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I've been in close proximity with a volunteer. And his everyday rituals. There's this pledge, I forget the wording.. "...I will strive my best to fulfil Sadhguru's vision.." more words but it ends like that. My reaction to that was utter contempt. He worships his guru with a photo and some Yantra and other usual stuffs like burning camphor, wearing bhasma. Not against any of that, I get it, rituals are a powerful way to invoke certain stuff. This is a cult. That's when I got into thinking what's the point of Shambhavi. I started connecting the dots. He mentions Shambhavi as "she's a star"..like she's a person, coincidence? I think not. In one of what Sadhguru claims to be his past life where he was a snake guy, his girlfriend's name was Shambhavi, and people killed him with his own snakes for that love affair. That was his first experience into awareness while dying. There's so much crazy stuff than the eye meets. Shambhavi is like a temple that once you're initiated, it's there, the point of your daily practices is to clean the temple, take care of it. It's borrowed bliss. This is quite a common theme in the Hindu culture with local deities. You're submitting something of yours for something in return. And the next is, knowing a community of people who are dedicated to volunteering, and doing the practices. That's where everything broke for me. The way he frames this. He's selling you bliss. I'm not saying it cannot work, but what it will do is destroy your possibility for material growth in big ways, unless you're an asshole who can use this to extract the preferred hormones by submission and use it as a cushion to do horrible things, basic hierarchy we find all over nature and human cultures, work a shitty job which pays well, cope with the money. All spiritual practices have an element to them which destroys your material nature if you're serious about it. I do agree with him that bliss or well being is not something that should be a goal, it should be the default. Had I not known these people intimately I wouldn't have quit this whole thing.

Done it in 2021, I never watched the videos just let them play. I only enrolled to get initiated into shambhavi mahamudra. It's a great practice for getting significant gains in happiness and overall wellbeing. I feel a bit of bliss from it, from time to time. Iv done all their programmes, Shakti chalana kriya is their best practice in my opinion. Which is done as part of the shoonya programme. Isha's practices are the best thing I have came across for improving your day to day experience.

The Inner Engineering Course is Excellent! The 7 classes are awesome as well as the practice learned at this level Shambhavi Mahamudra, its very effective, I felt a wave of Bliss after a couple of weeks practice. You have to practice twice a day for a mundala or 40days after You learn it, then after that its once daily minimum... The videos are great, and the Q&A videos attached to each of the 7 classes are very very good, he goes into more details than he does with the regular Youtube video's, its very worth the effort and price, I did both online and in person with Sadhguru, in person of course is the best option if its available to You!! No risk, no reward, do it and then give it a good go for at least 6mths, You won't regret it!! Some of the topics on the video's/classes: Responsibility, how to get Your Free Will back This Moment is Inevitable, basically a class and dissection of the art of Accepting What Is! Present Moment Awareness Sounds and Mantra The Mind, how it works, its a miracle worker! Food, what foods to eat and avoid while on the spiritual path. Karma, what it is and how to use it and/or dissolve it.. and a few more topics too...

The kriya itself is a mix of normal yoga practices, done in an order. The practice itself has nothing to do with bliss. It's the belief that this practice can change stuff, and the philosophy musings combined by the theoretical lessons, it creates a certain delusional effect. He aims to keep it alive so you keep feeling blissful, or you think you should feel blissful. What he's aiming to do is trigger certain hormones by using a mix of beliefs, yoga and a whole community of sheeps. As for the results, I can confirm they wear off the moment you start thinking on your own.

Shambhavi Mahamudra Kriya is potent as long as you hold the dogma. It's effective at first, then it quickly turns into a mundane exercise. Don't buy into their bliss claims. I recommend doing some actual physical activity instead. Shambhavi isn't in any way sufficient. I got initiated back in 2021, and it was a great experience. But the more I went into this rabbit hole, the more I saw it's true face, I quit the whole thing in a matter of months. Had nothing to do with Sadhguru ever again.

💙 How would you characterize your experience? I'd describe my 5-MeO breakthroughs as "bliss," perhaps - powerful experiences indeed. This might not do it justice - besides, it's just a single term - but it's somewhat accurate in my estimation. It's hard for the mind to make sense of such a state, particularly after the chemical wears off. I recognize that I could have interpreted it - any experience, for that matter - in a way that simply confirmed my existing beliefs or desires. It can easily become a self-fulfilling prophecy. It's a nice online social space - for fun, interacting with other minds, learning stuff, sharing or asking for advice, having the occasional thought-provoking discussion, and so on.

It’s hard to find inner peace when someone’s drilling asphalt at 7 AM. City life really tests your sanity. Maybe ignorance really is bliss, those people look like they’re having a great time not noticing anything.

Genes is Karma, is a form of memory, there are other form of memory too that influence Us and make us who we are or appear to be on a daily basis. Karma is also what binds You to the body, there are 5 bodies that make up a Human Being, this is yogic science, Food Body, Mental Body, Energy Body, Etheric/Astral Body, and Bliss Body, most are only Aware of their Food and Mental Body to a low degree... There are also actions (karma being created) in 4 main places for a Human, Body Action, Mind Action, Emotional Action, Energy Action, again most are 99% unconscious of all the Actions taking place in these areas, that is why their lives are spinning out of control and they have no idea why or make up stories like God or Aliens or Ghosts are controlling them.. So if we raise our Consciousness levels, then all of this comes into Your Perception, then Karma has less effect on You, then You have Free Will available to You, here while Embodied and after Your Body dies (the Energy Body, Etheric and Bliss Body goes on, kept together by your Karmic Makeup, Karma is like glue keeping it all together).. So when Body dies, the other bodies go on, karma included and if Your consciousness is high, You can choose where to go next...

You can know all about Death as You know all about Life, it just a matter of Consciousness, both are the same coin just different sides, turn over the coin and You know it! Memory or Karma is everything when it comes to Creation and Existence, Existence is Creation, Non Existence/Creation is Absolute in various forms, each one more Subtle, until Your at the Absolute of Absolutes, since there are varying dimensions or realms of Existence, here on this Earth, living as we do with Duality and Karma, this is the Grossest Aspect, least Subtle, everything felt is REAL, deny that and Your already lost.. Physical Death is just that, the stuff that makes up Your Body and Brain and such, the crudest part of what we are, this has to die, go back to the Earth, but we are not the Body or Mind, so what is more fundamental is still there (Energy, Etheric, Bliss body per say), this goes on to another lifetime, another body is being made, You unconsciously for the most part choose which body based on Your Karma/Tendencies, since You have no discretion in the inbetween realm...If Your Highly Conscious while Embodied, then You have more choice regarding this... Time only exists because Space Exist, and for sure is a Relative Experience, it can go slow or fast, they say the more Blissful You are the Faster it goes... And Yes, in the inbetween realm, there is no time, time exist here, so when Your over there in a blink of an eye your back here embodied, but it could have been 500yrs difference in time from when You left the previous one and into the new one, but in Your Experience it was a blink of an eye..

Beautiful experiences and insights for sure. You will see if it lasts. Or if something is still in the way between Absolute Reality and its love aspect. Godspeed! PS: Brown, Pith Instructions for Akhrid Dzogchen " Furthermore, awakened awareness remains uninterruptedly in, and immovable from, the [vicissitudes of the three special] states [which are the adornments of enlightenment]: non-conceptual stillness, bliss (and love, WbtR), and luminosity." Comment Brown "This passage refers to the fact that at this level of practice awakened awareness is frequently accompanied by special states of bliss, luminosity, and stillness, but that rather than becoming sources of attachment to state experiences or obscuring awakened awareness, these very states become the “ornaments” or friends of awakened awareness. In other words, these states now enhance rather than obscure the recognition of awakened awareness. PS PS: IT is not a state. But your original face. That which has never not been the case. Anything that arises in time is not It. If you live long enough, and practice efficient enough, you will get used to these states with time. PS PS PS: Wilber, One Taste: "And then, the Abyss beyond all beyonds. Some would call it radical Freedom, infinite Release, ultimate Liberation, the great Redemption, boundless Being. I wouldn’t know, for there is no I to know, in any form, sacred or profane, and so there is only this radical Formlessness, which remains its own remark. It is not bliss, it is not God, it is not love. It is not holistic, it is not Goddess, it is not interwoven anything. It is not infinite, it is not eternal, it is not any conception or object or state whatsoever. I-I am not light, am not love, am not spirit, am not bliss. II am not bound, am not free, am not ignorant, am not liberated. But this much can be said: where there is not this Emptiness, there is only suffering." "Around the sea of Emptiness, a faint edge of bliss. From the sea of Emptiness, a flicker of compassion. Subtle illuminations fill the space of awareness, As radiant forms coalesce in consciousness. A world is taking shape, A universe is being born. I-I breathe out the subtlest patterns, Which crystallize into the densest forms, With physical colors, things, objects, processes, That rush upon awareness in the darkness of its night, To arise as glorious sun, radiant reminder of its source, And slumbering earth, abode of the offspring of Spirit."

Why should we care about what You wrote? Why would you say this, then write a long post about what YOU think Awakening is, lol, why listen to You? If You don't care about that, then why share? When Your in touch with Truth, Absolute or whatever, You feel Bliss/Love, this doesn't mean that is what it is, its just that You touched it and that is the feeling when You do that.. Absolute can be anything, another person takes a drug, and feel completely different, why listen to You rather than them? Best not to make claims, just enjoy the experience, Your In Bliss, that is Good and that is All!!!

Conformity is bliss. A comfort built on illusions, not liberation.

No it isnt. So in a hypothetical where there is no chance of any suffering at all and there is guaranteed pure bliss , you are telling me that these people would still be against having children? @zurew Didn’t you already discuss how anti-natalism isn’t about consent with somethingfunny? If you reject the anti-natalist view of “non-consent to being born” because “you can’t ask a non-being”, yet insist you can violate the consent of a non-being that doesn’t yet exist in the future - that’s self-refuting. On your rape example - an unconscious person still exists as a subject with bodily autonomy - they have a continuing identity and rights that persist through unconsciousness. Even a corpse has rights despite no capacity for consent because ethics is relational - it arises from continuity between beings who exist or have existed. The dead still exist in relation - through memory and continuity. The non-existent exist in abstraction -without relation or continuity. Assaulting someone in a coma is still rape - because consent is temporarily inaccessible, not ontologically impossible. Latent rights belong to existing subjects whose capacity to exercise them is currently dormant - their rights persist because their being and subject hood persists. Potential rights, on the other hand, refer to non-existent or not-yet-subject entities - possible persons. You can’t wrong a non-subject or one who hasn’t existed as one - only prepare conditions that may later affect one ie be irresponsible but not “violate” consent when no subject exists to grant it or not. A living subject has intrinsic rights (active). A dead person has derivative rights (symbolic/relational). A non-existent has no rights, because they’ve never entered relation or continuity. On your latest example - you’re mixing up intent and violation. Just because one act leads to another doesn’t mean they’re the same act or carry the same kind of guilt. Paying someone to commit rape is wrong for the intent - the rape itself is wrong for violating consent when it happens. Determinism doesn’t erase that difference - it explains how one led to the other. Mixing up cause and morality is like blaming gravity for murder because it pulled the bullet down. Honest question - how do you live day to day by your logic? Every meal, car ride or consumer choice would be a “violation of future consent” from someone not yet born but guaranteed to exist. You’d need prophetic knowledge of every potential consequence before acting. Also - you think our brains grew this large because we ate grass and nuts and not all the other nutrients derived from non-vegan sources?

I dont have it formalized in any way, again all I can tell you is that If I reflect on it - I intuitively know that Im okay with violating consent in a bunch of scenarios , because I care about certain things more than just consent. Yes , but you still go for it, right? If you would be against it in a principled way, then you wouldn't risk it, but you are okay with making the risk of violating consent in a bunch of scenarios. You can go with this, but this goes back to what I said from the beginning. You are not against violating consent in a principled way and if we go back to the question I asked, then the answer is obviously "its okay to have children in a world where there is 100% guaranteed bliss and 0% chance for any suffering." And from then on, the talk isnt about "its wrong because you violated consent" but "its wrong because of the negative stuff you put the kid through".

So in a hypothetical where you are a sex god and sex with you is a guaranteed pure bliss, is it okay for you to be raping people? This is BS and empty talk since all you have to back it up with is "I feel this way". There is an anti-natalist subreddit with over 200k people on it. You are welcome to ask there how many of them are pro killing people.

No it isnt. So in a hypothetical where there is no chance of any suffering at all and there is guaranteed pure bliss , you are telling me that these people would still be against having children? its not, most who are not virtue-signaling pussies about it would say what I said - If they would have the pragmatic means to do so , they would end all suffering forever and that involves killing all life. Because again this often times goes back to negative-utilitarianism.

Its not about that. It's not the main premise. Some people like that life has suffering to it, so that it's not all honey and rainbows. That's what makes it living worth for them. But so what? This is their personal view on their lives. It's about consent. The child you give birth to might have a life of pure bliss or they might suffer and end up killing yourself. They might enjoy suffering or they might hate it They might not have wanted to have any experience at all. The point is that it's not up to you to make this decision. Who are you to sign up other people for all this? This is a strawman. Nobody is advocating for killing people. Nobody is even advocating for forcing people not to have kids. It's like saying that vegans want to murder all the meat eaters or that they want to force everyone into veganism using violence. No. Anti-natalism just points out issues with giving birth and is mostly being used as a personal philosophy. If you resonate with it, you are welcome to join. If not, that's your choice. It's just that most people who are against it, have no good arguments. So they must on some level know that they are choosing to just ignore being wrong and staying ignorant.

1) You can just reject the main premise that suffering is something that you have to care about the most (to the point where you ignore everything else). Generally when it comes to moral intuitions , I dont think most people agree with the underlying thoughtprocess. Like imagine biting bullets like "No,no no even in a world where there is only 1 millisecond of suffering and 10 trillion years of guaranteed full bliss, its still wrong to have children, because they cant consent to that 1 millisecond of suffering" Once you start to think about hypothecials like that, you suddenly realize that you are not against suffering in a principled way. 2) The other one is a pragmatic one - You dont have the means to kill all humans and even if you did, there would be still incredibly amount of suffering on Earth when it comes to other beings reproducing. So the argument is that you have reason to have children and or to not stop people from having children as long as you believe that there is a chance for technological progress, because the more you progress there the more chance you have to end up in a place where you can actually kill and destroy all life (and with that end reproduction and suffering).

Concerning the "Body" only, ejaculation is healthy if its not overdone and it depends on the age too, younger guys can do it more and need to release it in a way, but the older You get the less it is needed, but yeah its a good stress reliever, its like a dose of Bliss shot into the system, so that is good for You Body wise... But we are not the Body right? So in that context it is not so good to regularly ejaculate, its better to hold it in, preserve it and then let it be transformed into something else described before in other posts, to put it simply as Spiritual Energy! Spirituality is an Existence that is above Survival level of Living, ejaculation is survival level of living, Spirituality is not. The Yogi's and Rishis knew this thousands of years ago...

Goggins, he luv's to suffer because it enhances his Ego, if he can endure more and more suffering his ego gets bigger and that turns him on! The Monk endures suffering to conquer suffering, to go beyond it, to realize that it is the Body or Mind that is suffering, and that You/Me are neither of those things, so via suffering one learns to not have to suffer because what is You is not capable of Suffering... This suffering path is difficult and dangerous though, the Bliss path is much better and safer/smarter path!

Exactly. But I'll expand on that. When i awakened it wasn't even about letting go or achievement it was from a place of complete spiritual ignorance and just a curiosity into what is like a child might wonder about a toy or the sky. Nothing more. Ignorance is bliss. But spiritual knowledge could lead to the desire for achievement as you say - and therein you will be doomed to never discover Truth. The same can be said for psychedelics as much as you may want to dispute that. It is really no different than meditation.

not fully, you stay here in hope of getting one last line of this yumyum icecream or maybe we will get infinite bliss tech & gene editing immortality and feeling eternally satiated by the moment

I wish to share a little story with you about this entire journey most of us are on... I will start with my own to make the connection. Every since i was born I intuitively felt something was quite off about this world, growing up in a western way of life, everyone seemed very disconnected from what truly is, disconnected from the natural being or true self or nature of who we truly are, but I could never clearly make sense of it all until my 21st birthday. I had my reawakening back around 2011, this was even before stronger plant-medicines came into my life, and I am very grateful I realized who I truly was before I jumped onto the other trains, for I had my true-ground or source-within or center to revert back to, that I am never shaken by these experiences or the mystica of substances and neo-spirituality, for they only tickle and enchant the mind that does not know, rather "thinks" it knows, especially after an experience or trip, yet the true self (which does not trip or hallucinate, which is awareness itself) remains untouched and phased. And its been quite wild ever since, and one of the biggest lessons for me and for many I am noticing (especially those who glimpse enlightenment prematurely) mostly through substance abuse, is that there is a severe lack of grounding or connection / understanding of the earth, rather purely working from a mentally internalized perspective and projection of consciousness, which speaks the truth conceptually, yet fails to land in the hearts of men, for it has no (true-ground) from which its roots have developed to be reverberated effectively and recognized as true wisdom. I see a lot of energy today is being pushed, especially (online) keeping people away from the Earth or Mother aspect, so they put more energy into the (artificiality) or online world, or the religious "Father" or "God" who is invisible and never to be reached, and thus they are met with half-baked enlightenment or astral / mental bliss, caught in a never-ending cycle, that is toxic to themselves and others around them, (that many of us can see now, especially on these forums) for they are illuminated only through the mind, and not awakened through the heart. They remain un-grounded and never truly accessing heart-centered awareness and being fully with the people and life on earth, to be truly of service and using our entire bodies more so than just our minds, and so they remain quite distant and disconnected from being with body and truly feeling what it is to be truly alive and experience life in its very essence here on this beautiful earth. They spend far more time online and disconnected from the natural world, and thus almost completely disembodying and contradicting what they preach. At the same time it is not anyone's fault, its just that they have never touched upon a taste of the divine in other ways, so when they touch upon it or glimpse through one way, they are convinced that "this is it", when in reality, it is only partly it. Rather it is one side of a three-sided coin, the third being the merge of the opposing two. These last 10 - 15 years I have been exploring the earth and body more, all over the world, before that I was exploring the mind and higher realms, and what i have learned is that neither is the full picture, yet the merge of the two is what Enlightenment truly is, for Awakening is the opening, seeing, recognizing, and Enlightenment is the embodying, rooting, stabilizing, being. I realized that there are also those, especially in the native and indigenous cultures who can also be (too earthly) and not open to a higher light or true due to eons of tradition, culture and rigid beliefs, that what the Buddha taught as (the middle way) was the very Tao or Truth or Way in a nutshell. It always comes back to balance, and when you are in total balance in all aspects of self, supreme beingness can be. I realized something observing children especially, and how they connected and meditated, was interesting because it reminds me of when I was a child too and what happens during intense experiences or states where everything becomes overwhelming, we naturally revert back down to the ground, (think of when we are sick, or drunk or too high), the body naturally knows what to do. And this goes back to ancient times were people were found often lying down on their backs by a tree or in the bushes somewhere, with hands and feet spread apart, almost like a star or a cross, and that is how they connected to God or "the Father", so to speak... They intuitively knew only through (the Mother) the connection will be stable, grounded and secure. If we deny the Mother (the earth), we deny the very medium that allows the Father to be known. In essence, you cannot reach the Father without the Mother. The Divine is immanent in the earth and body; we experience God through life, matter, and presence. And this is the issue with modern spirituality and neo-non-duality and the words and teachings people are sharing online, they are missing the full picture. Remember what is natural is home, god-thought materialized, divine or infinite intelligence, what is artificial is borrowed and secondary, a tool. We built temples to connect-with-god not realizing the very temple of nature itself God had already provided, then we wondered why we felt disconnected and struggle to see, hear, feel God's presence and guidance. And this is the very essence of Buddha and Christs teachings, but many have become distorted over-time by the hand of man. You can be in the most spectacular temple full of psychedelic artwork, gems, stones, incense and chants and nothing will provide a more solid and divine connection as what nature already had since the beginning. You can try it yourself, go into a forest floor and lay there, compare that to some man-made place. In 5 minutes you can tap in deeper than 50 minutes in a room full of artificial walls and electronics / noises / discordant frequencies. Otherwise these things would of been created first, and life on earth would be supreme brilliance, garden of eden, paradise, not what it appears to be today. Now don't get me wrong, I know this can be triggering to those who rely on the artificial matrix and online world, more so then they'd like to admit, I have nothing against using a tool, but remember its a "tool" and remember that the tool needs to be put down every once in a while and look up, there's a whole world out there, more real and beautiful and alive than any tool ever created by man, the tools only tickle the mind, yet the hearts remain empty... These teachers may teach that the world is an illusion, but does that really give you peace? No, you see most of these people miserable, depressed and suicidal, because life is meant to be lived, not observed. If you are not (participating) in the world you are a dead-letter, you may see through the illusion but if you are not alive and "living"... See the illusion, but enjoy the play, because the play is whats truly alive, the essence of it, the experience of it, that's needed for a rich quality life. Its like looking at a rose saying "this rose is an illusion" rather the child smells the rose, feels the sensations, doesn't know that its to be labelled or called a rose, rather its simply being a natural extension of nature or divine intelligence itself, interacting with itself in a most intimate way, and that is what enlightenment truly is, to be intuitively aware of the Oneness, yet fully immersed in the experience of separateness. In a nutshell... Remember you are Nature and Nature is you, so its always both, its not one or the other. I woke up with the energy to share this, I trust it may spark something within you. Blessings ~

How the fuck do two people have sex, she gets pregnant, accidental or not, you pop out the oven as a new born with no blueprint for life and dependent on your ignorant ass parents or whomever just as ignorant as the next, didn't ask to cone here but you're expected to figure it out or you'll pay the price for two horny fucks who just wanted to have some fun. Tell me, huh, tell me. Why the fuck are we telling people they need to figure out life if they want to be happy, get it right or else, give them work to do to not be a loser like their horny ass parents who don't know their ass from their big toe either and had to figure out life too because their horny ass parents didn't know Jack shit either and let's just go all the way back to phantom Adam and Eve. Why the hell is it up to the unconsenting(sic) child to now listen to your dumb ignorant ass telling them either they suffer or live in bliss but they have to be conscious and do the right thing. They didn't fucking ask to be here so why is it that they should have to go through this hell of a hole in suffering. Why the hell do you think it's up to them to make the right choices now since they were plopped on Mother Earth with their own fingerprints to keep track of them and their behavior. Don't you see something wrong with this fucking picture and if they want to exist this hell hole, it's a fucking problem and others will try to deter them while their life sucks too but they want company to feel the suckiness. Stop telling people what they should or should not be doing with a life they never asked for on how to be happy and stop asking how do I be happy. No one can tell you how to be happy and stop trying to control the emotions of life because they're not there for you to control. I can't believe I'm talking like this. This is insane. Life is insane. Nothing is right. It's all fucked up. Having you believing you're supposed to be doing something to feel a certain way or else you'll stay miserable when you didn't ask to come here. Needing gurus and bearded men to market themselves telling you how to get enlightened so you don't have to suffer your parent's choices and be in heaven. Nobody sees anything wrong this because they're too busy trying to feel good or better about their existence. Nobody complains much about why the fuck do i need you to tell me who I am and how to live a life i never asked for and if they do, others are telling them there's always hope for the never-coming future or they want to institutionalize those who want to exit and call them crazy for wanting to leave this fucked up place and cheer on new-born unsuspecting babies for entering this hell hole. Or is this really the case.

@Hojo Entire conversation stems from a misunderstanding of identity and being. im not a self in a human body, there is a human experience taking place in awareness. I am the same awareness in which both the waking experience, dream experience and deep sleep appear to take place. After all, how do you even know about dreams if they aren't happening to the same you? Are you communicating with another you to get the dreams? No. They appear to the same you, before you give it a character identity and start thinking. Deep sleep is another story, there are no objects of experience there, there is nothing to remember. Its pure awareness without content. Who told you you understand awareness? Has no objective qualities it just is, there is nothing to stand under. Its being itself, existence consciousness bliss