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As long as thought is in movement there will remain identification with things. NO-THOUGHT NO-THINGS NO-EXPERIENCE NO-EXPERIENCER NOTHINGNESS

Does even the label "we" exist according to reality? The "we" indicates that we are unified but when I say "we", it only really means the human race... I think, personally, we are just more than humans. We shouldn't identify ourselves as humans but as reality (I'm sure you all know this, and yet here I am, thinking I'm human). We put our awareness on ourselves when that awareness is created by the human (agree to disagree but just an insight)? Maybe the awareness/conciseness exist because reality made it exist, but it's like a nightmare because we identify this awareness/consciousness so much that we trick ourselves to being just humans when in actual fact, we are the WHOLE thing. it causes doubt, existential crisis and for some people, be pulled into dogmatic ideologies I am both the stars, planets, nothingness, human, literally the whole universe. Being human is only one segment It's an important question to ask

That makes a lot of sense, at least to me. Here's the thing for everyone on this thread....it's impossible to put any personal experience exactly into words because... "What is said, isn't always what is heard." Anyhow, for the sake of conveying a functional understanding of non-duality, take a metaphor Leo has said which is we are each individually fingers on a hand with infinite "fingers". The fingers each represent a person and their experience/perspective of reality, and the hand represents the source of which yields every perspective. Not too sure what that source is called, perhaps it's nothingness because existence and experience can only "be" if there is an opposing state of being. Ying and Yang. In my opinion, it sounds like you got this figured out!

Fuck. If you told me a week ago what I am going to write now, I would have laughed at you. On May 25th I realized absolute Truth. What I did: During the week, that passed I had a 6.5d solo retreat and with some intense 10 to 12h of daily practice. The weekend before (May 18th-20th) I went on a nice camping trip with 3 of my friends and fellow self-actualizers. We did some inner and regular self-actualization work together and enjoyed time in nature. This was a great preparation and helped me to put some space between practical everyday life and the retreat. My intent was to reconnect myself with spirituality and to go deep into the work. I combined several different practices, kriya yoga, labeling and do nothing meditation, holotropic breathing, walking meditation starting at 5am in the morning. On the 4th day I took 300µg of AL-LAD. I tried to time everything in a way that I was a least likely to get disturbed by my housemates. Here's my schedule: M = meditation SDS = strong determintion sitting SHF = "see, hear, feel" (labeling) Holo = Holotropic breathing Allthough I was able to follow through with the entire schedule without missing one single practice (which I am kinda proud of ), I ended up having a lot of what I would call half-assad sits and sloppy meditations. I had to move and open my eyes a lot, even during strong determination sitting, and I ended up getting lost in thoughts a lot. Nevertheless I was able to enter a state of great calmness by wednesday. I also did 1h of walking meditation 3 times/d, just walking around in a park next to where I live so I wasn't really that isolated from the rest of humanity allthough I didn't really speak to anybody. In case you might be wondering, I had psychedelic trips before this one. I was actually doing psychedelics before I stumbled about Leo and the concept of personal developement. And over the last 5 years I had a couple of mushroom and salvia trips, one 25I-NBOMe experience and 3 AL-LAD trips prior to this one (100, 200 and 150µg). What I experienced: The actual retreat and practice itself was rather ordinairy. I had to go through some emotional work and purging to enter a state of great calmness and equanimity on day 3. To cultivate this internal peace helped a great deal with preparing me for day 5. The holotropic breathing also did a lot. I typically fall asleep soon after the breathing is over after a state of trance where most of the purging seems to happen for me. After waking up I alway feel so relieved. On the 5th day, I prepared everything for the actual trip. I sat down and said to myself: "I am ready to learn! Whatever may come, I am open and will accept it." Then I orally administrated the 300µg of AL-LAD and listened to some music for about 35min to help myself relax a little from a mild pre-trip anxiety. As I noticed it starting to take effect, I turned off the music and laid down on my bed. I started to see visual phenomenon and allowed myself to get fascinated by the patterns of the ceiling above me. I just let myself ooze into them and start to get absorbed. Everything got more and more intense and suddenly everything (my whole visual field, but also the inner world of mind and the fields of sound and touch) collapsed into one giant mosic like totality. And then, I suddenly realized what happened. I was no longer there. There was just infinite formlessness. I became Truth. I should note, that the experience was profoundly beautiful and profundly shocking at the same time! My human body just contorted in awe and horror. I felt every single emotion at the same time. I also noticed, that I started to hear sounds. High ringing type of sounds, that augmented the chirping of the birds outside and low drone like sounds, that seemed to be related to my breath Now the really profound thing was, that I seemed to be able to switch back and forth between this state of being absolute formless infinity and the state of being a contracted human form. This was immense! I experienced how I (absolute infinity) contract to create form, mind, relative reality, ego and suffering. I realized, that I am god and how I am constantly creating everything. I realized, that what most people call hallucinations or visuals on psychedelics are actually artefacts of how creation of form from fromlessness happens. They are just how absolute nothingness looks like when it creates reality. This switching back and forth produced enourmus insight and I was able to learn so much! It went on about 4-5h and then, I started to stay more and more in the domain of forms. As the trip became milder and taper off, I decided to take a long-ass walk because I wanted to be outside and in nature. It was so beautiful. My mind still was in this hyper-intelligent mode, that it seems to enter on AL-LAD and started to produce insight after insight, and it integrated all the theory and concepts about nonduality with the experience. The trip was about 8 to 9h long and I entered a nice afterglow, that lasted the whole next day, as I continued my retreat. I returned back to the state of great calmness, I had the days before the trip and the experience became more and more of a memory. I started to realize, that this glimpse won't be permanent. But the insights stayed with me. What I learned: I became Truth. I experienced, what I truely am. Everything is in perspective now. I learned how creation and existence work. I understood how I (the Big I, nothingness, god, infinity, formlessness...) contract to spit out all dualistic forms including my human form, the mind and reality. I also realized, how I have to create suffering and ego in order for this to happen. This was an profundly powerful and eye opening insight. It also showed me, how I (my human form) can literally not exist and be happy at the same time. For my body even to take a single breath, I have to create form and therefore suffering. And it made this whole issue of having to physically die to get enlightened very clear. Letting go completely litterally is the way, that I can return to nothingness. There can only be Truth or there can be creation and suffering. I understood every single contemplative practice, how each one works and in what way it is supposed to reveal Truth to you. Kriya, breathing, and all the different meditation techniques, Leo and Shinzen talk about make total sense now. I also learned how to meditate intuitively. The way Infinity came to me and the way, I had to let go sort of made a permanent imprind and I was able to recreate the way I focused my mind and surrenderd myself on the next day. It's basically a combination of open, choiceless awareness and a very deep surrender (simular to the do nothing technique). Leo's guided meditation video actually get's pretty close to it. Allthough I am not able to recreate the deep state I had on my trip, I can archive a calm and extremely peaceful no-mind kind of state that way. I learned how life purpose and spirituality work together. This became so clear to me by becoming infinity and seeing how reality comes into existence. Maintaining a minimal sense of self for this mammal, that I am to survive is best done by aligning myself more and more with the truth and with living an integrated purposeful life. I learned how the whole issue of authenticity and relating to other people is connected with spirituality. This was huge insight. The only way to relate to other beings without creating suffering is the way of utter vulnerability. Like if you literally would lay you naked body in the arms of another person, exhale your last breath and say: "You can have everything! My entire existence, it's yours!" This kind of surrender is the exact same surrender that is needed for enlightenment. I learned, that the biggest trap, I can now fall into is to cling to the memory of my awekening too much and to have too strong of a desire to recreate it. Whenever I am clinging to the memory, I am not surrendering to the Truth. What's next: More practice and more tripping. This experience of infinity I had is already fading and I see, how I have to do a LOT more work, to make it penetrate the core of my being more. I want to take my spiritual practice way more serius and I want to embody what I have learned. More theory. Even though I have studied quite a lot, I now feel like I needed the experinece to truly understand any of the theory. There is so much more to learn now. More life purpose work. I am curently building a life around being a musician and I want to do it in the way that is as alighned to Truth as possible. Having seen infinity made it increadibly clear to me how this has going to happen. Doing more for my body. I have seen what increadible miracle it is to have the form of a human being and I want to take care of this mammal that I am as best as I can. And allthough I have a pretty clean diet, I have all sorts of tense muscles in my back and consume quite a lot of caffeine. Getting more into fitness and exercising is inevitable right now. Working on truthful and authentic relating to others. I want to be able to open myself to others way more and to become a lot more honest. Tips and advice: Unlike Leo, I would advise you to have your first experience of Truth with AL-LAD rather than with 5MeO-DMT. I understand, that this is sort of personal, but if I would take the 20min of my trip, that where most intesne and imagined myself getting blasted into this state within a few seconds, I wouldn't have been able to let go so smoothly and I guess wouldn't have learned nearly as much.> Think of it this way: If you were trying to understand light, and you can choose between a lightbulb, which is nicely dimmed on and off again, and a single bolt of lightening, I guess for a first timer, the lightbulb is much more helpful. Probably my most important advice: Study the theory! If I wouldn't have been studying the theory of nonduality for the last couple of years I would literally have gotten nothing out of the experience. My mind wouldn't have been able to make sense out of anything. It would just have been some hallucination for me. Having concepts of what I was experiencing helped a great deal with recognizing it as absolute Truth and the way that AL-LAD makes your mind become this hyperintelligent wisdom machine worked greatly with that (which is another reason why I would recommend AL-LAD over 5MeO for a first time experience). On retreat, practice starts to take on at different dynamic on its own. Stuff comes up and it might be getting very hard to do some of the techniques as good as you would be able to do them in your daily practice. Don't judge yourself for that and don't judge your performance. Surrender to whatever happens and try not to get frustrated. The retreat is at play here and it will give you whatever you need to learn right now (sort of like a trip). Thinking in terms of good or bad retreats is not useful (recisely like thinking in terms of good or bad trips is not useful ). Solo retreats are perfect settings for breakthrough doses of psychedelics. If you are serious about experiencing Truth for the first time than this is definately one of the most recommended alternatives. If you're struggeling with this issue of life purpose vs. spirituality, consider psychedelics. For me they made the solution to this increadibly clear. They actually showed me, that there is no real difference between the two, especially, if you understand how your core values relate to Truth. Lastly: Remember, that letting go is the key! I am so greatful right now. Awakening is so powerfully life transforming and liberating. Thank all of you for walking this path together. I hope this report is helpful. If you have any questions, I am happy to answer.

You can do it all day, it’s really fun! Daydreams aren’t here to be looked down upon, they are telling you that you have a strong emotion in your heart that needs your attention. The stronger the thought, the stronger economic emotion, and the stronger the belief which creates both of them. If you watch your thoughts and emotions throughout your day you will naturally uncover these core beliefs that drive them! But in that case I’d recommend that you try concentrating on your heart in meditation. You will have hardly any thoughts until you engage in a addictive tendency for the rest of the day This returns you to the source of infinite nothingness which you can reach consistently with practice. It will increase your awareness thus making it effortless to observe thoughts and emotions throughout the day. I hope this helps you.

Only if one is bound by time they speak from perspective. This is the whole point, if you are merely accumulating info you are time bound. This is a movement of contradiction, duality, and implies that the accumulater is separate from that which they accumulate. It’s not about accumulation of info. It’s about understanding oneself completely and in that understanding dualistic movement ends. That implies a total emptying of everything mind has constructed. If you don't understand yourself you are blind to your own limitation. Accumulation never leads to emptiness, NOTHINGNESS. TIMELESSNESS CAN NOT BE LEARNED FROM ANOTHER. NO BOOKS, THEORY, CONCEPTUALIZATION LEADS TO THAT WHICH IS TIMELESS. ONLY SELF KNOWLEDGE/SELF LEARNING DOES. NO AUTHORITY OF ANY KIND, BE IT PERSONAL OR COLLECTIVE CAN HELP YOU TO THAT WHICH IS NAMELESS. INFACT IT ONLY PREVENTS.

The description is never the described. The concept of the ending of time is not the same as actually ending time. To end time implies the timeless. To use time by moving dualistically leads to more time. Verbal description will never bring about a fundamental change and end the dualistic movement of time. Any teacher or sharing that promotes and introdces time to anothers mind is doing them a disservice. Only the “disciple and possibly the teacher” may not even know that is so. They will live there lives in self deception not having actually lived in timelessness. It’s about empying the conditioned conciousness so that NOTHINGNESS becomes actual. Not adding to conciousness another dogma “contradiction” and in so doing all action is born of that contradiction. This implie a dualistic movement in action, which is not a sign of one who lives a nondual life. Ask yourself, do I act as if I live in TOTAL FREEDOM? Do I live a holy life. Am I whole? Is all action “I” take free of duality, division, contradiction? Only that is a sign of one who is ONE with the unnamable/immeasurable.

its a paradox. The mind can't really talk about infinity whilst being so finite. Eternal death would be assuming a dark room for eternity, nothingness is not that.

Well you already know you can lose each individual sense and still live on. the only one that is difficult is the mind/brain. But you see mind has gaps, there is times where you're not thinkin about anything just zoned out, or you could have alzheimers disease in final stages and still be alive, or you could hit your head and have a full identity loss. Or you can get scientists to electricute parts of your brains and have involuntary movement/spasm/reactions, they can remove parts of your brain and change your entire personality function. In zen they say this: "Sweep away thoughts!" means one must do zazen. Once thoughts are quieted, the Original Face appears. Thoughts can be compared to clouds. When clouds vanish, the moon appears. The moon of suchness is the Original Face. Thoughts are also like the fogging of a mirror. When you wipe away all condensation, a mirror reflects clearly. Quiet your thoughts and behold your Original Face before you were born!" You are that before the body was born, you will be that when you die. Once you die it's like you never existed in the first place, again nothingness. Because if I asked you what were you before you were this body what do you remember? you will not know, its just nothingness.

Dude he's talking about a dark room, like that you put someone in a solitary confinment, thats not what nothingness is, its not boredom or darkness or torture. Actually i keep telling you nothingness and existence is the same thing. Everything you see right now is nothingess, awareness is nothingness. It's not a thing. You can change awareness into another word such as "being" or "existence" etc. You're assuming you know what "real" means. How do you know this isn't what nothingness looks like? If we deduct all your sense perceptions what are you left with? There that is your true self. Once you lose, sight, sound, touch, taste, smell, and mind you will find your true self, the nothingness.

"Nothing exists outside of consciousness." I love it, the irony, yes everything that is outside your awareness is nothing Ok another example: If you say bye to your girlfriend/wife on her way to work and you go to work, is she: A) in some imaginary place in your mind (e.g. an assumption oh "she's obviously at the office". or B) lost in nothingness until you observe her again through preception and awareness. If we take away your eyes her visual beauty is lost forever in the nothingness.

Actually he says: "nothingness is really like the nothingness of space which contains the whole universe, all the sun and stars, and the mountians and rivers and the good men the bad men and the animals in the insect the whole bit, all contained in the void. out of this voids comes everything and you're it." So i don't know if you're just outright lying and trolling or just so delusional you hear completely different words to feed your beliefs??? Dude make up your mind, You saying consciousness is "not a thing" is the same thing as "nothing"

@Mikael89 Because Nothingness and Existence is the same thing, this is NOTHINGNESS. You're in IT right now. How do you know any of this exist without your own bias confirmation and illusions of the mind? You're so damn stuck in ego you just dont want to get it, you just want to prove your point. What the **** is awareness if its not nothingness, define it to me. Right I am done, ran out of patience I can't tell if trolling at this point or not either way waste of time and energy. You've even bent the videos to confirm your own beliefs, go to any of these gurus and say "I am awareness" watch them rip a new butt hole into you and make you come out being more confused than ever. And yes you are aware of nothingness, which is everything else that you are not aware of, because guess what, it's nothingness! You basically say I am consciousness the LIGHT that shines upon the darkness to reveal the room, yet completely and utterly ignoring the dark room in the first place. What is more fundamental the light or the dark room? The yin or the yang?

That's cool most of the mystics and guru's play paradox anyway. And many talk about the nothingness, emptiness and silence. You just cherry picking because you want to prove a point. Here are some of the gurus you mentioned talking about emptiness, I will update the list Osho - http://www.osho.com/iosho/library/read-book/online-library-nothingness-eckhart-empty-38103edb-6d6?p=5f7618faff0ef1ed80aa13530a49577f Alan Watts - Echart Tolle: Sadhguru: "Everything comes from nothingness and goes back to nothingness. Nothingness is the basis of existence. #SadhguruQuotes" https://twitter.com/sadhgurujv/status/944032314698412032?lang=en Adyashanti: Mooji: "You stay as the awareness itself, but don't say YES I am awareness! No you're not, the minute you that which says "i am awareness" is not awareness, awareness does not say it is awareness" Dude I'm getting bored of linking stuff "I can go on and on"....

I've only done this for two days and it has already made huge results in my progression... When I thought (previously) of nothingness, I felt a presence but recently, reading up on the forums with other people's opinions... It's gone weird, like I'm not in the moment but am at the same time I am? It's so paradoxical

You're right. What am I talking about... Just stop being in the moment. I just meditated and I just feel nothing but I don't get it. How can I feel this nothingness? Now I'm back to my senses and it's weird...

I'm nothing. No... I'm not attaching nothing to my state of mind. Not attaching emptiness to my mind. I am just nothing. No emotions, No fears, just fucking nothing. No understanding, no knowledge, NOTHING. Writing this goes against nothingness. I am just nothing NOTHING Am I enlightening right? Lol who cares, I am nothing. Nothing to prove, nothing to do. NOTHING

Thanks everyone. I think i just have to get more comfortable with the uncertainty. The "it's just a dream" perspective doesn't do it for me. It's easy to take that perspective from a position of current ease and homeostasis, but while all may be a dream, one who is being tortured will assure you that it is not "just" a dream. It's also real. Pain hurts. It doesn't not hurt. And the essence of who we are is pure awareness or consciousness or maybe nothingness... yes, we are that, but trapped. You're trapped awareness, conditioned, bound. A grain of sand is the same in essence as the whole beach, but it is not the whole beach. If you think you are everything, try levitating that cup in front of you or morphing it into a cow with your thoughts. Right, you can't, so we are imprisoned consciousness, confined to a tiny little blob. We are not the body in essence, but we are certainly stuck in one, even if it is "just a dream" that we are. But I guess even if pain is always occurring, adding worry, stress, and fear won't resolve it. So we can still retain some peace of mind at least.

This is such a freaky, mindfuck topic. I've had the exact same thought, and it's scary (but also magnificent and beautiful). I believe the answer is yes. Even with the most conservative multiverse theory (which imo is that big bang happens, universe plays itself out, universe ends, another big bang happens), this would necessitate that anything that could happen would happen. And at least that kind of infinity must be the case, I mean it would make no sense for one universe to happen and "then" pure eternal nothingness. But I think reality is much more infinite than that still. If it helps, like the others have said, You remain unaffected. In fact, to be technical nothing ever actually happens. It's all just appearances. You may have had some horrific dreams which royally sucked, but then you woke up to find out it was just a dream and you were safe and unharmed.

Don't identify with the external world, the body/mind as a whole is a direct experience, a direct hologram of the whole existence. So, to feel the entire universe, one must identify with his own being. The being you are experiencing as a human, already is the entire nothingness in a mobile version.

@Nahm That is a beautiful perspective you have. It is scary letting go of that "I" that constantly compares the present to past experiences or an imaginary "better" future self. It means you live with no reference points, driven forward by your heart/excitement over a bottomless cliff of nothingness.

Yeah the no self feeling is normal in deep meditation, you need to go deeper, prepare to die, this is it end of the line for ego, if you give in to thoughts at that moment or break the meditation the ego won the battle. It's very difficult to do as its not a choice of "i will do this or that" it kind of just needs to happen. You can literally meditate to the point that all your your body dissolves and you can no longer sense it, if you do it with complete darkness and silence this sensation is even better. I lost all sense of self and became pure consciousness, an indescribable energy field or whatever you want to call it, the nothingness, infinite, god, samahdi, I don't know if it goes deeper tho.

You don't need to do anything to awaken other than give up the fight. Surrender completely to everything. That's why I just accept what is, and the best way to do that is to love whatever arises. You have no control when a thought will arise, when a feeling will arise, or what a person will say to you in a conversation. So instead of surrendering to them in short periods of meditation (still do it of course!) but why not do it all of the time, allowing them to just be, through the art of being your own inner parent to your heart that you have always wished you had. My process: a thought arises? I say: "I love you", or some anything that is very kind, caring, and respectful. A feeling? "I love you". That is surrender, that is healing, and that anchors the vibration of love until reality reflects it. Affirmations of this kind change past the mental body of subconscious beliefs, because you are anchoring the oneness of your true self which is love/light/joy/gratitude/infinity/nothingness/emptiness/God. Bring this acceptance with you, accept the one who continues to backlash just so you can give this shadow the love it deserves. The ego backlash is really the most neglected part of yourself wanting to be loved, like a child who has walked up to the gates of heaven, and heaven keeps moving away just cause the child isn't behaving morally right. Are you gonna leave that child to die, or will you sit with this child disguised as an ego backlash, and feel it. Every feeling is a child wanting to be hugged and loved, same with every thought, every person you see. Just children wanting the attention they never got. It's painful to do this man! As I always say, there is no shortcut here. "I may be done with sadness, but it's not done with me". Replace sadness with a thought, or a feeling.

Only a mind/consciousness with NO-THING in it, is capable of love/and that creative movement of centerlessness. NOTHINGNESS

@Faceless Speaking of love, is it possible to be wise and in love at the same time? Or is wisdom mind and love absence of mind? And therefore not compatible? I feel like wisdom and truth goes together, just as love and truth goes together. But wisdom belong to the faculty of the mind it seems? And love belong to the faculty of NO mind, hence the faculty of nothingness. Please help me out here. Also@Faceless Thanks for your long and beautiful PM to me. Your approach to the subjects of "soul" and "reincarnation" was very interesting and rings very true to me. Thanks @Faceless ! Namaste.