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If it was over the phone, How did you know he was awakened ? Because your friend told you so ?

Today, being a hard-worker is seen as commendable, almost virtuous. “Get a job” is an insult intended to insinuate that someone is lazy and contributing little to society, while “hard-working folk” are considered morally decent citizens. It wasn’t always that way. More than 2,300 years ago, the philosopher Aristotle declared that the virtuous life was not one devoted to work. Writing in Politics, he declared that: "…in the most nobly constituted state, and the one that possesses men that are absolutely just, not merely just relatively to the principle that is the basis of the constitution, the citizens must not live a mechanic or a mercantile life (for such a life is ignoble and inimical to virtue), nor yet must those who are to be citizens in the best state be tillers of the soil (for leisure is needed both for the development of virtue and for active participation in politics)." In other words, people who are too busy working don’t have the time to perform their civic duty or develop sophisticated morals. On the same line of thought, nobody awakened having a job from 9 to 5. So those caught in working and working, think again, was a forced brainwashed released in the past, now people don't know how to build their lives anymore. They are too scared of taxes, authority and building an image, more than life itself. As a conclusion, working is not a virtue, it is in slavery circles. So the majority of the world became a big slavery circle, lol.

@win@winterknight From the fully realized "POV" which I consider to be yours/mooji/spira/tolle's ever-present experience which doesn't shift back and forth... From that POV, would the "awakened one" care or have preference over if IT were to shift between having the POV of a character who is awakened and rich vs a character who is awakened and poor, homeless and say partially blind. In other words, when that "which I am" is seen as already and eternally to be self realized would it care about what then unfolds out in my life? Like if there is hardship initially and then whatever or even hardship and a.continued downward spiral... As long as one is buddah, there is no more to be done? It is, as it is? Even with the character sitting down and doing nothing, and having the realization he is buddah, this is ok? (I am sure Bad for the character but ok for the self) Another question The realization that all is unfolding as it should really for.me personally brings me to just being ok with the situation, no matter how shitty things are... But the trick here is that this may allow things to get worse because you aren't doing anything about it. It's almost as if it's like the character really has to be okay with the present circumstances if it's the reflection of the understanding, however should also look back and see the repetitive negative behaviours leading the line of destruction of your life and what you should learn your responsibility as the ME and create and work for the work which will bring your life back to track.

above the "non dual" awakening, there is still magnetic fields. I m not joking, this reality has several laws. The problem is they are litteraly born from experience and self conceptualisation / and a lot of practical work. cannot be explained to dormant mind, and awakened mind get it their own ways. if you put your hands above the fire, it burns, is a law, project the idea. is the idea, the fire is real, only a fool believe he can rape 100 people in the street without paying the price.

Again, the point is that working in society with dormant folk in the majority of case you won't be able to transcend. And those who have awakened don't work, they have a system built to work for them. They work in teaching people or some sorts. They create something. So yeah the awakened human is superior i give you that, even if you think otherwise. "Do you think that people will tolerate, if you just simply sit on the couch, without contributing?" Yes they will because only slaves have this mindset. A system can be place and you can have income almost for free. I mean building a creative something, a career, a purpose, not only working for someone, this is my point, working for someone is the dumb part that leads to what Aristotle said.

I agree. I see this in myself and others. Roots of what turns into belligerence, perhaps. Allow me to be so pompous as to theoretically give a solution to this problem in education that would involve distancing from left brain rationality to include the Chaotic right brain as well as whole body awareness. Starting with Carol Anthony's take on commonsense which she makes one word out of. Commonsense: is a consensus of all the senses. The commonsense comprises the five senses of inner perception and the metaphorical senses. In humans, the commonsense is the "inner judge," which discerns what is in harmony with the person's inner truth (and therefore also in harmony with the Cosmos) and what is not. It's judgement is based on the inner senses, and is in the form of feeling. Another function of the commonsense is that of being the Helper of Transformation (This applies only to humans). This function is referred to in the Hexagrams 15, Modesty, 16, Enthusiasm, 17, Following, and 21 Biting Through. As part of our animal nature, the commonsense gets blocked when a person's animal nature has been slandered as "lowly" or as "the source of evil". Why education needs to include instructing that we are '3 brained beings' - Zigzag Almaas: “For the process of understanding to happen, three elements need to be there at the same time. The element of disidentification is one of them, involvement is another. The third element is the quality of allowing. These elements can be there when there is harmony among the three centers—the belly center, the chest center, and the head center. When there is this harmony, it is possible to experience fully, to allow, and to disidentify. Now, what do I mean by these three elements? Each center contributes to the process of understanding. If the head center is functioning correctly, it means that space or emptiness is allowed. What is the significance of space and emptiness? Space and emptiness make possible the quality of allowing. When there is space in the mind, there is no self-image. You’re not trying to stick to something in particular. You’re not trying to go somewhere. The mind is allowing whatever is there to be there. So the head center’s participation or contribution is space, which is an allowing, a welcoming in a sense—space for things to happen without rejection, without trying to hold on. You become complete allowing. The heart center’s contribution has to do with its central quality, which is the personal essence. The contribution of the personal essence is the diving movement, the actual living of the experience. You not only allow it, you’re in the midst of it, you’re one with it. You’re really it, you let it happen, you feel it fully, you sense it fully, you experience it fully, right? That’s the contribution of the heart center. The belly center has its contribution, which is represented by the self, the essential self. The contribution of the essential self is the disidentification, the turning away. When you are truly functioning in the belly, you are completely present, and being completely present, you are being yourself. So you are not identified with the usual activity of trying to get somewhere else.” Diamond Heart Book Three, pg. 73 Almaas: “Distinguishing Physical Sensation from Essential Substance The capacity to sense oneself must become so refined that the individual can discriminate between physical sensation and the sensation of essential substance. It is not enough that the mind be quiet. It is also necessary for the body to be sensitive. The mind can be quiet while the body is deadened. The body has to be awakened so that the center of sensing, the belly center, can be activated. The belly center, or what Gurdjieff called the physical center, is the center of sensing for all parts of the body. Its deepest function is the subtle sensing, the sensing of essential presence, that the Sufis call the organ for touch. Touch is, in a sense, the most intimate of the physical senses. The skin must be directly against an object to touch it. There is no intermediary medium, like sound for hearing or light for seeing. So this subtle capacity is a very intimate one. Accurately speaking, it is sensing essence by being essence. It is the most direct way of perception. This capacity of touch, connected with the belly center, is very intimately connected with the embodiment of essence. It is the body center; its mode of perception is embodiment. Here, perception as touch, and being, are the same act. So this capacity is the most important one.” Essence with the Elixir of Enlightenment, pg. 130 “Functioning of the Essential Self in the Belly Center Yes, usually the belly center has to do with embodiment, with the capacity to sense oneself. However, the belly center is also the will center. In a sense, the ultimate function of the will is to surrender to what happens, surrender to the now. And surrender to the now means not to hold on to something. The true function of the will is complete surrender to what’s happening without holding on. That is will. The essential self, like all essential aspects, can function in any of the subtle centers. When one is being the essential self its location is usually the heart center. However, when the essential self is functioning in relation to identifying or disidentifying from any content of experience, it becomes associated with the belly center. The essential self is more like a potential for experience, and it also manifests as a capacity for identification. One of the results of that capacity for identification is embodiment. Embodying something means you are identified with what’s happening. An essential state is present. You are embodying it if you are it. The true self has the capacity to identify with something you are experiencing, but it doesn’t have to. It has a choice; it has the freedom.” Diamond Heart Book Three, pg. 79 I guess my notions about commonsense have turned into an argument for education and Culture itself as being too left brained and doesn't include much in the way of whole body awareness or including the heart in the process of perceiving and understanding. This might be relating back to your mention of the paradox of commonsense and introspection. I may have gone off on a tangent but this is my version of fun,,,, Given also that my blindspot is still mostly intact, there is probably some form of me not seeing the forest for the all the trees,,,,

@Hellspeed I have awakened after just one year of doing The Work of Byron Katie. I’ve also done a lot of shadow work at the same time. Two birds with one stone.

Ive tried to have good regard for Teal Swan but I cannot. I dont think she is anywhere near awakened on these subjects. An intellectual telling of the audience of basic ideas, but thats it. She is georgeous on the eye. As you have said, yes, not confident in who she is. Cant take her seriously because the words she says sound so recycled spiritual jargon anyone can dig up but she credits it as her own ideas. Similar to that Aaron Doughty guy and Benhino guy. Id put them all in the same box of toys; they are cashing in and exploiting the brains of people hungry for love. Leo is at least his own element. Cult following again and again.

We all are awakened..just need to see that...

This would mean "Don't create until you have... awakened?... mastered self development?" Everyone is growing and there are people in their early 20s who created amazing stories. I think you're far enough to distinguish between a message that raises consciousness and a message that makes people more asleep. At least generally speaking, everyone will read from their own point of view. So don't worry about it, of course you will become better and your meanings will advance in nuance and impact. So what? Trust in your greatness right now and just do it. You can change your writer name as often as you like when you don't want to identify with the old stuff anymore, there are no limits here but your thoughts. That is really a beautiful lesson you learned, very inspiring.

So the question is Why there are enlightened people with decades of enlightened life behind who still acts a bit unethical, such as committing things which are considered as wrongdoings or forbidden from religious/God perspective. In other words, people who sees reality in its actuality, with awakened eyes, soul, consciousness, heart, divine nature, who are full of bliss, love and interested in self-development, knowledge, growth, eternity, but who still neglect idea that you have to believe in existence of absolute yet very simple categories of forbidden and allowed, things which you shouldn't do and which you must do. Belief in existence of sins, misbehaviour, disobedience? Such as you shouldn't swear (use bad language). How does awakened nature allows them to do that? In video below enlightened master uses bad word (even though only one time during interview). And I am not judging him or anything or playing moralism. And I don't want to gossip about him, or to say that I am better than such actions (I am not), I am simply trying to make sense of the case above using this video as one example. Nothing against the person per se. Even he does it only once here and its not a big deal, but isn't he is so full of compassion and wisdom and righteousness? So how does it make possible for this to happen? In other words, what is the reason for highly awakened sage kind of people to do things that are normally considered as unjust or wrong? OR, why we as adults are tempted into thinking that there are no absolute categories of wrongdoing/forbidden? Meanwhile only such categories bring meaning and justification, justice to reality. Otherwise, its all one, and it doesn't matter what you do. You have animal body and corrupt mind and unjust world around you, so why you should believe in simple ideals that you once used to have as a little naive kid before you started to see corruption of higher authorities such as your parents and hence neglect absolute categories? I just want to have some understanding regarding these questions. Understanding regarding 1) why enlightened people with total clarity of perception and big conscious hearts can act unethically. and 2) what make us not to desire to believe that God forbids you to behave in certain ways. Coz clearly we don't want to believe that let's say you shouldn't do this and you shouldn't do that. We simply don't want that. What exactly makes us rebellious? Its not a question of good and evil, because they are relative and only God knows about them, but it is the question of believing in existence of categories such as legal and illegal or just and unjust or forbidden and allowed which are defined by highest authority hence absolute and not relative (while good and evil are defined by ourselves). Let's not discuss ethics, morals, good and evil per se, but lets discuss reasons of why things are these way. Thank you

@WelcometoReality That's exactly how I feel about it. I'm interested in learning japanese, studying law, playing the guitar, playing games etc. Spirituality is a theme I'm only into -- of course, it is a marvelous subject -- because of "enlightenment". The possibility of an end goal to this. I don't wanna be like Leo, dedicate my whole life to these different approaches and methods and searches and inquiries about this stuff. I wanna be a lawyer, god damnit Let me just come along, do the work, and come out enlightened to get on with my life (not "my life", but you get what I mean). There's no way we're all after enlightenment becoming homeless awakened beings, right?

Duality is confined to just two options. Yes/no good/bad black/white -mechanical part of the Human centers/auto pilot Duality + 1(third force/self conscious awareness-Will-attuned to strange strange attractor/Holy Spirit) = Being/nonduality Love is nondual Beingness is nondual -- multiple choice living in the present Awakened Human Being ?

@Highest I understand it's extremely hard to convey Truth/Nonduality thu language, which is inherently dualistic, but the opinion about Atheists above is dualistic views. Do you as God realize that any Atheist you encounter is just a dream character you dreamed up? Thus they never are doing or have ever done anything, as they don't actually exist. Only you, God, are dictating their thoughts. And it's all happening only within your direct experience, in this moment only. Is this the way you understand things to be true? To me (because I have not had an Awakening yet, still believe I'm human and everything is material and dualistic) it's all just concepts, because I have not experienced God in my direct experience (I realize that once awake I may/will realize it always as been in my direct experience). Just out of curiosity, have you fully experienced/awakened to being God/ Infinity/ the creator of universe and all of reality/the Truth of Truths, or is your views and shared wisdoms beliefs based on teachings?

Morality and Ethics are just human conventions that change over time. Awakening is beyond that. Let's not confuse conventions with Enlightenment, even the extreme of taking a life is still justified in the natural plane, that does not mean you should do it, simply means reality does not care, is not lower vibration, in fact is the highest. So the conventions kicks in human minds, not because they are born that way, is because society was like that long time ago, now you choose to be hunted down or not, intelligence comes in place now, rather than morality and ethics. The purely moral and ethical human being will never Awakened, because he is afraid of even thinking of doing evil things, and if he does he goes to repression mode.

Reasons lie within the realm of ego. When you talk about highly awakened people, you may refer to: Ones that abide in eternal ego death. Blank mind. Those 'people' have no reasons whatsoever and interpreting their actions through this lens is nonsensical in my opinion. Ones that developed the ability to see through the egoic mind while retaining it. This ability can be used to put your self-refinement on overdrive, but it also means that you are still egoic and prone to errors. I have a hunch that Peter Ralston is in the second category.

Are you awakened?

I've developed the ability to control my own individual chakras and of others around me. Is really simple when you are sensitive enough. But don't go into the BS of fixed shapes and the literal stories from religious books. They are in reality organs in your body that are part of the basic parts of the brain. To use those parts, that we call subconscious mind is the process of destruction and shattering of your personality and the world as you know it now. After you discover what the hack are your own organs and how to control them. Yes it's possible to control Breath, Temperature, Heartbeat, Emotions, everything really. Even those around if they are dormant. From experience i can tell, the most awakened human can influence the less awakened. So is not that crazy in thinking if you awake to such a degree you can literally influence the course of the world. Just by having a direct opinion on how the world should, be aware enough of your own harmony and this is achieved. Being the reason so much fake news around, and they usually happen, because many people buy that and their grain of influence, build huge mountains of influence upon everyone.

Do a group meditation with someone who is awakened. For the initiates will be a like a DMT trip and what not? many crazy abilities. I do this kind of meditation with my family and friends. All kinds of beautiful insights arises in people along the way.

@Paul92 I was in a similar boat after a quit Christianity and became Atheist. But after a year or so it hit me so hard that i have awakened, and since then crazy shit has happened over the years. And sci-fi type of crazy shit that i can explain an prove So give it time, don't force the belief, go the contrary, is what i did, maybe it will sort out for you, who knows.

if you are really awakened and see that indeed there's no you, what now ? Will you stay sitting in a room staring the wall ? There's nowhere else for you to go, you'll have to stick around until the body dies, so what difference does it make having or not having sex, neither is wrong, There's people who need to have sex, a partner, and there is people who need to drop it and wake up, there's no free will anyway, so people wanting sex is inevitable. Each individual is in it's on level of development. You have to be careful because the mind/ego is very, very trick, the first awakening I had, the mind tried to make a new ego out of it, I was becoming a zen devil like Leo said, I was thinking that now I knew better, because I'd awoken, but fortunately I saw soon enough what was going on.

I think your advice is not very useful for most people, here in this sub people write to ask for advice for dating/relationship, most are far away from understand such a thing as non duality, are you awakened ?

Which is precisely what sages do. Sages don’t tend to just play on one end of the paradox where they never suffer. Of course you’re free to do whatever you want (in a sense). The desire to become a sage for me isn’t about having some title. It’s about having enough of a vision down the road about what I value most and what I’m going to want to contribute as a result of the work that will need to be done. You can be fully awakened to God and that is what you are but once you sustain that level of consciousness throughout your daily life, living for your own selfish agenda that doesn’t impact anybody else despite the fact that it’s an illusion tends to not be that satisfying anymore. Living for just pure comfort and hedonism and it’s all for you on the relative side of things just stops making sense. For me, I don’t want to speak for anyone else, I feel amazing when I give all of myself to someone and there’s that devotion. Whether it be with a person and I go grab them a meal and pass that on to them, $10 a hug and a conversation or picking up trash along a trail and then looking at the trees and hills and feeling a love for that and thinking ‘what if my work was like that for the world?’ I’m with you in a lot of ways. If someone for example is enlightened and they’re cool with being a life coach or programmer and they never ever talk about what they know and that’s what they want to do, man that’s awesome. If that drive isn’t there to talk about spiritual matters, then throw that idea in the trash. The main thing I think is missed about sages is that they don’t just play on one end of the paradox of never feeling pain or suffering. Christ I think is an inspiring example of that. Even people like Sadhguru today I think are great role models of that. These people serve and give beyond themselves. They aren’t some nondual know it all keyboard jockeys who talk about how everything is all an illusion and there’s nothing to do.

Here I am, still alive haha! So, here is what's new. I fell on A spiritual teacher named ''Byron Katie'', her work, actually called ''the work'', touched me deeply, and lighted up something also, a powerful one. I can share what it consists of, cause it's so simple. Four questions: 1: Is it true? 2: are you absolutely sure it's true? 3: how does that though / belief makes you feel? 4: Who would you be without the thought? ++: Turn the through around (ex: ''This guy always does idiot things when I'm here'' would be ''I always do stupid things when he's here'') which is a way to recognize how a tough affects us in a mirror effect. When you see someone closed minded, guess who is becoming closed minded is his presence? (meditate on that ) The thing is, this is already what I was doing, or what I was trying to do, which is to free myself from limiting, though, because when in such a path, you come to recognize that it is primordial to do so, since your belief affects your perception, so affecting your reality and actions, and dictating your life. If, for example, I am ill, but believe ''No one can help me'', a simple belief like this one, seeming inoffensive, is very powerful. I will listen to people advice while throwing them in my mind trash, because my perception will be altered to believe what I'm hearing cannot help. Those beliefs are very disempowering. The light that has been awakened by what I came through is a strong distinction between what is real and what is a thought or a belief. Now only that, but that this very statement is not useful that much, but that working on looking at one belief at a time and questioning its reality is where the importance lies. I'm coming to recognize that I have a lot of limitations to transcend (this is a belief too ). When you see your condition with clear enough eyes, you can be in pain with no suffering, you can even laugh in gratitude. I'm coming to think that I might have to go to the doctor again, but this time, I will go with a different pair of eyes, one that does not resent the doctor like I did, and do not think he will only do me harm... Yes, I thought that. I wanted so much to heal with my own mind, to heal by myself, but there is a rigidity in that, that makes me feel isolated. This ''I'll do it by myself'' is closing me from the world. It's not that all people who are ill should go to the doctor, everyone has its path, and can listen within to know what's demanded from them at the moment. This was asked from me, but I was arrogant, I still am, I am just opening to being helped by others, it feels light, it feels free, it remembers me that people are here to help, this is true. My condition is varying a lot, from almost no pain, to condition that are kind of all over the body, it's weird and difficult to know. I don't know what I have, that's for sure haha... It feels like I'm on the right path, and funny enough, when the belief that I'm not coming, it's an opportunity to question it, to see it's reality. I commanded two books by Katie, even tho they turn around those 4 questions. I love to bath in her stillness through her words. For anyone who is ready for unraveling their beliefs, even the strong ones, and ready to undertake a journey where they embrace that only they will go through it, which is required for a work like this, Go for the work of Katie. The power will be given in a pure and simple way, right into your hand, and you just have to walk it, see where it takes you. I am on this road. You will have the news about it, joy on you! haha. Right now, I'm in a Starbucks coffee, reading ''a mind at home with itself, by Byron Katie'' and writing to you guys. I'm in pain right now, just saying, so I can say I'm not in one article in the future . I sure hope that this story I'm writing will become a road for some to go through their struggle and unravel them to their authenticity. We all go through difficulties, and difficulties are difficult for all, no matter how the outside look. Our belief can overpower us so much that someone that seems externally to have everything can be in suffering, because true liberation is within, suffering too. Let's walk this road together. We sure are completely alone in this walk, but let's walk it together anyway. Be blessed with truth.

Let me disagree with Leo here. One knows what is real when something falls out of harmony, out of infinite. Take the example of DiCaprio in the movie Inception. The spinner always falls from spinning, it stops when he is set in reality. So, as a rule, in a dream you feel infinite, boundless, relaxed, even if it's a fixed dream/movie in your head. In reality one feels pressure and pain in the body when the real comes in, even if one has not transcended/awakened, feels the reality in his/her own fixed mentality .