Search the Community

Bro what if the real point of view that cares about Israelis is that this war only leads to more future threats, terrorism and anti-semitism? From a article: “Did you know that since the United States brought its “war on terror” to Africa, terrorist attacks on that continent have increased by 75,000 percent? That’s right: 75, then three zeros, percent. I learned this neat little stat from a new article by journalist Nick Turse, who also notes that “according to the Pentagon, terrorist attacks in the Sahel region alone have resulted in 9,818 deaths — a 42,500% increase.” People have been documenting the way attempts to bomb terrorism out of existence actually creates more terrorism for many years. In 2010 Professor Robert A Pape wrote an article for Foreign Policy titled “It’s the Occupation, Stupid” about his study with University of Chicago which found that suicide bombings are the result not of Islamic fundamentalism but of foreign military occupations. Some notable excerpts: “More than 95 percent of all suicide attacks are in response to foreign occupation.” “As the United States has occupied Afghanistan and Iraq, which have a combined population of about 60 million, total suicide attacks worldwide have risen dramatically — from about 300 from 1980 to 2003, to 1,800 from 2004 to 2009.” “Over 90 percent of suicide attacks worldwide are now anti-American.” “Each month, there are more suicide terrorists trying to kill Americans and their allies in Afghanistan, Iraq, and other Muslim countries than in all the years before 2001 combined. From 1980 to 2003, there were 343 suicide attacks around the world, and at most 10 percent were anti-American inspired. Since 2004, there have been more than 2,000, over 91 percent against U.S. and allied forces in Afghanistan, Iraq, and other countries.”

@Bazooka Jesus Dude..so you got the information that He took cocaine and meth (on YouTube right?the best source for historical facts). And now you conclude he is a massive drugs addict, who has lost his mind and was permanent high. Right...You think so very simple. By the way even people who take regulary drugs can be functioning mentally pretty well. Committing suicide in his position was reasonable, he lost the war and the enemy would surely be not friendly to him If he did not kill himself before. To make IT more clear: He would be executed for sure. So he would die anyway

Lol, right... except maybe when he was high as a kite on crack cocaine / methamphetamine 24/7. Like leaving the whole country in ashes and committing suicide? Well played, Adolf.

@zazen Palestinians in the west bank are under the responsibility of the PLO as their official civil authority, while in Gaza strip they are under hamas. IDF is found in wide forces within the west bank for security purposes since 2002, what proved to be the only way to stop the suicide bombing happened in busses and restaurants from ones to twice a week. I'm in the middle of the video of Daniel Levy but it sounds he suggests a return to 48' lines? Later he uses definitions and creates some sort of scheme or n not so clear equation from it, to moralize against the Jews moves in 1947-8 but he overlook the fact that they stemmed from a survival challenge they have faced after almost lost in a civil-like war between them and the Arabs reinforced by 6 Arabs countries. By the way the land occupied in 1967 was under Jordan. About Gaza he doesn't suggest any pratical alternative way to eliminate hamas besides moralizing.

@MarkKol I can relate I spent much of my 20's drinking to forget or depressed when i wasn't. Do you have any data related to the lack of testosterone being responsible for school shootings? Intuitively as you say I'd think it'd be the opposite, and the more violent people usually have too much in them. I can see though, going around shooting up a school, isn't the average reaction of a violent guy looking for trouble in a bar. It comes from the same place often, the desire for significance being met in an inverted, destructive or harmful way Six Human Needs https://www.tonyrobbins.com/mind-meaning/do-you-need-to-feel-significant/ 1. Certainty: assurance you can avoid pain and gain pleasure 2. Uncertainty/Variety: the need for the unknown, change, new stimuli 3. Significance: feeling unique, important, special or needed 4. Connection/Love: a strong feeling of closeness or union with someone or something 5. Growth: an expansion of capacity, capability or understanding 6. Contribution: a sense of service and focus on helping, giving to and supporting others These are a reasonable way to model human needs, and we each rank these as more or less important in our daily lives, which drive our behavior. It explains why someone can jump out of a plane, while another person feels happier in a steady job earning a wage. It also explains some of the more horrific acts seeking one of these needs to be met. Also, it could just be the kind of person that sits in their room miserable and alone, is the kind of person that has or generates less testosterone anyway, rather than it being directly related to the violence itself. When you hit the level of considering suicide, which I used to do a lot in my 20's, and still do very rarely, then it opens you up to these type of horrific or otherwise inconceivable actions.

@FourCrossedWands Is that official? Have the investigators conclusively determined the son did kill him, or did the father commit suicide, or some other cause? Also, my heart, understanding and empathy goes out to the victims, but also to mass shooters, they do have it rough sometimes in life. Don't forget to seek a professional out there, a hotline, or go do therapy and psychoanalysis too.

Sam Harris's faulty biased narrative is infecting a lot. They genuinely believes an ideology has the power to make 2.3 million people in Gaza or (2 billion Muslim in the world) to be gleefully waiting for Martyrdom and willing to commit suicide bombing any day. Let's dismiss basic psychology and the cries and calls for help by the Gazans to save their lives and believe Sam Harris instead.

Jews in Israel should have been committed collective suicide or let Hitler or other Nazis to finish the work, ignore the Jewish ancient connection to Israel and allow Arabs to have Israel as the 22th Muslim state in the world. Only that would be considered fair to these people.

Do you also believe it’s possible that. muslim suicide bombers will get however many virgins in heaven etc?

@Scholar it takes courage to be vulnerable and open to understanding extremely complex topics, such as suicide. Relating to them more holistically invites more nuanced and compassion forms of clarity, thus elevating their meanings towards a greater good.

This is getting ridiculous, I am developing much more empathy for people who commit suicide, even though I'm not the type of person to consider such a thing. But I can see how if someone felt this way for half a year or so that one could easily completely lose ones rational perspective of things. The emotions are so all consuming that it's really hard to even imagine a framework outside of it, and considering the influence these emotions have on ones thoughts, it can easily spiral out of control. Obviously I am just describing the experience, I don't want to concern anyone, lol. I simply don't remember having ever felt this doom and gloomy this intensely before, and I am not the most emotionally regulated person in the first place, in terms of my dispositions, so it's not like I don't have a sense of what even intense disregulation can feel like. The therapy lamp seems to have helped at first, but there seems to have been a backlash effect.

Think about the whole infinity. Look at nigth to a sky, dark imensity, no end. You as an integral part of the whole. Think of how would you kill it. How would you kill the whole universe? Even suicide becomes irrelevant. You cut the leaf of a tree but the tree and the forest keeps going. Infinity have no fear of death, to fear death you must have first a shape to maintain, and that is your current predicament. Unlesa you delude yourself that you dont have a shape or form to maintain. No need of maintainance no fear.

I wasn't saying suicide is creepy. I was responding to OP's statement about guys who kill themselves over loneliness. I don't take that stuff lightly and I am very empathetic towards people who are suicidal. I doubt people just do it out of the blue, though; we're just not aware of some of the causes.

@JayT79 @Princess Arabia The truth is, we don’t have a definitive understanding of why people commit suicide. Some people actually do it out of the blue, even if there were absolutely no signs of mental health conditions in them. That is not creepy, that is how nature intended it to be.

Seriously? You wan't me to provide data. Tons of people are committing suicide everyday for different reasons; and for the mere fact that I've read of guys who have become depressed and say they are suicidal over their inability to get laid is enough data for me to come to that assessment. The data on the amount of suicides is more accessible than the reasons why people do it. Just because you haven't or never thought to do so is irrelevant to my statement. Consider yourself proof by omission. People are always basing things on their own personal experience not realizing there are 8billion people world wide which i'm sure at least one has done this and can say that without needing data or proof.

This maybe true but do you have data for this? I mean I have a lack of experience with women and not had a lot of sexual experience with women but the idea of killing oneself is a bit of stretch. I couldn't fathom myself killing myself because I wasn't getting pussy from women. Maybe my intellectual knowledge of spirituality from this forum and psychedelic experience and practicing stay in the moment has prevented me leading to suicide.

Suicide can and will be recontexualized profoundly. You start to understand what suicide more openly and without judgement.

@jaylimix i've been reading your latest comments i think i should make the subsequent objections: 1- you claim the word Genocide is not fitting situation in Palestine - i invite you to take at look at my post page 241. The term can be applied and there is consensus on it, but western mainstream media is reclutant to talk about it for obvious reasons. 2- the fact that the population of palestinians is rising doesn't tell much about the quality of their existence. 3- You should't blame it on Islam about the suicide bombers. Pretty much every religion had their terrorist throughout history. The problem is their level of development and situation, not religion.

@Princess Arabia I am not "threatening" suicide. It just overwhelms me. Leo was such an important figure in my life. For so long. He is neither stupid nor delusional. When he tells me he does not experience a subjective experience the way I do, I just freak out.

I understand. I will just add my personal feeling about it. Iran is grasped as a very big demon in the eyes of Israelis, and thats because Iran is really the big brain that stands behind and funds Hezbollah, hamas, and the palestinian suicide bombing in busses and restaurants Israel is traumatized by from the early 00's, and also terror activities abroad against Israelis. During the recent decade Iran is developing a nuclear weapon at the exact same time when it declares more and more publicly that it wants to eliminate Israel from the map. A careful ear, when knows the past events when everybody were sure nothing really bad will happen (and we all know what happened) will take seriously this threat. The fear of Israel from Iran is very serious, and from that I can understand why Israel felt that urge to convince bush to do something that maybe will remove this untolerable nuclear threat and maybe will cause their regime to fall by the way. Also there are reasonable claims about the long term iranian's regime plan to encompass Israel physically in order to one day be able to treaten its existance. in fact, thats what middle eastern experts think that Iran wanted to do in the 7.10 surprise but hamas decided to do deal for itself and to do it alone what made Iran to be extremely in rage on it after oct 7th. I can add links on that. I agree that this is indeed hapenning, and there are a lot of close-minded Israelis especially from the right wing. But at the same time It hurts me a bit that people don't see the other sector of citizens we have here from the center-left camp (~40% and maybe more of the population) with them a deep conversation is really possible. Yes as long as the right wing is almost homogeneously controlls Israel, this is impossible. I agree about that. I can say that just couple of years ago I was more anti religion, but then I started to see that many of the "lite" religions actually have some depth in them and a sense of warmth when they relate to you, that this is harder to find among the hard-core secular ones which is interesting. But I emphasize this is probably mostly only among the 'lite' or moderate religious and of course not among the more hard-core religious that on them I agree with you.

I apologize if I was a little abrasive. But I honestly believe there are no "life situations" where my theories fly out the window. Just do a thought experiment and apply my theories to every situation. What would happen? Or tell me some specifics where my theories do not work. Even if you put me in a hellish "situation with no escape" and I killed myself, I accept that. You are probably correct about my suicide but it would still be the yin yang symbol and the two fishes going around and you are focusing on the sad fish and not the happy fish. If we manifest our reality by our vibrations or frequency, then change your frequency and create goodness in your section of the world. Your contemplating the misery amplifies the bad vibrations. If possible, re-read my original reply above and give me the benefit of the doubt. Have an open mind about my reply. Thanks.

@Lila9 Its fair to say evacuation isn't ethnic cleansing. Its fair to say turning half of the infrastructure to rubble there, and having a history of creating opportunistic settlements (which you then have to justify and defend constantly creating tension), leads people to believe you will resettle these areas as your own. I'd be AMAZED if not one new settlement happens. Its fair to say it hasn't happened yet. If anything this word is being held up now, so that isn't the course you choose as a people. Heck, I've seen people in Israel saying we'll go further south next as an example. - If I come back 5 months from now and say you've done ethnic cleansing, what good is it? It would already be done. It's why its nearly useless trying to get you to see the large fallout regionally or internationally from this, because that has happened, but it can always get worse. Leniency does not radicalize. Impulsiveness, carelessness, and inattentiveness is the opposite of vigilance, which might create opportunities for mischief, but men and women earning money, feeding their families, and living in relative safety are not prone to becoming terrorists who want to suicide bomb you, or throw rockets over at you, because their lives are mostly stable and their families cared for. The worse a situation gets the more you radicalize people. With this action you've not deradicalized anyone, you've created hundreds of thousands of new people willing to do violence across the region. Just like their actions created in you. Again this has perfectly played into Iran's hands, both because of the BRICS angle, American isolationism, many groups having an excuse and gaining a large amount of new recruits.

1) Very logical - Giving civilians a month to move south, opening up humanitarian corridor, air support first before boots on the ground otherwise it would be a suicide mission for the soldiers. 2) Aren't the leftist in the government green hence orange/green?

@Vrubel @Nivsch @hundreth @Lila9 and anyone else who enthusiastically supports Israel. A love letter to Israel (with humour, hope and good faith) - Osama Bin Shapiro Speaking on being strategic and whats in Israel's best interest. It's probably in Israel's best interest to not take their cue from America in how to deal with the war on terror through bombardments. A chihuahua can't learn from and act like the Pitbull that claims to have its back. America has a geography blessed with vast seas on its sides, a ally to its North and a weak neutral nation to its South that geopolitically insulates it from its foreign adventures. It can go around bombarding regions and barely have any repercussion - Europe bears the brunt of the cost via the refugee crises caused by these wars. I would offer my cousin Aladdin's flying carpet for escape but your state carpet bombed it. First, make sure not to deny the facts corroborated by international state bodies and human rights organisations on Israel's situation. Move the sideburn curls away from the ears and listen to the world. What you deem labels such as occupation, apartheid lite and discriminatory security structures are realities for millions of Palestinians. Occupation doesn't mean the most literal definition of the word like when you go to the toilet it says occupied by someone sitting on it - Israeli's don't have to be sitting on Palestinians laps in Gaza eating Baklava to claim occupation or defecating on their land - they can be occupied externally by controls of their border, sea and airspace depriving, dehumanising and un-dignifying them. Israel should avoid being duped by neo con evangelical interests who portray themselves to be on Israel's side but fill their pockets from war profits at the cost of Israeli/Palestinians filling their graveyards with bodies and who's pockets are filled with nothing, but instead get eviscerated by the burns from bomb blasts and the white phosphorus that US provides Israel. Deep down they wish to see their demented prophecies of Armageddon and the return of Jesus manifest - like wise for the fundamentalists of Judaism and Islam of which the former wants to hasten the Messiah and the latter their Mahdi for the 'great battle' after which Islam prevails. Israel acting the way America does in response to 'terror' endangers it in a way America acting that way doesn't. Israel sits by itself in a angered region. Israel's actions have enraged the Global South and domestic Westerners which are its own allies. Even Western media outlets critique Israel's actions as they are unable to keep up with propaganda that gets shred by the advent of social media and alternative media. Their are limits to Americas interests - they can't just bankroll the expulsion of 2.3million people and destruction of their homes with the current technology that allows the world to see it and feel it. It's not just the scale of destruction (more than 50% of homes destroyed) and civilian death (children and women) but the timescale of it (in the span of 2 months) that puts this conflict in a terrible light and moral standing for Israel. Israel are losing the sympathy of the world in real time - it may think it can win the battle but definitely not the War. Footprints disappear but good luck dealing with the digital footprint of massacre that don't as easily for decades to come and the constant hostility that brings with it globally - but we're meant to think this onslaught makes the Jewish diaspora feel safer. ''Western public has lost all its appetite for war. All the careful sanitising, video-gamifying and propagandizing that has been put in place since Vietnam in order to build a platform of consent for “humanitarian” wars has cratered into nothing. You can’t have a up close screening of the reality of bombs and all the things they do to human flesh and then go back to the way you were ever again. Millions of western eyes have been changed forever.'' Those to whole evil is done, do evil in return. Israel not only defends itself but has the strategy to establish deterrence capacity - deterrence by definition is supposed to be disproportionate to scare off / terrorise hostility (de facto terrorism in policy) but only causes further hostility and terrorism. Deterrence through strength means being strong, not necessarily flexing that strength on your neighbours like a narcissistic school bully which radicalises them towards you. If Israel or any countries safety requires the occupation, imprisonment and oppression of a people, you don't have safety and never will. Resistance movements are built on the blood of martyrs which Israel ensures a continual supply of. Their called grassroots movements for a reason - you can't get rid of them unless you poison the soil ie genocide, expulsion or brutal subjugation. Ironically a used phrase to describe Israeli operations is 'mowing the grass' which is periodic to keep resistance checked. But this resistance will never stop unless the soil is destroyed because its the soil (people) that keeps the grass (resistance) growing. Everything Israel obtains through oppression is inherently violent and must be upheld through violence - that violence will be justified through ideas of superiority and the idea that those you oppress must be more violent and oppressive than you. And when that oppression is resisted as it always has been, that resistance will firstly be gaslighted as barbaric terrorism from savages and secondly will be used to feed the fear of safety needed to maintain that cycle, a cycle set in motion by the aggressor who attempts to reverse the role of victim and victimizer, aggressor and defender in a bid to clean its global image and standing and not lose support from its main benefactor being the US. But The US can't be stained with the sticker of ethnic cleansing and more blood than it already has and that the world has become sick of. They most likely won't continue to bankroll this or else the current party risk political suicide- and if you lose US support domestically, politically and economically you become very lonely in a neighbourhood you can't afford to be lonely in. This is where Israel's arrogance and entitlement is its downfall - a level of arrogance and entitlement shared by your habibi - Bibi Satanyahu. Ultra-Zionist aspirations are limited by the ceiling that is the Palestinians suffering that the world will not stand by. If lobby interests, the state and the military industrial complex go ahead and get involved despite domestic disapproval anyway - this will suck Hezbollah and other actors into the war - world war 3 is here and we'll probably be too busy to rendezvous on forums like this. You reap what you sow - you sow the wind, you reap the whirlwind - and in the Middle East if you sow the wind you reap the sandstorm that blinds you from humanity and chokes the throats from which their should be uttered words of peace and a breaking of bread eaten at the table together alongside local Judean olive oil and hummus. Peace for all though for real, inshallah.

I think some people will go down bad paths without it early though, say drug addiction, suicide, or suicide by 9to5(i.e. the American Dream), but not all. If you have a good family upbringing you would regret it a long time until you figure it out.