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How do you know? Do you speak from personal experience? (sorry, heard that one somewhere before ). Or is it deduction from cases you think are enlightened and who still suffer? There is a path beyond Enlightenment to stabilize this freedom from suffering, but the tools to do that are given for the first time WITH Enlightenment (peak to plateau to permanent). And most "Enlighenments" are just Awakenings with remnants of separate-self hijacking the newfound Nonduality. And yet, the amount of bliss and release from the suffering of the self-contraction that resting in True Being (or Awakened infinite nondual timeless Awareness) brings, once it has become accessible, is astonishing. And that bliss and force of True Being has the potential to stabilize that in plateau to permanent. These statements of yours are in contradiction to roughly 2 millenia+ testaments of beings who have realized their True Being. Suffering is the "rubber band" that makes separate-selves return to their True Being. Hamster-wheels until the original condition is restored. Suffering is what guarantees that no being is lost in the illusion of separation forever. The longer one chases states/experiences/whatever, the longer the hamster-wheels spin. One could even say that the separate-self IS suffering/resistance/contraction (Adi Da called the ego self-contraction). Because one of its main essences IS the suffering/contraction/localization/resistance to what is. Suffering IS the ego IS the separation/separate-self. I can tell you from my own experience that it is felt exactly as that (self-contraction), which becomes obvious at some point on the path, as contractions in the head and body. When these contractions/solidities (mainly in the head at the end in my case) fully dissolve and drop, the boundless field of consciousness becomes infinite and truly nondual. It is such a relaxation of tension/contration/localization/constant-background-contraction/"baseline-suffering". It feels like vast-spaciousness, nondual, limitless, so free and open. Bliss itself. And honestly, every being not living from this obviously and inevitably suffers, is in the claws of the merciless self-contraction. This becomes then totally clear once one has experienced this dropping of the self-contraction, which then creates compassion. Which stabilizes (paradoxically) Awakening and Nonduality even further. That is the beginning of boundless vast Non-Duality (not yet Enlightenment), in which Awakened nondual Awareness ripens (Roger Thisdell stage 4 to stage 5) towards Enlightenment, or the full dropping of anything separate, truly becoming Infinite Being. Here the bliss starts flowing, and the path starts showing itself to itself. Fueled by the bliss of True Being, which already starts giving a powerful attractor point starting here. Selling the bliss of vast nondual limitless spaciousness at the River PS: And for the "trying" to dissolve suffering. Yes, trying doesn't work. The dissolving of suffering/self-contraction is the case once it happens. Until then, while trying, there is suffering.

uhum. ok. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_suicides_in_the_21st_century So lets look up all the people who had everything that mainstream-society sells as summum-bonum.... In other words, to be precise: No hamsterwheel-project left to distract themselves from their self-contraction/ego ... money, fame, friends, lovers, success, n+1, all tried and found to be useless/unsatifying in the end, and not interested or smart enough to be motivated to investigate ET n+1 et al.), and therefor got depressed and killed themselves? Seems like a loooong of pretty "succesful" "people" to to me... Selling a-path-to-transcendence-instead-of-the-hamsterwheel-de-jour by the River

Good points, and that resonates with me. One can realize what One is and what Reality is (Enlightenment), and that is final. If its not final, it was not the essence of it. Then you can have endless Awakenings in what You/True You can do (or imagine, or manifest as form). Endless, because what can be imagined and manifested is endless, Infinity upon Infinity. God herself is busy exploring that, having fun at that, and will never reach the end of it (see Cantors Set Theory, and Infinity of Infinities exist already in this universe. Which means nothing else that the larger Reality manifesting our universe is capable of an Infinity of Infinities, and therefor will never run out of realms to explore. I am absolutely not against that, its a wonderful thing to pursue the beauty of these Awakenings. But I just prefer to do that after realizing True Nature, because else it gets the usual ego-hamster-mill of pursuing experiences relieving the ego/self-contraction suffering. So its just a matter of what to do first, what to give priority before the other. Not either/or. It can even be done parallel, and normally happens this way (Awakenings/mystical experiences of all sorts before Enlightenment). Added bonus with realizing of what one really is (True You) and what Infinite Reality really is, its essence (Infinite Being and every possible appearing including ego/separate-self not happening out of it but expressed BY that Reality)... is a tremendous relief/liberation from suffering or resistance to what appears/is, and knowing what survives death (everything that is important), and what was before birth, and what can never not be there. Jesus did a good job of keeping Realization during torture (although he had a short lapse: father father why hast thou forsaken me). But of course he was Jesus. Let's put it this way: When getting tortured, better by pretty stable in Realization. On the other side, even if the self-contraction kicks in again during extreme pain, why is that so necessary? With an incarnation into physical reality, the reset button is pushed anyway for the vast majority of beings, and then hopefully their Karma brings them back. But all of that is relative show. True Being was never hurt, even if the incarnation forgets realization of True Being. And True Being has no moving parts, can never be damaged. This shift of perspective happens naturally when realizing what one is. Illusion off, illusion on, that is still on the relative level. The illusion of the separate-self never really existed (the rope was never a snake), but appeared to do say (the snake appeared and was seen). Maybe that perspective is helpful. Selling Water by the River

A very good and important topic to contemplate about. I also spent a long time with the topic of what causes actually Awakening, and its relationship to suffering. I tried to include as many past & present cases into my perspective on it as possible. On suffering in the context of Awakening, Enlightenment, the meditation path and my personal experiences (and my personal pet-theory of it all): -warning, the usual conceptual overkill of yours truly ahead- The following is my perspective based on what I have seen/read about other cases, and my own experiences. Without some form of suffering (or more precicly in Buddhist terma Dukha which means not suffering, but more unsatisfactoryness) nobody would ever start the path to Enlightenment/Awakening/Liberation/True Being, because one would be happy & satisfied doing the myriad of projects to become happy and free of suffering/unsatisfactoriness in our culture/time. Maslows pyramid up and down. What is not so well known: Even Maslow put towards the end of his life stage 6 on top of Maslows pyramid of need: (Self-)-Transcendence. So for the start of the "Enlightenment-project" (which is a contradiction in itself, but that is another story...) one needs either a) a mainstream-culture that pushes spiritual liberation/Awakening (and for our lifetimes, Maya goes "not today darling" on that topic, or b) some form of suffering or dukha (unsatisfactoriness) to start the journey. Then during the path to Awakening/Enlightenment/liberation, the old cycles of suffering/unsatisfactoriness don't stop at once. Here is how it developed for me, in a nutshell. The nature of the separate-self/ego to cycle between being happy for some time, then suffering/being unsatisfied/resisting what is/unhappy, then start a new project to make it happy, and round it goes. If God would write a manual to make a Samsara/Illusion game with (separate) self and others, it would go something like this: Give them some unsatisfaction and a carrot (expectation of happiness induced by a certain experience in the future), let them chase, then give them temporary happiness(=not resisting what is) and them make 'em suffer again. And given them lots of levels of carrots/games to chase and try out for permanent happiness. That is all that is needed to have a game with separate-self. The chasing goes from Maslows pyramid base stage 1 apparently up to chasing ETs n+1. Then, on an efficient path (my case Mahamudra/Dzogchen), the bliss of ones True Being (Awakenings to Nondual Awakened Awarenes) by cutting off the thought/feeling stream of the separate self in real time (also called meditation, if done correctly) starts flowing. At some point of my path (mainly Mahamudra&Dzogchen), I literally could start producing my bliss for example while meditating, walking, in meetings (at least some of them when I just could watch the show ) and so on... That normally starts after some years of meditation (on and off the pillow) when the vast spaciousness of boundless awareness starts showing up and the contractions in the head get literally relaxed. That impressed me pretty much. That bliss didn't hold with "hard" problems/really bad events in the beginning, but it started the become stronger and stronger, inducing more and more awakend nondual states of blissful silence. A positive feedback loop. More and more facets of True Being started to show up, see my last post on the remnants of separate self that need to be seen through. Creating more and more Awakening and bliss. At some point the shift can happen towards realizing what one really is/True Infinite Being, or Enlightenment. Since that normally implies a gradual transcendence path/process over several years that one has been fed each and any core-separte-self identity/suffering during the meditation by Maya in the years before, pretty much all of that stuff is transcended. Because Maya will "throw" anything at you that she has to keep the illusion going, and she has a lot. But it can jump to Enlightenment any time (Karma, aka genetics but I prefer Karma, more encompassing), induced by various events, often suffering, before that path/during it/at the end of it. For most it takes the whole path. The more gradual and longer the path, the more stable is the realization later. Yet, once having realized True Being, it is no longer in doubt. So, that was my experience, now comes my theory: Beings are karmically wired more or less fortunately/differently. Some wake up because their visual field conforms for some reasons (base state, Kundalini-Awakening, whatever) very well to the True Nature of things (mere appearance and not solid objects out there, Infinite field of awareness, boundless, timeless, always here, basically my last long post about a mindstream conforming to the enlightened mindstream. Or at least they have the potential for that shift to happen quickly. and their core-separate-self-identity-arisings are for some reason (Karma,...) easily seen through when contemplating&self-inquiring. For these beings (1) and (2) in place, some trigger can cause Enlightenment. Suffering-example: Tolle. Kundalini/Energetic: Ramana. Anamanda Ma, countless examples in history. Branch of that is shaktipat hitting a "fertile field". Then there are the normies, like yours truly, who need an either need a) an efficient practice (like Mahamudra/Dzogchen) first to induce awakened states, then get rid of all illusion/separate-self remnants, and then some good pointing out instruction of the real state of things (the properties of True Infinite Being, basically my last long post). quite some time/years needed to start inducing awakened awareness/mere nondual appearance of the visual field via meditation/trekchö/cutting off each and any thought-arising in more and more highspeed by looking into its (empty/consciousness) nature out of which thoughts/feelings are made. Until then of course also suffering in cycles. But getting "over the hump" towards bliss-inducing state happens here in the fastest and most efficient manner, as least in the opinion of yours truly. The beginning steps of that path are also concentration meditation, like in b) below. But quite refined ones, and not for too long before one shifts practice. Learning to produce ones own bliss with being in these awakened states. This way, gradually getting rid of large parts of suffering by slowly transcending the "sufferer", and replacing misery of the separate-self with the bliss of awakened states. and then, towards the end of the road (or if one is gifted/fortunate/lucky also in the middle of the path) the shift to realizing True Being and its immortality (or infinite-always here nature), and with that removing the final fear of "death" or disappearance. b) a practice that is less detailed and focuses more on brute-force willpower/push-through concentration meditation: Jhana, Zen, "sit and die before the wall" approaches that need to push with willpower through lots and lots of suffering. Here, we are again at lots and lots of suffering (at least at the beginning stages, but also all along the path from what I have seen), because Maya will throw everything she has at you to get you off the pillow/meditation, not that one wakes up and leaves the game prematurely... And now the second part of the post, why are the paths with less/minimized suffering not practiced more widely? As @Arthogaan has noticed correctly in the post below, and I had the exact same thoughts many times... Short answer to the question above: they are more complex and need more maintenance/coaching/understanding. So they are more difficult to teach & multiply & roll out, and normally need personal coaching. they have mostly been kept secret until recently because of the various dangers, like for example ego-inflation, nihilistic misuse-potential, or just plain and simple misunderstanding potential of complex practices, which leads to stagnation in the practice. Why do we have mainly enlightened ones who got lucky/were lucky with karma/genetics (see above), or from the paths 2b) Concentration meditation/Theravada/Zen? Because until recently the highly(!) sophisticated methods of Tibetan Buddhism like Mahamudra/Dzogchen/... (who have developed much more and way more sophisticated than for example Zen/Theravada which are very similiar to what was done in India 1000 to 2000 years ago (although I love these traditions very much) were not accessible at all. The Tibetans "concentrated" more on spirituality as a society, 1000 years of R&D of enlightened lineages and sometimes a large part of the adult population in the monastaries (~15%+). Head of state = Dalai Lama for a long time. Basically, main focus of that culture&society including government was Enlightenment. Of course there was also a lot of stupid things going on, like war between monasteries. But the overall development of buddhist meditation in that setting was unparalleled. Compared to that (sorry) Theravada and Zen sometimes feels a bit like "living fossils" (said in a joking way), although I like them very much and they do work quite robustly and produce fully enlightened ones. The Tibetan Teachings are very sophisticated and either need lots of focus on them (like reading the books of Brown 10-20 times and experimenting a lot), or a good and enlightened teacher explaining them and checking for understanding (which pretty much didn't exist until recently, all secret teachings are out, see books of Daniel Brown. "best of" collection of Menri Trizin, selected by Menri Trizin (probably those with which he achieved his own realization) to be translated by Brown). Another problem is they got a deeply cultural "lingo" and quite some hyperbole (the Tantric teachings of generation/completition stages and especially the lower Tantras). Quite hard to approach. So the only thing not published by Brown of these systems are some of the secret pointing out instructions for Enlightenment, although quite some are published, for example his Akrid book (Pith Instructions for A Khrid rDzogs Chen. Yet, reading that in parallel to Pointing out the Great Way is probably better than starting with that book alone). That system plus a bit Jac O'Keffee, Roger Thisdell, Massaro, Wolinsky for the final steps towards Realization (I wrote quite a lot about these), and some psychedelics for state-peak-previews... These elements I assume will be found in the Global Dharma of the future. Then some more aspects: Concentration Meditation Systems like Zen or Jhana/Theravada are quite robust: Don't need so much teaching/feedback during the process, are more brute-force and less complex. More robust, less efficient (in the meaning that one needs to push through suffering with meditation, and that they can be slower/less pleasant, and many meditators end in the many cul-de-sacs of the path where one can just stagnate if certain nuances are not understood. But done long &hard enough they work. Metaphor: The axe to cut down a tree. Doesnt need fuel & maintenance & sophisticated handling like a forst harvester.... which brings us to: The Forsest harvester to cut down the forst of Illusion: Mahamudra&Dzogchen&other Tibetan Buddhism techniques, see for example Daniel Browns books & videos: can work if done correctly/understood correctly/coached correctly in the fastest way possible by swiftly creating Awakened Nondual States most pleasant way possible (minimum amount of pushing through suffering on/off meditation pillow, taking the meditation off the pillow into daily life at the earliest possible point. avoiding pretty much all cul-de-sacs of the path where meditation practice can stagnate/level out if something is not done correctly, which means and end to the growth of Awakened Nondual States. Mostly they don't even appear then in first place, and one remains in the mericless claws of the separate-self-contraction/suffering. but are way more complex than the standard concentration meditation practice like Zen/Jhana. Pointing out the Great Way, Brown has hundreds of pages of descriptions of the various stages/steps and how the path develops through them. So many many things to potentially do wrong if something is understood incorrectly. Zen-Koan-meditation would just push through these errors if done long enough, but an incorrectly done Nonmeditation (done too early) or One Taste meditation goes nowhere and stagnates... Selling Water by the River

Yes. Exactly. Instead of getting rid of the illusion of being a ship on the ocean (ignorance, separate-self arisings I-thoughts, I feelings, feeling of being something specific) and truly realizing that one IS the impersonal/boundless ocean with all waves/dimensions that could ever be. And ever was was, only can be, and ever will be just the ocean. With or without the ignorance/illusion of feeling oneself as a ship/individuality being in it. but instead of that deciding for: Wave surfing and wave investigating. Lets go on the highest wave and see what the ocean can do. Infinitely consciousness high wave-surfing. Of course that is just the indviduality/ship/ego hijacking the true state of things (impersonal consciousness/ocean), going wave surfing on the highest and "infinitely consciousness" wave/dimension/whatever of manifestation (which is the Relative (manifestation), not the Absolute), and all the while never truly transcending its separateness/individuality/ignorance, but projecting that onto the Infinity of manifest arisings/form ("waves"), and proclaiming that as "infinitely consciousness". Ego=God=Solipsism. Bravo! And of course that is not the end of the game. The individual/ignorance is still very much alive. It contracts and suffers again and again. And Absolute Reality/Impersonal Infinite Consciousness/True God "says" (or better does that to the aficionado of that grasping worldview): Not today darling, no end of suffering before you let go that fascination of wave surfing and trying to become "infinitely" consciousness. Not before you stop chasing your own tail(s). Of which there are, guess what, and Infinity of. An Infinity of tails to chase. And all of which actually is NOT infinitely consciousness, but just wave-surfing and and becoming aware of high waves of manifestation/dimensions/manifestation-mechanisms, earthly or alien n+1. Projecting certain remnants of the separate self onto Infinity, and not letting the separate self illusion/ignorance truly exhaust itself in the ocean of truly impersonal consciousness. Infinitely consciousness is dropping into the ocean, transcending ones separate self/ego/ignorance truly, letting it die, understanding all its illusion/ignorance mechanisms, and becoming the impersonal boundless ocean of Absolute Reality itself. Maintaining that boundless nondual Awake Awareness of mere appearance in Infinite Reality in daily life. Because the clouding-over-ignorance mechanism is truly transcended/seen through/gone/dead, and "one" lives happily ever after as that which one really is: Absolute Reality itself. Self-evident moment to moment nondual boundless Awakened Awareness, all manifestation just mere appearance, always available, not depending on certain substances. But I guess that would require a major philosophical shift, and would create a certain marketing problem or two. Yet, it would feel infinitely better in daily life.... But hey, whatever floats ones ship on the ocean boat so to say... Its a free country Lila! And the self-contraction/ignorance is the spice of the universe, especially on the highest level of expanding the ego to infinitely large God-like dimensions. Where else to view such a show than in this little Samsara of ours? And as always, to all the "other" players in that magnificant show, good, bad, smart, maybe not so smart, alien, not alien, and so on and on: Bon voyage! And thanks for having the courage to endure the necessary suffering that goes along with playing/identifying with a fragment of the Totality (individuality/separate ego) to keep the illusion-show going in a convincing way! And never forget that when you are tired of all that suffering and confusion, there truly is a way home. Which, funnily, is always right Here, right Now. Hidden usually under a truckload of "me", separation, ignorance and illusion. So lets not make that truckload bigger than it already is. Selling water by the River

Thank you for that post. Then I don't have to write something similiar, end can enjoy the sunday focusing on other endeavours. But what would happen to our little drama show here if that were not or no longer the case? One could start worrying a bit about the drama factor of the show winding down considering the possibility that certain key players get tired and actually could consider getting off the hamster mill & tail chasing. And getting tired of being only temporarily relieved in their self-contraction by grasping at the beauty of trying to understand the infinity of the manifested side of consiousness n+1 so to say. And actually winding down and ending the "you" or self-contraction, as Inliytened1 mentioned. The contraction=ego=separate self=suffering burning, dying and evaporting in the obvious omnisience of ones own True, Enternal and Infinite Being. Being replaced by the relieve of knowing ones True Self to be all arisings and manifestation, no matter how high or low or alien or eartly or n+1. Now, ever since, and forever, no matter how much confusion arises again this life or the next. But considering how much ingeniuty Infinite Reality put into the autopoiesis of the ego/separate-self delusion-arisings/Gestalt (all the way up to the very top of the mountain), probably not much to worry considering the continuation of the gig. But who knows... Selling Water by the River

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concept https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abstraction "It [Solipsism] states you are ..". If that is not a concept I don't know what a concept is. "Solipsism" is a concept, "you" is a concept, "mind" is a concept. The two sentences above are conceptual, consisting of concepts. And that is why these two sentences of yours are: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-contradiction But hey, don't want to spoil your gig. You are a perfect example towards which certain teachings lead to. And the originator of these certain teachings (Solipsism) apparently doesn't object the outcome of these teachings. Like you flooding the forum with conceptual ideas like Absolute Solipsism (loaded with ego & separate-self). Actually, it is not so difficult: True Self = Infinite Impersonal (!) Suchness/Being/Reality/Consciousness: Solipsism ok. But that takes the death/transcendence of the separate-self/separating ego. Not blowing it up to infinity-proportions (God-ego). And even then, what is the use of talking "Solipsism" to other un-enlightened egos, when it mainly tends to blow up their obstacle towards true liberation, which is their untranscended separate ego/separate-self, to God-Ego size? False Self = separate self/ego/self-contraction/all of these concepts: Solipsism = madness. It depends on the mindstream claiming Solipsism. If done not from a truly enlightened perspective/mindstream, it is just ego-inflation: Ego = God. Which is the equivalent of shooting oneself in the knee and embarking on the Enlightenment-marathon of getting rid of anything separating/ego. Quite a show, although it doesn't reach Athens. Selling Water by the River

That's because you don't look your fear in the face, otherwise you would know that right now you are full of fear, of control, of self-contraction. Your entire mental stream is basically fear. yours and everyone's. Anything what's going to happen is going to happen, so why to fear it? Just relax and abandon yourself, you are now in the infinity, your fear is not control anything, so trust in reality and relax. That's what works for me. do it consciously and really, feel yourself deeply, and surrender yourself to the limitless now. You don't have control of anything, so you let yourself fall, you surrender your need to understand, to control, to hold on to a mental handhold. It is something quite difficult , some psychedelic helps, even weed, 5meo or LSD, but just sometimes. I try constantly with or without psychedelic as deeply as possible, only that really makes sense, it is the great mystery of existence, and right now it is. you have to merge with it, penetrate into living reality. If you manage to do, it's the glory, all you problems will finish, you will laugh 10 min of pure happiness. You will realize that all your life you was lost, just until now

With the energetic practices/meditation that you describe one can generate states that are awakened and boundless/nondual. But as soon as the energetic practice stops, the separate-self Gestalt/structure "kills" the nondual boundless blissful state when it comes back after practice. One can literally feel it contract back in the head. Its like applying medicine to a disease. Relieves the symptoms, but not the source problem (separate-self contraction. Literally contraction, creating contraction/location/center in the head and body). There are practices that dissolve the separate-self-contraction directly (the root-cause, or the source problem, and not just its symptoms, no nonduality and lacking bliss), in a way that the whole flow of I-thoughts/I-feelings is cut off in real time fast enough (Trekchö in Dzogchen for example, certain Mahamudra practices), That (dissolving all me-thoughts/concepts and -feelings) fast enough in real time (needs a lot of training) then leads to dissolving the sensation of being centered in the body (the contractions and localizations), and also leads to "hard" nondual/infinite Awakened states (then also off the pillow in daily life), including the "solidity" of the "outher" world being replaced by mere lucid appearance hovering in infinite Nothingness/Reality/Ones True Self as expressions of it, "seeing itself". Without these two shifts towards truly nondual awakened states (loss of center and mere appearance instead of solid external world), most of the talk/writing about it is just wishful thinking and conceptual speculation. It is not just thinking differently, these are "hard" awakened states. Only in these awakened states can the real state of Reality be realized, and the separate self slowly dissolved. Without these hard awakened nondual states, there is only illusion/duality/separate-self, and no chance to really realize what the underlying nondual Reality beyond the illusion/ignorance really is. I have the impression that is an important point for you, since you are among the rather few that actually practice and not just engage in conceptual speculation, but in generating these awakened states. And I agree fully on that. I have written extensively about these practices of Dzogchen/Mahamudra. If that is done proficient & fast enough, the mechanism of creating a separate-self and a localization & center stops, and one has these awakened boundless/nondual/infinite states of Infinite Nondual Consciousness in daily life when getting up from the pillow. I can confirm this from my own practice. It is too good to be true. Yet, it is true, and at that stage of practice always available. From that basis and in these states, one can dissolve the last remnants of the separate self contractions/localizations/lenses of perception in the burning of ones own infinite and impersonal True Being. The contractions that were the separate-self/ego melt like ice in the sun. I can only invite to try these techniques. In my experience, they are way superior to any standard concentration/energetic sitting meditation/practice. Exactly because it attacks the root-cause, and opens up Awakened Nonduality States in daily life. Mahamudra uses extensively concentrative sitting-meditation and energetic practices (Tummo for example) in the beginning, but goes beyond it as soon as possible. Off the pillow. Water by the River Here a description of the practice system I mainly used: https://www.actualized.org/forum/topic/92467-god-fucking-damn-it-another-meditation-rant-thread/?do=findComment&comment=1309816

Very True. Allow me some musings (in general, not specifically to your answer), since this is an important point. The Absolute Reality can only be described/approached with a) what it is not (in-finite, silent, Abyss, Nothing-"ness"), via negative (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apophatic_theology), Nagarjuna Madyamaka https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Śūnyatā). Although Yogachara/Consciousness only school (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yogachara) extended that to Infinite Consciousness (which is true), we are already on a slippery slope here giving the Absolute limitations and (relative) properties. b) pointers showing a path to practices (actual practices, not just concepts) that can generate certain nondual awakened states in which the realization of it (Reality itself and ones True Self) can happen by itself ("Enlightenment"). By removing the filters/clouds of the ego and BEING infinite reality itself. Why? Because all these pointers appear WITHIN Absolute Reality. Can an infinite ocean define and realize itself fully using only water as pointer in an infinite "mass" of water? So we can describe the waves of the ocean and what the ocean does, and how it confuses all the waves to think they are waves. But we can never describe the infinite ocean fully with concepts. For that, one has to be it and realize it. And for that, the ego/self-contraction has to truly die and get truly transcended. Not just wear new cloths (I am God/facet a/facet b/.../n+1). Which is the same as the wave declaring it is the ocean. Deep Identity Level change. How does one spot it? Wave=psychological suffering. Ocean = potential for no more psychological suffering when the wave is truly dead/transcended, having been seen through and fully being/living as the ocean. Quite a task, but nothing else to do for eternity... Selling Water by the River

"When I look around me at the things in my world and say, “Everything is alive,” what I’m really saying is that everything is consciousness in a process of evolution. Just as evolutionary biologists look at a human being and say, “Millions of years ago, you were just a single cell swimming in a primeval sea,” so I might look at myself and think, “Millions of years ago, my consciousness was a sofa in an alien’s living room circling Epsilon Beta IV in the Gamma Quadrant!” And who knows what far future David Spangler may be starting his evolution of consciousness as my easy chair right now? This is fanciful, of course, but my main point is not. We all participate in a universe of consciousness that is evolving all the time, from the dimmest flickering of sentiency existing in a dream state that is not even self-aware to the fabulously and unimaginably complex and radiant cosmic Beings whose lives embrace entire galaxies. And what we do affects that evolution, at least in the environment around us. I have encountered subtle beings in the higher-order realms in comparison to whom my consciousness is not much more evolved than the sentiency I find in my sofa. Their response to me is always loving, caring, considerate, and appropriate. They are like shepherds of consciousness, tending its evolution across vast expanses of life and energy. The light of my sentiency is like a shadow compared to theirs, yet they tend to it—as they do to millions and billions of other lives and consciousnesses within the field of their awareness—as if it were the brightest, most valuable flame in creation. This is the true implication of saying that everything is alive. We are each caretakers for the consciousnesses evolving around us, particularly those of lesser complexity and capacity than our own. When it gets down to it, I really am my sofa’s keeper!" David Spangler, Subtle Worlds, An Explorer's Field Notes I thought maybe that is interesting for some. The range of beings, from Sofa to human to beings embracing entire galaxies, towards totally alien realms beyond. And we as humans in the middle. Able to realize and live our True Nature of Infinite Consciousness/Reality itself. Until we do something else next life. Maybe develop towards that Galactic thing? Who knows... And endless wonderful path still ahead. What do we do while here on the planet? Preview being Galactic beings (or Alien beings/realms beyond) in certain psychedelic states this life with boosting consciousness? Or realizing and stabilizing our essence, that which we really are: Absolute Reality, Pure Impersonal Infinite Awareness in nondual Union with all that is arising? The blissfull Empty Infinite Centerless Timeless Nonduality of Awakened Awareness? And going previewing other possible modes of existence from that basis/realization, with or without psychedelics? Or not at all? Or tending our garden, hobbies, enjoying earth? Or both? That I don't know, and the answer is unique for each being. But one thing I do know and have realized, beyond any doubt or possibility of error: Going exploring before having stabilized the realization of True Nature/Enlightenment and access to ones True Impersonal Nondual Infinite Nature (and the blissfull states it brings resting in that can bring) can only mean regular suffering. By definition, like any other separate-self and its projects to ease the suffering. Because where there is not this realization, there is only the self-contraction/duality/separate ego and its cycles of suffering and fear and contraction. Which seeks easing its suffering by having the sublime experiences/states of higher consciousness/realm states, often of psychedelic nature. Having said & written that: Bon voyage on whatever your path may be. Walk it, but don't have the illusion that peaking and previewing divine and higher realms brings the permanent freedom from (psychological) suffering/resistance/contraction that only transcending the self-contraction/ego can bring. Preview it, peak into the bliss of divine higher realms, explore it and try it for as long as necessary, and then realize and stabilize the bliss of ones True Nondual and Pure Impersonal Nature/Being right here, right now, on this earth. Water by the River PS: 2nd thread started ever. Hope nobody is too annoyed by this one.

Excellent. I agree. PTSD caused by chronic pain has strongly direct body/stress impact. It doesnt mean Adya is in automatic psychological resistance (psychlogical resistance suffering) to that. Apparently, some here like to deny the possibility of that - and the possibility of truly realizing ones True Nature. Why denying this potential? Probably because it would mean its necessary to actually seriously engage in regular practice of transcending the self-contraction/ego. Sitting down and meditate. Building conceptual castles of declaring Ego=God and no practice/transcendence/meditation necessary and sometimes doing psychedelics is a lot easier than actually seriously undertaking long-time transformative practice. That would be all fine and well, much better than doing nothing spiritual at all. But declaring that higher as the transformative/transcendence path needs a lot of denying and blind spots. Including denying and blind spots on the topics of psychological suffering/resistance to what is, and enlightenment. Which is exactly what we can see here... A challenge to all of these aficionados: Sit down 5 hours and face the wall. Bored or resistance? Well, there are the ego arisings to be transcended/cut-off, delivered free house.... Too annoying or not enough will-power? Bored and unable to push through? All fine and well. But then please at least some honesty and integrity on the topic of what is possible and what not and not all these defense-mechanisms of the e**. Seriously Selling water by the River

You don't need to experience the content of the mindstream of other perspectives to understand their essence/Awareness/Being. Only a fraction of Full Enlightenment descriptions contain a description like Leavitts Picture. And actually, there is no need for that. Structure/essence vs. content. Why it is that way can not really be communicated in language, but becomes clear once realization happens: a) When the last remnants for separation/individuality/separate-self are realized as just arisings in the Infinite Boundless Opening of Absolute Reality/Awareness, and the essence of each and every arising is realized to be a manifestation of THAT, there can be nothing outside/beyond/other to that. It is limitless, boundless and infinite. All there is and can be. Absolute Reality itself. b) The realization that there is nothing other than that Reality excludes the possiblity that there are other "Awarenesses" outside of that. c) And for the validity that each being has the same Pure Impersonal Awareness as its essence: That is a direct realization of just looking at one "other" being/perspective in these enlightened states. It is you. But here, I can not convince you with words or concepts. Train towards these nondual infinite pure empty Awareness states for yourself, and see. a) b) and c) is enough for Full Realization of Reality (and the essence of all possible beings). But like I said, I never claimed I can proove that to anyone without that being having Realization/Enlightenment. And I can't transfer that via text. No one can. Yet the model of Leavitt is a model that makes much more intuitive sense than the standard solipsistic "I exist and all other beings are blank puppets without Awareness or Non-Player-Characters so to say". That view is hazardous for awakening, it ends in Nihilism and Narcissism. That is the only reason I argue against it. It is a bad pointer that leads into the claws of ego and self-contraction and not liberation.

For the Totality/Wholeness of the Absolute and Manifest aspect: The gold (Absolute) and the ring (manifested side of the Absolute/arising/appearance) made out of gold metaphor. It is a Infinite Unity and Totality. Always gold, but the ring can appear or be gone. The nature/essence of the ring is gold. But not the other way round. And for equating anything with the Absolute (and not with its manifest side or potential): The Absolute is truly Infinite. It is neither this nor that, not even love. It is beyond it all. It couldn't be any different. It is your true BEING, but not what you think your being is right now. Realize it, then you will understand. The Absolute is beyond it all. If you would understand it, you would be enlightened right now. It can't be communicated in words. Once you start intuiting/realizing it, it will be totally clear. Where was unconditional love in deep sleep? Before your birth? After your death? These are all Koans that pointing directly to your truly Infinite Absolute Nature, which is literally right here right now, but covered under a myriad of clouds of mistaken identities (thoughts/feelings). These Koans have a very clear answer, just not one that can be carried with words and language/duality. A good approximation is: The Absolute is both totally empty (undescribeable) and also infinite potential. The Infinite Potential contains the potential for unconditional love, expressed then in the manifested side of the Absolute/Infinite Consciousness. But that is already to much concepts. The referent of the signifier must be there: Realization of the Absolute in an awakened state. That is then called Enlightenment (the full&final one). Sorry, language ends somewhere here. Maybe one more idea/metaphor: The blind men describing the elephant: One says its a hose, one says a trunk, and so on. The facets of Awakening. If the elephant is the manifested side of consciousness, then the whole (infinite) elephant has love as its essence so to say. Because fundamentally it is a nondual Unity. And where there is an other, there is fear (Upanishads somewhere). And if there is no other (nondual infinite unity), there is only love. And the Absolute would be the spaceless locationless unmanifest (no body, center, location, anything. FULLY EMPTY) Awareness of the elephant, "seeing itself", but also in nondual union with it. The gold from the ring-metaphor and the elephant the ring. And if the elephant is zapped out of existence, the Absolute Awareness is neither aware of the elephant, nor (and that is important) of itself. There is no time, no space, no nothing. But the POTENTIAL for sentience/awareness. Unaware of itself. But as soon as the elephant arises/manifests again (with love as its essence, see above), Absolute Awareness "sees" again - love. So it can only manifest as metaphysical love so to say. And now make elephant infinite (no boundaries) limitless... And there can only be love! Yet the Absolute can not be defined with love (only). Not even with (Self-)Consciousness/Awareness, since that doesn't happen when nothing arises/manifests. But with potential for Awareness if something arises. And since the separate-self-contraction is perfectly capable of clouding over the original state of infinite love&bliss (resulting from nondual infinite unity, aka "no other"), instead of doing all these metaphysical conceptual word-games, it would be better to sit down and practice cutting off the mindstream with all its illusion-arisings of the separate-self-contraction. And become empty nondual infinite impersonal Awareness itself. Then love will flow freely anyway, which is all that counts. Ok, now a Zen-Master or two are probably going to kill me....

Sure, but it clearly shows you what is Absolute (or fundamental, or Reality itself) and what is just a temporary arising within it (as it of course, but still within it). It clearly shows (or makes one realize and understand) which is eternal, omnipresent, timeless, changeless, infinite. And that is how you can define Reality, or God. In other words: It shows what is always there, and can not not be there. Which funnily is also the True You. Metaphysical love: Lets do a thought experiment like the following: When nothing arising, you don't know that you exist. Deep Sleep. Yet you are. You reappear every morning. So even a very subtle (self-)consciousness is an arising IN Reality. That becomes very clear once having had these states in meditation. So when anything at all, however subtle arises, a "you", a consciousness "of" can appear. Or just the colour red for example, without self-consciousness (in an animal for example). But it arises and is being "awared". That is manifestation/arising. And as soon as there is red (or any other arising for that matter), there is also underlying fundamental love. Because the reality in which it arises, that which arises, and the Awareness of it is a Unity, and love is the opposite of division/duality. It is the intuition, experience, and pull back of/from this underlying nondual Unity. The Totality pulls all beings with that love back home to their True Being. And that is why love is as fundamental as any other of the first manifestations occuring in the Infinite (like space, time, first forms/archetypes of manifestation). How that works in practice: Feel in certain empty awakened states into an appearance, and use something like the Koan "what is this really". The answer will be something like you & light of Reality & love. But that is not the fundamental Infinite Absolute. The Infinite is really fully infinite or empty, or not definable. It is YOU. And YOU can't "see" YOU as an object. The eye can't see itself. Everything you see is illusion-arising-manifestation IN True You. At that point you have fully realized how "you" (small y) can be fully switched off in deep sleep and yet True You (capital y) still be there as the Absolute Infinite. That realization is a beyond a mere conceptual-insight, and can't be fully explained. It is a realization which can only be had in infinite boundless nondual mere appearance awakened states, and then asking what is "beyond" that, or what is True Me. You have to BE it, and then ask yourself what IS it. And then "you" or It can realise itself, but only out of this certain states. But that you is not a thought. That you already has to be the Totality in a nondual way. And to get to these states, you need a lot of training in getting an empty mindstream and cutting off each and any blabla concept in the mindstream. Psychedelics get you to these nondual states, but its not empty/impersonal enough to realize what is "beyond" that. And then one confuses the Totality of Manifestation with the Infinite Absolute Unchanging Timeless beyond. The real realization is a very clear and simple answer, a direct realization, without any FURTHER or beyond or n+1. And it is not a fundamental reductionistic baseline, because it is the Realization of Reality itself, and of realizing the essence of every arising in it. General Omniscience so to say. Not the content of all realms, but the essence/suchness/substance of every possible manifestation. In other words, of anything possible at all. That is why its final, and why Osaid said that once the Ultimate Truth is realized, its done. Everything else is just content/manifestation/realms: Fun to explore, but why grasp & suffer doing it? God is doing the evaluation of its endless potential anyway, and will never(!) run out of worlds/realms to explore (remember, its infinite). And God is doing a better job at it with more grace than currently Leo, who does this clearly in a grasping and suffering way. But declaring that project higher than realizing Ultimate Truth. A perfect recipe for suffering: Declaring/confusing the lower (Manifested Side of Infinite Consciousness) with the higher (Absolute, totally empty and infinite at the same time, without opposite). Ok, back to love: So love is so fundamental that as soon as any manifestation arises it is there. One could say that the Absolute is love. But on the other side it is not, since the Absolute can be without any arising. So its a question of what is more fundamental. And since the realization of this Absolute is the all deciding "point", a pointer saying the Absolute is love is rejected as a non-efficient pointer by most enlightened persons. Yet, it is a very difficult topic, because one could validly say that the Absolute is maybe not love, but its first manifestation is love, the essence of any manifestation is love, the essence of any possible world is love, love is what got the whole game going and what makes the Universe evolve back to its source, grow in complexity so that it can realize its own Unity in the form of enlightened beings. And in practical daily life, as we have heard thousands of times before, all that matters is love. That is true! The only remark is: To fully love all the time, the separate-self-contraction has to be fully transcended, since it keeps the game going with unloving periods, and its "projects" chasing experiences to get back the love/bliss. Selling Water by the River PS: And the realization that you can not not be there, even if unaware in Deep Sleep: That is really coming home, You can NEVER loose yourself, and never did. The world becomes home, all separate-self-contractions that were the essence of "un-love" or "masked" the natural and inherent flow of love stop, the underlying infinite Unity becomes apparent, and the mindstream becomes love & bliss. For some, even divine/celestial perception showing how universal consciousness rolls out reality starts, like Harri Aalto or David Buckland for example. That is where Leo thinks he is the only one exploring these realms with psychedelics, but that is wrong. Life then becomes the celebration that its meant to be. And that is not the "end" of Enlightenment, but just the start of all which comes after, this life and the following ones. Each being expresses this realization differently, since individuality as separation gets lost, and not individuality as being/mindstream. Each one will express his/her enlightened love differently.

That is how it looks like when one has not reached Full Enlightenment. Full Enlightenment is the realization of what everything is (Reality), and what oneself truly is. By BEING it. He thinks he has it with his Awakenings, but I agree with Inlightened1 and Osaid that he confuses the lower with the higher. Leo is busy engaging in the exploration of that which is already manifestation and form, although of the higher/highest realms of the manifestation of consciousness. But still manifestation occuring IN the Absolute and not being/realizing Absolute itself by being it fully and truly. Impersonal. And that exploration can easily become an addiction and disfunction. To ease the suffering of the ego/self-contraction that is not transcended. Hence, no Awakening in sobrestates , because the self-contraction is in the way and not cut off/transcended fast enough in real time. No nondual awakened states sobre, because the untranscended self-contraction/ego prevents it. And guess what this untranscended separate-self/ego is doing in AWAKENINGS? Misinterpreting the Awakening, and what the true self really is. Although it doesn't see that all these Awakenings are interpreted though the lense that the self-contraction constitutes. Ego = God. Wilber on that in Religion of the Future. Chapter Dysfunctions of the 3rd-Tier Structure-Views, Violet Meta-Mind: "The “visionary” nature of the violet meta-mind is fundamentally due to the growing perception that the entire Kosmos is indeed a coenaction of consciousness itself, and the present given universe, as normally perceived, is merely one of hundreds or even thousands (or more) of other worlds (and this, indeed, is one interpretation of the string theory of modern physics). On the one hand (from one perspective), these are all different aspects of One World; on the other (from another perspective), they are all completely separate and different worlds altogether. Individuals often have the sense that they can “penetrate” or “step into” one or more of these other dimensions —the world is just such a wildly open, transparent, diaphanous, sheer, gossamer, filmy place that one can walk right through it and intoother worlds. And the Present moment itself is often the doorway; it is not by “transcending” temporal duration entirely that one can penetrate to an alternative reality but by entering into this Present with more and more Presence. One can step deeply enough into the timeless Now to step into another dimension altogether—just step right here, and push hard. It’s easy to get lost in those worlds, which are, at bottom, simply different dimensions and perspectives of one’s own (violet) consciousness (although, as noted, from another angle, they are all real, ontologically different realms because they are each genuinely co-enacted by a different perspective in consciousness). Given that this stage is the first great transition from “earthly” realms to “heavenly” realms (as a permanent structural enaction), getting lost in these “higher worlds” is indeed one of the most common dysfunctions of this level. The deeply transcendental, otherworldly, electrically visionary nature of consciousness at this altitude makes fixation to this side of the street an incredibly inviting and alluring venture. This is likely to couple with the dysfunction, discussed earlier, of standing in heaven and giving a blistering critique of life here on earth, with all the semiprophetic pomp and pomposity that comes with it." And for the claim that no one has reached or explored what Leo tells about with all the Alien Awakening and so on stuff, because no one is telling/writing about it. I disagree here: Maybe check Harri Aalto, Christopher Bache, David Buckland, Stanislaf Grof and Jürgen Ziewe (and his descriptions of the Superrealms). And many others more on request. I have not seen one fundamentally and structurally really new description of the explorations he claims that has not been described before. I doubt he has read much about other explorers of these realms, and that is why he thinks he is the only AWAKE. And when he claims he is the most AWAKE on the planet: Little Public Relations-recommendation: The most awake on the planet of all those he knows, read or heard about. Or better claim clairvoyant skills (able to judge each person on the planet) right from the beginning. Water by the River

Guess Ralston would agree... "because enlightenment is truth, the reduction in suffering is just a side effect." And very much yes to that. If one thinks about it: Something has to rout beings home, and that mechanism is called suffering. NOT staying separate and in duality & happy ever after. And why should suffering continue when being back home? That suffering has to rout beings back home into non-separation is a Kosmic necessity/law of the highest degree, valid in each and all possible realms and dimensions. Spirit "casting itself out" in manifestation, and drawing itself back in again with the tool of suffering. Making (the illusion) of each separate-self-contraction/suffering (separation/duality) return home to the Unity (non-separation) of its True-being. Couldn't be different. Leaving beings "out" eternally in separation would be cruel... And: After having returned home to Enlightenment and non-separation, the individual perspective/soul doesn't stop to evolve and continues to other lives and other/higher possible forms of existences (maybe Leos Aliens?) Of course as a relative appearing phenomena, not as "Absolute Truth" or self-existing/separate-existing anything. Nirvana as extinction was a very early Buddhist dogma, and was replaced quite soon later (Mahayana, Vajrayana, Rainbow-body and so on...). It just does so in a non-separates non-identified way, knowing and understanding its True Nature and its unity with all of existence. Selling Water by the River

I like Snoopys perspective on these not so happy transitionings from this life to the next: ... and the end of suffering is possible, as stated by every spiritual tradition since millenia. Thousands of Realizers over the centuries stating that. And the recipe is transcending the illusion of the separate self-contraction, becoming the Nondual Totality/Reality, and then finding out what is aware of all of that... or the real You, Reality itself. And before talking about keeping that final Realization while being nailed at the cross, it is a good start maintaining some Awakening during everday life. There have been prominent cases who have had challenges with staying in the awakened perspective during these unfortunate transitions (Jesus on the cross “My God, My God, Why Have You Forsaken Me"). But since the Real Nature of every being has no moving parts or anything else objective/material that could be "damaged", apparently "IT" didn't get damaged while suffering that procedure. Or any other of the lovely mishaps you mention. But Nightmares are possible in the dream for sure. IT never changes, because it is empty pure Impersonal Awareness itself without any core, mechanism or objective/material anything. And it is also all of manifested/imagined Reality in a nondual way. Worst case you can have is a nightmare. Although a veery realistic one. That is why Karma is so important: Its all a dream, but one can have a nightmare, and Karma works with mathematical precission. So, anyways, just take up some hopefully efficient practice and see for yourself concerning the topic of the end of suffering. Selling Water by the River

Yes (the bold letters). The Real You. An Infinite silent eternal Abyss/Singularity of Infinite (empty and impersonal, or pure) Consciousness, being Infinite Reality/Existence itself, and containing all worlds and arisings/apperances in a nondual way, perceiving itself by itself. And once the separate-self-arisings parts of the human are gone (or known well and cut off fast enough), IT becomes stable. The functional part of the human/soul/individuality continues, even better than before, because it no longer suffers from a mistaken identity and the separate-self-contraction. Selling Water by the River

Beautiful! IT (what you describe, bold markings by me) is always right here, and can not be gone. Just temporarily clouded with containing/giving arising to the illusion-arisings of the self-contraction (certain I-thoughts and I-feelings). One can do perfectly fine without them, because most of them are just suffering. I am happy for you that you had this Awakening, insight and experience. That is a wonderful "place" to live ones life from. Water by the River PS: Just some further musings, not specifically intented as answer for you/your post, but also for others that maybe are a bit put off (or just dont really know what I mean by that) by my frequent mentioning of the Impersonal/Nonpersonal [or empty] Nature of Reality/Pure Primary Consciousness/Infinite Consciousness. I certainly would have been a few years ago. [IT/Infinite Reality (what you describe, bold markings by me) is always right here, and can not be gone. Just temporarily clouded with containing/giving arising to the illusion-arisings of the self-contraction (certain I-thoughts and I-feelings). One can do perfectly fine without them, because most of them are just suffering.] Yet, after waking up, the personal individuality/soul stays, though no longer being a separate-self, but an enlightened being in nondual unity with existence itself. Impersonal or non-personal is not bad at all (although it can sound scary in the beginning), but on the opposite: It allows for the full expression of ones individuality or soul-qualities, that now can finally flourish in nonduality, and are no in a contracted separate-ness, hampeing its flow and expression with suffering and other not so nice experiences. But instead expressing itself fully in the Infinite Existence/Reality that one really is then, containing in this perspective (of Indras Net/Reality itself) this individual soul and its expressions. It is like: Unenlightened Being/perspective = Absolute Reality + Individuality/soul + and separate-self arisings cutting Nonduality/Reality into two, creating suffering and/or boredom. Enlightened Being/perspective (or better woken up perspective in Indras Net, since the separate being has been transcended and replaced with Infinite Reality itself) = Absolute Reality + Individuality/soul (each perspective/being is different, have different traits and capacities and inclinations, even enlightened ones) + and no more separate-self arisings cutting Nonduality/Reality into two, but instead True Identity= Impersonal/Nonpersonal Infinite Reality + containing (transcended and intergrated) Individuality/soul, evolving further in this non-contracted state of being. Enlightenment is not the final end of the caterpillar-being (only of certain aspects of it (clouding mechanisms, separate-self-illusions), preventing it from being a butterfly), but just the beginning of the unique butterfly and its path, this life and the next...

Thanks for describing your experience. I do agree with that, based on my own experience. And thousands of others in all cultures and centuries described it like you do. That is a very important element of the path. It probably sounds quite a bit nuts, boring and strange. At least I would have interpreted it like that a few years ago... But that is exactly how the Impersonal (Silent/Pure/Empty) Infinite Consciousness perceives all of its manifestation in certain awakened nondual states, watching itself, perceiving itself, being itself and the world, by itself, for itself. (1) That starts to happen when the self-contraction/separate-self is seen through, transcended and cut off either with high enough speed & proficiency, or with some more energetic state-change techniques. So the resulting flow of bliss makes it no longer possible for any grasping/contracting thought/feeling-arising to grip & contract the focus/attention (and cut the nondual field into two, or duality), and create bad emotions/stop the flow of bliss. And motivating the separate-self with that resulting suffering again for searching or avoiding certain experiences to eradicate the suffering, and relax the contraction again. That process you describe is the natural way that leads the transition to the deep identity level change to ones True Nature, the Infinite Silent and peaceful/blissful Abyss of Pure Consciousness without location or any kind of objective appearance... When not finding IT (or Consciousness, or oneself), at some point the localization of consciousness dissolves, making every appearance (thought, feeling, cloud, tree, the whole world including ones "small self") just an appearance arising in the Infinite, silent & empty and not-personal Eternal Reality of Ones True Being, Infinite Consciousness, or Reality itself. (2) And when it is seen that even the "Understander" of this Nondual and Awake Realization is nothing more than a bundle of "understanding"-thoughts arising WITHIN THAT, then Full Enlightenment is finally seeing that there never was a separate-self besides an illusion, and nobody (besides) an Illusion actually woke up. Pure Infinite Consciousness/Being was there throughout, undisturbed, just containing some illusion-arisings. And yet, that Realization or waking up of that perspective of Indras Net makes all the difference in the dream of that perspective, finally dissolving the self-contraction/separate-self illusion even of the "Understander" of all of that for good. Selling Water by the River PS: (1) are the stages of dissolving the separate-self into nonduality, and (2) is going from Nonduality/Unity towards even relaxing/dissolving the "Understander"-separate-self-illusion of that into Infinite Consciousness/Reality itself. More on that in this post: PS PS: For Infinite Reality to create a separate-self/self-contraction/ego and to maintain it, there are just two emotions needed that have to regularly occur in cycles (not permanently, that would also kill the separate-self) : 1) suffering (in the meaning of non-satisfied-ness, or "non-bliss" , and 2) boredom. That starts all of the projects for getting back again the bliss via certain experiences (whatever that may be varies a lot). A bliss that would be there if not the separate-self-contraction would stop its flow via contracting. Of course, that can only be seen after having touched the natural bliss of ones True Being, because if that would be seen earlier the whole process would be shut off immediately. But if there is no technique available to just cut off the contraction/suffering, one has to stick to grasping for certain experiences, because that is then all one has...

You would be the first one for whom that bliss-out has worked permanently without the comprehension or Realization of Full Enlightenment by just shutting off the mind and sitting still. I see. If you mean the manifestations/appearances/Awakenings n+1 that Consciousness can produce WITHIN it and become aware of it, awaken to it ever more: It is endless. In that way, you also don't comprehend it. And never finally will or can. Its God business exploring what it/God can do, its potential, forever. We are the instruments of the Reality/God doing that. It will never stop, never run out of new Awakeninsg. An Infinity of Infinties, as already Cantor has shown. But I do comprehend the Absolute, or my True Nature, and the nature of the dream. And with that all possible dreams. And that ends the separate-self, and the psychological suffering. And with that, we align. And I am, and will remain, a big fan of your explorations and Awakenings. Just have some mercy on your followers: Many of them don't have the potential you have of exploring the Multiverse/Consciousness, and just suffer more if they don't pursue the classic path to the end of suffering, the end of the separate-self contraction, or Full Enlightenment, and go instead for exploring the Infinite Infinities of Reality. Most of them will probably not reach Full Enlightenment in this life, but it is not the only life they have. It is growth over a long cycle of lifes (see for example Jürgen Ziewe, http://www.multidimensionalman.com/Multidimensional-Man/Life_after_death_-_a_description_of_the_afterlife.html ). Maybe they have to learn their individual package in this life? Setting these up for the path of the (fascinating and important) exploration of the Infinity of Dimensions of Reality and ever higher Awakenings into Consciousness (your Karma) will lead to additional suffering on their side. Maybe there is balance possible that honours the respect, beauty and splendour of Gods creations, ever higher Awakenings and becoming more consciousness (that I don't denie at all), and the path each soul is traveling towards its True Being? To minimize suffering for all possible beings? Water by the River

But if one can access the Absolute at will (the visual field as boundless timeless infinite nondual mere appearance), switch off the self-contraction/separate-self (and its suffering included) at will if it dares to raise its ugly head again, and STAY in that Ultimate Impersonal Reality... that says something about (to use your words) how conscious "one" is. Well, you can turn it around it all the ways you want. The fact that Ultimate Reality is not stable accessible and suffering continues is the hallmark of the psychedelic-afficionados, from all I have seen so far. How come Infinitely intelligent Reality doesn't let the psychedelic afficionado rest blissfully in True Nature? Why does suffering not stop in that case? Because Infinitely Intelligent Ultimate Reality doesn't want that (nor could it, even if "it" wanted) a not fully transcended ego/separate-self stays there blissed out and proclaims "that is the highest". IT is IMPERSONAL Infinite Consciousness. With Impersonal in bold letters. And until that is delivered by fully transcending and killing the separate-self-arisings in normal life, there is practice of transcedence and "dying to the lower identites" to be done. The suffering is what pulls a separate-self back to its True Nature, Empty Impersonal Infinite Consciousness, or Reality itself (including the manifest show in a nondual way). Honestly, if there ever has been one big warning sign dangling on top of all of that proclaimed "highest Awakeninsg n+1", it is what described in the paragraph above. Suffering continues. And Reality will make you suffer until you get that. Cruel game? Not really, no one gets left behind halfway up the mountain, in the suffering of the claws of the self-contraction of the separate-self, until that is fully transcended and gone. And going exploring the Multiverse in ever "higher" Awakenings ."Higher" into what? The Absolute can not be higher or lower, only form/manifestation/appearance/arisings WITHIN IT. So its higher Awakenings into ever more relative appearing arisings, not the Absolute. And that will just prolong that suffering. Please prove me wrong. If you don't shut down the show here, we all are in the prime seats to watch it. Anyway, bon voyage! Water by the River

Yes. or: Nietzsche: God is dead. God: Nietzsche is dead. God (if one is inclined to call it so. Absolute Reality comes a bit less... "God-loaden") contains the ego. But the ego ist for sure not God. The essence of the ego is the same essence as everything else. The ego may think its God, but... well, you know the rest. Actually it is not so difficult to get, both in theory in practice, but apparently its just too much fun for certain egos to consider themselves God. Well, the show made out of that confusion (ego=God) here is .... well. Great Show IMPERSONAL Infinite Consciousness. Which is the same as EMPTY Infinite Consciousness. Which is Reality. That contains it all, ego & character & reality & all the rest. An example: The Reality/essence of a gold ring is gold. If the ring is molten, the essence is still the same. So the essence/God/Reality/Infinite Impersonal Consciousness IS the gold, not the ring. To say the Reality/God is the Ring is incorrect, because the ring can be gone. The ring thinking it is all that exists = Conceptual Solipsism. The gold/IMPERSONAL Empty Infinite Consciousness understanding/realizing its Reality = True Nondual "Solipsism". But if there is only One, or better Oneness, whats the point of talking about Solipsism? To whom? Then the ring is no longer believed. It is seen through. It stops existing as being anything more than an Illusion-arising. Telling other rings/Egos "you are God" only boosts the ring, the clouding over of the actual state of things. It is a trap. What is never the case: Ego = God. Ego = an arising within God/Reality. A part of it. Contained in it. One ring appearing in and made out of an infinite Sea of gold/Impersonal Consciousness/Reality. That is why Awakening is not stable for Psychedelic-only aficionados. Psychedelics "bomb" large parts of the ego/separate self out of functionality (but not all of them), stoppling large parts of the clouding over of the true state of things, revealing larger parts of how Reality/True Nature really is. But not all of them. And especially not when off the trip. And that is why suffering doesn't stop. Ego=separate self= self contraction = regular suffering. Water by the River

Reminds me of a joke: A guy dies and is sent to hell. Extremely frightened because of that, he is very surprised when he arrives; beach, palm trees, sun is shining, happy people around in shorts and bikinis. Behind the next corner there are people eating great food and there's some cool music playing. After some time of wondering, a man in an expensive suit approaches him and says: "Hi, you must be the new one. Welcome to hell, I'm the devil. As you're gonna spend eternity here, make yourself comfortable and have a drink. If anything bothers you, always feel free to ask me." The guy still doesn't really understand what's going on, this is not what he expected. But finally he decides to inspect the area. Everywhere he goes, there are people laughing and having a great time, there's games, party and fun all around. Then he arrives at a steep cliff that divides the paradise hell from an area underneath, and there is hell as we know it: demons torturing the doomed, there's fire and the smell of brimstone. Shocked, he runs to the devil and says "Devil, how can that be? Here, we have the sweet eternity and down there people are tortured and burned! How can that be?!" The devil laughs and says "Oh, that. That's the Catholics - they want it that way." Yes. Anyway, no big disagreements. You are on the path, which is all that counts. I am just making commercials of the lovely holiday-destination soon to be reached, so to say. And understanding that is extremly valueable. The contraction that kicks in shortly before fully waking up while slumbering, if you ever had that kind of experience. It is a very real and feelable contraction in the head, that at least I couldn't dissolve when I first started noticing it while waking up. It is that contraction that evaporates into/"becoming" the visual field/Infinity when nondual awakened states start to begin/kick in. And when that contraction/self-contraction is dissolved during waking-life, suffering is just not more possible. Vast spacious tension-free Suchness of Reality, no thought-arising "gripping". It is that what one searches in every experience one normally seeks. It is that self-contraction/localization (often in the head) that psychedelics tend to blast away, among doing other stuff also. Imagine you could do that with just cutting your thought-stream and staying "on-top" of it, watching it (the thought stream) spool down in you, but not "gripping" "you". That is a wonderful relief, physically and energetically felt in the body. It is not escapism, its an additional degree of freedom to live ones life from that state. That is not the end of the story, a subtle identity (althought non-localized) is still left-over after this point, but here its starts to get really lovely. Selling Water by the River