times panic attacks when smoking it 2) I have tinitus (sometimes it is related to the energy body-chackras-emotions so they say) Do you have some advice what should I do to relase those emotions or what ever it is? (it's some blockadge for my life- I know that) PS. I din't post this in emotional problems, because I'm fucking into this non duality thing, my most important life goal is to get enlightent ( I need to let go of this too-I know ), to know the truth, to experience nothingness and so on... still not there, maybe this is an step between ,,me from the point where I stand now" to the ,,truth"... soo that's it ???

The ego is a false illusion that you have identified with, its only function is to help you navigate through this physical reality. This is difficult to accept at first because this means you've been living a lie your entire life up until this point. Don't try to chase this state as you'll never reach it, your only function in this reality is to just be and enjoy whatever life has to offer you. The paradox is that Nothingness = Everything. Again. your mind is not going to grasp this so just practice mindfulness and be aware of the sensations going through your awareness and try to pinpoint where they are coming from. You are going to be confused for a while but that's part of the journey, this is a just game you created for yourself since you had nothing better to do. It may feel like you are dying at times but this is a process of rebirth This is one of my favorite quotes that I hope will help you "What the caterpillar calls the end, the rest of the world calls a butterfly." -Lao Tzu

@Leo Gura Thank you for replying Leo, Yesterday I thought the first glimpse is the hardest and that I now know how to get there easily. Well, I just meditated again and tried to get there. I knew how to reach out for it but I couldnt become it. Once I came near to becoming it, my heartrate increased, adrenaline, heavier breathing and existential anxiety kept me from becoming it. What you said makes perfect sense. Is there a better way to think of nothingess thats not so frightening? Maybe, oneness or something better that I can tell my ego? In the past I have always thought of enlightenment in a good way of being everything in nature. Now I just fear death. Of course I understand what my ego "did" there but I cant help it, of course. I dont want to "be gone"! I dont want to forget my ego. Its what has always kept me going in this world. Isnt it foolish to throw it all away? Its funny, Now I feel so much love for my ego. I had a hard time during the last couple of years (depression and anxiety) and I always tried to think back to times (mostly childhood) when I felt so much love for myself and the love of my parents. Those were the happiest times of my life so I always try to feed my ego with them to be able to live better. I thought that it was unconditional love but was it really that and does it matter? I see the paradoxes I think. But how do I put my trust in something that I dont know yet what it really is. The "teachers" say it is the true self, it all I am. How do I trust them? I guess it all comes down to: Realizing that ego is an illusion. (I guess I am not fully convinced yet) Digging deeper into the existential anxiety/terror that occurs close to becoming nothing. (Somehow it tells me there is something real about the nothingness that I am to become) Maybe I can try to concentrate on the things that in the past led me to believe ego is stupid. Maybe it helps if I read and understand more about what exactly happens in terms of existential terror when I chose to become it again and kind of foresee it so I am prepared to react and not helpless. I am quiet confused now. If anyone can help I would appreciate it.

I guess then really the question I am asking is. why is enlightenment not just an transcendent mask of ego? losing perception of a thing is only a lack of object permanence. What really is Ego but a sense of self - and what is nonduality but a sense of self? letting go doesn't cease the existence of the object - only the attachment to it. But both the Sage who speaks his mind shows he is attached by his insistence to share it - and the Sage who holds silent shows he is attached by adhering to the principal he imagines up to explain things away. Thought is not limited to words and images and sensation. Awareness is thought too. literal being is thought, as we can experience it. Experience itself is the ego - It has been recommended to be in the moment, to be aware of the direct experience without judgement without allowing the rational mind to rationalize the experience. I do not deny the inherent meaning in such an activity - but it is like in quantum mechanics - the measurement itself changes the existence. True existence is necessarily unknowable - because knowing AKA direct experience is limiting existence to a measurable state. awareness is our most authentic tool of measuring the world around us - but measurement itself is why duality "exists" = measurement itself results from the "influence" of ego. in a certain way, "true" or however you name it - enlightenment is in ceasing to be aware altogether. we cannot escape our existence - only transcend it - and to transcend it does not leave the existence behind in any way. that existence is still there. to return to the discussion at hand - we name certain thoughts and experiences. in this way we create duality. Both in asking if he glimpsed nothingness, and in answering - we all have forced the topic to be about somethingness. Nothingness cannot be remembered - and we cannot be aware of it. There would be no experience in nothingness - and no sensory input - no awareness - no consciousness - no body and no mind. Nothing that we can imagine* can be nothingness - we can't even look at it sideways with our periphery. I am not yet familiar with the neti-neti method. but any method is not nothingness. this is not to say that we are futile to attempt to pretend to glimpse at it - but instead the intention is to reveal the practicality in releasing the need to ask if we've got it. the answer will always be no. It is only something we learn from in pursuit of, but never something we reach - and if we believe we've reached it, we are fooling ourself by means of ego. *or be

Buddha does not use the words atma, atta - "self". He uses just the opposite words: “no-self” - anatma, anatta. He says that when mind ceases, there is no self left. You have become universal, you have overflowed the boundaries of the ego. You are pure space, uncontaminated by anything. You are just a mirror reflecting nothing. When thoughts cease, who are you? An utter emptiness, nothingness, no-thingness. It is because of this that Buddha has used a strange word. Nobody has ever done such a concept before, or since. The mystics have always used the word “self” for the interior-most core of your being. Buddha uses the word “no-self.”

@aryberry Infinity/Nothingness is NOT an experience. Ego ends forever after true enlightenment. It never existed. Life as you know it ends.

@Leo Gura why exactly, tho, is the whole enlightenment process not just another trick of the ego? experiences of nothingness, infinity, another being, not just a trick of ego? just as we can never prove the existence of physical matter because it all falls back to sensation. we cannot prove the existence of non duality because it all returns to the fact of our awareness being aware of everything but its direct self. awareness proves duality in the exact same way it denies duality. where am I even going with this question. I'm too asleep. peace, friend.

Well, try it again Everyone goes through different experiences during their practice. The neti-neti is meant to show you that you are not an experience (na+iti = not that). So then what are you? Of course, the experiencer. The experiencer is the nothingness behind all experiences. It is like that here and now. The next step is to see that you are the origin of all experiences, and the dichotomy of experience and experiencer is only an illusion.

@Bebop Thanks for replying Bebop, I am almost speachless. Its hard for me to believe that it was genuine, but then again there is no possible way I could truly explain it with words because I have never had it before. One thing that I am sure of is that I didnt try hard at all. I was almost bored by the parts of the video when Leo went through the different senses and thoughts. "Of course I am not taste, duhhh" Despite from other meditation sessions in which I tried so hard to grasp something that might enlighten me, today, I did not intend or think of an outcome like this in any way. After having that moment as confused and excited as I was, I almost didnt make it to the end of the video. The next thing I thought of was to ask about it in the forums. Then I cooked a meal. I didnt feel any different, just excited and mind blown. After eating, I am writing this now. I am scared to forget and doubt it. I am trying to write down as much as possible to remind myself. Somehow I already start to lose some of the memory of what it REALLY was like. It wasnt the question of who I am that kicked it off. During the session I asked myself many times without results who I am or who the observer is. First word perceiver had a huge impact on me to understand more and that something must be perceivinig. But the thing that kicked it off was the thought of nothingness, trying to imagine nothing and then without being able to grasp it, just trying to be it. Trying to be something that I had no idea of what it might be but it must somehow be perceiving everything. I wonder why I didnt feel/experience any relation with that nothingness, it felt completely foreign. And the fear was like an existential fear of being sucked into the nothingness, not ever being able to get out again. I think before trying to get to that nothingness again I might have to do some deeper research on peoples experiences and what happens next or else I will be too scared again and wont get any further than today. Edit: @Natasha Funny how in that exact moment you post the reply with the guide Thanks alot!

@Santhiphap Yes it sounds like you had a glimpse of nothingness. It's not an experience but rather what everything arises out of, your mind is not going to be able to grasp this. Keep going with it, ask yourself who is aware of the sensations

Hi, I just did the "Enlightenment Guided Inquiry - The Neti Neti Method" by Leo and I had an experience of that nothingness, or did I? At the moment in the video when Leo said I should just try to consider that I am nothing and I should now try to be that nothingness, something happened for a split second or even shorter: Some kind of feeling of nothingness evoked very strongly. It seemed like nothingness was expanding rapidly, followed by an immense fear and because of that strong fear the nothingness shrunk/contracted and disappeared. All this happened in less of a second I think and the fear was dissolving as well. Now I am questioning myself if that was some kind of imagination or hallucination. Everything else during the meditation felt like imagination but this short experience didnt feel like imagination. It just happened unvoluntarily. I cant really give more information except that now I have a very unclear picture in my head how it "looked" like in that moment. Just expanding and contracting blackness but no structures in it with which I could explain how I identified the expansion or contraction. It was more like a feeling than a picture. Whats weird is that I didnt understand/realized myself as being that nothingness. It just came over me like a frightening chill. Could someone with confirmed enlightenment experiences comment on this? Thank you.

I've just been heavily involved in the last year or two on the studies, meditation and practices of attaining the perspective of "not-self" and more recently "non-duality", which seem to be highly inter-linked from my understanding. I have learnt to apply a more sharper and heightened definition of the word "integrity" which seems to be a kind of glue to the concepts that can be directly applied to the practice to make the direct experience of 'not-self' and in particular 'non-duality' all the more real. So firstly, given the breadth of each of these subjects, let me outline what I mean to be clear by giving a short definition of what I'm specifically referring to, then it would be interested to hearing your thoughts: 1. not-self: the very fact that our awareness and perceptions within our awareness is an also all that makes us up human experience. Perceptions come and go and are continuously changing. Also, that we are neither an independent object of our awareness and perceptions. So, we are a bundle of experience that is not us but that we can't seperate from. 2. non-duality: our individual subjective experience is everything, yet nothing at the same time. Awareness is all encompassing for the 'self' but for awareness to exist, then outside awareness needs to exist, which is 'nothing'. This oneness with our perceptions, and the duality between a unified subjective experience and the 'nothingness' behind the scene, is the connection point that we all seem to share. It's impossible for unity or duality to explain the whole picture but taken in balance of egoic self referential agenda and the all pervasive nothingness that all of our awarenesses are embedded in, then we arrive at a complete picture. 3. Integrity: is an alignment between our "internal" and "external" world. If the divide between our internal and external world doesn't really exist given the existential framework of nothingness that it resides within and the fact that not-self asserts that there is really no external 'self' viewing the external world in the first place. So the one single reality exists for all of us must be aligned to satisfy both not-self and non-duality, given that there is a hard assertion that there isn't a divide in the first place! As a clearer example, this is clearly experienced when one practices 'mindfulness' or 'presence', when they concentrate on an object and then their inner world drops and they are just there with the object as one, but neither seperate or believing they are the object they are considering. So the reason as to why I see integrity as an important playing card in applying this approach, is because if you don't consider a private world to exist and there is complete harmony between one's perceived internal and external world, then one is more honest and at no disharmony with themselves and their environment, including others.

No, you are the body and mind wanting to become the field nothingness. That's the difference. Start by not wanting to read your own mind.

So if I'm not the body or mind but just a field of nothingness that is aware of the body and mind happening inside it, why am I not aware of other people's body and mind and thoughts and feelings like they were my own ego? This field of awareness is locked only to my ego somehow? Doesn't this field of nothingness stretch out into infinity and observe everything?

Good, so let's quickly cut to the chase by airing out some of the hidden assumptions in your reasoning. Do things really exist for YOU? Or do things simply exist? Do YOU hear sounds, or do sounds simply arise? Do YOU feel things, or do feelings simply arise? Are YOU bringing up images? What is that YOU? Are there really things, or simply arising sensations? Do things exist, or do amorphous sensations arise and pass away, having no constant existence? What actually exists for more than half a second? Anything? You say you exist in thought, but is that REALLY what you believe? Do you cease existing in between two thoughts? Keep exploring all these questions. This is the right track. But it will require much practice. Try to get REALLY clear about what you believe you are. Not ideas of "Nothingness" but REALLY! If we put a gun to your head, what is going to die? << That's more like it. All your ideas of nothingness are gonna REALLY hold you back. Drop them. Pretend like you've never heard anything about enlightenment, and then proceed with the self-inquiry.

to me experience means the recognition that something exists. I don't think I'm the perceiver perceiving the perceived. I experience that there is perception of these things.. that's all. "I" refers to "me" "awareness" "nothingness" whatever label you want to use. I realize that I do still identify that there is a me experiencing these things because I need a premise that explains the experience that's occurring right now. Your premise is based on that "I" don't exist. which I understand. but that doesn't deny that there still is experience happening regardless if there is someone behind it which of course enlightenment says there isn't. I'm looking to find out what is the source that even recognizes that something exists in the first place. that's the thing I'm interested in. which is nothingness. which I'm really trying to get to the bottom of even if there is no bottom to be found. Sorry if there's a lot of confusion.

So this is the first time I'm actually doing some self-inquiry, I have no idea what I'm doing but I've decided to journal to help me in this process because I just became really frustrated without it. I currently have no idea how to do self inquiry, but I'm going to figure it out. I'm looking for some tips on how to do self-inquiry, questioning my identity and who I believe I am, finding out who am I, literally, and I want to know what's true. I'm not looking for you to tell me that "dude you're awareness! you're aware of it all! " or "you're nothingness!" I understand all of those ideas, but I want to experience awareness and nothingness for what it ACTUALLY truly is in direct experience. that's all I want, I just want the truth with the ultimate intent of living with an accurate perception of reality. and who I truly am. this is my first inquiry --> "What exists for me? I can feel things on my body, sensations, I can hear sounds, I can see objects from my eyes. What else? I can hear thoughts that I have no idea what they are or where they are located, they’re just there. I can bring up images that I have no idea what they are or where they are located, they’re just there. Anything else? No. this is all that exists for me. What are these things? I have no fucking clue, I just know that they exist and that there is an experience of them. Where do I exist? Take a guess. I exist in thoughts again I have no idea what they are or where they are located, they’re just there. I’m labeling them thoughts because I need something to ground me in this work. What is a thought? Truly? It’s an experience. What is an experience? The recognition that something exists. What exists and doesn’t exist? What exists is something that I can perceive or notice, whatever label I want to use here. What doesn’t exist is what I can’t perceive and what I can’t notice again whatever label I want to use here. So what am I? “I” am a label created inside an experience." I'm just looking for some tips and maybe a little guidance in this process and maybe how others do self inquiry, how you started, how you progressed, Thanks.