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@Inliytened1Hi my friend. @cetus56 please let me address this because I think it will be useful? You say your ego has to die for you to wake up to yourself, right? That is the case for either drug experiences or not having enough training in states - which you can earn from a recognized dzogchen lineage holder, or someone respectable in adwiata or a real enlightened one man band (very very hard to find, you won't find it on youtube). State training which I am talking about is how the Buddah became enlightened. That's a story given to us from the Buddhist science of enlightenment and the Buddahs realization is a science that can be practiced and eventually nirvana can be attained. Permanent enlightenment. Enlightenment is also a process if you look at it from a different way. It's called the noble path. I speak of that a lot. But as far as being nothingness having an ego as opposed to being an ego with a memorable non dual experience, the difference is permanent enlightenment and intellectual understanding. Bodhi is intellect, and in a Buddah the bodhi is also awakened. That's because intellect is needed in being able to see through what causes separation. Without the development of bodhi you are basically pissing in the wind with your practice because you cannot get to permanent realization without understanding the steps. And that requires practice. Nothingness or God is reality, but experience tells us that you and I as nothingness is an ego inside a body and the evidence of this is sensation tied to belief. That belief and sensation never goes away. And you don't want it to go away either. Because being nothingness is not what you want because you will just be a mess. I had a discussion on here about ramana maharshi and i said that ramana was a mess. He wasn't trained by a swami, he just woke up and let his body be eaten by rodents and didn't care. That's why he got arthritis in his hips? Who knows? But there are certain consequences you pay for ignoring samsara. But the belief and sensation can be seen directly for what they are if you are already disidsntifed from the body and mind as the witness. Once you are the witness all you need to do is put attention on the sensation of boundary between body and world and eventually the boundary will collapse and you will wake up from the dream as the universe. But for the witness already not identified with body and mind it's a very small step from being formless witnessing presence realizing that this presence is not local. It's everything. So no ego death required. Just skill and understanding. That's what this meditation practice will do for you. If you feel you are dying then you are still the body or mind. When you say you're enlightened I know you are not because you have not done the work to understand all of these stages of meditation states. No hard feelings and I'm not saying you didn't have a bona fide experience either. I don't know. But what i do know is that you speak from ego as if it is real. When you speak as nothiness having an ego then you can be called a master of the work.

Mooji is a Japanease name for nothingness And this name was given to him by papaji (I think)

@Leo Gura In terms of improving the quality of both my individual life and everyone else's, is realizing myself as God, and all that comes with being God, literally the most valuable thing I can do? Seems like life purpose, relationships, health, finances, travel, etc. are all important but like if I am literally God, every single blade of grass, every ant, every planet, every person on this damn forum, an infinite blank slate of nothingness just infinitely dancing through different forms, infinitely creative, infinitely intelligent and infinitely loving... these other elements of my life just seem honestly pretty insignificant in comparison. I'm having trouble explaining this but my intuition is telling me that the most beneficial thing I can do for myself, Kevin, and the world as a whole is to fully realize myself as God. Most beneficial in terms of bringing love and consciousness in to this world. Maybe a stretch here, but is the whole reason for God manifesting in infinite forms to get to know and experience itself and become a 'more mature, more conscious, more evolved God'? I guess my question is, does God (and I know I speak about this as something separate from myself - semantics) want me to awaken? If I'm doing this dance forever, there's no impatience or hurry, but there is a desire to know myself as God. It seems there is no higher joy in the Universe then God knowing itself as God, seems like this is why Leo pushes 5meo so much.

@Ponder Are you nothingness or formlessness in deep sleep ?

Yes Buddha realized himself as "Nothingness".Once you become really enlightened you Will know what "emptiness" really is.

You would (possibly) be nothingness aka formlessness. However, form is inseparable from formlessness, therefore it’s impossible for you to exist. It’s impossible for reality to be any other way than it is since God using his infinite intellect and infinite love, created the only possible configuration of existence. Tl;dr No

Weed by itself in high amounts has made me more in the present moment. Some of the body sensations become very alive and it gets trippy when you have no tolerance and do some dabs. Otherwise it serves as a nice sleep aid. Or when I am drunk. In terms of spirituality I think its value comes when mixing it. I smoked some weed the day after doing DXM and some was still in my system. I was getting heavy visuals and its an experience where I experienced nothingness to a degree and so "I" and "nothing" merged. LSD + MDMA + Weed also has given me great insights. I think weed is more complicated than 'it kills your life energy its bad never do it' It largely depends on you and how you use it. There is no clear guide on this because of how variable people can be in development.

@Ponder I read a few of your posts and I can tell. One that has aligned with Truth can also recognize Truth. @zeroISinfinity And I think in reference to Ponder's comment about nothingness, he just meant it is formless. Language breaks down so easily because it's so easy for us to misinterpret someone else's words, or we use words in different ways. That's why this stuff is so hard to communicate. All we can do is the best we can with what we have with words. The finite cannot reach outside and grasp the infinite.

Absolute is not nothingness it is pure Love.

Hey even after tripping 5-MeO a couple of times and having had a breakthrough, my mind still cant answer the question (and I guess the mind is the problem): What happens "after" your body has died? Does your higher self enjoy being this nothingness until it starts to dream again? What role does enlightenment play in this game? Does enlightenment only help you in this life to overcome suffering? Where and what is this "place" that enlightened beings such as the buddha reach, when they have achieved enlightenment and union with the one Being and dissolve in the here and now? I often conceptualize it as the singularity of Being that I have experienced during trips and that is prior to any manifestation so it rests in peace forever. But I dont really get it... Maybe its just me as the ego still has hope of surviving death and reaching heaven in the future. I feel like this question hasnt really been answered for myself. Because somehow it seems like this whole enlightenment liberation stuff just helps you in this life and when you have attained it and reached the "highest realization" you just throw yourself back into mundane life and suffering again and again. Doesnt make sense to me. Hope you can give me kind of a concept or insights that you have had so that this gets at least a little bit clearer to me...

I wouldn't consider it a teaching, no more than I would consider bird chirps as a teaching. It just appears. Yet within the construct of a timeline, one could imagine causation. What "caused" these appearances to arise? This would get quite tricky indeed as there are an infinite number of causative inputs. Yet it certainly appears that my mind-body has been shaped by many occurrences within it's lifetime - including a wide variety of "spiritual" beings - both human and non-human. What has resonated with my mind-body has changed over time. If your question is in regards to "learning" about this through a teacher, book, video, philosophy, experience etc. - then there is no source in that regard. There is no one source. There have been many many that have influenced me. My mind is is not beholden to any teaching or idea. Each sources as a separate entity is very limiting. For me, a deeper level became "no teachers" and "all teachers". In terms of models of consciousness expansion, that is a major expansion. One of the keys of "liberation" at the human level is no attachment/identification to any idea. For example, a test for me at the human level is. . . can I let go of those ideas I just wrote about as I let go of bird chirps? Or do they mean a little bit more to me than bird chirps? Can I wake up totally fresh in this moment completely free of all these ideas? Or will my mind-body carry them around in a backpack? Are these ideas simply bird chirps floating by, or are they attached to my mind-body? Do I actually believe these ideas are true? Will I wake up tomorrow speaking of these ideas as if I believe them. If so, there is some attachment within the mind-body. . . "But wait. . . what I wrote is so profound and insightful. I invested many years for those wonderful insights. . . And I had that amazing Mu experience of nothingness. . . That's gotta count for something!! ". Such thoughts simply arise in the mind-body - it's part of the personal human story.

I'm not going to go into it in a very complicated way like you are saying. If you want a Satori (enlightenment) to happen to you to see and become nothingness/No-self/there is no you, you still have an ego to deal with in this life afterwards. If you don't want to talk about this life, then don't. I was only answering the topic question. It's your responsibility to research and prove it to yourself. I'm not here to prove anything to anyone.

@Shaun You understand very well, that is our true nature We put on the clothes of a body, and a mind later on; and we misidentify ourselves as being them. We are actually nobody. The person who is reading this now is this endless space of nothingness. That is what we all are, in every moment, yet since we identify ourselves as the passing thoughts, we therefore believe we are the sum total of our past experiences when we are so much more.

I recently had an odd...but rather interesting insight on mushrooms. This came right after a nondual state of conciousness that I had with my friend who is into crystals. I was working a lot on unifying dualities and I realized that I was God (I feel like I could've went much deeper but anyways). First of all, a distinction must be made between the masculine and the feminine. The masculine is unchanging conciousness, Nothingness, that which sits "behind" and "allows" for the forms to exist. The feminine is the constantly changing dance of forms. Although the masculine and the feminine are identical, they need each other to exist... The feminine is the world of dualities (differences). The masculine is the unification of dualities (sameness). My friend was saying that crystals are important because each of them has their own specific energy. Later I realized why this is important. A Crystal's vibe or structure or energy is always a certain type of way and not another type of way. Just like all forms. But...crystals are important because their structure is very dense and fixed. Meaning that crystals "hold differences." In this way, crystals are an important factor in Creation. This also explains why feminines are generally drawn towards types of spirituality that is very "surface" because it is all about attracting certain desirable forms and getting rid of negative ones. While masculines are interested in being liberated from the attachment to all forms as the Ultimate Death. I'm not really sure what my "point" is but crystals definitely play a bigger role in the structure of reality than any old types of rocks. For the reason that they "hold differences". My reasoning isnt super flushed out and I would take what I'm saying here with a grain of salt but it is definitely interesting.

@Anirban657 @Anirban657 Preetom asked you very important questions.He is practicing self enquiry. Are you able to locate the I am Ness or I feeling ? Is it fixed or located in chest or head ? Or really can't grasp it ? Answer them. Robin steel is equating awareness to experience which is not the case. I asked winter knight about your question and my reply.He said it is inexpressible but the KNOWLEDGE self is aware of itself is realized. In other words awareness is continuously experiencing something other than itself Only in Nothingness the Truth will be realized. Regarding self enquiry Hold on to the I feeling or I ness continuously till it vanishes.It this I am Ness which is preventing us from realizing the truth.

1. If the purpose of life is to become more consciouss and realize yourself as it is often said then: - Why did god delude himself into duality in the first place? Why didnt he just reside in godhead-nothingness forever. 2. Or, If the purpose of life is to for god to experience himself as a limited creatue, which you also hear a lot. - Why did god allow a mechanism to realize himself, why did he allow a majority of people on earth doing nothing else but trying to remember they are god (religion). Doesnt that contradict the purpose if god wants to know what its like to truly be a human and then these humans say fuck it and all they do is try to be god again.

The question by @Anirban657 is how to be aware of awareness. Below is my reply to Anirban of my understanding of Nisargadatta Maharaja words. ----_-----------------+------------------------------- I am not self realized and never had the nothingness exp. But the words awareness is aware of itself is not used by all.It is confusing the seekers. First of all Awareness is not an object or thing or feeling or emotion. The word try to be aware of awareness makes you think you can experience awareness as an object that is impossible. The eyes cannot see itself.This is just a pointer. Awareness or Infinity or Self or God is beyond everything. Awareness is beyond the waking state,dream state,deep sleep state. In deep sleep awareness is aware of unconsciousness. In dream it is aware of the dreams. In waking state you know what. But in the waking state when the sense of me,body experience,thoughts everything is gone what will remain ? Pure empty waking conciousness or no-thingness with out any objects.So awareness is aware of this. So finally Awareness is beyond everything being,non being,sleep,waking,dream any exp non experience,Nothingness,Emptiness what ever you call it name it. So you can never expirience awareness or in short drop the words awareness is aware of itself.How to be aware of awareness. What ever perceived cannot be the perceiver. You cannot experience yourself you can only know what you are not. By knowing what you are not you know what you are.-Nisargadatta Maharaj Hope this is clear. _------------------------------------------------------ Is my understanding correct ?

@Anirban657 @Anirban657 I am not self realized and never had the nothingness exp. But the words awareness is aware of itself is not used by all.It is confusing the seekers. First of all Awareness is not an object or thing or feeling or emotion. The word try to be aware of awareness makes you think you can experience awareness as an object that is impossible. The eyes cannot see itself.This is just a pointer. Awareness or Infinity or Self or God is beyond everything. Awareness is beyond the waking state,dream state,deep sleep state. In deep sleep awareness is aware of unconsciousness. In dream it is aware of the dreams. In waking state you know what. But in the waking state when the sense of me,body experience,thoughts everything is gone what will remain ? Pure empty waking conciousness or no-thingness with out any objects.So awareness is aware of this. So finally Awareness is beyond everything being,non being,sleep,waking,dream any exp non experience,Nothingness,Emptiness what ever you call it name it. So you can never expirience awareness or in short drop the words awareness is aware of itself.How to be aware of awareness. What ever perceived cannot be the perceiver. You cannot experience yourself you can only know what you are not. By knowing what you are not you know what you are.-Nisargadatta Maharaj Hope this is clear.

The difficulty results from the fact that awareness is nothing. The mind cannot grasp it in the same way it can grasp a wall or tree or a thought. So by trying to become aware of awareness you are really trying to realize Nothingness/Emptiness. Yes, it's frusrating. There is no way around that. You are being asked to grasp the ungraspable. Through lots of practice the mind must become very still. That stillness of mind itself becomes the empty awareness of awareness. You. Are. It. Try focusing your mind on nothing in particular and just let it sit there. The more it sits there, the more Emptiness will dawn on you. Don't try to grasp it. Let it wash over you.

@flowboy Impartial or unbiased self observation without self criticism is a huge win. Even with a small bit of self criticism,,,still a win! Maybe you'll get an unexpected surprise and feel your own nothingness from the hot cooking. It seems weird writing those words. Regardless, you are still observing.??

I will express my truth and if it is of no use to you, by all means, please disregard it. I am not the body. Nor am I the thoughts and feelings which comprise the personality/ego. I am the silent witness who has no opinions. Quote from Maurice Nicoll - THE FEELING OF NOTHINGNESS “When the Work says that a man must come to realize his own nothingness before he can be re-born, it does not mean that he must humble himself and so on, but that he must by long self-observation actually begin to realize that he is nothing and that there is no such person as himself. The object of this is to get into a position, psycho- logically speaking, between the opposites...Why is it so important to get somewhere into the centre of the pendulum and not swing to and fro? Because here, between the opposites, lie all the possibilities of growth. Here influences from higher levels can reach us. Here, in this place where one can feel one’s own nothingness (and where one is therefore free from contradictions), influences and meanings coming from higher centres, which have no contradictions, can be felt. Not regarding yourself as good or bad, not priding yourself on being just or otherwise, not thinking you are well-treated or badly-treated, not being caught by either movement through identifying, you come into this mid-position. This is not easy! With personality active, it is impossible.

duality is supposed to be fully embraced with responsibility. life can't get any juicier than that. beneath duality there's nothingness (infinite potential) and duality is the result of pure magic. the fact that the universe can experience a human being, say "i", write poetry and appreciate music is just a infinitesimal display of the supreme power of existence. fight no i find what i points to for i is yet another finger

@Leo Gura and so it must be! @andyjohnsonman remember relative to your ego whose sole focus is on your survival..nothingness is gonna seem the oppositie of everything that it actually is! Keep in mind that You with a capital Y made it that way so that the small you can even exist!

I realised all this spiritual work i'm doing is just for my ego. I'm just wanting to be a better person but within that there is separation between me and other. I want to be better than others which is just more ego. The ego is incredibly sneaky and it always wants to be in control. Last night I had a balloon with nitrous oxide and after inhaling the whole thing got a 20 second ego death. It really freaked me out and makes me think whether or not nothingness is synonymous with love as my ego was terrified when regaining control and the nothingness just seemed scary. However I have had much better experiences on mushrooms. Maybe i should just stay away from nitrous oxide.

@Leo GuraAnd Leo, to be radically open-minded includes taking all sides into consideration, or as many sides into consideration. If someone shows you this, it does not mean that he/she is "anti-psychedelic." It does not mean the person is not interested in enlightenment. Look closely and carefully into the person. This clip has to be looked into very carefully too. You also have to question whether or not the person you are talking to has profound experiences already or have experienced Truth/Nothingness/No-self/Riding the Ox Backwards. Did he/she experienced it with or without psychedelics? If so, describe it. Let's see the work of the enlightened human being and how deep is the enlightenment.