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That would have been funny! No I intuitively knew what was happening, I jsut htought it was something that happened to all people who meditated. So you could say the trigger was meditation but thats not really accurate. I did meditate, and kundalini did awaken... would kundalini had awakened even if I never meditated? Probably yes. It was something you would call a destiny. I was in a 2-3 month long period of deep depression and grief.

@OBEler I did absolutely nothing. It woke up spontaneously. At that point I had no idea what spirituality was. First almost year of the journey I didnt even know the signifiicance of it. Awakened kundalini will fully enlighten you in the process of purging out the ego out of your nervous system. Which is not kundalini yoga. Kundalini yoga is just a practice. I have no idea what potential it has to awaken kundalini. This should be answered by someone more knowledgable about these topics such as @Leo Gura

Leo talks about this issue in the video. Just because the paradigm of Materialism is false doesn’t take away the patterns that the experiences have . In other words, the experiences still obey certain patterns. For example, if you don’t protect the brain, you will experience the appearances of living with brain damage. Even dreams have this kind of structure amongst the appearances as Leo mentions in the video. Even after you are awakened a bunch, you can’t just fly through walls now. But that doesn’t mean the paradigm of Materialism is true. No paradigm is ever true. That’s the deeper issue you gotta grok.

Over history, do you think a scientist has ever figured out a new clever way to actually test what was then untestable? Would this be an example? : A few hundred years ago illnesses were thought to have "supernatural" causes. The current scientific paradigm and lack of methodology prevented scientists from testing alternative hypotheses. Then, a scientist figured out how to create a microscope which led to the discovery of microbes such as bacteria and viruses. Hmmm, this is a different perspective of "intelligence". It is like the cube illusion you posted. For a while, all I could see was a small cube in a box. Then, a large cube with a corner missing. Here, "intelligence" is generally viewed as a product of the ego/self. "I" am intelligent. "He" is more intelligent than "Her". Yet, if we acknowledge the self is illusionary, there is no self to be intelligent. Most scientists would still take a 3rd person perspective that "intelligence" can be reduced to physical synapses. Yet, if one opens their mind to a "mysterious" source of the intelligence (nothingness, infinite consciousness etc) it is a game-changer. . . I would say the physical brain is necessary for the cleverness I use, yet perhaps it is insufficient. . . Are you familiar with the Two Slit and Eraser experiments in quantuum physics? The results were "shocking" to scientists since it refuted a scientific paradigm. There is just now way for me to reconcile the results with a traditional scientific framework. I'd be one of those people who needs to hear it. Could you recommend a reading / video that may provide me some more insight regarding epistemic and metaphysical errors of most scientists.? I think I would be more receptive to someone who has an understanding of science and became awakened with a new perspective. Btw, I will be teaching a neuroscience course for the first time next semester. It could be quite interesting. . .

It's interesting how people interpret my intentionally open ended comment and it seems there are some who seem to act as if a materialist boogeymen is under the bed waiting to dash their mystical dreams or maybe I'm misinterpreting other's comments. Although if the mind were open enough my comment can be interpreted in any number of ways. It is also interesting you view "everyday life" as cementing a zombified stupor of unconsciousness.... you are aware that you create this for yourself by thinking it so, aren't you? This is a belief based paradigm constructed from a duality mindset... you are welcome to free yourself from it's influence and effect at any time. For my own experience I find the ripples of awakened consciousness in every facet of life no matter how tediously everyday it may be....but alas everyone can do what they will with their own experiences.

http://www.poehm.com/en/list-of-enlightened-people/ David Hawkins † Born in June 1927, died September 2012. US American who worked successfully as a psychologist. After his awakening David Hawkins has been completely withdrawing from public into solitude for 7 years. After that, he had to learn interpersonal behavior again in order to be able to "interact normally" with people. Mario Mantese Mario Mantese is one of the best-known living enlightened people in Switzerland. He previously played bass in the internationally successful soul group Heatwave. After a gala evening in London, he was attacked and stabbed with a knife in his heart by a stranger. Waking up from a coma in which he was wandering through the afterlife, he realized that he was enlightened. Although unable to walk and his articulation affected, Mario Mantese (also called master M) has frequently over 1800 visitors at once at meetings held in Switzerland. Mantese has the reputation for performing true miracles. In his books he reported in addition to healing also about being present in several places or that he has commanded the clouds in a thunderstorm to create a rain-free corridor in which he and his companions went home without getting their feet wet. There are reports that he opened car doors without a key or commanded retractable barriers to rise. In a report he describes where he appears a woman, flooded in light and three times his body sizes. Sai Baba † 1926 - 2011. Indian Guru, who is believed to be able to do miracles. Above all materializing. He practiced that over and over again in his events: suddenly objects would appear in his hands. Karl Renz The “veteran” of enlightened people. In 1979, he became enlightened during his sleep. Isira Good looking Australian. She had her first awakening with 16 while she was raped. In her death struggle she realized that the man raping her is pure love. From that moment on he refrained from her. Barbara Voedisch She lives in Chiemgau, Germany. In her youth she was raped two times. She became enlightened after receiving the last information of her third channeled book, without previous contact to masters or spiritual books. Byron Katie Before her enlightenment, she lived in the hardest despair, self-accusation and depression. Besides Eckhart Tolle, she is one of the rare enlightened ones who, end of the 80's, from a dire mental condition became enlightened without any previous contact to spirituality Suzanne Segal † American 1955 until 1997. The astounding thing happened to her: while waiting at a bus station in Paris, she all of a sudden lost her “I”, but she didn’t know how to take that state, so she was helplessly sent from one psychiatrist to another. She suffered from states of tremendous anxiety because they tried to treat her state as something pathological. Only at the end of her life she realized that "enlightenment" had happened to her. Yolande Duran French (born 1963), who suddenly experienced enlightenment without any previous contact to spirituality. In contrast to Eckhart Tolle or Byron Katie she did not go through a valley of depression, worst self-accusation and suicidal thoughts. She was a normal woman, who, one day in the summer 2003, out of the blue, in her living room at home, stopped thinking - the silence came nevermore to return. Two months after this experience her only son died in a car accident and everyone around her thought she had been in a deep state of shock because they could not see any crying, collapse, or sorrow - but in truth she was inwardly unmoved by this death. Richard (Rick) Linchitz † US American 1947 – 2013: He was a physician and passionate athlete, until he got a diagnosis of lung cancer. His success-oriented life plunged into a deep crisis. He could not continue to practice neither as a doctor, nor sports nor playing the caring family father. In his great despair, he threw himself with all his energy in the spiritual search for enlightenment. He attended countless spiritual teachers and visited spiritual and awakened masters in India. One day teacher Satyam Nadeen told him at a retreat in Costa Rica "Consciousness is all there is - and you are that" and he awoke. His body healed inexplicably.

It's interesting that the Buddha got awakened by witnessing the suffering of others. So it seems that suffering can lead to disillusionment either way.

I am 19. I am an IV heroin/cocaine addict since 15. Those two are the most crippling of my many addictions. I have restarted an amazing prescription drug called Suboxone yesterday, and whilst getting back into the practice of self actualization (see previous posts—I used to be somewhat active on here before my relapse), I started studying Leo’s videos again. I have thoroughly attempted the 12 step program, studied the Alcoholics Anonymous textbook (a collection of stories of the pioneers of AA and how it came about, what it is what is it’s purpose and then more stories of recovered addicts/alcoholics are enclosed) I have also been forced by rehabs to attend literally hundreds, possibly a thousand or so meetings, I have to speak up for 12 steps, though I am on the fence about if it’s for me still. In his video titled “Overcoming Addiction- The Root Cause of Every Addiction” starting at around 33:00, Leo begins speaking, seemingly from inexperience and misinformation about 12 step programs. I felt that he did not even read the actual twelve steps before making this statement about twelve step programs. “You can enroll in a twelve step program...” False- you do not enroll in a twelve step program. You just go to a meeting (usually in the basement of a church) and sit down, it’s free. U can opt to make that meeting ur “home group”, but u only sign ur first name on a loosely kept and rarely ever checked list usually written on some piece of loose leaf kept in a folder. “...and they’ll give you a lot of great techniques and that will be great...” I honestly cannot think of one technique for breaking addiction other than the one solution they offer you, which is living by the twelve steps. That’s literally the only technique. And it is a spiritual way of life, not a technique. “..but they don’t give you the big picture because they don’t understand it themselves...” “Your mission is not just to quit an addiction, and that’s the only real mission that a 12 step program will give you, they’ll say ‘okay let’s have you quit this addiction, and then we’ll replace this bad addiction with some good addictions” Completely utterly false. Having read, studied, been taught and lived the entire AA program in the past, I can assure you this is entirely 100% false. They only teach you about the twelve steps. They say by surrendering to a higher power (the universe, god, etc) and by ridding yourself of all the negative character defects primarily FEAR, EGOTISM/SELF CENTEREDNESS, LYING, ANGER, etc and by undoing all of your wrong doings wherever possible, and then by practicing meditation and prayer “to increase our conscious contact with God as we understood him” and the main part of what they say solves an addiction: Literally the main part, and Leo literally teaches this...it’s literally the last step... “Having has a SPIRITUAL AWAKENING AS THE RESULT OF THESE STEPS, we carried our message to other alcoholics and practiced these PRINCIPLES in ALL of our AFFAIRS. The program simplified down is this: “Get help from spiritually awakened people, and then when you yourself are spiritually awakened through living these spiritual principles we are about to show you how to live, THEN you help someone who is currently suffering in what your shoes felt like when you came in” He goes onto say “there’s a very big difference between playing defense and playing offense, in a twelve step program you’re playing defense you’re not playing offense. You’re not trying to become the best human being you can possibly be [uhmmmm no these suffering addicts literally are trying through these steps I see them try so hard I literally was just trying for my life to reach apotheosis while in a twelve step phase] Defense can be good, but it’s not as good as what I’m telling you here. You can take the techniques from the twelve step program [you actually can’t, it’s literally ‘dedicate your life to living under the spiritual principles we lay out, or you can leave on your own accord and try it your way again’] but have the mission to be self actualized. But what you are telling people there is simply wrong. And it’s kind of hurtful to those in AA. And the whole video was great, and I truly respect love and honor you Leo, but I feel as though I have a duty to all those who’ve helped me in twelve steps, almost as if they were giving their life to help save mine, and to carry their message to this other SPIRITUAL group, and correct this incorrect info Leo said in this video. Though Leo and Actualized.org lean far left hand path, and AA more-so the right hand path, let’s look at the similarities...starting with the leaders. One was named Bill Wilson and one is Leo Gura. Both are very into psychedelic compounds. Bill Wilson had his first spiritual awakening with the Belladonna Treatment in a hospital, where he saw a white light and immediately had a spiritual experience while tripping. He immediately wrote down his experience and came up with the program and over half of the twelve steps. He right away began helping people in the very hospital he came in for treatment, and essentially tasted enlightenment. He then went on to HEAVILY experiment with a little known compound called LSD, and tripped numerous times for SPIRITUAL PURPOSES with some of the greatest minds of the time, one being Aldous Huxley, author of The Doors of Perception. Both mess around with consciousness work and mystical experiences. Bill was adept at meditation and was into ouija and channeling, and supposedly channeled the twelve steps from a spirit monk that claimed to be a deceased monk during a seance in his home, he held seances a lot. Bill got into what they called back then “witchcraft”. Both use a triangle as their symbol...which AA describes its spiritual meaning and how each side represents a certain thing. Both groups are just people looking for help, both groups encourage growing to your apex. Idk I’m just trying to say that AA, though a basic spiritual program compared to more left hand paths. He goes on to say “don’t quit ur drug because of a negative reason [trying to say AA gives u a negative reason to quit] you need a positive reason. And the most positive reason is to become self actualized. It’s not about fixing problems it’s about living life to it’s fullest. This is a very different attitude...” AA gives you both. They say if you don’t transform, you will stay stuck in your addiction, and that only leads to jails, institution, insanity, and death. But they literally prove to u how people can come from being so broken to living a truly spiritual life and even help others. It is almost entirely a spirtual, semi religious group, that seems to outsiders like it’s not spirtual, in order to attract people who want nothing to do with God or spirituality (drug addicts) The goal of the program, is FREEDOM. not from just your addiction, but from your ego and negativity. opioids (and to a large part in this order amphetamines/cocaine/prescription pills and alcohol...but especially opioids...) are a HUGE issue in this country, and it’s taking the nation by storm faster than ever before. So when an addict goes to rehab, literally 90% of rehabs say if they want to live, to go to a twelve step meeting the day they get out, to raise their hand and ask for help. There is literally a meeting EVERY SINGLE NIGHT you are forced to attend at the rehab where outside speakers who have been through the twelve steps. I advocate for SMARTrecovery as well, but twelve steps can truly transform you from the inside out if you choose to live by it. This one Leo was totally wrong on and it needed to be addressed. 1. We admitted that we were powerless over our addiction, that our lives had become unmanageable. 2. We came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity. 3. We made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood Him. 4. We made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves. 5. We admitted to God, to ourselves, and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs. 6. We were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character. 7. We humbly asked Him to remove our shortcomings. 8. We made a list of all persons we had harmed, and became willing to make amends to them all. 9. We made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others. 10. We continued to take personal inventory and when we were wrong promptly admitted it. 11. We sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God as we understood Him, praying only for knowledge of His will for us and the power to carry that out. 12. Having had a spiritual awakening as a result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to addicts, and to practice these principles in all our affairs.

Why do people who believe they don't have free will choose to tell others they don't have it either? I guess they have no choice and are subject to the unconscious mind's impulses. Attempting to stop the mind from thinking is like attempting to stop the heart from beating. Why? It's what it naturally does. Although, I would liken the exercise of awakened contemplation to conscious breathing, we can intentionally cease for a short time but eventually we pass out from the lack of oxygen to our brain and the body resumes breathing when we aren't actively preventing it from doing so. In a similar way we can try to not think but when we aren't looking the unconscious mind springs forth with impulses in many forms. Since we cannot see the unconscious mind doing it's thing it is only once it rises to the conscious mind that we notice it. So our work is to be aware of the machinations of the mind and observe them, not try to stop it from doing what it naturally does. By being aware of what stirs in the mind we can cease to be influenced by the mind's unconscious impulses which are past experience and choose to be present in the experience of what is happening now. By being attentive to the present moment we are creating the pattern of being present in our unconscious mind to recall at another time. So at that other time will we reminisce about being present in a past time? Will we just remember us being present in a past moment or will we be present in the moment we have to be in now? It's our choice....or is it?

My assumption is that Jesus was a real person. He was indeed crucified. Jesus did not really die. He went back to the east. He died at old age buried in Kashmir. Some say he was a yogic master and he poses psychic abilities. I believe this is true since the Bible seems to show us that he is spiritually awakened. Becoming enlightened really does tune a person's energy therefore making acess psychic abilities much easier. All of healing miracles are true Walk on water is true. Resurrecting a person from death is true Catching fishes miracle is true The one miracle I wasnt quite sure to be true is multiplying bread and fish

When I entered Samadhi, and stayed for fifteen days, I did not know what was happening. I came in naturally. I did not ask, I did not ask. And from what I remember I was never afraid to be mad or mad. Then I realized how many people should be in hospices for not being able to deal with this awakened state. I am awakened that we are God and that there is a Higher Deity. This is very clear from experience. Did you experience the awakening of the Self?

If I was totally awakened I wouldnt immerse me in the matrix to rescue people for humanitary sake. Its the same like when christian prophets went to turkey and died dilapidated. I'd just only try to convince someone who has a seeker nature, a genuine hunger for thuth.

Hello I'm new here, this is a great site. I did a search on nightmares and found several different threads so decided to make my first post here, since all of my demon encounters have been in dreams. I had some intense dreams the past few nights, and in the middle of a scary one, I actually remembered something I read on this site about bad trips and how they can be good learning experiences, so I thought maybe that's true of dreams also. So I kind of made myself stay in the dream for a bit longer than usual. Then last night I had a really scary one, and instead of looking away from the monster in the dream, I just stared at its face and then I became the monster. Usually I wake up terrified, or I just cower in fear till the dream ends, so this time I noticed that I took different attitude during the dream. I don't know if this qualifies as "lucid dreaming" or not. I wasn't in total control, the only thing I remember being in control of was that I chose not to try to look away from the monster's face. I didn't feel as though the demon possessed me, it felt more like I possessed the demon. If indeed I did become possessed, I would say that it wasn't totally horrible; there was a pleasurable aspect to it as well. Then I did all kinds of horrible things as the monster, which I prefer not to go into, and kind of exulted in the evilness of it all, it was as though I was Saruman after having joined the side of Sauron in Lord of the Rings. I might have then awakened and felt like I was a terrible person for indulging in that way, but again I recalled Leo's Rant Against Morality video about not automatically labeling things good or evil. And then I felt less guilty, and now I chalk it up to a super realistic kind of role play, or like if you play a video game and you choose to be the villain character. Although I'd prefer not to have these kinds of dreams on a regular basis, LOL.

When I entered Samadhi, and stayed for fifteen days, I did not know what was happening. I came in naturally. I did not ask, I did not ask. And from what I remember I was never afraid to be mad or mad. Then I realized how many people should be in hospices for not being able to deal with this awakened state. I am awakened that we are God and that there is a Higher Deity. This is very clear from experience. Did you experience the awakening of the Self?

I too, grew confused about the relationship between Life Purpose and Enlightenment work, but here's a nice summary of what I've realized. To begin, lets look at three propositions: Enlightenment work represents development of one's inner life (INNER development), not observable by anyone other than one on the inside -- its working on how you feel about the work and how you look at the world. Life purpose work represents development of one's outer life (OUTER development), observable by anyone 'on the outside' (Yes, I get that 'there is no outside,' but bear with me here. I use this term in the regular everyday sense - the way that you can't see my experience of the color red but you can see me practicing kickboxing). Anyway life purpose work is about the tangible stuff I take from the world and the tangible stuff I give to the world (art, science, words, videos, volunteering, etc.) Both Enlightenment Work (INNER development) and Life Purpose Work (OUTER development) have elements of Purification (Taking Away stuff) and Increasing Complexity/Power (Adding stuff). No part of is completely detached from any other part. Life is about all of these aspects of development. You cannot have one without the other, although they are separate focuses or views. It is like talking about North, South, East and West. I cannot have North without South or East without West. But looking Eastward gives me not much information about West and looking northward doesn't give me information about south. Then again, at the highest levels, all four views come together when you go to the highest levels, the way that if i went east all the way, it would connect with west on a globe and if i went far enough north, i would begin to go south. So if I wanted to have the greatest levels of Outer development, I would have to have had the greatest levels of inner development. If I want to give more to the world, i have to stop taking away so much from the world. If I'm the type of person with true awakening then I am the time person who doesn't take in the things that I know I don't want. So, what we have is a grid of four quadrants of getting your shit together. Waking Up - Inner Enlightenment work by taking away attachment to untruth Growing Up - Inner Enlightenment work by adding mental complexity/the ability to take on multiple perspectives Cleaning Up - Outer Life Purpose work by taking away attachment to addictions Showing Up - Outer Life Purpose work by adding techniques of mastery so that we express our highest values Each of these quadrants has its own line of development through transcending and including previous levels. These quadrants are all connected, yet they develop independently. Which is to say the following: A highly developed human would go as far as possible in all four quadrants of personal development. they would feel awakened, look awakened, act awakened, and talk awakened But just because you're good at one level of development, doesn't 100% mean you're good at all of them. for evidence, look at anyone in Tim Ferris's Podcast There is increasing levels correlation between all four quadrants as one develops to the highest level in any one quadrant that is, to really show up in life like a Leonardo Da Vinci or Bruce lee, you have to have gotten your shit together We often might only pay attention to people who are really good at any one level, thinking that that is the way to live, but often it is only a focus on one quadrant Again, The problem is that people only spend time focused on one quadrant and one quadrant only, thinking that that is the be-all end all. This is why so much of self-help might conflict. More over, our society only looks at the quadrant of Showing Up as a form of success. As mentioned before, since it does correlate at higher levels, Showing success is a small form of evidence of overall development, but its not the whole picture. Do not create a duality between life purpose and enlightenment. They are one, not two, as are all things - hence non-duality. Also, Do not create a duality between purifying your life through non-action and adding more to your life through action. Moreover, I cannot tell you, no one can tell you @Dan94 what life might look like when all four quadrants are developed to their highest level FOR YOU. This is part of why the tao that can be spoken is not the true tao. Leonardo Da Vinci is nothing like Bruce Lee is nothing like Joe Rogan is nothing Like Peter Ralston other than that they all hang out in Being Cognition (and technically they are all the same awareness!). It is in this sense that we all follow our own path. Furthermore, all of this is mental justification for chilling the fuck out and hanging out in Being Cognition while observing stuff. Being cognition is the sense that the world is perfect as is and that everything is seen as an end-itself or a subject for-itself instead of an object for an end goal. The common repose of being cognition is that you could die in that moment and that it would be the perfect ending to your movie. We have all felt this way at some point in our lives, and it always feels like everything in our lives lead to that moment at that moment. When you feel like you have woken up, grown up, cleaned up, and showed up sufficiently you will allow yourself to hang out in being cognition. Other wise, you will probably trick yourself into going back to deficiency cognition, where the world is basically a rat-race hell. So it is that: Enlightenment work is life purpose work viewed form the outside. Taking away subtle addictions is the other side of adding mental/physical power. And that all of this is just so that you can allow yourself to step into Being Cognition - but from the very beginning you could simply hang out in being cognition and that is itself all that's necessary to do all four. The systemic strategy, then is to allow yourself to go into Being Cognition (by developing curiosity after dropping Knowing) and through your own curiosity develop yourself on any of the quadrants as your intuition pulls you from a sense of wanting to know and wanting to get better (PLAYing) not needing to know and not needing to get better (SEEKing). This is Not Knowing In Action. If you're wondering what it looks like to allow yourself to access being cognition and develop yourself in all four quadrants look no further than Bruce Lee, Leonardo Da Vinci, Plato, Wim Hof, Peter Ralston, and Joe Rogan. Those guys have their inner life developed and their outer life developed as well, all while allowing themselves to hang out in Being Cognition all the time. Simply Work Diligently, Patiently, Persistently, and Playfully to Realize the Truth - that there's nothing more than simply working Diligently, Patiently, Persistently, and Playfully to Realize the Truth - that there's nothing more than.... Love, TJ P.S. people wonder what Spiral Dynamics Coral Level looks like, it is everything I described above. Coral = all four quadrants of getting your shit together combine and you allow yourself to hang out in being cognition 24/7 (although being cognition is available from the get go) @Leo Gura let me know what you think of this proposition.

Entry 241 | Divine Love Theory: The reason for all suffering in life could quite simply be that we haven't opened up ourselves to express love for all things. The emptiness could just be a void where love is absent. Applying it: Learn to love all things about your existence; your body, other people, animals, viruses, cancers, evil, selfishness and selflessness, ignorance and wisdom... Everything. It would be incredibly shallow to say that I love music and playing guitar. Of course, that's how it started. But I've just been awakened to the fact that 10+ years of devotion to these things have not only deepened my love for them, but they have deepened my love for life itself. Love for the most raw perceptions available to me such as sight, sound, touch, taste, smell, thought, emotion, imagination, and the sixth sense. There is no separation between performing music, listening to music, and doing nothing as far as the divine love within me is concerned. Actually, perhaps the reason why I've experienced so much growth over the last year or so is simply that my love for life has deepened. I've become fascinated by it. But sometimes, I still suppress that feeling because of the conditioning that needs to be grown out of. Music is no longer the forefront of my life anymore. Life has become the forefront of my life. Now more than ever, I feel compelled to discover as much as I can through means of knowledge, wisdom and direct experience. But just to give an idea as to the things I love, maybe a list is in order. Because there are lots of things that I never would have believed possible to fall in love with. So here goes nothing! This list includes: The sensations of the wound steel strings of the guitar beneath the fingertips Vibrations of sound waves tickling the skin The internal music provided to me through means of the sixth sense The way the dog opens everything but her eyes as I rub her tummy Making strange and funny faces in the mirror Doing strange poses and body movements Resting my head against a wall or surface and listening to the amplified sounds it can make Making tasty, healthy food for me and my parents Laughing with those closest to me Embracing the aspect of myself that is far-fetched from what is socially and culturally 'normal' The fact that I have a fully-functioning, healthy, young body Embracing possibilities that others would deem impossible The bouncy, light-footed feeling that comes over my body when performing a piece of music Being unnecessarily graceful with my movements Making people cringe with puns Having meaningful conversations Having the balls to have made it this far Loving the fact that our bodies will wither and die Watching the heartbreak and grief of others when people die There really is so much more to love about life and, to be fair, that was a pretty personal viewpoint. But the fact that some of those things might not resonate with you will help to define the authentic version of myself. But some things we can globally love, such as making bad puns (I wish). And to be all-loving of those things is by no means an easy thing to do alongside a heap of social conditioning. But it makes for the fuller life. Pick of the day:

@electroBeam I know what you are saying. This is said out of misunderstanding, by many people who only have theoretical knowledge of Vedanta. But I can clarify this.. You may have heard some Vedantins saying that the most qualified people for Advaita is the ones who can get the truth the moment they hear it. When someone points out the truth of who you are so skillfully, if you are a qualified person for Vedanta, you will get it and you will be instantly awakened. Listening to the truth that is skillfully pointed out by a Guru is called 'Sravana' which literally means listening. But what makes one such a qualified person? What kind of qualifications are they talking about? They are called Sadhana Chatustaya - fourfold qualifications with 6 virtues: https://www.swami-krishnananda.org/spiritual.aspiration/aspiration_6.html So, if someone has completely and perfectly developed these qualifications, he/she will be actually be able to awaken, once they hear the truth pointed out. Such people are called 'Uththama adhikaris'. After they listen to the truth, if they still don't awaken, that only indicates that they have not developed these fourfold qualifications. So, they go through two more stages to compensate the incomplete development of fourfold qualifications, which are known as manana and nidhidhyasana. Manana is more commonly understood as reflecting over the truth repeatedly and niddhidhyasana is a type of meditation that is explained here: http://www.adhyatmaprakasha.org/Volumes/PDF/english/043/index.pdf So what does this tell you? If someone is not awakened in the Sravana stage, he has obviously not done the prior step of developing fourfold qualifications correctly. If he has done it correctly, then he doesn't need anymore practice but he just needs to hear from a Guru as he points out the truth. Such a disciple who didn't complete the previous step properly is similar to a student who has arrears in a college semester. In other words, going through the stages of manana and nidhidhyasana is not normal even though it is more common. If you ask a vedanta student why many people have to go through manana and nidhidhyasana and why they didn't awaken once they heard the truth, they may probably tell you this : "that only happens very rarely to a few people, such a people are rare to find'... They will say as if it is an exception, but it is supposed to be the rule. Because, obviously, if they had worked harder on the fourfold qualifications, it would have happened. Where did they go wrong then? They went wrong because of the instructions like 'bhakti yoga, karma yoga and kriya yoga are limited' that you mentioned... Because, after hearing such instructions they tend to think "if they are limited, then why go through them? Let me directly listen to my guru, study scriptures and practice manana and nidhidhyasana... I think I have developed the fourfold qualifications". Most of the students of Vedanta do this mistake. But, if you ask any qualified guru how to develop these fourfold qualifications in the first place, he will tell you this: "You should practice Bhakti yoga, karma yoga or kriya yoga"... Because these practices help developing the fourfold qualifications by purifying the mind. Let me put it in a different way. You may heard many people say that you cannot do anything to get spirituality awakened. They will say that there is no action possible, nothing you can do can get you spiritual enlightenment. They are right, but this teaching is not complete. The truth is, you cannot do anything to get enlightened; but you can do many things to purify your mind, to develop these fourfold qualifications. That is why they say that enlightenment doesn't happen because of your doing but it happens because of grace. But what happens because of your doing is this purification of your mind, which gets you ready to receive that grace, which makes you to awaken as soon as the truth is pointed out. In some cases, the self knowledge (atma jnana) dawns automatically once the mind is completely purified. That means, developing these fourfold qualifications is the actual spiritual path. In other words, bhakti yoga, karma yoga or kriya yoga is the actual spiritual practice which occupies the longest time in a person's spiritual journey. That is why in Gita, Krishna says that there are only two paths: Action and knowledge. A person does some action to purify his mind, then the knowledge of the absolute reality dawns; finally he lives the rest of his life with the strength of his self-knowledge. This is the whole gist of Gita, as explained in the commentary of Adhi Shankara. You can download the free ebook of Shankara's Gita commentary here: https://archive.org/download/Bhagavad-Gita.with.the.Commentary.of.Sri.Shankaracharya/Bhagavad-Gita.with.the.Commentary.of.Sri.Shankaracharya.pdf All these three, bhakti yoga, karma yoga or kriya yoga come under the path of action (karma nistha); and the rest comes under path of knowledge (jnana nistha) . Karma nishtha leads to jnana nishtha... If self-realization can be compared to the top floor and if you compare spiritual practice as 18 steps leading to the top floor, then bhakti yoga, karma yoga or kriya yoga are spanned in the first 17 floors whereas the path of knowledge is the last step. How can anyone reach the last step without crossing the first 17 steps?

@Martin123 so will self realization eventually happen? or people with awakened kundalini before self realization will jump to unity consciousness all together. they will completely reconstruct their ego/karma and have the most harmonious loving unified self. But they won't have total and permanent dis-identification and experience the void consciousness. Is this where it's going? And Jan also mentions that true dis-identification can only happen through self-realization. You can't fake it or temporarily have it. If you try hard to dis identify then it's just disowning/dissociation which is basically neurosis.

No. The case that you first self-realized and then awaken kundalini has been most common. I am one of those who awaken kundalini before self-realization, and that path will (hopefully) take me all the way. I am not so sure about this being too rare anymore. It is the return of the divine feminine/ shakti nowadays after all :). There seems to be a bunch of individuals with awakened kundalini w/o first self-r.

@Martin123 Yeah but the one who shall not be named wasn't even enlightened, until a few weeks ago. Just awakened. Awakening doesn't deserve the label enlightenment in my opinion. Only when there's a permanent shift to oneness with the self is one enlightened.

I think its kundalini awakening. its close to what you are saying https://theyogalunchbox.co.nz/kundalini-awakenings-symptoms-process-benefits-support-help/ but its not active yet, you just awakened it once. I have 0 experience whit this so i can easily bee really wrong, i just watched some people that talked about it.

@egoless Lucid dreams is reffered to when you realize you are in a dream (you become awakened in the dream)while you were already dreaming. Astral projection is consciously leaving the physical body.

@John You don't see such examples because they don't become public figures.. The public figures who you see are only the tip of the iceberg. There are probably thousands of spiritually awakened people who continue to do the same thing after enlightenment. Actually, what you said is not a rule but an exception. Only a very few people give up their old jobs after enlightenment and create an organization to guide other people. As Brimstone rightly said, the change that occurs is actually a shift in the perception of self. That shouldn't necessarily change their lifestyle. After awakening, you may not be interested in personal success because you feel already complete, fulfilled and you won't have a necessity to accumulate or crave for anything. But you still continue the old life style and even try to go to the next step in the ladder for other reasons. What if you have a family and children to support, you still have to fulfill their dreams. Awakened ones hardly think about future. They act according to what the present moment or situation demands. But to others their actions may appear like motivated by craving for fulfillment. When people who are not awakened think about how it feels like living an awakened life, they can only think based on their limited, ego or identity based existence. So, they will always come to wrong conclusions no matter how intelligent they are. Because, somehow unconsciously they still assume that there is going to be duality (or being separate from the existence) after awakening. But after awakening, it opens a huge number of possibilities. You feel totally liberated from the prison of having a limited existence and you feel boundless. You may even act like a fool if you want to.

There is a point during the trip (as in all my trips) where I have a feeling this nondual experience will surely last forever and that I'm awaken now. It surely is convincing at that peak experience when I feel limitless. But of course I eventually come down. However, I can see the subtle nuance pathway being veiled to me for me to be awakened. It's just a continual peeling of the onion and seriously questioning my limiting beliefs and paradigm locks and not to get so easily sucked right back into them as I sober up. Really I feel sharpening of awareness, more trips, and continual studying is necessary for a persistent breakthrough. I like the slow motion water droplet Leo posted in his blog. Each I time trip it's just easier and exciting to just go as far as I can. Dying becomes a skill to be learned or better yet surrendering is the most beautiful art. How willing are you to die right now at this moment? Enlightenment is right now. I am nothing right now. A ghost, a hallucination is a breathtaking dream we call reality. But it's so convincingly real. My parents are convinced, my friends are convinced, and society is convinced that this is real and that we are born and we die. How would an average joe in western society possibly find out about nonduality?

These people have a dark side, his girlfriend killed herself and was introduced to coke and other drugs by him. There is plenty more. I am increasingly distrusting of all these so-called awakened people. They can end up being much worse then us "egoic" regular lifeforms.