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To make a point to previous comments, I will make point because it might help to someone who wants to progress beyond nonduality: salvation and enlightenment are not the same things. And Jesus didn't teach oneness and enlightenment per se, he taught faith and obedience to one God and salvation through being born into Holy Spirit (which is miracle that can be in this life, but it's not coming from this world/from this existence, its not some mystical experience or awakening). Although he defo was enlightened and one with everything, but that's not what he meant when he said that I am one with God. Have you ever heard Buddha saying such words about Holy , about god or anything like that? Of course no, because Buddha and Jesus taught different things. God in Christianity (and in Islam/Judaism) is not everything/nonduality/Brahman/nothingness/infinity/being/existence/consciousness/dream/reality/absolute oneness it is none of this being, it transcends this being. That's why revelations, meaning, miracle, holy, prophets, beliefs and faith, while enlightenment doesn't need any of that, has no meaning, need no faith, no god, no scriptures, and no teachings ! rabit hole goes very deep, seek and you shall find Leo is correct when he intuits and says that there can be more than just absolute truth, infinity. When you might think what can be more than infinity and absolute truth? Leo doesn't know what it is, but his intuition is correct

@cetus56 Too much nonduality. I feel you on that. @Timotheus ?

@WildeChilde I see auras. It switched on after a psychedelic trip (on top of 20 years of foundation). I see the energy in the “air”. I (very often) know what people are going to say. For a while I would say it first, and it would really trip someone out. Then, I stopped. It’s not as fun to know what people are about to say as one might think. It’s too much nonduality wise. I get glimpses when I meet someone of their past & future. Emotional glimpses. I know if the have repressed shame / guilt, and if it’s from what they did, or what someone did to them. It’s weird because prior they sound like magical powers, experienced they seem ordinary.

God in Abrahamic religions is not ultimately about having awakening to oneness, God in Abrahamic religions is about believing in transcendent God, its about conscious act of faith. So one the one hand: there is monotheism of Abrahamic traditions which is based on revelations from prophets And on the other hand: oneness, infinity, void, absolute, all that is what we can call as true/absolute nature/substance of reality Humanity have known and experienced this things (oneness) long time ago, Platonism is based on that, Hinduism is based on that, Buddhism is based on that, you ask whats not based on that, everything, even polytheistic, shamanistic traditions had this awakenings to the core of reality. However, people and spirituality across the world did not exactly understand: well, all is one, now what precisely to do with this amazing oneness? Whats the point? Reach ultra-joyful state of being, have siddhis, do magic, have out of body, go to spend some lifetimes in heavenly dimensions, live to the full on the earth, quite all whatsoever and annihilate into nirvana? What exactly to do? The 'burden' of self-awareness were always too much to carry on, this burden asks questions about future even if you are enlightened guru who is 'joyful'. Being joyful didn't help people to drop hunger for meaning, hunger for something which is not what is, hunger for at least some importance. One could say that strive for such things coming from ego, however experience of enlightened sages in history proves that even when ego is gone, question for meaning is still there, ability to have faith in something beyond what is - is still there. Some subtle sense of restlessness still bothered greatest sages of all. Some like Ancient Greeks have adopted 'life's good approach' or hedonistic treadmill, it is what we call polytheism. Just have joy, love, live, and philosophise like Platon. However, happiness never lasts forever because you will die, and be maybe reborn again and suffer again. On some point joyfulness stopped to satisfy human beings. Didn't seem enough. Some like Hindus and Buddha, were sceptic about limited possibillities of hedonism, they didn't feel quite right about having endless pleasure on earth or in heavenly dimensions without any meaning whatsoever, especially given that joy for them was illusiory anyways, especially given that you reincarnate and must suffer again until you realize truth again and so on forever, so they decided to adopt 'quitting everything' approach having decided that life is pointless suffering samsara, quitting also were via escape into the nirvanic ecstatic state, being in the empty silence of ananda. Buddha was very much about that. But this escape too couldn't satisfy majority, whats the point of coming here if we are just to vanish into nirvana? Something put us here so we just leave? Didn't seem enough. If some advanced beings in Greece and in India at least had some strategy of dealing with life or had 'earthly wisdom', but so-called unspiritual part of humanity were completely lost in the sufferings and passions of this world, if you look on the history of humanity of last 10,000 years, its just never-ending battles for survival and physical suffering, tragedy after tragedy, burden of having self-awareness. However, here comes the mysterious part of God. You see oneness/absolute/infinity is not the mystery coz it is what is, it is what can be realised, it is what were realised by many people before, it is absolute truth. Hence its not the mystery, its obvious. But for human-beings it was never enough really, what was the point of the whole deal they asked themselves, if nothing ever changes under the sun? What is the truth within the absolute truth? Whats right in the truth? For millenniums people only had hope that maybe something will ever change, they believed that maybe something will change in this undifferentiated bowl of oneness jungle. Also, if its oneness, how does that explains duality within oneness? Why there is opposition? Why there is individual awareness being within this moment of here and now? If awareness is one, why it has individualised aspect present within human-beings? Thats when we come to the Abrahamic prophets, and their mission. These prophets are messengers of so-called 'the good news'. The good news is coming from that very mystery of 'why anything? why we are here asking about meaning in this bowl of oneness?' Message tells that yes, there is something in the future, God (or Mystery within Absolute oneness) gives you promise of this and that, but there's no proof for that, no rational understanding, you can only believe in that, have faith in the message, have faith in that which is not what is (God), not because I have proof, but because your essence (spirit) within your heart and your mind comes to the conscious conclusion that there is something true in this message that resonates within your heart and your mind. Your spirit smells truth. And you left to make leap of faith into the impossible thing, leap of faith is act of conscious will. To believe into impossible thing (God is whats impossible to be) which is silently sparkling within your heart ever since you were kid. And faith makes you to live accordingly to the message (message is the map for those who thinks for themselves). Not because that has any ground in the being (God here is the opposite of being), but because there is faith in something, and you yourself don't quite understand why believing in something even happens. What is the promise? Kingdom of God, New heaven, New earth after last judgement (not old infantile heavenly dimensions which never satisfied ancient people but mature heaven with things to do) . But however, this is interesting thing: its not really the heaven that motivates people, its rather that this promised thing is whats real within the dream world. There is one tiny real thing in between truth of absolute oneness. And this real thing has so many 'grande' things within: like faith, will, fight (holy war), 'God's plan', greatness, sacrifice, meaning, virtue. Things that do not really exist in the dream world, yet the revelations triggers the very hidden ability of human beings to actualise virtual virtues. To make dreams come true. To make impossible and non-existent to be. The dream world is simulacra and simulation, or copy, enlightenment makes you to realise that its the dream and you come to conclusion that the dream is the only reality. However, this what make people to be dissastisfied, they wanted real reality, not reality = dream. They wanted something from the source, something free from lies, otherwise enlightenment just make you to be one truthful dude living among lies, didn't make sense to people. People wanted real. This real is what is holy or divine in the Abrahamic sense. Thats why Holy Spirit, not just any spirit. Now the question, is that for real? Or do people just trying to feel important in the meaningless samsara? Well, the answer is figure out for yourself, you were given mind to think about this very thing. Revelations are just like a map that you find in the desert to finish the journey. Its not about blind belief, nope, faith in the benevolent mystery plays role of the last key of deconstruction of reality. Adam, Abraham, Moses, Jesus, Muhammad. Gospels, Quran. God in Abrahamic traditions is that very mystery of whats beyond 'what is'? Mystery of why do we have ability to believe if there is nothing to believe in within the meaningless samsara of oneness, why do we have ability to give meaning to something if all is meaningless? God is the very origin of meaning, the very origin of cosmic drama played out among cartoon characters made from matter. Logos = meaning/word/concept. In the beginning there was Logos, and Logos was with God, and Logos was God. 'In the beginning, God taught Adam to name animals (to give meanings to things)' In the end of the day, nothing in this world, neither body nor mind nor external world want meaning or want to believe in anything, only tiny divine spark within you wants it because its very job is all about meaning, believing and actualising potential of believing. Not intelelctual belief in anything, but belief of divine spark in the very essence of divine spark. God in Abrahamic sense is the mystery, it is transcendent = that which is not anything of this world, its not absolute oneness but that which is not. It can't be known and realised, you can establish 'connection' with its spirit here, you can feel its presence in your life, you can experience awakenings to the spirit, but overall on the grand scheme of things (beyond your death) you only can have faith in it, of course not the blind faith but conscious faith, faith is the act of intellectual will. And holy revelatons are not about entering organised cult, no, scriptures are maps in the dessert of unknown, maps are for people to read consciously and through heart, for people to understand and to realise truth resonance within the scripture (divine spirit within you is this discernment mechanism of true and false). Probably the biggest thing to think about is not god, but faith and believing.Why there is faith, why to believe in impossible God? If there is ability to believe in impossible transcendent God, then there must be a reason for this ability to exist in the first place? Don't ask so much of whats the meaning instead ask why do you have urge for meaning? Just like there is a reason for eyes - to see, and for ears - to hear. This question is worth to ask yourself. This is indeed the matrix. if you remember, in the beginning of the movie: Trinity (God in Chrstianity) were first one who appeared, she was hacking the matrix, trying to contact 'the one' and in the end we see that the godhead or deus ex machina or boss of machines was the one who created the matrix, one who put humans into the matrix, and he was the one who made humans to escape the matrix through creating program 'the one'. The one is your spirit, individualised awareness. PS. Think about nonduality and enlightenment as the high school of spirituality, and about Gospels and Quran and Abrahamic scriptures as the university of spirituality.

@Matt8800 Conceptual acknowledgment of meaninglessness without the actual realization of self. Mental equanimity without actuality in immediate ‘surrroundings’. An enlightened mind, without a completely deconstructed, and fully realized reality. “There is no point to this”, vs, “holy fucking God, THIS IS THE POINT TO THIS!” OMG WTF?! as you’re crying on your hands and knee’s devastatingly humbled by the impossibility that you are at all, laughing at the hilarity of everything you ever grieved. Having “figured it out”, without actually being aware of exactly what the fuck is going on here, right now. And transcending all of that to begin to experience nonduality.

I fully understand that I'm not the body, and that we "invent" a person to be out of social conditioning aka ego. So far I've only experimented with mushrooms, and my ego melted away, I could fully look at "my" body completely detached, like I watched/contemplated some objektive thing, I could see all the flaws of the bodymind without any identifikation with it, truly liberated. However, even though I fully become aware that I'm not the bodymind that took the scrooms, I felt I was still something, like some sort of individuality. And since I'm into to a certain type of cosmology that advocate that although we're not an ego that came to be in a certain body and Then dies with it when the body goes down, we are instead all eternal individuals with different developed skills and talents which we constantly improve on by every life we temporarilly live. Is This compatible with your teaching and nonduality? To me This makes sence, although all is one at its final analysis. Think about it, lets ponder compassion, a highly complex trait/feeling, yet some seem to have a very finetune and developed capacity for compassion at very young age, while others never manage to Carry out any such capacity throughout an entire lifetime. Could it be that we all are going to manage a high level capacity for compassion and other appreciated traits in the end? But that we are at different stages because what we as "individual units" have learned throughout pervious lifetimes aka reincarnation? According to the particular cosmology that resonates with me, we are all the same in terms of what it is that experience, it is always one and the same awareness in each of us that experience whatever we experience, no individuality in that regards. Rather what distinguish us as individuals are that we all have a set of "talent kernals" developed according to what we faced in our eternal Journey so far, and the work we have Done throughout our multiple lives. Thus we are at different levels. Some have very high intuition for Love, beauty, compassion etcetera. This also would be very fair(if it's true), that means people are not randomly lucky to be conpassionate and hence popular, but they rather deserve it because of work and crises in previous lives. To sum it up, the cosmology I refer to only suggest one consciousness(nonduality). It's only the one and same awareness that experience everything through us. But there is an individual aspect as Well, we have different capacities and potential depending how developed out "talent kernals" are, which depends on how we lived and struggled to become better peoples in previous lives. Is This something that can be true? Or do we live in a more strictly nondual realm where any Idea of any individual agent makes no sence? What do you think? I would like Leo's response, but I would Love to hear any other response as Well, please give your opinions on This topic. ?

Your individuality, post-awakening, will be grounded in being the entire universe. You can't get more unique and individual than that! But that includes every atom and every other living being that has ever existed or will ever exist. Your little ego will dissolve as if it never existed, and then "you" will just be the universe. What you experienced there on mushrooms was a step in the right direction, but still far shy of total nonduality, at which point even the thought or memory of ever being an ego makes no sense any more. You become so universal that there is no difference between living and dying as a body. In total nonduality it makes no sense to even ask the question, "Where will I go after I die?" Because you are forever infinite and cannot die.

No, sorry. It is not compatible with my personal understanding of nonduality. From what I understand from your post, you are trying to validate your cosmology. If you don't free yourself from assumptions of what reality is, you cannot see it properly. Reality simply is. There is no understanding of it other than raw awe. It cannot be explained with a story. Why do you need to explain us? Why do we need to be transcendent beings that cannot 'expire'? This wordy chain of cause and effect is ego talk. You should contemplate its importance to process your emotions, but it is not the answer. At least I think so, while I produce this story.

I know, the unchanging is the atman. Atman is always the same as Brahman aka the same infinite and impersonal consciousness. But your particular atman improves according to your accumulated life experiences and work, your potential for compassion for exemple grows accordingly. (Individuality) But "your" consciousness stays the same, as it does for all others. We are never anything other Then the same impersonal infinite consciousness, all Altmans=Brahman aka nonduality(all is one) you see what I'm saying here?

nonduality. All there is, is you - and you are not all that is. Hells. Yes. That is awesome to hear. ❤️ End of every ‘thing’. When you remove the beliefs, there is no suffering, no mental duality. When you remove the projections of physics / physicality / all that is, when you remove this universe which you are projecting, and then remove yourself too.....” “

@zenjen Possible. My impression of Osho (and this could just be my projection), was that he was so absorbed in nonduality he didn't give a fuck about human afairs here on Earth. And so things here on Earth got out of hand. If Osho didn't want to be involved with managing a community, he shouldn't have started such a big one. He also may have had parts of his shadow which he never worked through. His love of luxury, oppulance, sex, drugs, and adoration from fans all seem fishy. Those are lower chakra desires. It was obvious to me from the get-go, when Sheela said that she didn't care about enlightenment or meditation, but only serving Osho, that that would lead to great evil. You cannot have a human being leading a spirtual community of 1000s who is herself not doing any spiritual purifcation work. That will lead to obvious disaster. A leader must be more conscious than her followers, and always working to improve and humble herself.

Practices, reading, retreats, psychedelics, etc. Who had this influence on you? It’s not the result of direct experience. Nonduality is pure liberation. Not a metaphor. There is nothing ‘paralyzing or soul zapping’ about it. This is ego backlash against putting the time in. Do the practices anyways. Meaninglessness is unrealized nonduality and it’s prior to the empowerment of Being in charge of one’s own meaning. Realization brings meaning, and thinking, to be something you did before that death. A past life you are freed from.

It's a huge, vast difference. Study Ramana's life and you'll begin to see the depth of the enlightenment journey, maybe. Ultimately you'll have to experience it for yourself. Just a glimpse of the Absolute totally shatters everything you knew and throws all prior experiences out the window. Many states of nonduality can be similar in description, for instances, there are many void states which seem absolute, but people stagnate and fail to go deeper. They still have karma and aren't really free from bondage--they retain their vasanas, don't see the whole of reality, and never know Sat Chit Ananda. When Ramana talks about the Bliss of the Self, it's not some fancy, roundabout way of saying you become happy when you're enlightened. He's describing the nature of reality.

Haha! There is no contradiction at all! The Absolute I -- not to be confused with the self you presently think you are -- is Nothingness. It is formless. So all forms occurs within formlessness. But it gets even weirder! Since everything is totally nondual, there is no difference between form and formlessness. They are in fact identical. Everything is Beingness. But I, the Absolute am not that. AND I am that! What you are missing is: From a totally nondual perspective, nonduality and duality are in fact identical! Because everything is relative. Everything is simply a matter of perspective. Everything is consciousness, everything is one. But oneness includes manyness. Oneness includes every form of separation possible. One = Many Many = One Unity must include infinite disunity. Freedom must include infinite types of oppression and limitation. Love must include infinite types of hatred. Everything must come full-circle. Paradox here is not a bug but a feature. P.S. It is impossible for an ego (you) to understand this. This understanding only comes AFTER the ego's annihilation. The ego's annihilation IS this understanding.

@herghly I don't know. Spiritual powers are a seperate thing from realzing total nonduality. I am talking about total nonduality here, not spiritual powers. I do not understand why Martin does all that energy movement stuff. To me it is irrelevant to nonduality. I guess that's just his way. For me it is not like that.

Just to clarify, transpersonal psychology is not enlightenment. It is more about spiritual and mystical experiences, but short of full-on nonduality. It's still a great field to study.

@Matt8800 No, you are tricking yourself. Having a worldview of any kind is false nihilism. True, realized nihilism is total nonduality. You ain't even close to that yet. All ideas about reality are basically false. So start dropping them. Reality is Nothingness. This cannot be understood using the mind. It requires a deep awakening out of materialism and duality.

Can't say. Haven't read enough of his work to tell how deeply he graps nonduality.

Ralston, Jed, Sadhguru, and a few others. It's hard to be certain because there are so many facets, degrees, and nuances to nonduality, and different ways of talking about it.

@Leo Gura what is total nonduality and half nonduality ?

@Maycol That requires a very deep enlightenment. Yes, Neti Neti, or self-inquiry, or yoga, or meditation, or 5-MeO-DMT. 5-MeO-DMT is the most direct and surest way. You will experience pure, total nonduality the likes of which cannot be imagined or spoken of. Experiencing total nonduality is not easy. It usually takes enormous work. It took me about 4 years of hard work every day, and the only reason I succeeded was thanks to 5-MeO. Most people here pursuing enlightenment will never realize total nonduality in their lives. It's too deep. But with 5-MeO it becomes very doable. LSD is the next best thing, since 5-MeO is hard to find. But LSD will still not take you deep enough. But it will still give you a good glimpse and knock your socks off if you use it properly.

@Faceless It’s not really a ‘state’, it more of a reveal of what’s actually going on, what actually is. Anything one says to another about nonduality is inherently not describing it. I can say the whole thing is you, but that doesn’t really describe nonduality. It does have to be experienced & realizated. Not realized like mentally understood, but like actually reality. I’m not trying to be secretive or vague, I hope it doesn’t come across that way. It’s the nature of the subject. PMing.

Bashar is a good example of a channeler. To be clear l never said whether channeling is good or bad. It is just a thing. Whether you should pursue it is not easy to answer. Be careful with judging spiritual techniques or methods with which you have no direct experience. From what I currently understand, what you really want is enlightenment. But it's good to know that stuff like channeling is really possible if you care about fully understanding how reality works. There are many facets to spirituality besides pure realization of nonduality. Way more facets than people realize. Like demons, angels, spirits, dieties, entities, astral realms, etc. Just don't get too distracted by all that stuff. Go for enlightenment first. Dabbling in the occult can be big distraction, and poses risks.

“experiencing infinity’ seeing God’ lol, as they are for me and me only” You’re aware beyond the meditative state there is the state of nonduality, yes? This might be why you reference and share some experiences & practices, while diminishing the practices & experiences of others. When you see it’s all you, this doesn’t hold anymore, as in it is resistence you’re freed from. Just a thought for ya. It would also make sense of the things you say about experiencing absolute.

@cetus56 I could not agree more! Heading to Home Depot.... -rope -duct tape -dolly -nonduality safety glasses