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Nothingness "Underneath the condition when you are awake and aware, and beneath the condition when you are in bed at night and dreaming, there is the deep-sleep condition. Here, there are no thoughts, there is no “you”, no mind, no relationships, no other, nor world, or universe. There is merely a condition of empty presence, no-thing-ness. Everything, every form, event, etc., is superimposed on this empty presence, by the mind in the waking or dreaming state. But the organism, the body, continues to exist despite these daily reoccurrence of emptiness. This condition in which there is no mind, no thoughts, no forms, and no you, is the “ground” state, your natural state. This empty presence is the condition of the organism before its birth (and its conditioning and the arising of the I-thought), and will be its condition once again upon the death of the form of “your life”. In other words, an organism appears to arise within empty presence, matures, and recedes again into empty presence (similar to the way an electron arises and recedes in the quantum field). The organism knew nothing of existence or nonexistence before birth, and will know nothing after death: “You” will not know that you— or anything else— ever had “existed”. Recognizing the fleeting temporality of “existence” – and that existence will be completely non-existent, in due course— it becomes clear that not anything that you do, think, feel or say has any lasting significance or meaning. (This is the message of the Bhagavad Gita.) All that appears, to the organism, to be done is merely a momentary expression of the field of ever-present beingness—utterly lacking in lasting reality. This is why it is said, in the nondual writings, that “nothing really matters”. It is also why it is said that (as a book about Papaji is titled) “nothing ever happened.” All that we learn in advaita is intending to point our attention to nothingness. (And not its “existence” or “nonexistence”, since where there is nothing, neither of these are applicable.) In other words, the intention of advaita, or nonduality, is to direct us to ajata. And, I would say, a thorough understanding of the former is necessary in order to comprehend the latter. When we come to recognize that, in truth, there is nothing from the start, we understand what is meant when it is said that all that we perceive is simply a dream, an illusion— seemingly superimposed on ever-lasting empty presence. Now, is this information simply an interesting “analysis”, or does this have practical value? Someone recently sent me a book by the Dalai Lama, and I’ll extract a few quotes. All phenomena are empty. Emptiness pervades not only your individual ego or sense of self, but the whole of reality…That emptiness of mind is its ultimate nature, or mode of being. To realize that, is to pierce and see through the deception of ignorance…freedom from ignorance (is called) nirvana… Realizing emptiness is directly related to our quest to purify our mind of afflictive emotions like hatred, anger, and desire…We project onto things a state of “existence”, and a mode of being which is simply not there…. This understanding of emptiness..is one of the principal factors of the true path….For such an insight cuts right through the illusion created by the mis- apprehension of grasping things and events as existing… We realize the emptiness of all phenomena, not just the mind and body of the individual. In my favorite story about Ramana Maharshi, a man came into the room where Ramana held satsang, said he’d written a biography of Ramana and asked permission to read it. Ramana smile and nodded, and the man read his manuscript. It was full of inaccuracies and error: he said that Ramana was married and had children, that he’d been a Socialist before his enlightenment, and on and on. When he finished reading, Ramana smiled and nodded, and the man picked up his manuscript and left. One of Ramana’s disciples cried out, “Master, did you hear what he read? Is any of that real?!” Ramana waved his hand as if taking in the universe, and asked: “Is any of this real?” -- Ajata project (Robert Wolfe)

In my experience, the thoughts are always in words or images like stories or a short movie. If I was visually, audibly and speech impaired, who has never spoken, never heard sounds and never seen anything, how would I experience a thought? Please do not take these impairments literally, What I am basically trying to ask is what is there to an experience of thought underneath these complex, subjective layers of sounds, words and images. I experience the "hologramy" nothingness of my surroundings including my body when I sit with my eyes open long enough in a place and get deep into myself (kind of visual meditation or I don't know what to call it, I just do it for the fun of it) but I cannot escape the labeling of the things, like I cant help recognizing a tree and calling it a tree for example. How do I get underneath it where the experience is more raw, underneath the labeling and underneath the recognition of shapes and calling them by their names. It is so hard even to put my question in words, hope someone gets what I am trying to ask. Thanks in advance.

Nothing and Infinity are identical. You can almost think of it like a black hole. If you’re a science junky, you might be familiar with the hypothesis that inside black holes is another expanding universe, though from the outside it looks like complete nothingness. It’s like reality is collapsing into infinite density which equates to nothing, and then explodes on the other side back into something. Whether or not this is actually how black holes work is not the point, I’m just creating a comparison. So you can kind of think of reality analogous to that. When you look into the black hole,(or yourself) from the outside, you see pure nothingness. But when looking OUT from inside the black hole, you see everythingness. So you could say that reality is just nothingness sort of being turned inside out or inverted into everythingness through the strange loop that is consciousness. Your consciousness is at the very center of the singularity. Or rather, you are the singularity which is consciousness itself. Nothingness pretending to be somethingness.

wtf. i was driving along behind my friends car, watching how my headlights changed the shadow of his car, at this point i completely zoned out, i was just experiencing, i didnt have any thoughts, neither was i aware that i was driving, there was nothing, yet, there was experience but i was not the experience. out of nowhere, consciousness appeared, and as soon as it appeared, the nothingness was gone, nothing, turned into something, i was then aware of the consciousness ariving (how?!, where from? wtf?), aware that it had came out of nowhere, and that in the previous experience, my mind was so quite, empty, nothingness, it was not blissful, it was not quite, it was, nothing pure nothingness, even describing it is making it something, which it was not, ugh?! this experience was profound, how could something come out of nothing. If nothing is, well, nothing, how can it conjour something, nothing, is something? yet, something is nothing? my brain exploded, i felt this strange, understanding, yet i both understand, and do not understand. It wasnt an experience, it wasnt a feeling or an emotion, it wasnt the thought, it just was, direct nothingness, which when i realised, dissapeared, because it became something. [edit] another thing, it was gone as quick as it was here, it just was, i was, and at the same time, i wasnt, and now i am not again. is this, it?

By something being physical, I mean, having form. I defined form as the coherence between various dimensions of experience. I said: "manifest from", not "manifest form". It "comes out" of nothingness. I can't find the right word for what is happening. The table is there only in your experience which gives it its "physicality", or form. The table does not exist before the distinction is made.

It's even weirder than that. Let's say that you are making the distinction in your visual field and label it as a table. This distinction is not arbitrary, you are not having a groundless fantasy, the table is there. It is true. And yet - prior to making that leap, prior to having the experience of a table, the table did not exist. Physically. By making that leap, the table became manifest from, or through, or within nothingness. Nothingness is more fundamental than form. What I was referring to as "form" was, perhaps, the coherence of the experience of the table. As in: the table is a table, regardless of whether you are seeing it or feeling it with your hands. The shape as you touch it is not distinct from its visual appearance. Have you ever wondered why is that? Why don't you pluck your eyes out and "see"? ATM I'm going through covid and lost my sense of smell which is an interesting experience. I do have my nose but air is without quality. The movement of air I'd say comes via the sense of touch, but food is "flat". I can imagine and remember how chicken smells, but I can't actually feel one in front of me. When I'm using the phrase "prior to labeling", I mean without thinking with words, the actual thing. Distinctions are more fundamental than language. I'm perfectly capable of seeing the difference between the stool and the floor without chatting to myself. When it comes to sight itself, it's more tricky, because in order to understand that you are seeing from a particular place (eyes), you need to see in the first place. Yet, that "seeing from a particular place" is a distinction. We make distinctions in various dimensions of consciousness (sight, sound, taste, etc). It's helpful to learn the aggregates as they are described in Buddhism. The order in which they are described is important, but I'm having difficulty expressing why. IME they are progressively closer to nothingness/source. Experience is what really is. It is the truth. You have access to it when you stop fabricating reality with expectations, beliefs and fantasies and look what's really there. It is apparent when you stop thinking about it and actually do it, or be there. I highly suggest reading Peter Ralston's Book of not knowing and experiencing for yourself what is being communicated there.

I can go below zero by just measuring a point as a meter. Its a visualisation trick which works quite well for me although it creates a very strange image. Similarly i can measure a meter as a point and truncate an infinite shape into something I can image as well. I'm not going to get into whether apples are illusions or not, that was not the point of the topic. As for "nothingness" well you can have less than it depending on how you measure it. As an example if we measure "nothingness" using symmetry then it has an infinite value. The universe though has finite degrees of symmetry and is hence less than nothing from a particular perspective, hence my theory that the universe is less than nothing rather than more which explains why it can exist

Steven Bancarz claims to be have been a New-Ager/Mystic etc. He didn't practice what he preached: Buying material stuff, drugs, alcohol, suppressing feelings and thoughts, no real awakenings, except love maybe, no shadow work. Only when he totally surrendered he maybe saw a part of the source, and gave credit to jesus. Nobody who sees the nothingness can put it into relation with any of the "content". The sectarian circular reasoning he uses is basically what's wrong with religion and what has allowed it to survive that long.

30 min meditation today. Really good sit. My mind got very concentrated. Good energetic flow in my body. Feels like just dissolving into nothingness.

You can have a direct realization of GOD, cause that is all that there is. GOD is everything and nothing and even beyond that. It is a paradox and a mindfuck. We will never figure out the totality of what GOD is. But we can realize that GOD IS and will always be. Even when this is over. God IS. The UNMANIFEST godhead is not even conciousness or awareness, it is beyond existence and non existence. But GOD manifested is conciousness. A zero. A singularity, a nothingness, and not even that lol ? GOD is zero and everything in between and everything that is not in between. Recognize the utter absurdity that existence is here. And it comes from NOTHING. God is a human, a bird, a chair, and whatever. Infinite power and infinite imagination. It is non being and from it being arises. So non being is ALL powerful. The mind can't grasp it. But everything is utterly EMPTY. Emptiness and nothingness is the truth. But nothingness is not a bad thing. It is all nothing but nothing is everything lol ? direct realization of GOD and infinite imagination is a profound thing, it is infinite in infinite dimensions, this is ONE out of an infinite number of realities and this i have had direct insight into. You are God and simultaneously the whole scene that you see, GOD is the entire visual field and the thing behind your eyes. And when you think you got it, it slips away, so it is and it is not. Sorry for the contradictions in this post but language is not it but it is at the same time ? Mindfuck.

@Psychventure There is the seeing of one's own true nature. Of being infinite nothingness. And if you see it well enough, you'll see that this infinite nothingness (which is everything) is immortal. And so it is that I know that this nothingness will never die. Physical death is an illusion. Me, Mujtaba, my human self with a name might die. I don't know. Whether I have a "soul" which will reincarnate I don't know, but that's a lower order structure to structureless infinity/nothingness. My true self won't die. Naturally this is a scary thing when seeing. I was traumatised by the directness of the experience and my mind keeps itself distracted from seeing this constant truth. -- The prospect of living forever terrified me a lot when I was younger. I used to be a very religious Muslim. And I thought about Heaven. That I would be there forever. And forever feel terrifying. And I hoped that God at least has the decency to give me a button which I can press to just sleep or die. Continuing on with what is nonetheless just an intellectual chain and making myself feel comfortable. If I already have existed forever, then what is there to fear for the future.

‘That’ is this. This is absolutely nothing. Nothing is not some other thing, place or dimension ‘after we die’. It’s this. “Everything” is the movie the screen (Nothingness) is being. It’s not that the brain doesn’t know what happens when we die, it’s that brain is a thought, not a thing which knows. You are that which is knowingness of the thought ‘brain’, and that which is the ‘thought’ ‘brain’. Humorously if you will, ‘death’ is also a ‘thought’, which is you, and is about you. It’s funny because it’s the same you ‘life’ is attributed to. How funny are you? “I do not remember what it is like to be in a dream, i simply do not, never have !!! So i don't know what to compare this reality to...” You can’t be in a dream. You can make it seem like it though, by dreaming. Imagine if “you” - conventionally speaking, as a person, wanted to go somewhere. Imagine you don’t have a car, but you can become any vehicle. *poof* - you become a car. But there’s no you to drive the car. But the scenery changes as if.

@Inliytened1 yeah, I get you. my thing is from my experiences and understanding of “consciousness”... there’s another level. One which deals energy and nothingness. It’s like there is this form of consciousness and we understand because of consciousness. However outside this conciseness there is shiva. Outside shiva is energy his wife. They both have created this. This is his daughter. This daughter holds gods. Gods created this so we can understand and grow. It’s ultimately just aspects of shiva and energy. Shiva created Vishnu and.... lol I’m explaining in Hindu terminology. Sorry if that confused anyone. It’s easier for me then explaining what they are. anyways, I’m still growing and learning. I honestly just loved talking about this with you! p.s shiva = nothingness so great you stop existing, so does energy, so does consciousness inside of it. tara(their daughter) holds this world. it’s so beautiful. mother = love, purity, energy. love is ultimately a aspect of purity... the energy of purity to be exact.

I surrendered and as i let go, death happened. I merged back with nothingness and it was one of the most satisfying and beautiful moment that you can possibly conceived as a limited human creature. The beauty of death is inconceivable, it is truly astonishing how powerful and majestic death is. I'm looking forward to my physical death now. It will be a blast.

I too saw results about a week in. I had realizations like Nothingness = Wholeness and had a paradigm shift. Arc

Self inquiry -- instead of trying to answer Who am I? or What knows this? just realize that the question is what defines your limitation as a separate individual -- you don't know something, or you think you know something. Try to find the one who knows your experience, no matter how subtle the content gets. This can bring about pretty amazing states like the witness where experience kind of turns inside out and it's like you're looking in at experience from a vast nothingness. The God-like experience of the pure I AM. (You can transition this into enlightenment work by encouraging an awareness that on some level, you'll never actually know what's aware, because there's no questioner that could know anything, but that's a different axis of development altogether.) If you haven't done it before, this description doesn't do it justice. Self inquiry is a subtle but very intense and demanding activity that only works well if you do it way more intensely and way more often than you're probably willing to, and in all situations. It can be very distressing because you're essentially looking for something that is simultaneously not there, and all there is. Meditation with relaxed diligence. Learn from Culadasa, Rob Burbea, Shinzen Young, Kenneth Folk, etc, someone who has students who seem to get results. Meditation retreats Self love Gratitude Journaling Figuring out what you want Psychedelics -- each trip can provide insights that can be integrated over the course of a week or 2 and as a result life changes can happen beyond that in snowball fashion

You are right. Only nobody can report from nothingness

"Experiencing nothing" is a paradox for the finite mind. You have to experience it yourself to truly know it. It's like trying to imagine the experience of having no eyesight. There are people who see absolutely nothing, not even black or white or any other colors. From this example you can see it is possible to be aware of nothingness. Now extend that awareness of nothing to all the perceptions that make up your reality, that's what complete nothingness feels like. You are actually experiencing some form of nothingness right now. You are never aware of what is behind your head, so you could say you are experiencing nothing there. You just take it for granted because you are so focused on the finite things you can experience. Now try to extend that feeling of nothingness to all your perceptions. This is basically the best I can describe it. The difference is that these are not experiences, just imagination. They're like the off-brand versions of nothingness.

Depends on your definition of enlightenment. If your definition is to be in higher states of consciousness at all times, then it is not permanent. The states of consciousness go up infinitely, and it is always shifting like a wave. You can not function as a human in super high conscious states(where reality melts down). You can be as conscious as you can while maintaining reality, but it will still fluctuate up and down, just less extreme the more conscious you are. This is by choice. My definition of enlightenment is the full realization of being/self/love, which will also lead to the end of seeking. To reach this point, you would have to experience absolute nothingness/infinite love directly. This is permanent; the knowledge of why everything is the way they are becomes absolutely clear, thus ending the seeking. This, however, doesn't mean you are in high conscious states all the time. After this, you are truly free to be whatever you want to be, so you are free to choose how you experience reality. And no matter how high or low your consciousness gets, you will always have this knowledge/being as a baseline.

The human ego is also a belief. I was talking about the eternal Self. The ego' story is that death is final and this is just a ride into nothingness. Have you ever experienced death to know that you won't come back to life in another form? We forget many things in this life, so the reincarnation theory seems plausible to me. Yes, it is one of the explanations and you can call it a belief but it is better than "death is the end".

A paradox is what happens when the finite mind tries to describe an infinite aspect of reality through its own superficially dualistic terms I realized this after I had an experience of nothingness. After reading that over, I realized that I experienced a paradox. It is entirely possible to experience nothingness, but impossible for the finite mind to reconcile that since it can only think in dualisms, so it gets turned into a paradox. It's impossible for me to imagine my experience of nothingness because in order to have a thought you need a finite object of some sort to think about. Here is one of my favorite ones: The second sentence is false. The first sentence is true.

You might be aware of the darkness but you may not truly know that it is your only (nothingness within, ironically, felt being) and final resting place (death).

@Shin Of course. You’ve never gone anywhere, ever. You’ve just been witnessing colors, shapes and sound shifting in your consciousness. That is what they call the illusion of “Maya”. Whats even more amazing is that if I asked you right now to close one of your eyes, and then ask “what is behind you”? You cannot are what is truly behind you, because if you turn your body the visual field is still in front of you LOL. What is behind you is pure nothingness. And that’s what you are. You’re literally a magical being. Magic is real, that’s how reality was constructed.

I can confirm reality is ultimately a self-aware hologram being in nothingness.

Oh my God! I just realized that I have been aware of nothingness since my early childhood. I didn't know that I was aware of it. How stupid! I come from a Muslim family, and so while growing up, people used to say the word Allah a lot. The moment my realization happened was the moment I asked my mom about Allah. She said that Allah created everything blah blah blah. I didn't understand the meaning of any of that. But then I asked her; how does Allah look like? And she said that he does not have a form and cannot be perceived. At that moment, I got a clear definitive intuition of God as nothingness, and it stuck with me till this day. Only I didn't realize that before. I have never not been aware of nothingness.