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@vinett Ahhh, you have encountered the limits of language. You can explore various ideas of what each of those terms mean. Yet keep in mind, there is no universal definition. For example, some awakened spiritual teachers use the first four terms you list as synonymous. Other teachers use the terms slightly differently and other teachers may use them completely differently. It sucks. I know. It's important to get a sense how someone is using a term - what is the context? For example, when I first listened to Rupert Spira, I noticed he was using the term "God" a lot. I thought "Oh geez, another holy roller religious nut" and I moved on. Yet, then I noticed many awakened people considered Spira as I wise awakened teacher. I thought "What gives?". I re-visited his videos. In one video he said that he used the terms awareness, presence, consciousness and God as synonyms. That completely changed the meaning of his talks for me and I had to recontextualize everything he was saying about God. Using the term "God" the same as "Consciousness" is VERY different than using the term "God" as an authoritarian guy in the sky that judges what is right and wrong. Humans assume their definition is "normal" and that everyone else uses the term the same way. This can be fine for terms like coffee cup and pencil. Yet, people can give very different meanings to words like "relationship", "respect" and "honesty". From my POV, many interpersonal conflicts are due to people assuming they have the "normal" definition of a term and that everyone else uses the same definition.

How much does it shit in the woods? I think its a really good question, one as a 20 year spiritual practitioner have found myself blindly thinking suffering goes on more then it maybe does. I can see how this has formed a perhaps false idea of reality, and served as a reason to feel as though I have a solution to all this suffering (not to say the spiritual life and lessons can uplift or benefit humanity). Its also weighed on my heart in a belief that reality is a lot worse then maybe it actually. I mean if we are to take into account any use of happiness surveys that ask how much a person feels content for what ever reasons that feel they are content, or summarize how they feel during a question of if they are happy, who is to say thats not happy? From what I've read it seems like people stat being relatively happy/content 50-70%. Interesting though that this is across 100 or so countries (a really interesting side fact is all countries when asked what do they think is the average level of happiness of the general population, they answer 30-50% lower then reported). Its really easy to think everyone deep down is really just a mess and suffering, and perhaps it is this way, but the percentage of people that have psychological issues (anxiety, depression of all levels, bi-polar, suicide statistics, etc) It's maybe 20% of the population. Sure maybe people are "self" medicating via drugs, alcohol, and food, and what ever craving we can think of, but perhaps some of this is a projection onto a generalized whole from a spiritual slant. I mean I believe a lot of the people who get into spirituality and the ones that awakened to something greater, had a lot going on, perhaps more then the average joe, their experience of humanity may not be a actual reflection of the human condition. Im no expert, but if I had to guess the general okayness/not suffering/kinda content of the general population is 40-50%, 20-30% pretty happy (even if its not for reasons of self knowing, bliss, god recognition) and then a gradual gradation going down into the into unhappy/suffering levels. Still lots to improve, its just not what I think the people who are really suffering and seeking spirituality generally think. Again I'm talking about general feelings of ones life, not if there isn't impactful emotional moments or tragedies, I think these are more common and most people face stuff that is regarded as hardship, but I'm not sure if that makes "most" people not like their life

Do you know a little bit about the kundalini energy ? As I understood it, it's your inner life force that is sleeping at your root chakra, waiting to be awakened. What I ment by "waking up" is the awakening of this energy, producing an up-flow through your spine, until it reaches your last and seventh chakra.

Many times in your videos you would speak from the stand point of enlightenment even if you weren't it a the moment so I assumed that you considered yourself enlightened, my bad. I see that whether you are in an awakened state of consciousness after 5meodmt or in you're everyday unawakened state of consciousness in both cases you are missing the point to realize. Hence the Zen quote. As for Martin I too can see that he is enlightened. The strongest hint is that he's been exactly the same since his enlightenment 8years ago. When you watch sadhguru 15years ago he's speaking exactly the same things that he does nowadays. This stability over the decades is a powerful hint. But those are just my 2cents as I'm not enlightened not did I go for a full release dose, so don't mind me.

@Serotoninluv very interesting. Are you awakened now?

I have seen his videos He was quite big during the YouTube prank videos era And then went on up from there He's far from awakened He's read a bunch of stuff it seems But doesn't apply it Has mad anger issues Was yelling at the guy during an interview and then later said it's love lol But yeah, the move now is good He says he will start meditation n seems like may even do ayshcusa n other stuff too So then he will truly get it I hope he does learn then someone big in public eye will be able to spread the message wide Although with this guys issues, I hope he is fine, seems like his ego backlash maybe hardcore But u never know... 5meO maybe the key

"Enlightenment" is a carrot in the mind that people put on the end of their spiritual stick. Cease self suffering by using that stick for walking the awakened path and just eat the carrot.

After Jim Carrey, famous YouTuber Fousey is awakened. Fouseytube with approx. 15 million YouTube subscribers gave away all his 3 channels, shut down all his social media, and is going to India to live as a monk and meditate 24/7. A mass awakening is happening guys.

https://www.reddit.com/r/streamentry/comments/9e4eva/practicea_rapid_path_to_awakening/ I saw this on reddit a few days ago. It's a technique to investigate the sense of self and achieve awakening. The technique looks logical: First part, observing selfless space. Second part, evoking the sense of self and observing it. And in that way observing it's impermanent and conceptual nature. It's supposed to get you awakened on average in less than a week. It seems too good to be true, but nothing lost in trying it. I have been trying it for a couple of days. No spectacular awakening event has occurred, but my sense of self seems to have changed. I lost the knot behind the eyes. Clearer head, less negative emotions, less I-related thoughts or concern. Maybe it's placebo. I-related emotional patterns (shame, pride) still happen. When they are noticed they can be interrupted. It's like they are a habit, but now I can stop them because they have no reason to exist. Maybe it's not placebo If you want to try it, take a look at the ebook with stories of people who went trough the process. https://www.en.openheart.fi/114 Please let me know your thoughts.

@Buba Everything you've described so far sounds like Eckhart Tolle's experience with a similar situation. In the introduction of the Power of Now he describes: "Until my thirteith year, I lived in a state of almost continuous anxiety interspersed with periods of suicidal depression. It feels now as if I am talking about me past lifetime or somebody else's life. One night not long after my twenty-ninth birthday, I woke up in the early hours with a feeling of absolute red. I had woken up with such a feeling many times before, but this time it was more intense than it had ever been. The silence of the night, the vague outlines of the furniture in the dark room, the distant noise of a passing train - everything felt so alien, so hostile, and so utterly meaningless that it created in me a deep loathing of the world. The most loathsome thing of all, however, was my own existence. What was the point in continuing to live with this burden of misery? Why carry on with this continuous struggle? I could feel that a deep longing for annihilation, for nonexistence, was now becoming much stronger than the instinctive desire to continue to live. 'I cannot live with myself any longer.' This was the thought that kept repeating itself in my mind. Then suddenly I became aware of what a peculiar thought it was. 'Am I one or two? If I cannot live with myself, there must be two of me: the 'I' and the 'self' that 'I' cannot live with.' ' Maybe, only one of them is real.' I was so stunned by this strange realization that my mind stopped. I was fully conscious but there were no more thoughts. Then I felt drawn into what seemed like a vortex of energy. It was a slow movement at first and then accelerated. I was gripped by an intense fear, and my body started to shake. I heard the words 'resist nothing,' as if spoken inside my chest. I could feel myself being sucked into a void. It felt as if the void was inside myself rather than outside. Suddenly, there was no more fear, and I let myself fall into that void. I have no recollection of what happened after that. I was awakened by the chirping of a bird outside the window. I had never heard such a sound before. My eyes were still closed, and I saw the image of a precious diamond. Yes, if a diamond could make a sound, this is what it would be like. I opened my eyes. The first light of dawn was filtering through the curtains. Without any thought, I felt, I knew, that there is infinitely more to light than we realize. That soft luminosity filtering through the curtains was love itself. Tears came into my eyes. I got up and walked around the room. I recognized the room, and yet i knew that i had never truly seen it before. Everything was fresh and pristine, as if it had just come into existence. Picked up things, a pencil, an empty bottle, marveling at the beauty and aliveness of it all. That day I walked around the city in utter amazement at the miracle of life on Earth, as if i had just been born into this world. For the next five months, I lived in a state of uninterrupted deep peace and bliss. After that, it diminished somewhat in intensity, or perhaps it just seemed to because it became my natural state. I could still function in the world, although I realized that nothing I ever did could possibly add anything to what I already had." It only gets better from here. If you want to hear directly from someone who has gone through literally the exact same thing as you and come out the other side 'as if I had just been born into this world' and 'in a state of uninterrupted deep peace and bliss' then get this book the Power of Now.

Let me put it this way: possibly as one becomes more awakened there are less thoughts, but it's not a necessary condition. Frankly, an enlightened person just doesn't give a shit about whatever arises. It's all natural, including thoughts, including negative emotions, and there's no "hook" to attach to any of it. So it doesn't matter what comes up. There's no need for it to be any different than what it is. That's the major difference.

@Haumea2018Would you say the more awakened someone is the less thoughts arise? @Jack Riverfragmentation = identification with thoughts = psychological time?

@Jack RiverYou do not feel the state of "flow" in sports borders the "awakened" state? Muscle memory does not require any thought processes I feel "flow" is exactly this....complete detachment from self (no fears, no objectives, detachment from outcome, and no other thoughts) possible in all creative activities

He has been at 1000 for ten years, I think, and has been psychic for decades. And as Leo said, even if the number is off by 1, does it make any difference? It's still in a certain stage with certain observable characteristics. It's funny how people on the forum are reacting to the map, like it's some kind of an ego trip or something. I assure you nobody fully awakened is going around thinking "yeah, I'm at 1000, I'm better than you at 580." It's more like "when are you going to reach 1000 already?" Wake up, damn you! 'Cause at 1000 it's painfully obvious what the other person is doing to prevent themselves from awakening and if anything it's frustrating.

Let me tell you a story. The Awakened One does not make assumptions. The Awakened one has Evolved from the Sleeping Self that only sees as far as he is. He Knows ALL and Sees ALL perfectly of the old way/self/selves. A 3D world understands fully a 2D world, A 2D world does not even know of a 3D to begin to understand. Ultimately, there are no right or wrongs but the fact that it disturbed your peace indicates denial of truth behind the matter itself. Never confuse Natural with good or bad, Natural always comes first. This will make sense as you evolve. All the best

Interesting thing about awakening,prior to it, I had never read a religious scripture,esoteric writing or philosophy text in my life. Mostly because it didn't make much since and I assumed most,if not all of it,to be written based on myth and philosophy. After awakening I started looking into some of these writings and texts and, surprisingly, found I could understand the bulk of what was being said. From the eastern writings like the vedas, upanishads, baghavad gita, tao te ching, etc.,- to the christian mystics,NT bible,western esoteric writings etc., I haven't looked at the Quran,but from these writings and text's I have looked into, they all carry very similar messages about the "Reality" or "God." The reason,and what can only be the reason, imo, is the ones who wrote or delivered those words in spoken and written form were speaking from an awakened and/or realized state. Not some made up philosophy or religion,which they were later turned into. Undoubtedly there is also the mix of myth and metaphor as well, depending on the culture in which they were written,but the central messages and themes are very similar across the board in reference to God or Reality.

There definitely can be a position of power which can be abused by the 'guru' but I'm not going to assume that's what is going on. People who have followers/fans/students and the like have to be cautious about the dynamic between them and sure to not abuse that power they have. In the situation of a guru like persona who claims some enlightened state they should not be slaves to the selfish desire even if there are desires that still manifest. I have found in my own experience that in the most awakened states there aren't any desires that arise in me....but I don't make any claim of anything.

@Scholar Those are some good questions. My mind wants to simplify the issue. Yet, it's very nuanced and complex as you are finding. You wrote: "But then when I look at the suffering there is something about it that I cannot explain in words that makes it seem like it is bad. I just can't articulate it, but then there is also something that makes it seem like just another experience, that I cannot articulate either." I go through this a lot. Perhaps it's a paradox. For example, sometimes "spirituality" seems so impersonal. There is no "I". The true "me" is one with everything. There is nothing to do than to be in the present moment. It's so amazingly simple. Yet, it also seems so personal. The spiritual journey feels deeply personal. My direct experience feels personal. There is a desire to grow and evolve. What if we stepped away from the term "bad"? And thought of suffering as energy. There are many forms of energy. Suffering seems like a seeking energy. An energetic yearning for a different present moment. Perhaps the seeking energy can be mild or it can be very strong. When I see an animal experiencing pain, they don't seem to have the same type of seeking energy as humans. They seem to be experiencing the pain in the present moment and may avoid the source of the pain. Yet, they don't seem to have the same type of yearning and struggling as humans. The sense of powerless and loss of control. The thinking about how things could be better if only such-and-such happens. Have you listened to awakened spiritual teachers on suffering? That might shed some insight. I've never done a solo retreat. Yet, boredom over extended periods and not being able to leave would likely lead to a degree of suffering for me. Yet, it probably wouldn't cause any permanent harm.

i agreee eckhart's was spontaneous.. i think depending on the teacher, and what their path was like... it is all reflected in their teaching also i think that a lof of the gurus refer to the simplicity of seeing thru the illusion but it's only really AFTER the fact that they say this i dont think they are deliousion, far from it lol - i dont even need to say this but when they say, or eckhart says IT IS HERE NOW! just NOW. simply NOW it's easy for them to see it as they are speaking from that place of NOW vs the rest of us could be a billion miles away from the NOW (billion mental illusory miles) but yeah. i agree with you. the work that needs to be put in is massive it's no easy task especially since it is a sub-task for most of us, unless we can , like Leo, work towards making a life purpose in which we end up working in this field of study and making a living to be able to continue to do this work and not worry about paying the bills my goal personally is somehow winnging the lotto (using mind/law of attraction/positive vibes to get that lol) and then after lotto, meditate away and enjoy and go deeper into it i am not after the money (or so i think now, hopefully i wont change after getting the money) but yeah. i am after the freedom which money will give me which allows me to do this work uninterrupted or worrying a guru would tell me here, i am just setting up this obstacle for myself to delay the work which needs to be done. but from my full time work job which i very much need if i need to survive on the month-month bills i got. i cant bring myself to full dive into it... and the next thing i know is i have lost my mind and cannot work anymore and then lose my house/job/car lotto > freedom > eventual enlightment LETS GET THAT MONEY SO IT CAN GET ME ENLIGHTMENT SO THEN I CAN LOOK BACK AS ALL AWAKENED SOULS DO AND GO LIKE WOOAH. WAS "I" A CRAZY LIL NUT OR WAAT?

We have to be really careful with this though. haha I used to be a Christian and this sounds like my dad when he would say "They aren't true Christians." due to the things someone would say. With Bodhisattva's, the definition is "a person who is able to reach nirvana but delays doing so out of compassion in order to save suffering beings.". Bodhisattva's are tricky characters because they may not necessary speak about awakening with the public, but they know of it in their inner life. They are not necessarily obvious and outspoken in the way that maybe Eckhart Tolle or Alan Watts are. It's through small Freudian slips and pointers that make you realize "oh, maybe this guy or girls is awake but is just hiding it because they think it would be more effective if they did." Jordan Peterson comes across to me as a Christian mystic , who might have awakened haha, who is trying to bridge the gap between Christianity and science. And he needs to tread really carefully with this. When a friend or a coworker seems to be having a problem, I do not speak to them about non-duality. In many of my social circles, I do not think it would be helpful to push people towards "awakening". Sometimes the next best step is to help people within the dream and give them a sense of relief within the dream. Which I think Jordan Peterson seems to be doing. haha But you are right, I do need to take Peterson off the pedestal I put him on though. And maybe I have rose colored glasses on when I watch his videos. And I need to be more critical about his work.

@GafaRassaDaba That sounds like a really rough entry and I feel for you. You must have been pretty open minded before the trip, to have such a glimpse. I hope you can remain open minded. As you’ve already experienced, sometimes what you know most, turns out to be opposite, and sometimes the depth makes precisely that difference. Psychadelics are a throw of the dice, I wouldn’t rule them out & assume you’ve digested the big picture, but I would look into some daily practices & theory to build a foundation first. As an analogy, I feel like you saw the photo, and now as you experience more, and surrender, let it settle, the details come more into focus, making all the difference. Some find freedom in infinity, some find unification in no-self, some find inner peace in love, some an effortlessness & synchronicity in their days. All of this is for you too. All of it. So if you can empty the cup again, there’s more. The one thing we can’t do, is filter now, through a lens of the past, through a memory, through a projection. That, begins the weaving of an “I” which “knows”. On a more personal, and relative note - Yogananda was awakened as a fetus. You might be one of those rare birds born with high consciousness, but not yet aware of this. There may very well be a GafaRassaDaba sized map in this yet.

A Bodhisattva is someone who has awakened. That ain't JP.

I think and feel like you. I hate this society, the system, the rat-race slavery and how dumb are people are nowadays. And in the future, according the elites agenda to only be one mixed race, more dumb, easily governable, zombies of instant gratification. Sometimes I think I dont want to have children to make them struggle in this modern slavery of agressive competition and, mainstream conditioning and indoctrination. I also feel alone and misunderstood, Im not interested of my friends, like you say they are like dogs. I'd like to have awakened friends like me and have interesting . The key to feel better is gratitude. Life is a gift and experiencing it as pure awareness living a human experience seeing, tasting, smelling, breathing is sacred and beautiful.

@sgn It's got nothing to do with reality or facts. If you get triggered, that's ALL you! It's all about how your mind is failing to understanding the complexities of reality, denying reality. The reality is, people eat animals and you don't like it. That's not the world's problem, that's your problem. Don't project it on them. Own it. Triggering is never in the situation, it's in YOUR interpretation of the situation. If you were fully awakened, Hitler himself torturing kittens would not trigger you.

ive also had a paranormal experience (seeing a ghost or spirit) for context im 20 years old and have never had any similar experiences until I had an awakening and started meditating this year so i can say that in my experience there are other 'realms' which can be perceived in our own i have a speculation or intuition that these experiences only happen to those who are not afraid (or in other words those who are awakened to some degree). but im just speculating