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You can skip all but tell me, is Jed McKenna’s description of enlightenment is how enlightenment actually is????? Is that as dark as he describes? And how would you describe it in a literal way? I really like Jed’s writing and I’m not exposing or rejecting him by any means, on the contrary I do believe in what he says coz he sounds very reliable and he really removes some fairy tales, but I don’t know what to think about it, probably I’m not getting something but I feel like Jed’s description of enlightenment is somehow different from others’ including Leo’s. And I get that enlightenment is not all nice but a bittersweet pill where bittersweetness is not a problem. But in Jed’s description of Truth, Truth is sorta very ‘dark’ and doesn’t look like something natural. As I understood ‘enlightenment’, before reading Jed, was something like ‘feeling of borderlessness and oneness with everything beyond your body’, and ‘feeling as if you are child who knows nothing again’, and peace and staff like that. But Jed doesn’t seem to talk about that at all, and please correct me if I’m wrong but these are how he seems to perceive the world: 1. There is no feeling of connection and oneness but rather total isolation in infinite cosmos. 2. He feels that people are not real or alive, but rather not more alive than a stone. But shouldn’t everything start to feel more lively instead ??? 3. Overall he doesn’t seem to feel bliss and peace etc.. but rather emptiness. 4. Total nihilism. This nihilism as I see it should turn into something like seeing beauty in everything without need for meaning, but Jed seem to miss all this meaning since he does emphasise meaningless life so much. Yes life’s meaningless but if you can’t shut up about it, it seems like you want some meaning? And Jed seems to want some meaning. Maybe I’m wrong 5. In the end of the day, he suggests against pursuing enlightenment but rather to be sensible adult and enjoy positive aspects of life coz after enlightenment you cannot enjoy ‘positive’ things of this world anymore because no more good and bad dichotomy. Jed talks how watching movies has no emotional triggers anymore, so does people in real life who looks like soap opera characters. But how can one enjoy beauty in life or in arts while for example watching movies where whole point to connect to story and ‘be involved’ in this story for 90mins? Isn’t that the whole point of art, connection and aesthetics? How to feel this life to the fullest if ‘your existence’ become observer-like and not participator-like? 6. He doesn’t seem to think that enlightenment is your natural state of being. And I always thought that enlightenment is a state in which any living body SHOULD live naturally and only because of unnatural bug in ego we do not live in it. This question really bothers me, if kids and animals are really enlightened, it then has to be natural for us, but some gurus seem to say that it is not something that everyone need or should have in their life. ? 7. Also he says that enlightenment always require conscious intention, it cannot happen spontaneously. But how about Tolle, Sadhguru and many others who didnt pursue it, but it just happened to them without intention? 8. Has to do with personality? Coz some enlightened people (like Rupert Spira, Sadhguru and Tolle) constantly talk about joy and peace and staff like that, while Jed sort of emphasises harsh reality. So might it be that enlightenment will lead to different ‘mood outcomes’ for different personalities? Jed seemed to describe himself as pessimistic anti-social type guy prior, and did enlightenment just increase these characteristics in him? I don’t get it tbh. 9. I like his straightforwardness and description of non-duality though, but he made me to doubt if I really want to pursue this. I already feel constantly disconnected and empty, its hard for me to find meaning in anything and to have passion or purpose, and everyone already seems unreal and fake, and there’s not much joy in me anyway And If I got McKenna right, all of that will just skyrocket towards infinity for enlightened person but it’s no longer problem, except that it’s not because of nice peace but rather coz of some nice emptiness. I mean all of that is not what I felt in ‘unconsciously enlightened childhood’, childhood was nice happy-magical times, definitely unconscious ‘oneness’, and I thought enlightenment is something like early childhood. I’m sure I’m not getting something. But if so, how would you describe your own state of enlightenment, not in a poetic way but as literal as possible?

You can not become happy...your very nature is happiness, bliss, and joy. Happiness is something you are, when you are not making yourself miserable. So the trick is to clearly see how you are making yourself suffer and miserable...and cease doing that to yourself. Also, you might want to actively find joy through appreciation for what-is now and whatever is happening. Appreciation makes joy and happiness much easier to feel. The alternative is not to feel numb to life...just live in joy and happiness. A happiness that does not depend on anything. But this is a bandage only, because you feel shitty and suffer because you believe you are this fictitious "me". Realizing the happiness that dos not depend on anything will not occur as long as you believe you are this illusory "me". The "me" will always have problems and create misery for itself. In a way, it is problems and misery that strengthen the illusion of the "me" and sustain it. What are you...really? Inquire and delve into who you think you are...and see you are not that. At the same time and in the mean time, appreciate as much as you can all of the time. I will conclude that there is a bit of truth in your last question - "do I become happy by not having the need to be happy?" If you need/insist that you never feel pain, never experience unfortunately circumstances, etc...then you won't be happy. The trick is not needing things to always be pleasant.

In this thread, we share and discuss some of the weirdest and most bizarre experiences you've had on psychedelics. What I'm interested specifically are all the experiences that could not be summed up to just "took psychedelics, got ego death" kinda experiences (although they are obviously very profound), but that is not exactly the topic here.To illustrate, I'll share a few of my own stories. 200uq LSD and 10g of (weak) magic mushrooms I lied on a sofa, staring at the ceiling. Suddenly, as well as on the sofa, I was on the ceiling looking at myself. I was now simultaneously two versions of myself, on the ceiling and one on the sofa and I did not know which one I was. This lasted under 10 seconds and then I snapped out of it. On the same trip, I suddenly realized that if I stop walking and moving I wont remember who I was, what I was doing, where I was, or anything. I was walking in circles contemplating what I should do, until I realized that this is just fear in action and I stopped and closed my eyes. At that instant, just as I thought, I forgot who I was, where I was in space (lying, standing, sitting), and what lead me to that situation. In my visuals, I was violently being pulled into a wormhole of some kind, and then suddenly a massive sense of infinity hit me, and I opened my eyes because I was just so baffled out of my mind. I would not sum it up as an ego death, It was something else, as I was not left with any insight into myself really. It was a touch of space and eternity. A side note, I would not recommend combining LSD and mushrooms to anyone: you go as they say, completely bonkers. People who do them together are drawn to doing them together and don't need a recommendation. 350uq LSD I was peaking hard and my focus was suddenly being pulled intensely on a particular spot on the wall. Then I switched my gaze upon that spot, and the view behind my window. Suddenly I was hit with this immense non-verbal feeling of "nothing is really inside anything" and at that moment, I became my consciousness. My heart was pounding and I felt a strange pressure around my chest. Tears started to flow like waterfalls, yet I had no emotions except for a huge "OH. MY. GOD." -feeling. I felt as I saw everything for the first time. I could hear my fast paced breathing and pulse, but I was not inside my head anymore, my body was like another piece of furniture, an unrelated object. I was a point of consciousness, levitating in the air. My eyes were not seeing, seeing happened and I had no eyes. This lasted for about 45 seconds, and then it faded away. I spent the whole evening thinking what the FOX (see, don't always have to curse) just happened. I came to the conclusion that It was not an enlightenment experience, it was something else, a very TRUE state of perceiving the space around me. 15g of (semi weak) mushrooms and 5g harmala This is a short, but a beautiful one. I was meditating and peaking quite hard. I was on about 40min mark of my meditation, and I was in a trance that made my whole body feel like I'm a statue. Then a sudden insight hit me: This here, is it. I can do absolutely nothing, in my mind or otherwise, to be more me than I already am. This is what my being is. This insight was related to problems/frustration around self-inquiry that I had pondered for some time. The most biggest, dumbest smile was all over my face, and a warm sweet wave of insight euphoria hit my body and I felt a strong sense of completion, wholeness and bliss. I meditated some more after that, and then i got up. And after that, I became, in my mind, a pirate - - - These kinds of non-enlightenment experiences are to me, deeply interesting and profound. As enlightenment, they seem to happen very randomly and unexpectedly, I don't experience something like the examples above on every trip, even on similar doses. They are something that really can be accessed only on psychedelics, they carry with them an immense sense of reality and unreality, mixed together into this brew of experience that defies language, logic and intuition. They are not exactly as "useful" or pursue-worth as a genuine awakening, but nevertheless, very very deep and profound.

@Monkey-man I'm a fan of McKenna's writing, and of spiritual autolysis, but I fully understand where these concerns are coming from. I wonder whether, if someone's only exposure to enlightenment theory was through McKenna, would they be in massive trouble. As it stands I find him to be a valuable point on one end of a spectrum, with (for example) someone like Matt Khan at the other. I think the important thing to remember is that any teacher can only talk about enlightenment from their own limited human perspective. And it seems like McKenna - if he is enlightened - had a very rocky journey to get there and this informs his human perspective. However, I also think a lot of his writing is in fact very subtle, and it can be easy to misunderstand him. He has a particular sense of humour and mode of communication that can make things seem darker than (I think at least) they are. And I think he does this on purpose. Why? Hmm, let's look at your questions: 1) Read again but pay attention to his descriptions of 'the universe'. Remember he writes from a human perspective; when he does take time to talk about the universe, he alludes to a profound connectedness, gratitude, and trust. The isolation is from the ego perspective, and this is what he comes back to again and again: when he says "you don't want this", he is talking to the ego, the fictional character. Not the truth. 2) Maybe I'm forgetting something, but his most direct description of other people is "like children", or "half-awake, half-asleep". Which again is all about people being run by ego. But I'll be cute with your point and say you can reverse it and say that a stone is as alive as a person. That's a very Jed thing to do. 3) Hmm, maybe. Maybe not. Consider that he's trying to cut through the 'bliss' narrative because he sees that as more delusional food for the ego. Go back and read the first chapter of Damndest, at the feeling he describes reading the Gita. Look at his discussion of 'agape' (don't know if I mis-spelled that) during the interview with Julie. In Incorrect he tells Curtis his living reality is one of contentment. There's more going on that he's only willing to allude to, not directly state - I suspect because he sees 'bliss' as crack for the ego and really wants to break past that concept. 4) Interesting thought. In terms of meaning, certainly he talks about the human having certain 'rights and wrongs' hardwired into it. Maybe his 'ego-costume' still seeks meaning? However, regarding beauty, look at some of Julie's later writings in Incorrect, and remember there IS no Julie: this is Jed describing to us his own process and shifting perspective. Pay attention to when she talks about the beauty of things she used to hate. Remember when he says that Ahab is missing a key characteristic: intense joy. 5) He does say to pursue adulthood unless you 'absolutely have to' pursue enlightenment. It reminds me of Steve Norquist saying "you don't want this". In both cases they are talking to the ego, and making the point that the desires and goals of the ego may not be compatible with enlightenment. And if you lose any belief in right and wrong, good and bad, suddenly the dream might not look so bad, right? Why not stay in it and enjoy it while you can? The question of audience is very important here, and is addressed in Incorrect (both in the 'review' at the front, and when he talks to Curtis about criticism). He is making a very clear distinction here that, if you are looking to enlightenment because you think it's going to enhance the life you are already living (i.e. if EGO is pursuing enlightenment to help EGO's ends), maybe the end of ego is not, in fact, what you are looking for. I think this is actually a very important point to contemplate for a while, and yes it can be a painful one: WHY are you doing this, and HOW MUCH are you willing to allow to change in your life if that is what is really required? If you're looking to enhance the life you have, is killing yourself really the way to do that? Also I'll point out he clearly loves poetry, and in some of the bonus material spends some time describing how he loves delving into art and music. 6) This entirely depends upon which 'you' we are talking about. But remember the simple razor he uses: whatever is, is right. He describes humanity in belittling terms at times, like children, so certainly doesn't seem to see ego bound reality as 'best' or anything. I don't think it's so much that he sees enlightenment as not the 'natural' state - but certainly not the natural state for the character/ego/human, which is so often who he is addressing. 7) I think he's either wrong here, or knows he isn't (he does say "what isn't possible in a dream?") but is trying to push people into action rather than waiting or relying on the zen "bam" factor. Hard to tell - perhaps he's overly reliant on his own process. But I suspect it's a call to action. 8) I think it's a combination of personality and intent. He doesn't seem willing to indulge people's ego-fantasies about enlightenment. He wants to cut straight to the core and not allow a moment's breath to stop and look at anything that the ego might grab and go "ooh, I like that". And I think it leads to books that are rather hyperbolic at times; which can only allude to deeper truths - but the hints are there. The thing about these books is they don't leave you anything to believe, really, except the falseness of the ego and ego world, which of course comes over as depressing and nihilistic to the ego. They're not books you can read once and believe and think "that's nice". They need intense scrutiny and an extremely discerning eye, they need to be pulled apart to be understood, and they need to be compared with other perspectives. I find it very interesting to compare what McKenna says against what Adyashanti says. They're actually not all that different. 9) Contemplate, and choose what you feel is right! I've had moments like you describe and I've always been drawn back, and whenever I have I've realised that what dissuaded me was an idea I had generated, nothing more. Have a look at what you've been imagining enlightenment to be, and look at what the consensus is between those who purport to be enlightened, and go from there! I hope some of that helped!

Savanna scatters and the seabird sings So why should we fear what travel brings? What were we hoping to get out of this? Some kind of momentary bliss? I waited for Something, and Something died So I waited for Nothing, and Nothing arrived It's our dearest ally, it's our closest friend It's our darkest blackout, it's our final end My dear sweet Nothing, let's start a new From here all in is just me and you I waited for Something and Something died So I waited for Nothing, and Nothing arrived Well I guess it's over, I guess it's begun It's a losers' table, but we've already won It's a funny battle, it's a constant game I guess I was busy when Nothing came I guess I was busy (when Nothing arrived) I guess I was busy (when Nothing arrived) I guess I was busy (when Nothing arrived) I guess I was busy (when Nothing arrived) I guess I was busy (when Nothing arrived) I waited for Something and Something died So I waited for Nothing, and Nothing arrived I waited for Something and Something died So I waited for Nothing, and Nothing arrived Category - Enlightenment & Meditation I picture the "nothing" in this song, as nothingness. It just inspires me since it really drives some deep points home if you actually view nothing in here, as nothingness, the no-"thing" that you are. Basically, he waits for some thing, and always chases after things. But then there is this nothingness, which is always there, yet he was always busy chasing after things while totally overlooking what already was there, nothing(ness).

@How to be wise There is some goodthings... a very good thing is the love and bliss at the end of the process (I can imagine) - strong bodily orgasm-like sensations - feelings of relief - finding resolution for lifelong problems and finally allowing the letting go to happen -very strong boost in your intuitive abilities - you get pretty good at manifesting what you want... because you begin being in alingment with reality, and what you want will be the same thing reality is going to put in front of you whether you like it or not > In ex. one of my personal experiecnes is that I really wanted to travel to Canada during the summer into nature, and the perfect opportunity presented itself. Now, the experience was much less pleasant than I thought because it was there for my highest evolution and not to have a vaccation from my growth but still xD... - you start seeing what people need, and you intuitively fulfill these things for them And again, this is just a start, I am 2 and some years into kundalini awakening, and its no longer the hell it used to be in the beginning, the first year was the worst... but I survived it (gotta give myself a high-five for that, cuz not only I survived it, but I managed to stay in university through that entire period... damnit good job me!). Most people report (after their kundalini integrates) ability to transmite source-energy, or pressence, (give shaktipath if you will)... which I can imagine can feel quite nice realizing youre unleashing the grace of god onto another :-)

This is typical dark night of the soul stuff and is unavoidable for serious progress. Congratulations on your progress! The rule is: It gets worse before it gets better... Always. Are you willing to swallow the "worse" period? That is the question. Damn right it is. Im sorry for your pain. May you be blessed with joy bliss extasy and love. The rule of the thumb is that noone who achieved full enlightenment is gonna tell you: "Oh I felt ok for a long period of time and then I gont enlightened." Hell no! Its more like "Yeah I felt terror, was pretty sure I was insane for a few years, I could barely function and then my redemption dawned." The human unconsciousness is real. The human pain is real. Very real. There is only one question. Are you willing to take it?

@AleksM ‘dualistic reality’ , “me & you”, objectivity, and the definitions written & words said therein, are illusory. Reality can’t be defined because there is no one to define it to. Is reality experienced....no...no one to experience anything...no distinctions to be experienced. Same situation. It is. @Monkey-man reality is absolutely real. Illusion is an illusion. Life is not real. Life & death are dualistic illusion. Neither exists, and each only has meaning contingent on the assumption of the other having meaning. Neither actually have meaning. Neither are true. When you see you are not alive, you see you don’t die. Like all words are contingent on the “meaning” of other words, so is it with the very ‘air’ you “breathe”. Living in an illusion we think is reality blows. “Living” in an illusion we know is an illusion is pretty sweet. Being in reality is bliss. The word freedom immediately reveals a lack of freedom, a veil. There is no word in actual freedom.

Everything starts with a vision, what isa good way to come up with a great vision? Many people in the past have what seems to me a Hugh sense of accomplishment by living their visions, or can we say by converting their visions to reality, Nickola Tesla comes to mind, Leo Gura comes to mind, it seems like when you truely know amd share your gifts in the world you contribute to society through your work you are living life to the fullest. My main focus now in this work is finding that one thing... I have a doubt that positive psychology itself has the power to transform the world, however I don't have a vision for the world, I have a vision for myself... I once read that leadership starts with self leadership... So all I'm going to do is follow my bliss and actually start talking action.... Self Actualization is a part of positive psychology.... And to act is really important... So whats my vision for self actulization? To master master mindfulness. To experience all of reality as it is... To live a life where money is never a problem ever again... To have amazing sex.. To have a life purpose, an impact statement, to complete the life purpose course in its entirety.. To travel the world experience the beauty of nature.. To master my emotions...

Let's get one thing straight I am not my father and I didn't say that I thought life was all about suffering. I'm just thinking of ways people can come up with to end suffering. I myself am very disappointed in my father for a number of reasons. He made a lot of promises to me that he ended up breaking and lives life like a robot just going through the motions. I remember as a kid that I had hopes and dreams and in one moment in my life I was in a very dark and displeasing place. I was going through some severe depression but, I got over it. The question is though how do I make sure something like that doesn't happen again if I could help it. Some things our out of our control like tornadoes and earthquakes. Although the things that are in our control like raising children sometimes people do a really terrible job that leads to extremely terrible outcomes. You need to ask those questions on why my dad put me into this world to him not to me. I don't plan on having any children myself in fact if anything I am planning on adopting and becoming a voice for people who are suffering and people who need help. Of course there are many amazing and interesting things to do in this world where we find happiness and bliss but, I don't think it gives people the right to neglect people who are suffering. Case and point I'm sure that when all the Jews were suffering in the concentration camps the Nazis and their collaborators were having a good time. I'm sure that while some people live in their mega mansions and use up all the worlds resources they are as happy as can be while other people starve. I'm not saying I have a solution I'm just saying I ponder these things from time to time. Speaking of the world blowing up it has happened before in Japan and all it takes is one psycho to end the lives of unsuspecting people especially when they are in bliss and having a good time like that shooter in Las Vegas who killed those concert goers. The way you responded to my post shows a lot of strong emotions. I think a better idea is instead to really think about what I said and think about this in a more non-egoic and non-emotional way. I am currently studying a book called Political Ponerology that talks about the origins of psychopathy and such. It talks about how people who have no conscience get into positions of power and from there they mess everyone else's psyche up as well and cause irreparable amounts of suffering to thousands and in some cases millions of people. I think that humanities best bet is to stop these psychopathic people as best we can to create a society with less suffering. Immunize ourselves from these psychos.

If your father is convinced that life sucks and it's all about suffering. Why did he put you on this world, and just end his life already? Let's put it broader, if everyone's life is all about suffering. Why haven't we come to a consensus to just blow up the world and end all the suffering? That would be the most noble and logical thing to do. Like a dog with terminal cancer that got hit by a truck while trying to pass the road. It's only compassionate to end its life, without much pain. But do you think life is really about that? Do you think we are all sick dogs that secretly want to put down to end all the misery? Maybe you do think that. But that says something about your own current state of mind. Remember when you were a kid and you had fun all the time. Just exploring, discovering and creating. And when you fell and you bruised your knee; you cried for a bit, wiped your tears and then you went right back to exploring, discovering and creating. Life can be that way as an adult too. Joyful, without worry. Like Ramana said; retrace your steps back to your source and you will find the bliss again.

Most welcome, you'd be surprised how much something very small could shape and direct your trip in a whole new way, psychedelics in general is like amplifying all your senses multiple times or more, i remember once on LSD i decided to drink one beer and it felt like i stepped into a new more denser/darker world just from a single beer, my friends did not notice this, i guess i am much more sensitive but i did or another example would be when i was feeling really good and eating/living very clean and had LSD that lead to the one of the most amazing experiences of my life and i felt like every cell in my body was vibrating infinite orgasms of eternal bliss. After that i was in an afterglow-like state for 2-3months as it almost felt like it kicked my initial awakening back up in gear All the best, Safe Journeys!

David Spero, love this guy bio http://www.davidspero.org/about-david-spero What I like specifically is the embodiment of the teaching being presented in such a fun alive character, being inclusive of not just non-dual realization, but the that vibrant aspect is also acknowledged as very valid, as well as the devotional aspect. Which brings a nice trilogy of the path, through silence - energy - devotion. So there is meditation, embodied passionate living and embodied emotional openness/devotion. For me it's very inspiring and reassuring to see such an evidently bright character that speaks about the truth of embodied bliss for over 10 years now, showing the same clarity, certainty and presence in his being and eyes, showing that this is indeed very real and lasting. I find all beautiful to watch, to me this human expression is pure art but here are some of my favorites

@LaucherJunge I was thinking like this yesterday after doing that, I said to myself that maybe my consciousness level is not that much there yet to experience such a bliss as @heisenburger had.. But interestingly today I'm in a very different state whole day long. I enjoyed the reflection of the sunshine on the walls, sensing the wind from the gentle motion of the branches.. I haven't done a trip yet, but when the last time this type of sensation occurred in my perception was when I was testing a very low dose lsd. I'm in such a happy blissful mode for no good reason than yesterday's practice. But yesterday, it was heavy sensation on me till I sleep. @heisenburger I'll check it again, I heard others on this forum recommending it too, but this time, this explanatory vid for the challenge was the first one that I was more interested in. Thank you though very much. I'll keep doing this exercise on a daily basis. (I mean not 2h everyday -yet- ... but!... at the end of the day if you wanna become an addict, let it be to happiness, isn't it)

unconsciousness sucks. I notice my need to be right all the time, going all the way back to the school days. Now that I know there's no way my family could understand the work I'm doing, I have imaginary dialogues in my head with them, where they object me and I put them in their place with an air of superiority. The result is resentment towards them and their unconscious ways. Why do you resent them? Because they're unconscious and they don't realize it. They're not living up to their full potential, and it bothers me. Perhaps I'm a little angry at myself too for not living up to my full potential in the past and present. Why should humans strive to live up to their full potential? Because that's what life is all about! It's the hero's journey! The journey to integrate and transcend yourself! And nobody fucking realizes it! Everyone lives a fucking mediocre unconscious life because they avoid themselves and their emotions! All of our problems have to do with this one issue! I want to fucking slap everyone on the back of the head and tell them to WAKE THE FUCK UP! Lordy lord, aren't you feisty. So you believe that unconsciousness is bad. Where did you get this idea from? None other than Leo himself. Well, not really. He never said that explicitly, but I extrapolated it. But after a few years of this work, I see so clearly that it's true. Unconsciousness is a huge root cause of all of our problems. That's baaaaaad. I should cram my megaphone in unconscious people's ears. Can you absolutely know this is true? No, not really. Bad relative to what? And what does it mean to be unconscious? It just means, unaware of what you're doing. When you're unaware of what you're doing, you're unable to see how you sabotage yourself and get stuck. If you're trying to get unstuck, unconsciousness is bad. But in the existential sense, there's no inherent badness to being unaware. You're just fucking unaware.... How do you react when you believe that unconsciousness is bad? ....and you cause all of the world's problems! By sitting on your damn plastic couch eating your damn plastic cheetoes fogging your fucking brain and wasting your life, you're not only doing yourself a disservice, but you're doing the world at large a disservice by catering to your emotional weasel, you fucking twat!!! I get all oo-ra-ra and pissed off. Almost like a religious fanatic. Who would you be without that belief? I'd be...well, definitely more compassionate, that's for sure. Probably kind of lost too, because self-actualization seems to be my anchor. The thing that keeps me waking up in the morning and moving in a clear direction. It's invigorating and worthwhile to live for. Without that, I don't know what I'd do. Probably fall back into old unconscious ways. I'm kind of afraid of unconsciousness. Seems like I fear unconsciousness just as much as I want to self-actualize. What if unconsciousness is good? Fuck, unconsciousness is good? No way! Well, actually... If you want to live an easy, safe, comfortable existence If you want to have at least some happiness, sometimes If "ignorance is bliss" is your motto If you want to be in the herd Then I suppose unconsciousness would be good. But I can give a million-and-one different reasons why unconsciousness would be bad. I shall continue to hold my belief like a religious fanatic. Sigh...We'll have to work with this some more.

If you TRULLY want a risky career, you can try Poker ? The centering in the present moment and all spiritual practices turn the already beautiful game of Poker into Gold. It's a beautiful dance. It feels like I am playing with cheat codes, when I can just recede in myself and experience bliss while I perceive others are getting bored on the table and play way more hands than they should - making mistakes. In the toughest situations self inquiry and meditation have helped me remain calm and collected no matter what - no matter if I lose big. Instead of getting angry, i go deeper within. I bet this has made a big difference in my performance. Beautiful place to do both money and spiritual practice all at once. But you need to have experience in poker to be good.

I attended a ayuascha retreat two months ago in Sweden. Three nights of ayuascha and one bufo ceremony. Ayuascha was pretty lame, don't get the hype at al. No mindfuck components like lsd, just nausea and some colours while eyes closed. The bufo experience was amazing. Such a beautiful ceremony with al the lovely people welcoming us back after the infinity. Can't even imagine how you can take this alone at home. I've never been so nervous before in my whole life, so it was so important for me to have people around, and after with the integration. I don't remember the first part of the trip, just the OOM sound that got higher and higher and then I was just gone. I came back 5 minutes later, had the worst panic attack you can imagine. Thought I was going to stay at a mental hospital for the rest of my life, it was just to much. But I surrender after a while, and omg that feeling. Everything was just stil and silent, felt like mdma x infinity. I was in that state in 10 minutes. After that I felt some anxiety, and thought like "I'm not gonna do more spiritual and enlightenment work, it too scary " . These thoughts stay with me for maybe half an hour. Now, 2 mounts later I'm more motivated to do this work then ever. The first time after the retreat it was hard to really grasp the significance of the experience. But it has growing on my everyday. My meditation practice has gone through the roof. I can go really deep now . I've felt that feeling after I surrendered a couple of times. It's scary as fuck. The first time I felt it I almost had a panic atack. But this morning I stayed in the infinity feeling for maybe 30 seconds and it was so beautiful. Total bliss. How has your meditation practice evolved since 5meo?

Eversince my 2 very foundational LSD trips in this years spring I feel completely transformed, in the sense that having this awakening experience but not yet being "enlightened" leaves emotional scars, as it seems to me. I often have these thoughts of being "the only aware" entity in this world, but also I (conceptually) know that this again is just an illusion and solpisism not quite where I want to be with this work. Also this bring this very depressive and lonely vibe to my spiritual work, even though it is "supposed" to be or lead to bliss. I know this sounds like something an egotistical self would say, but my question is, how to overcome this phase? There certainly is something big I'm missing.

Of course! Extreme bliss and love for the divine, while tears of joy and happiness and a sense of freedom. The self is beautiful

Perhaps because you have too much expectations what one is like when putting many hours a day meditating. As long as there is an ego this is what it is. I can be all day in a sea of bliss and love... doesn't mean I am going to be kinder to anyone and not state my true honest opinions. Let's keep it real.

@Joseph Maynor just following my bliss homie. No stress for now ?

Hi guys, New to this forum, first post. I've been practising self inquiry for the last year pretty intensely. Before this year I saw anything spiritual as bullshit. I managed to take this year off and have focused on meditation (2 X 30 mins sessions daily) , long walks in nature while being PRESENT and self inquiry when I'm not using my mind for practical purposes. I feel very much as if I'm being lead down a path and helped along the way. I've had many beautiful experiences where everything was perfect and I felt bliss to be alive and present. I started the journey as a result of an Ayahuasca experience which showed me the "self". From there I researched and eventually found Advita and the "Direct Path". I now do an Ayahuasca about once a month and this has helped me a lot. I think I have Kundalini moving in me. I get very strong sensations of energy moving inside my head, back of my neck and light sensations from the base of my spine up my spine. I feel as if there is something like an energy moving inside of me. It can be pretty intense like a strong massage but from the inside. I'm practising non resistance and trying as much as possible to go with it. I live in Ireland and it's Mushroom season here so I decide to try them out. I took some many years ago but then it was all about fun now its about going in. I did a few trips on relatively small doses 2-3 grams which were lovely. Then last weekend due to a mix up I ended up with over a 5 gram dose. I wasn't expecting this level of trip and wasn't really ready. I got through it and managed to hold my space but it was tough. I felt like I was on the edge of the universe plowing into the unknown. It was raw and very uncomfortable. Then I sat and felt my entire being dissolve and regenerate. Then when I moved again I had lost my body. Everything was the same and everything was different (..before there were mountains ..) . I could see myself but it wasn't me. At one stage I merged into anothers body. This lasted until the next day and I feel its still there if I look. The experience was very weird and very very scary. I had to almost "glue" myself back together to feel normal again. I really didn't like the dis associative state at all and was literally praying like mad to come back. This has left me in a fearful state. Up to this point I felt love and kindness and help, this felt raw uncomfortable and was not at all nice. I'm now at a place where I'm, for the first time, questioning my "path". Does this path which leads to enlightenment ( I know it's not really like that but for the purposes of discussion) result in that dis associative state similar to what I experience on the mushrooms? If so I feel I might wish to slow down and hang where I'm at as the next "level" (if it's what I experienced) just doesn't seem that attractive anymore. I know this path is not for the faint hearted and I know that I need to lose myself. I thought I was ready for that but it seems maybe I'm not. Can I ever be ready? I know that the fear is the mind and I suspect that the mind is using this to avoid having to take "second place" but even now if I take the fear and go into it I'm not sure I want whats on the other side. I thought I wanted it more than life itself and now find myself a little confused about where I'm at and what I want. Any thoughts guidance greatly appreciated. Love

Da Vinci Some weeks ago Leo mentioned researching Leonardo Da Vinci because... That guy could learn and do anything. I thought... Wait a minute, I know barely a thing about this name... Let´s check him out... Have I been sleeping or why didn´t I know? Maybe because I am more attracted to people who are still alive... Like eh... Kesha Anyway, life has changed ever since... Profound proverbs #007 says that experience is a hard school, but a fool will learn no other way (an Irish proverb if we believe Leo which... We are lazy... And don´t care )... I don´t know in which fashion that is meant but I think Leonardo Da Vinci would feel like a pretty big fool hearing that because experience was his main learning method. He claimed to be a student of experience. Well, we would say he mastered observation (experience and observation aren´t quite the same, right?)... That is for sure... As for experience... We´re ALL fools then, aren´t we? So what I noted for myself is that Leonardo was a brain linker, a realist dreamer and an all force mobilizer. He used both of his hands even for fine motor work. I have felt like using them both in several occasions throughout my life but you need to keep up with that or it might just lead to great confusion (and fuck... that level of concentration... I´m jealous...)... I see potential in this being one reason for his changing character... That and... Heh, experience... He must have spent a big amount of his life in flow state, I think he experienced his work as very pleasant (most of the time at least), went into concentration and did not get easily out or back... And of course his dedication paid off... That reinforced his drive until the soup would get cold... The real hack though was if not believing that he is special then at least that what he is doing is, that his approach is (which it was...). It was not just about getting out of his low status, he mainly cared about becoming and being better. He enjoyed being ahead of others, he wanted them proven wrong, he... Had a big ego because he HAD to have one, he had no other choice rather than create the ways in which he would be in a position where he could be very confident about himself. He did not get anything for free after all... Even though his attractiveness came first I guess... He observed it would be better to preserve and perfection it, I guess... What else? Well, I don´t care if the special handwriting he used was comforting him, the side effect of others not being able to easily read what that man who was constantly standing, walking around and taking notes in a notebook comes in just too handy, if you´re asking me... People can be very annoying and curious... Another main insight. Da Vinci did not add or subtract anything to reality. He saw it´s perfection in awe and felt a need to understand it. Maybe when sitting down to execute he added light or shadow to a painting but you see... I don´t know if it was his projects or what was valued in art at those times but it had to look highly realistic and the best version of realistic. Not just a face for example but that face at its prettiest angle surrounded with the most complementing light, the perfect underlining Color... Well, a perfectionist, what else? But back to bare perception which is what he did first... He USED his senses, it´s like he drained them out. And by doing so he found there to be more to things. He found that mood, that soul, spirit, atmosphere, movement... Which is what set him apart from others. He was literally sensitive and his sight was a loving one. Patient. Mindful. Yes, that is the word and I think that it´s where things get slightly spiritual... Another note I took: Glasses. It´s like he had a variety of glasses or lenses to look at a task. Like he could say: "Shades vision on" or "architectonical zoom vision off", now "3D model in big"... He did not just master the ways of looking at ideas but he also mastered his switch of glasses... It´s less like one person with several brain functions/skills but more like one brain with several brain/person functions... Well, heh... Now I´m impressed. But look he was, as anyone who ever came up with the limitless drive to accomplish exceptional work, obsessed. Addicted. He WAS his state, he was his work. He was doing, even his thinking was doing I bet he forgot his own name more times than I will ever... But just because he did not write too often about his emotional world does not mean it did not exist rather than his agony and bliss by work. Also anxiety and fear of failure in his earlier years at least... It looks like he was good at linking and blending ideas. He was... Creative (of course). But he had bit of a comparative mind didn´t he? Quite measuring... Well, it had to for his work, be set in proportions and distances... Look, he was hard working. He was willing to do more in order to get more and he was interested in how far it goes... He worked with what he had and not with what he didn´t until he´d get what he wanted anyway. I´m not talking just about material, I´m talking about utilizing information, anything he came about to know... It´s what the fittest lower class people do (include me if you like)... Another thing is that he had no google, he carried that in his notebook and his mind. Define this, define that... Not just describe but define. As an artist he could had been satisfied with the surface of things but he went way beyond that, to the abstract, the function and then of course possibility of things. He was a philosopher at heart interested in the nature of reality, he knew how to ask questions. From that he built his understanding of the world from scratch. Once again, I am impressed. Well and... If one looks close, like Da Vinci, one might find patters there and the more patters one finds, the more analogies and even speculations one can make... Last note: Da Vinci= visualized genius. You see... So many multidisciplinary potentials of excellence walk on this earth... But that all needed skills get built, get mastered by someone and meet the eye of the average Joe? As rare as Da Vinci himself I´d say. You can SEE the fabric of mind in his codex, you can see both his training and his fruits of work. It´s all on paper. And it makes me wonder what came first... The idea and then the picture, the plan, the sketch or the other way round? Did he look at the basic notes and imagined up the complex, did he built in his mental map, onto memory? As a painter the drawing was part of execution but as an engineer it was part of planning. It was still an idea, just a picture, a page...

It's like tuning a guitar. Why tune a guitar? To hear nice music! If you love every last bit you are aware of in the now, there is no option but bliss. The trick is not to let the mind convince awareness with stories that what is right here right now is not loved. Awareness naturally merges with/loves everything, including that pain over there. Can we love the pain? Only if we remain as awareness! ? Separate from thought stories, Merge with Now, don't cheat on the now. Don't cheat on the now by believing the serpentine stories of mind. All is as it should be and que sera sera.

Hi arberor, Please pay attention that you describe your experience by opposite aspects: 1) The smallest thing (point). 2) The biggest thing (infinite expansion). By (1) alone you may feel claustrophobia. By (2) alone you may feel agoraphobia. In both cases you are in fight or flight state of mind (emergency state of mind, which may be experienced as anxiety). But you see dear arberor, (1) and (2) are actually two extreme aspects of the same thing. The same thing can be described (by using an analogy, which is not the thing in itself) as a sea, where its calm aspect is unbounded and non-local (known as (2)), and each one of its wavy aspects is bounded and local (known as (1)). If you get (1) and (2) in terms of a sea, you are not trapped anymore by emergency states of mind (you are the sea and you are your own Home (you are naturally fearless)). From this non-dual sea awareness there is nothing but an everlasting bliss.