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@fanta I know where you're coming from. I used to have suicidal thoughts quite frequently, up until I started meditation and self-inquiry a few months ago. This was a response to intense anxiety and pain in my chest region, created by the unhealthy patterns etched into my mind. I have always had anxiety issues and never really felt like I belonged anywhere. So I started meditating, and dealing with my demons as they crop up. The suicidal thoughts vanquished for a while. Now, they have arisen again. Although it’s not a low-conscious level of despair like it was before, it’s a realization that life is all that there is, at this moment. There is no event in the future that can change how I’m going to feel as a person. Before, I used to escape into memories of the past, or dream about the future in order to deal with these thoughts. It’s as Albert Camus said, the only true philosophical question is whether to commit suicide or not. Everything I have ever experienced will be completely forgotten forever, whether I die today or in 50 years from now. This isn’t a bad thing, but I just can’t figure out if life is worth it. The only experience “I” could ever have after death is if I get reborn again, with a completely new identity, and with all memory of any past consciousness gone. Suicide is basically a reset button, and sometimes I wish I was able to integrate into society like a normal, low-conscious human being, unaware or uncaring of any truths, and living blissfully ignorant lives and unresponsive to internal suffering. Like all of my family and friends. All I can do is just hope this phase will pass.

Well ive been suicidal, but for me poker made me suicidal, and lack of money, so i was tired and didnt see why i should go on with this. I also was only looking in one direction, i didnt want to let go of poker. So before i was bout to jump, i decided wouldnt it be better to do this die before you die thing. So i sat in meditation and sat there foe longer than ever, even when i was feeling so much pain i continued. I felt my insides become hardened, rebelling. I thought maybe i will die this way, i guess its a more pleasant and clean way than jumping. Then when i finally finished, because i was so tired. I was so relieved that i could only go to bed and sleep, and it was awesome. I felt so awesome in my body and thought, why would i want to get rid of this, i love it. (when i didnt think about external circumstances) Ithink even till this day, sleep is the best part of life for me. Dreams are awesome. They are kinda worth struggling for. Your life is a triangle ? waking, dream and deep sleep. Non duality says this triangle is a dot actually and everything else is a projection. You go to death every night in deep sleep. Its the bottom left point of the triangle. In other words, suicide wont do anything for you. You are already that point always. By suicide you would not achieve peace. Go for enlightenment instead! Ps: watch videos of Ira, Rupert Spira and Ramana Maharshi. I like those contents best for non duality.

I'm a newbie. Have been meditating for 2 months and practicing mindfulness throughout the day. I have guilt that I am unable to resolve. I have 3 older siblings, about 15 years older then me. I do not keep in touch with them often. I sort of ran away from the drama because I didn't want to get pulled into it at the time that includes nieces and nephews that were subject to the same things I was. I am not sure of anyones diagnosis. To make things short, amongst my siblings, there has been suicide attempts, heroin addiction, prostitution, bankruptcy, cheating, abuse, extreme anger, pill addiction, alchoholism and I just scratched the surface. Anyway, I am doing okay for myself with what I feel was little effort and honestly I have been kind of like a leaf in the wind. I have a hard time making decisions because I feel like my decisions are not good enough, not helping enough, or too selfish. Sounds silly, but I have a hard time gardening, playing music, having a pet, taking the kids to the park because I feel like its not helping anyone. But then I have guilt when the front of my house looks like crap, or I didn't take the kids to the park. I feel like I would like to learn skills but I always feel like its selfish but there is a part of me that wants to be selfish. I also have lived in fear of not doing so well in life because it runs in my family but I am getting over that. I want to seek truth but I know this is holding me back from being present. How do you reconcile this guilt to make decisions that will be aligned with your authentic self? I get that its an illusion but its so strong. I am sorry if this sounds silly. It really has had me stuck in life and not being able to fully enjoy it. I feel like I am leaving people behind. Thank you in advance. This site has been truly truly amazing.

I started consciousness work a few months ago as an emotionally wounded newbie, and I would still categorize myself as such. Though, thanks to some innate characteristics like my radical openmindedness and strong curiosity, I have been able to benefit from advanced personal development despite being a very low cconsciousness person. I initially thought I had my first no self experience several months ago when first starting but can realize that it was just delusion. This time was a totally different feeling. I was engaging in a self-inquiry session, and after about 50 minutes I felt a totally new sensation. The body felt like a mere object, a part of this endless nothingness. I can't aptly describe what happened since it only lasted three seconds or so, but I don't recall having experienced anything like that before. I should add that my conciousness and self actualization work has started to pay off. I had crippling anxiety, depression, fear, victim mentality, narcissism , entitlement, feelings of inferiority and superiority, over thinking, and many other severe neuroses. I had lost all my friendships, had to take time off from school, and was on the verge of suicide. After taking lots of action and serious study of multiple sources, I can actually say that I am decently happy most of the time. That aside, my experience of whatever that was was pure terror for the few seconds it lasted. Though it wasn't an ordinary terror such as a fear of some danger, rather a complete overwhelming awe of something that I just couldn't even grasp or adequately put to words. Since my experience was so brief, I don't know if this is at all a valuable insight or if my imagination was playing tricks on me. But something was different and I wanted to take note of it. Eager to hear your thoughts.

@Frogfucius A total man is neither extrovert nor introvert. Then you have the tranquillity of the introvert and the excitement of the extrovert. That's what a rich life has to be - the silence of the introvert and the joy of the extrovert, the centre of the introvert and the periphery of the extrovert. The introvert becomes more and more sad - silent of course, but not happy. The extrovert is very excited; the introvert is never excited. He remains calm and quiet, but calmness and quietude are not the goals of life. Ecstasy is the goal of life. Just to be calm and quiet can mean death, can mean suicide. You can dry up all the sources of life in you. You will become calm and quiet, all the fever gone, all the passion gone, all the lust gone - but then you are also gone. You are just an empty room, a negativity, a sort of absence, not a presence. You are not fulfilled. You cannot dance - you have nothing to dance about. You cannot sing. No song arises in your life because all songs dry up when love dries up. You can be with an extrovert, happily; you can relate with him. He is an excited being. He sings, he plays around... many games. He enjoys. Of course he is tense. He is never silent; that is his problem. Happiness is at a cost - that he loses tranquillity, equilibrium, balance. His excitement becomes more and more feverish, and there is every possibility of it turning into a delirium. The extrovert can be mad at any time; the breakdown can come very easily to him. He is so excited and so tense. He has no centre - just the revolving periphery.

Thats what jesus would say! Joking aside, you gonna die anyway. Isnt it more fun if you become aware of the you that never dies? You have been given this chance now and for whatever reason you gravitated towards this. And after all you wont die, only illusions will die. Its a journey of finding truth, not some suicide mission. The true you, they say, can never die. Of course that being the case it doesnt really matter if you get the realization in this lifetime or in the next 100. I feel that I owe it to myself to find the truth, so im on the path. Im enjoying the path. And observing the one that enjoys! I think it would be regrettable to turn away from working on inner peace and inner truth.

Firstly, nothing is egoic without ego. NO PHYSICAL ACTION OR OBJECT IS EVER EGOIC! EVER! Things become egoic when the ego gets a hold of it. I can use a fork egoically to murder your entire family. Or I can use the fork non-egoically to eat a salad. Even weirder, it's possible for me to use a fork to murder your entire family unegoically. That's right! I said unegoically! That's a bit of a stretch, but possible. An earthquake can kill a million people in the blink of an eye unegoically. Our aversion to death and murder is itself egoic. Secondly, even if my channel is egoic, for example, the point is to be moving towards egolessness. It's a long process. You can't just go to Walmart and buy egolessness off the store shelf. You have to bootstrap it from ego. Ego has to come to grips with the fact that it is self-limiting and must ultimately commit a noble suicide. That is the entire process in a nutshell. Your entire life is a game of you either moving towards that noble suicide or running away from it.

Animals experience everything as it is. Man does not, because his mental abstractions and ego get in the way. Animals are more in-tune with the fundamental nature of existence than man, because they are incapable of conceptualizing it. That said, some animals are capable of empathy, they do have a sense of self, and may even act altruistically. Whales and dolphins have been known to protect stray seals, and have also been known to commit suicide. I'd say the more complex the mind, the more conscious the animal. The more conscious the animal, the more they associate with mind patterns. But then they become less in-tune with their fundamental existence, which could be psychologically harmful for the individual... I don't know, I'm just throwing thoughts out here.

Well I haven't read that book, but I can make an empirical claim that you are wrong in this case. I have done psychedelics in times of despair with positive results, also there have been so many others that have. Look at ayahuasca for example, how many people do you think are drawn to go to the jungle because they are in a state of crisis? Sure, some people are there for the "fun" of it, but that is not a significant number. Visionary artist Alex Grey is another example, he was on the edge of suicide, having prayed to a god he didn't believe in the day before spontaneously trying LSD for the first time which radically changed his life. I am not saying one should take these substances when in crisis, because it can easily go bad. I am saying that what you are claiming is false, and frankly if you haven't done any psychedelics you shouldn't be making any sort of claims about them.

Sometimes or often. I find my self escaping into some fantasy about being famous or admirerd or being super human or stuff like that. Hockey pro, super soldier, artist. Iv started to think. Is that damaging to my self esteem? To have these idiolised images of how i wish i were all the time. Becouse i feel like absolut garbage all the time. I realy feel like im just a huge fail as a human. Realy massive fail. I sometimes find myself engagera in fantasis about being some extrodinary enlightened meditation master. And it feels like it ruins actual meditation. I feel kind of desperate in getting better to. I realy feel like just blowing my brain out from time to time and have suicide attempts every now and then. Im sure it will happen again. I feel so low it dosnt even mather what i do. Becouse it will change nothing about how i see my self. Iv done every drug there is. And generally irresponsible behaviours while driving etc just for the kicks without any regard for anything. I feel like i truly dont care about anyone else. And that kind of bathers me and not. Becouse ser other people having this sort of connection with others that just cant have. Even the wish to care more is just for me. I dont actualy care at all. I even went as far as to almost joining isis or some extremist group like that just to be part of anything. And get killed. Im desperate to get enlightend and thats not gonna happen comming from that position of mind im sure. But i just cant deal with it. I meditate like crazy just to get by. Becouse if i didnt i would go nuts in mather of days. Iv given up on life in a way. But still not. Im just getting by i dont actualy think i be getting somewere tho. I dont even bather trying. I just think that with time and daily meditation mayby i be alright. So i just go with that for now and just hope things will solve them selfs. I dont expect anyone to give a shit. But it was nice to get it out. Have nice day.

Neither would I. But I think there's something deep to be learned from primitive societies. In modern societies, the constant stimulants and chasing of egoic pursuits are what fog the mind for humans. That's why most modernized people aren't spiritual or in-tune with consciousness and existence. It feeds into an illusion that only continues to get stronger - just look at the rising depression and suicide rates among developed nations. Only through great suffering do modernized people find bliss and happiness, something that is already acquired by the primitive peoples.

We should all appreciate the joy that breathing, drinking water and eating healthy brings to us... It looks so simple. White american males must be too much in their stories.. The only reason i see for suicide is being tired of life because of not having enough for food/ water/shelter, so you cant keep your energy up. All madness is caused by the lack of resource. Otherwise you just need to start paying attention how good it feels to just breathe... Even if you've been bullied by someone etc or raped or whatever. Shame... Who cares, look how good it feels to breathe my ego loves to breathe too. Its reasonable.

I would say life is a nightmare for a lot of people, not just drug addicts. Depression and suicide rates have been on the rise for decades now, and will only continue to grow. Most of the people committing suicide in America? Middle class, white American males. Are these people who take their lives also not suffering, maybe more so than the addict? It got so bad they had to take their lives? Drugs, sex, money, partying, alcohol, TV, etc. don't cause suffering. They're merely distracting oneself from feeling the intense suffering they have by not being in the present moment and finding fulfillment by turning inward. But hedonists don't turn inward, do they? They seek pleasure through outside means.

Enlightenment comes to oneself depending on the path one takes. I believe that faster one throws themselves into the emotional fray, the sooner it will arrive however it greatly jeopardizes their sanity and life and they may seek suicide as a solution for their suffering. A life of small baby steps of personal growth will make such process a lot longer and perhaps one will miss the boat before they pass. But the length of time it takes should not at all be a focus. In fact enlightenment shouldn't even be a focus whatsoever. It should remain a 'cool thing to accomplish' and that's it. Take the desire out of such journey. By doing that you're already on the right track. In all honesty, it comes the fastest when one applies self-analysis and notes their neurotic behavior.

that is why you need help. you "tolerated". you are like a sponge. she can suck on it for the emotional juice she needs and spit it out when she wants to and suck on you "whenever" she likes without regards to your "being" and "feeling" of the moment. you are such a dush... just report her to the dorm manager or better, "find a temporary girl-friend to separate her out". she is messing up your life, bro. she threaten suicide? or you come again? i will record you and our conversation and put you on Youtube for the world to see. it works...no joke. You start with "my g/f can't leave episo #1"? you can take it down when she decided to leave.

Since she has already got around you before, she is convinced that you will buckle again. Are you giving her mixed signals by letting her into your room? You sound like someone plagued by guilt. Have a chat to a your personal tutor or make an offical complaint to a member of staff that she is threatening suicide. Tell them that she is harassing you and you would like her to stop. It's time to be serious about this if it is bothering you that much. Harassment can be draining and will impact on your studies.

Hey guys this is my first post I am currently a sophomore in college and live in the dorms. Over the summer I broke up with my girlfriend because she is a very negative, angry, and emotionally driven person and we had nothing in common. The problem I'm having is she lives in the dorms with me, just a floor under me. She is completely obsessed with me and will randomly come up to my room and immediately put me in a bad mood. I have worked on staying calm around her but after a while it seems impossible. She gets so mad and is always yelling and hitting me for no reason. Then I will ask her to leave my room and she will argue until she finally leaves and then will threaten suicide if I "don't maker her feel better" (which really means saying something that she can twist into thinking we will get back together.) She has coerced me into having sex or cuddling with her multiple times and has even gotten me to be fwb for a while. I did not want this I felt trapped and forced. I really wish I would never have to see her again, she is bringing me down emotionally and makes me not even want to leave my room for fear of seeing her. Any suggesttions for mentally dealing with this? All I've tried is willing myself to stay calm which can only work for so long .

Define self actualisation for you first. For a homeless man in NYC it's the accomplishment of a warm bed and hot food For a child in poverty it's the ability to provide clean water and tomorrow's meal For a mother with 4 kids it's to support and provide till they become independent For a girl with big dreams it's flashing lights and magazine covers For some it's enlightenment For others it's suicide For many it's religion For you? Who knows

Have equal attention to all of your emotions. Become distracted by one or more at first and gradually all of them. Forcibly induce an unconditionally calm and content state of mind during all of them; including happiness, so as to not act rash. This cocktail of emotions creates a seemingly impossible balance. Despite the differing emotions, they create a balance. The reason why is the same as how people are not as disturbed by the emotion they experience during movies. For instance, a scene about suicide from a brave teenager who takes the place of another and yet is the main character may induce anger, sadness, happiness, suffering, and also provide a burst of energy and inspiration. Try this exercise when you watch a well flavored movie or while you are going to sleep. Do not treat any emotion as poisonous. Instead, dive into what seems like fire only to find it to be light. This is why the differing emotions mix so well. It only seems like fire, but when you get past opinions and the futility of traditional and mainstream thought, it is light. This exercise can also be done with the five senses. Please leave comments about your own experiences.

@Gabriel David Gomez I've been thinking about this. The hedonistic growth of societies have caused us to suffer. Our mind doesn't know how to limit desire and say enough is enough, nor does it know how to not compare us to other people and perceive them as better off because they may have one materialistic thing that we don't have. It seems like a fundamental flaw of the human psyche, drilled in by societal conditioning. Depression and suicide rates have been on the rise for a while now. In 2010, for the first time in human's history, more people lived in cities than not. Urbanization is damaging to the psyche - stimulants are abound, families are broken up, there's nothing but competition in a never-ending hamster wheel, we're overcrowded and yet everyone feels like a stranger to us. We evolved from close-knit tribes, in forests and in nature. The underdeveloped societies are measured to be the most happy and fulfilled in life, counter-intuitively. Suicides and depression are swept under the rug, never reported on in the mainstream. Human psychology is never given a thought in mainstream society, because it doesn't serve the hedonistic nature of itself. These are just my theories, of course. I find it to be true in my own life.

Can people relate to that feeling when you want to do something and finally get yourself together and pursue this something, but am faced with social resistance in the face of which you begin to doubt yourself intensely - is what you fight for even right, good, worthwhile, etc.? It is important to understand that this question comes from a place of great misery, feeling both lost and alien in the world. Paul Chek once said "I'm normal, humanity is sick." Teal Swan touched on the issue, I believe, in her post about authenticity and how the anti-Teal campaigns made her feel like her existence is wrong, "This very train of thinking is what led to my suicide attempts years ago." The situation is that I live at home and am currently somewhat frowned upon by my family. I do remember that topic back from the birth of the forum where the consensus of people stated that they don't share nor tell friends and relatives about their interest in PD, but this is difficult wrt diet, fitness and meditation, among other things. There seems to be a run and retreat mechanism: I will try to implement something or make a change. Testing the waters, momentarily unveiling parts of the facade (that I believe most people create, read 'The Drama of the Gifted Child'), but once scorned sufficiently, I revert. As you might imagine, this causes great confusion and self-doubt. Since early childhood I have sensed a hypocritical attitude in others where they idly aspire to certain ideals (health, success, etc.) - yet simultaneously almost keep others down in their pursuit of those very ideals. And this behavior absolutely baffles me. I don't think there is any point to describe the situation any further. Fill in the blanks. I hope that I managed to convey the gist of the topic that I want to raise a discussion about. How can you possibly work with your parents rather than against them? Does self-actualization work have to be this strenuous?

Um I think most of the world's population is glad to have been born. Don't overestimate how bad life is before enlightenment. The egoic mind causes suffering but there are still good times in life, and those good times make the suffering worth it. Especially if you have a life purpose and are doing personal development. Personally, even when my ego has gotten out of control to the point where I thought about suicide I never regretted being born in the first place. And since you say that we're all better off dead, what are your reasons for not killing yourself?

@username If you do a copy/paste with your consciousness, then no problem. You have a clone that thinks like you or whatever and you still get to live. If you do a cut/paste, then the "cut" part means you kill yourself. You don't sound like you're advocating mass suicide, but unfortunately, a lot of people sound like they do. @Leo Gura No, actually it's been done for the first time recently. It says brain-to-brain, but actually it's brain-to-computer-to-brain. So it seems like your prediction has an error of hundreds of years. No it doesn't require you to know anything about consciousness. You just have to plug wires at the right place and Boom! You know the internet like the back or your hand. You plug some more and Boom! You have a hundred different senses, instead of the usual five. A few more wires and Boom! Enlightenment can be pursued without all the distractions and traps that usually get in your way when doing self-inquiry. It's obviously simplified, but you get the point. That's where we totally agree. I want to become a robot by incrementally modifying my brain in a way that I always wake up after the operation and it just felt like a normal nap. This way I don't even have to get into the whole consciousness debate. The key here is incremental change. You're already doing it every night. Why not improve the process?

@Electron Pleasure implies there is an opposite: pain. Enlightenment has no opposites. it is peace. Peace with what is. That is why I pursue enlightenment. The second reason for me personally is Truth; I want to know what is the Truth. But yes, on the other hand, you might want to promise your mind/ego some pleasure to convince it to commit suicide. Maybe that is comparable to Islamic promises (I am no way expert in that field BTW) that if you kill your Self, you will get some virgins in the end. Isn't that the promise of peace after your ego is annihilated? If so, it is completely misinterpreted by Islamic suicide bombers....

From the article, "Family Matters- Sadhguru Speaks About His Family" For some reason we could not complete the consecration at that time. So on that full moon day, she sat with a group of people, meditating. Eight minutes later, she left, without any effort and with a big smile on her face. She was at the peak of her health, just thirty-three years of age. It is not easy to leave like this without causing any damage to the body. Just walking out of your body like you drop your clothes and go is not an ordinary thing. When a person has reached that point in his life when he feels everything that he needs is fulfilled, and there is nothing more to see in his life, he drops his body, willfully. If there is any struggle or injury, it means suicide. When there is no struggle, when somebody just walks out like he walks out of a room, that’s Mahasamadhi. Once a person leaves like this, that person is no more. When somebody dies, you say they are no more, but that’s not true. They are “no more” the way you know them, that’s all. But once a person leaves in full awareness, shedding the body without causing any injury or damage to the body, that person is truly no more. That person doesn’t exist as a being anymore. They have just melted away, the game is up, completely. For all spiritual seekers, Mahasamadhi is the ultimate goal – the very culmination of their sadhana to dissolve into Divinity.