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Your question, 'If I commit suicide, will anyone else suffer?' Shaun, if you don’t love yourself, everyone suffers. Why? Because what is in you must extend from you. And in a mind that was created, dedicated to joy, the love that you yourself are longing to give, is shut off. That is the root cause of your sickness, that is why you see life as futile. But, if you could learn this simple lesson, your life will be transformed. The lesson may be simple but it takes practice. And you must be very gentle with yourself. Kind to yourself. Forgiving of your failings. The text I am about to share with you, has a value beyond compare. Take your time. Perhaps come back to it if the time isn’t right. In or out? “Look at your life’s wheel, all your relationships, all your abilities, your profession, whatever it is, you don’t deny them, you just reverse the direction, you change the purpose. Instead of going out leading nowhere, (with the illusion that you are getting somewhere with someone), you now go back to that quiet centre. And in that quiet centre is everyone, that’s where the world is, it’s in that quiet centre. That’s where all relationships are, because ‘ideas leave not their source.’ And you don’t have to go anywhere because there is nowhere to go, you are everywhere. But to do that you have to break the identification with your body which is the spokes going out towards the wheel that spins and goes nowhere and identify more with the mind which is that quiet centre. And what you do in order to have that happen is not work on changing your self, you just work on shifting how you look at people. That is why a big thrust of, ‘A Course in Miracles’ is shifting perception of relationships. Which means you don’t give people power to make you happy; you don’t give people the power to make you unhappy. People have no power. People are just figures in a dream. Just as figures in a sleeping dream have no power. They are simply projections into a form you could recognise in your dream of a thought. And that’s all we are, we’re all projections of a thought of separation. The other thing is when you have the spokes come back to the centre, they all unite at the centre. When they go out they’re all separate around the wheel; the circumference of the wheel. When they come back they all unite at the centre, they all lead to that centre and in that centre, ultimately, we are all one. Just as the old saying goes, all roads lead to Rome, all roads lead back to that quiet centre. And that’s where we all are, as one. But it can’t be that True quiet centre unless everyone is in there with you, that’s the catch. It is described in that section called the ‘Circle of Atonement’, which is about that circle and bringing everybody into that circle. Jesus makes the same point in the section titled ‘The Little Garden’ where you bring everybody into your garden. It’s the ego’s garden that excludes certain people, in Jesus’ garden is everybody, he invites everybody… ‘You bring them in,’ meaning that you shift the purpose that you’ve given to the relationship, you accept the fact that everybody’s there within. The, ‘bringing them in’ is simply just a phrase that expresses the shift from the spoke going out to the spoke going in. Because there’s nobody out there in the wheel, in the spokes, everybody’s in that quiet centre. But everybody must be there with you that’s the key thing, everybody must be there with you. Not in form because it gets very crowded ☺ not in form but in content, everybody’s there with you which means in your mind you don’t exclude anyone. On the level of form you can’t include everyone. You can’t be with everyone in the world all the time but in your mind you don’t exclude anyone; through judgement, through anger, through attack, through specialness. And so that’s what gives your life purpose. In a sense you say Jesus’ New Year prayer everyday; ‘Make this year different by making it all the same’. Make this day different from all the other days of my life by having me see everything is the same, there’s one meaning. Again, you must accord one meaning to them all. But you can see how difficult this is to apply because you may be a very diligent student of the course and you read it every morning and you think about it etc… and you get caught in the world and Boom! It’s gone. You know you get caught in a traffic jam or you car doesn’t start, right? Or you hear about something on the news, you know and it’s gone! The peace is gone! The purpose that you’ve given to the day has gone. See how difficult it is to stay in that centre. The pull is so enormous to get you out of it. And so what’s helpful is, just be aware of that. Don’t fight against it, don’t fight against the pull, don’t feel guilty about it, don’t judge yourself, just be aware of how difficult it is and the reason it’s so difficult is that we’re afraid to live lives without fear. We are afraid to live lives without fear because if I don’t have fear, I’m peaceful and I’m quiet and there’s no separation. If I’m afraid, there’s somethingI’m afraid of. Which means I’m into a dualistic universe, I’m into separation, I’m into differences, I’m into judgements and I’m attacking. And we are all little babies wanting attention, wanting to be fed, wanting to be justified in feeling upset, feeling unfairly treated, feeling victimised, feeling abandoned, feeling alone. And so it’s very, very helpful just to keep this in mind as you work with staying in peace, especially as you work with the course to see how there is a part of you that does not want to learn it. Does not want to practice, you may intellectually believe it sometimes, but you really don’t believe that you could walk this earth and not be fearful, not be angry, not be lonely, not be depressed, not be in pain. And you know that has to be the case because you go through life feeling angry and alone and anxious and in pain. And if that’s where you ended up, then that’s the goal you must have set at the beginning because it’s your play, you wrote it, it’s your dream. That’s what’s helpful, very, very helpful to understand. If you are feeling something you wantedto feel it otherwise you would not feel it. Our whole life, our entire world, mitigates against that recognition. That’s why we made the world that way,so we would not recognise this. And so being able to see that there’s one purpose, one goal, one meaning that unifies everything is very, very helpful. And you’ll begin to see over time how much easier it is living like that. Because you don’t have to judge among alternatives, you don’t have to deicide who’s good and who’s bad.” Kenneth Wapnick

27th July Today is a horrible day for me. I cut myself and bled a lot. Feeling dizzy and weak. Hope it gets better. At this time, spirituality makes me feel better. It's a savior. Been through so much in life. Will I ever get peace. I just feel so unfortunate sometimes. What could have I done to change things. Things became worse so much so quick. It was like a train wreck. How could have I changed things so quick. Where was the time to change things. Things kept getting worse. So much went wrong in such little time. There was absolutely nobody to help those who I felt were helpful neglected me as I kept getting worse. And those who showed false hope kept telling me lies, taking me for granted and dismissing me. My cries for help went unheard so many times. I was suicidal so many times. Humanity is shit. Often people express regret and grief when someone commits suicide. As though they were always waiting to help, they were only wishing the person had reached out, meanwhile those who reach out are always exceptionally ignored.. What an irony. I cried for help to get freedom from a pathetic toxic environment and toxic relationships but none would hear my voice and offer hope. When hope arrived it was too late. Today is a dismal day as I reflect back on my childhood. A mother who suddenly turned into a beast. A dad who was always terminally ill. A sibling who was always busy with their career and their own life to build. A first boyfriend who only cared for sex. The second boyfriend who gave false hope of a good life and started harassing when things didn't go his way. The third boyfriend who used guilt trapping and threats and constant verbal abuse and replaced it with periods of false support. I wonder sometimes what happens to people like me who are wandering lost in the wilderness of the world only to be found by vultures. Hunted and preyed on. And the toxicity and lack of support creating tremendous frustration and illnesses. May God have mercy on my poor soul. The day I die will be the day I will say to myself, "oh God, I went through too much. No more please." This world and its people are a dangerous place Not meant for the wonderful, kind, brave, strong and the loving. The world is a vulture.

@Shaun From the perspective you are mentioning right now, suicide is pointless, if one has infinite lives then why not make the best of all of them one by one? You couldn't possibly know the future, you can only visualize the most wonderful possible future and build it. All these things you mention come from love, this might sound sick but if someone rapes someone they did it out of love of sex, or pleasure, etc. They love in a very low consciousness way. What is making one fear love?

@Shaun Hey man! I hope you dont do it. Suicide hurts all of us. A month ago I was on a subway and a kid jumped. I saw many people crying and I myself felt horrible. Then there is all the good you can still do. Usually when people that are depressed make it through they have much richer emotional systems then other people who were never depressed. It will all end up playing in your favor in the end. Hope you feel better soon.

You say you have to keep going back and forth to a job within a meaningless existence, and the only alternative you can think of is suicide? Why not just pack a light backpack and start walking if you are so lost. Maybe you will find something that is more meaningful. Maybe you will run into something that is great, or something might click.

Lost in spiritual concepts and beliefs, one is missing a connection to absolute love. Go deep, find the love and bring it to yourself. Bring it to the resistance of bringing it to yourself, and the resistance to that, and so on. Find the love feeling. All who love you will more then likely suffer if you commit suicide, and there really is no point to suicide, dead, living, no difference.

If your a parent or guardian don't assume your child is straight, or even a minority, sexual preference can be super fucking different than expected, there are groups for people attracted to anthropomorphic animals, people attracted to robots, and porn for many tv shows or movies, not to mention groups that are still commonly seen as 'evil rapists and predators' which include but are probably not limited to - Pedophilia - Incest If your like most people, most of those probably make you vomit at the thought of having a normal conversation about, which is honestly fine, you don't have to make it your mission in life to talk about uncomfortable sex stuff, but seriously having one awkward conversation with your kid can save them years or potentially a life time of pain, and possibly prevent them from committing suicide, anxiety, and beyond, and it doesn't even have to be an awkward talk, just don't have a conversation where you assume they're straight or allude to them that you 'know' they are straight. Also in one of Leo's videos he talked about society still being stuck in the dark ages, and believe it or not, being qualified as a pedophile or incestual does not mean that person has done anything illegal, or with other people. Maybe question your assumptions of why you think that, its likely that many of those people are just like how gays were back In the day, no one talked about it, no one cared and thought it was wrong, and support systems are limited. Therapy isn't a huge option because therapists are legally obligated to report this kind of information to the government, a government which still believes pedophilia = child rapist or incest = rapist. Anyways thats just one little area, the best you could do is just become more conscious of it, knowing is an important action.

According to life between lives regression therapy, souls who commit suicide almost always regret their action because know they'll have to go through the same challenges once again. They feel like they have wasted their incarnation and let down souls they had a contract with, Their spirit guide(s) are understanding and offer them love and compassion tho.

@electroBeam Suicide and Ego-Cleansing have two distinct intuitions, you can literally feel the difference buzzing if that doesn't bug you enough.

Try quitting, if only for a few secs. Give completely into the defeat and angst. Surrender all your goals, everything. Maybe even admit defeat of not being able to surrender. That is what surrender is. Kill the person who you are trying to be, not your physical body. Be who you are, and feel what you feel. Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem, so it is obviously a very bad solution.

Perfect advice for someone contemplating suicide! Your not wrong but You need to be in the right state of mind for shadow work. Would rather see him get to a positive baseline before going demon hunting.

Well to me the dynamics to this situation are obvious, you haven't mastered the art of going inwards. To me, suicide based on analogous difficulties arise from this problem of not mastering introspection. There is a divide between the internal and external that runs several layers deep beyond the superficial physical distinction, they somehow live with the idea that they need some purpose internal to themselves that runs parallel to the circumstances of reality but to me this is simply not true. Our only purpose to me is to grow our consciousness and anything designed as an 'external' purpose is merely secondary to this because it is a byproduct of this consciousness work, meaning our purpose changes according to our level of consciousness. If our consciousness is low then we will imagine things equivalent to that low level, like being a drug dealer (don't want to stereotype all drug dealers though of course) and if it is higher, well we might run a business with more of a win-win focus and do whatever we can to avoid being a drug dealer and not just because we fear being caught. All of the work is inside to me. This isn't to negate external motivation (I have a heck of a lot of motivation and this is how I go about it), I'm saying that all motivation externally for me is generated internally, of which is dependent upon not only my level of consciousness but the level of inner work I've done at ordering the contents of my consciousness, meaning becoming more informationally congruent with past experience where prior dissonances (i.e. insecurities) are resolved with inner contemplation of those circumstances. This is the beginning to developing wisdom that is self-earned and self-taught. By going inwards, we learn to transform the contents of experience into a relationship that builds between the prefrontal and the emotional regions of the mind, fortitude here of which inevitably results into the realization of some important insight about those events. This grows our mind, awareness and reduces our suffering where in doing so, external purpose becomes self realized via a growth in consciousness rather than something that's forced. In short, run towards internal insecurities, delusions, illusions and overall pains not away from them. This is where the work begins and this is when you will begin to resolve your troubles, at least, that is my prediction based on my own practical experience on the subject with respect to working with myself. Thus, YOU will be the one to solve this because you're the only one that can go inside and work things out there. That can be quite empowering to know this. There will be no quick fixes, in my experience I'd run away from cliche advice. All the best.

Why would anyone commit physical suicide when the can just as easily commit suicide of the mind. It's just as effective and a lot less messy.

This is the very breach through which devilry arises. Just because something is what "God" wants doesn't mean that it's not a toxic mental pattern. GOD and you are ONE. GOD is not a separated entity that says that everything is okay and that it would be fine if we were killing each other or committing suicide.

Yet it is ultimately God's doing that somebody isn't conscious of what it truly is. It still does make sense at least to me. Your will is always God's will whether you realize it or not and that includes low consciousness people. The decision of suicide or no suicide seems ultimately grounded in the relative. You could go either way and that's what ultimately God wanted. But this kind of realization seems to only come with higher states exactly because it would not be handled with care to someone in lower states. To the lower states it reinforces nihilism ideology with negative perceptions.

Suicide is the banalization of the sacred and this is a sin, immoral, or karmically bad. Not from the ego perspective but from the universe itself, the oportunity of life is such a beautifil gift and a loving act, and rejecting this by suicide is so low and wrong... alsom killing animals for food, i a lovely act of sacrifice, or eating a plant, is a magic moment that has been banalized. Be mindful every time you eat and what this means.

@ajasatya Tell me what following statement you don't agree with here. God is infinite. Our finite is reality is God experiencing itself. God must experience all finite possibilities regardless if they're good or bad / low consciousness or high consciousness. Through God all realities exist. So why isn't a possibility of suicide the will of God if you believe the four statements above exist?

If someone is considering suicide, that person is not really conscious of GOD. So it wouldn't make any sense to say "Your will is the will of GOD". In fact, it could do much more harm than good. Suicide due to depression or emotional trauma is only considered in extremely low states of consciousness.

@ajasatya How can suicide be an act against God if you the will of God?

Suicide is pointless, comes from ego to sustain itself as dominant force. Remember ego has ony one chance to live and YOU don't.

Nothing exists. But materialistically, I think it's fairly self explanatory why suicide is discouraged. I mean, in my opinion...I don't see why you would kill yourself before you just break bad....if I was gonna do it I would definitely go on a shittone of holidays and fuck as many bitches as I can get hahahaha and do loads of drugs and just go mental. Then do it More fun.

@Mikael89 yes the Absolute is the Absolute. The duality of suicide being discouraged or encouraged breaks down. But as God would you go around encouraging yourself to off yourself when you created yourself to be? It is your ablility as God to do so - but that's not the question here.

@electroBeam If suicide was encouraged, you wouldn't be here asking this question. So, maybe you are the reason why it is discouraged. Maybe the only reason why it is discouraged is to make you get to this point and ask this question, and then read my answer and realise that you are the goal of life.

The destruction, the killing, is part of creation. You cannot act against the work of God, as all acts are the work of God. Is it not interesting how you created suicide so that you could then go and complain about suicide being against your own Will? You are playing with yourself.

Darn I was hoping this would be a discussion on assisted suicide for cancer patients or heavily disturbed individuals. By your theory these people would be lucky enough to have quicker enlightenment if we supported assisted suicide.