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@V-8 Lol, you do you man. If you wanna wake up faster, look into spiritual transmissions, Ramana is known for saying the greatest teaching is silence yet many aren't ready for it hence he invented Self-Inquiry to help people get to the unbreakable silence. Since April, I've been working with a teacher 1-1 which has helped beyond words, we've gone through my own blockages on this path, understanding myself more on a human level, dealing and overcoming those blockages etc, and then a 15 minute transmission at the end of each session, I've had multiple awakenings and deepening of these awakenings in the last 8 months, to the point where I can truly rest in the absolute and be completely satisfied, life is amazing. I'd also rather you didn't try and play some superiority card as if I'm not interested in realization lol, I linked you some of the greatest masters of our time. From your messages it sounds like you're still seeking and haven't found what you're looking for. I was not arguing that meditation is the best tool for waking up, I was merely stating just because it isn't doesn't reduce it's effectiveness to 0. If you want to talk about truth realization we can, and while many preach psyches, I'll happily talk about transmissions and working 1-1 with a self realized being, I find it funny how you made assumptions. You also seem adamant there are still others, that is a CLEAR indication to me you are not deeply awakened, one who has truly realized The Self, knows it all there is, in fact the world you see doesn't exist as you believe it does, it is merely The Self also, these sort of awakenings are what can truly blow your 'paradigm' to quote yourself. I'm sure these guys can also help me out on how effective RASA transmissions have been for them @Haumea2018 @Jkhv1 @Gneh Onebar Just say your last comment, the fact you think Rupert, Adya and Ramaji are merely 'cattarpillars' yet preach about Terrance McKenna and Jed McKenna shows me the level you're at, without being disrespectful awakening goes FAR beyond those 2, in fact I'd argue Jed (if he ever reveals himself) is still stuck in seeking himself, as it seems you are, again I'm not trying to be disrespectful but you're making out these beings are 'cattarpillars.' However, I do agree the flower and Satsang model is outdated and 1-1 teaching is far more effective. Good luck on your journey, my friend, when you find what you're after believe me it's worth it

Considering the number of people who claim to be "awake," most of whom contradict each other (exclaiming "their truth"), it should be apparent that there are many levels of "awake;" and few of which are actually Truly Awake. "Contradictions in perspective among those Seeing the profound do not occur" – Taranatha. More than 99.9% people on this planet are asleep,...95% don't even realize it's a Dream. "We have to learn to know what rhythm we're in, how to ride with it, how to shift; to sense what rhythm others are in, and how the different rhythms are complementary or discordant" - Gabrielle Roth. "What Rhythm are you in?" Jonathan Horan "Everything in the universe has a rhythm; everything dances" Maya Angelou "Where are you on the potentially endless wave of human evolution?" Ken Wilbur "To honestly inquire into our rhythmic signature, and realizing it, we acquaint ourselves with our place, and unique pathway to liberation." Gata de Aztlán There are several models to determine what level you're at,...such a Spiral Dynamics. At SD 9 (Coral), one is Truly Awake,...at SD 8 (Turquoise) one is Truth Realized,...at SD 7 (Yellow) one is Self-Actualized. "Only one in a hundred people become fully self-actualized because our society rewards motivation primarily based on esteem, [superficial] love and other social needs" Abraham Maslow Yes,...many First-tier Thinkers believe that there must be many "stages" beyond Coral,...but how can that be,...what's more awake then Awake? Many seek to "know themselves,"...and yet it is impossible to know Who you are, until you realize When you are. The crux is,...to realize When you are necessitates absolute honesty,...and Liberation from sentience. The senses can only know the past. "Those who are greatly deluded about enlightenment are sentient beings." Dōgen "The person who gathers knowledge through the six senses is categorized by the Buddha as a lunatic." Sabbe Putajjana Unmattaka. "The senses do not know, but man believes that his senses do know--and in that belief lies man's confusion" - Walter Russell Sentient Beings include all those in the lower 6 substance levels of Spiral Dynamics. Thus, SD 5 (Orange) considers themselves 'awake" compared to the Absolutist SD 4 (Blue), and SD (Green) believe they're "Woke" compared to the Individualists SD 5 (Orange) and all Others. Only at Yellow (SD 7) do entities open to learning at any time and from any source, like bees that gather nectar from many flowers. Millions and millions claim to be spiritually awake, yet I'd bet that 99.9% have no idea what the words spiritual or awake actually imply. One cannot realize Spirituality through the patriarchal paradigms of Form, nor what is Awake while dreaming. To be Literally Awake is quite easy to define,...and that definition applies to everyone. To be awake is to have a Conscious Awareness of the Absolute Present. Sentient Beings can only perceive the past. NO ONE can see, taste, touch, hear, smell, or think in the Present. "The senses do not grasp reality in any way." Socrates Dreams are the perceptions of ego while asleep in Duality. There is no dreaming without the Drego, typically occurring at night, and ego, typically occurring in the day. All dreams are about the past; extentions of patriarchal energy that can only perceive motion in one direction. Patriarchal energy is Yang, Particle, Form in denial of Yin, Wave, Empty of Form. The Feminine of Duality is not a gender of Form, but the Wave of a Particle. "The Buddha Shakyamuni often told his disciples to regard all phenomena as dreams." Gata de Aztlán "Treat everything you perceive as a dream." says the Lojong proverb to uncover Bodhicitta. In the later part of the fifth century BCE, Sakyamuni was said to be spending an evening with a family, and in the early hours of the morning, someone asked him, "'Do you dream?" Sakyamuni replied, “I used to dream; then I became Buddha (a Tathagata). The word Buddha is generally agreed to have come from the root bud meaning to be aware of, or awaken. Sakyamuni Buddha was thus an Awakened One. Buddha referred to himself as a Tathagata, one who doesn't Come and Go. "Thoughts come and go. Feelings come and go. Find out what it is that remains." Ramana Maharshi To paraphrase Adyashanti, a true Spiritual Master is one who shakes you awake, not one who tells you how to dream better. "A real Master is not a teacher: a real Master is an awakener. His function is totally different from a teacher; his function is far more difficult. And only very few people can stay with a Master because to wake up after millions of lives is not an ordinary feat; it is a miracle. And to allow somebody to wake you up needs great trust, great surrender." Osho

@V-8 Can you not see how you're just on the opposite end compared to seeing Meditation as the best thing ever, you have made it out to be terrible, and disregard the clear benefits it has on many. While I don't believe alone it is the best path to awakening, it is clear it has a great magnitude for many not just those on the path in regards to an array of issues in one's life, and especially for certain Enneagram types (such as 7s like myself) it can be extremely beneficial pre and post-awakening for helping with a range of issues. Why not like at things from a more nuanced standpoint? Yes meditation may not be the optimum path to awakening and alone is unlikely to awaken many, no this does not mean meditation is useless and is in fact extremely beneficial for many people. I don't see why we need to be dogmatic about everything lol, certain meditations suit certain people, hence the wide variety of meditations. If meditation doesn't work for you, that's cool there's plenty of other tools around, but it works for many people in different ways so I think it's a bit reductionist to state meditation is useless, especially to newbies on the path. Post-Awakening life is like a 24/7 meditation in terms of non-resistance to the now, allowing the flow of thoughts and feelings etc and I feel for you if you haven't experienced that. I do agree simple meditations such as 'witnessing' need to be made deeper, these are great introductions, but meditation goes way deeper, my personal favortie is Pure Awareness meditation or Resting in the absolute (which is also the aim of Self-Inquiry btw) when meditation is taught in Non-Duality it 'aims' to help you notice that unbreakable silence, notice The Self that encompasses all, and in my experience is a very helpful tool for daily practice for me and for many others Oh and your ridiculous claim that awakened beings don't advocate meditation here's some articles from the greatest sages and their recommendations: https://ramana-maharshi.weebly.com/meditation.html https://o-meditation.com/2010/02/16/focused-i-am-meditation-nisargadatta-maharaj/ https://non-duality.rupertspira.com/read/meditation_is_simply_to_be_ http://www.awakin.org/read/view.php?tid=960 And since you love quotes here's some from some masters of our time, even though no awakened being has ever advocated meditation of course! Rupert- “Meditation is simply to be. It is what we are, not what we do” Meditation starts with an investigative quality. In time the investigation aspect gives way in favour of a more contemplative attitude which, as the objects of contemplation are slowly relieved of their ‘objectness’ and ‘otherness,’ is revealed as a simple abidance as the Knowing Presence that we are, in which and as which all things appear. Adyashanti- True meditation has no direction or goal. It is pure wordless surrender, pure silent prayer. All methods aiming at achieving a certain state of mind are limited, impermanent, and conditioned. Fascination with states leads only to bondage and dependency. True meditation is abidance as primordial awareness. (This is why I worry about the obsession with people's Psychedelic states, THIS IS IT NOW!!!) Adya says it best, true meditation is abidance as primordial awareness, or as the Self, and post-awakening that happens 24/7, and it's amazing

. would imagine at least a High Functioning Green. I've not heard of an Awakened Being advocate meditation. (Buddha, Tilopa, Lao-Tzu, Hui Neng, Saraha, Wei Wu Wei, etc.) Meditation is however, an excellent way for teachers to find financial support,...with promises of awakening that will never arrive. ... I did however observe the psuedo Buddhist Thich Nhat Hanh, who grew a business giving Westerners what they want, and am quite sure he is a High Functioning Green. The 4 books of his that I forced myself to review showed no level of competence in regards to love, compassion, emptiness, nor any understanding of Christainity or Buddhism which he continually attempts to merge for his faith-based Western supporters. There are MANY Caterpillars teaching Caterpillars to be Butterflies today. I appreciate your honesty estimating yourself at high functioning green However if so would that qualify you to judge meditation? Awakening is in the blue section. Would this not back you a caterpillar? In the oldest texts of Buddhism, jhāna is the training of the mind, commonly translated as meditation .

@V-8 "I've not heard of an Awakened Being advocate meditation. (Buddha, Tilopa, Lao-Tzu, Hui Neng, Saraha, Wei Wu Wei, etc.)" In a literal sense of course, we've little idea what some of these spiritual teachers from the ancient world actually said, even if they did actually exist. But in the case of Buddhism, there are meditation instructions in the Pali Canon (early Buddhist scriptures) for mindfulness of breathing meditation (Anapanasati Sutta) and insight meditation (Satipatthana Sutta). And I've only read a handful of Suttas so there may be more. @LfcCharlie4 "You'll know within yourself what is the best path for you, and you should follow that guidance system, " Speaking for myself only, my spiritual journey has been winding and disjointed, several times what I thought at the time was the best path turned out to be sub-optimal although not without merit for me. Insight and intuition are very similar if not the same quality imo, and a skill which spirituality is trying to develop in us. So, it seems like that as an unskilled young newbie, I was in a catch 22 of lacking enough intuition to know the best path for me to learn intuition But over many years I've gradually got somewhere. Looks like I'm on the gradual path rather than sudden! It's ok, I've no regrets, I'd probably do it all over again from the same starting point.

Whoa! Transcendence is not in the Pyramid of Needs. The "best method" for realization is Unfeigned Surrender,...which doesn't mean let go and let god. "You abandon completely all belief; you abandon every sort of way of hanging onto life. You accept your complete impermanence; the prospect of your death of vanishing into nothing whatsoever, you see, and of not being able to control anything, of being at the mercy of what is completely other than you, and you let go of that, you see, this means that you even get rid of any God whatsoever, to do it fully. You don't have a thing left to cling to." Alan watts Or as McKenna said, ,..."Go jump off a cliff. Don’t go near the cliff and contemplate jumping off. Don’t read a book about jumping off. Don’t study the art and science of jumping off. Don’t join a support group for jumping off. Don’t write poems about jumping off. Don't cling to a parachute as you jump off. Don't let people tell you it takes 10 years of training to jump off. Don’t kiss the ass of someone else who jumped off. Just jump." I've not heard of an Awakened Being advocate meditation. (Buddha, Tilopa, Lao-Tzu, Hui Neng, Saraha, Wei Wu Wei, etc.) Meditation is however, an excellent way for teachers to find financial support,...with promises of awakening that will never arrive. In Buddhism, the Long Paths of Theravada/Hinayana and Mahayana are into meditation,...they believe that meditation will help one to get into a better place for Awakening in future lifetimes. The Short Path, Awakening in a single lifetime is about Non-Mediation. Non-Meditation begins in the Heart,...not the heart pump,...but the Heart Center, associated with the thymus,...gnowing, not knowing. Books are not very primary to my uncovering. But I'll often come upon a quote after an experience. I like using quotes,...my last book is a Collage of quotes for the Integration of the Feminine. The Feminine of duality is not a gender of Form, but the Wave of a Particle. I view Spiral Dynamics as a very help tool to identify your current level of Conscious Awareness,...AND a model that shows the extent of Human Potential. "We have to learn to know what rhythm we're in, how to ride with it, how to shift; to sense what rhythm others are in, and how the different rhythms are complementary or discordant" - Gabrielle Roth. "What Rhythm are you in?" Jonathan Horan "Everything in the universe has a rhythm; everything dances" Maya Angelou "Where are you on the potentially endless wave of human evolution?" Ken Wilbur I first read Maslow in college in the 70's. Loved it. Was blown away in the 80's when Joseph Campbell said he had one Peak experience,...knowing he was going to win a school track-n-field event. At that time I already had more than a thousand, not counting knowing where a parking spot would be. However, as I not met Campbell, nor seen any of his personal communications, wouldn't guess as to Spiral Dynamic level,...although would imagine at least a High Functioning Green. I did however observe the psuedo Buddhist Thich Nhat Hanh, who grew a business giving Westerners what they want, and am quite sure he is a High Functioning Green. The 4 books of his that I forced myself to review showed no level of competence in regards to love, compassion, emptiness, nor any understanding of Christainity or Buddhism which he continually attempts to merge for his faith-based Western supporters. There are MANY Caterpillars teaching Caterpillars to be Butterflies today.

Different tools work for different people, Psyches give great insights clearly, but plenty before have got there without them, Leo is the first real proponent of them in this current community, T McKenna obvs was back in the day, but he only reached early awakenings, and Alan Watts has the famous slogan on them. If you feel meditation, Self-Inquiry, Yoga, working with a teacher is better for you then do that. If you feel psyches are better than do that (please be careful with the substances though, so much inconsiderate use of substances) Or, if you want to utilize both do that, Leo's school is based on Psyches for better or for worse and he's got his insights and deepest awakenings from them, while many may not agree this is the best approach, it's his approach and he's going to of course teach his approach, I for one am interested to see where it takes him as I am not a Psyches user really bar several experiences, from watching so far it seems Leo has INCREDIBLY deep insights and glimpses, but it's the integration that is the challenge as it is for all of us. Meditation is an awesome foundational practice and should be practiced everyday really, especially for certain Enneagram types, but many TM meditators meditate for 50 years and don't get awakened etc, so it isn't a guarantee, many who meditate still won't have much idea what Non-Duality even is, but that doesn't mean meditation, Yoga, Self-Inquiry isn't still awesome. But, as others have said meditation becomes an effortless 24/7 practice post-awakening as The Self has come forward to the foreground of your life and the unbreakable silence has been realized, but effort is required until it is no longer needed. You'll know within yourself what is the best path for you, and you should follow that guidance system, not everyone wants the Psyches path just like not everyone wants to work 1-1 with a teacher, find what works for you and as Leo said have the motivation to follow through as this path can be extremely hard at times, especially at the beginning and it will be easy to throw in the towel, but it is certainly MORE than worth it in the long run, life becomes fucking amazing beyond words, and thinking back personally to how my moment to moment experience was is unbelievably different.

@The Awakened Vikingtnx?? You are right. The truth is that I can't help but turn into this "actor", when I see everyone around me playing it. But this is what everyone with this problem needs to hear. There is a solution, a change can happen without the need to play an illusion if you don't want to, at the same time accepting it fully even if everyone around you is unconscious of it, for the undeniably true and real permanent thing is that we are all awareness, no matter if we are unconscious of it. Awareness is primordial, what we are, our entire direct experience and visual field. It's there eternally, beyond consciousnesses and unconsciousness. The only solution, as I see it, is to dissolve the power of fear and fuckings change myself. Nothing and no one needs to change, but myself and my delusions. I'm conscious of this now. Acceptance is key. I accept now everything as it is. The only question, if not the powerful actor, what should one become and how to?

It's okay to "play" in the play of life. When you know who you are it's okay to let the action figure do as it does. You are the ultimate watcher of it all. There's no right or wrong other then what you think. Don't hold such a firm grasp on to how you should or shouldn't be acting, as someone who is awakened and aware. Be a little loose with it, see what happens.

Don't forget there's a LOT of gurus who I class as fully realized who got there through working with a teacher 1-1, I agree that talking to a huge audience isn't that effective for awakening as everyone is an individual and therefore requires individual attention for the most part, at least I did, especially if not going down Psyches route. I see books, talks etc as tools to help people and as great introductions, but real work is actually working through your shit, having awakenings integrating them and also utilizing foundational PD to improve all areas of your life imo. For the majority of people, teachers such as Rupert Spira, Francis Lucille, Ramaji, Adya are the most relatable as they actually worked with a teacher 1-1 or had to 'work' for this and didn't just have spontaneous awakenings like Ramana did (not shitting on him as Ramana is one of the greatest masters of the last 100 years) But, as you say, for those who spontaneously awakened, it's harder as they don't have a process as such or didn't go through that seeking phase, so they need to kind of empathize with seekers on what would help them most in their own situation. Hence, why I strongly advocate 1-1 work with a truly self realized being, I was stuck in a loop of Non-Dual addiction for 2 years getting barely anywhere.

@Consept most spiritual teachers who are awakened are spiritually gifted. So meditation didn't take them long at all - and some may have had spontaneous mystical experiences without doing anything. Just sitting there. So they would never look into them. But this isn't the norm for the average Joe from what we can gather.

@Consept It's not that the psychedelic will do all the work for you. It's just a way to understand reality at the highest and deepest level which would otherwise be virtually impossible. The psychedelic will motivate you to get serious about the work. You basically won't understand half the things I say until you do some psychedelics. And then the real work can begin. Most of those gurus became awakened by fluke luck, so it's not wise to count on that happening to you. You are not Sadhguru, so don't expect his results. You are you, so you must deal with the cards life has dealt you. Life has dealt most of you bad cards, so you will want every tool at your disposal to overcome that. If you insist on crawling up the mountain on your belly, go for it. But you could also just take a helicopter.

"ime" ? I'm seeing this abbreviation a lot here. Does it mean "in my enlightenment"? Also is SAE "Spiritually Awakened Experience"? (It used to mean stamped addressed envelope to me, haha)

If your cutting things out of your life because that's what you think your supposed to do/you were told to do Because enlightened people live a simple life of quiet meditation and contemplation or something along those lines and so you start cutting out the standard regular people things like movies/tech but it's like trying to quit smoking or some other kind of addiction then not only are you doing it for the wrong reasons but your 99% eventually going to fail and go back to doing them. The "awakened " people that everyone try's to model that live lives so different then the normal American person does so because naturally they lost the desire for those things and naturally they faded out of there daily life and so they dont live a life of chastisement and self-control like most assume they do instead they live a satisfying naturally Simple Life

Yeah. And many enlightened people fix these issues once they become aware of them to a sufficient degree. But they need to focus on them and be aware of them. Also, these are only publicized flaws of teachers. There are many more issues an awakened person might have besides procrastination etc. So when Shinzen cured his procrastination, that doesn't mean he turned into a perfect Buddha. That was only one big issue he faced. There still are micro issues he might be dealing with and we'll never know because they are not publicized. The point I've tried to make was that awakening doesn't equate to moral excellence or behavioral saintliness. Awakening is little bit of a double-edged sword here. It makes it easier to work on these issues if the person wants to get rid of them but it can also make them totally fine to have these issues and therefore eliminate all motivation to change those behaviors and thought patterns. That is why all awakened people have all sorts of behavioral issues. Whether big or small. Some do have much less so than others, but they still have them.

For years I've had a interest in working with Spirit guides. Of course when I started out I believed that spirits were separate beings than myself.. now I see them as nothing more than fellow dream characters. Entities outside of the personal dream self, yet one with THIS (dream). Completely self, yet separate. Just as it should be, to keep things interesting. Being dream characters does not belittle their importance, in any way. They are guides, after all. Whether they were created just for me (dream self character) , or I'm merely a drop their cosmic bucket, it does not matter. THIS dream is filled and populated to the brim. The character stands in relation to all else. If a dream character can come to me in the form of a spirit guide and enrich my life in any possible way, I would gladly welcome it. I have a little practice connecting with Spirit guides from dabbling with it for a few years. I took a long break and I'm now connecting with that again. But it's nice because I'm coming back with it with fresh eyes, because before I really did not understand what Spirit guides were. (and am willing to admit that I possibly still don't) As far as names go, I believe names are just for fun with Spirit guides. The essential connection with a spirit is by their energy /vibration /aura /etc, rather than by what they are called. You can't name the nameless. But since I am not attuned with feeling various energies, it's helpful to appoint a name to the spirit guide so that you can invoke their presence in the future. Whether I pick the name, or they pick the name, or if it really even matters at all , I don't know. We're ALL and ONE continuum. So while hiking this morning, and after a small bit of strong Marijuana, I connected with a guide named Josh. I said okay, let me touch your energy so that I can emulate it. Not wanting to be a leech and to have practice connecting energies. We began thinking about gods in terms of the dream. There was the usual bibble babble: the gods are one... the gods are many... Humans would appear as gods to a newly awakened animal... I got lost in a stream of thought, which ended upon 'the gods are superfluous.' (actually at this point I'm not sure if talking about the gods, or THIS God, but) I'm like okay Josh, I'm not that smart, slow down. So I pulled out my phone and looked up the definition. su·per·flu·ous /so͞oˈpərflo͞oəs/ adjective unnecessary, especially through being more than enough. Just thought that was a funny description lol. But the truth is I didn't exactly hear 'superfluous' because that word turns out to not even be pronounced the way it came to me in my mind, and the word sounded longer. Also the impression I got while receiving the word was of how 'the gods' are fluid. hence I was pronouncing superfluous as 'super-floo-us' until my husband corrected me later. So I went back to Google and let the word prediction help me out. I found superfluidity, which more matches the word I heard, and also has an interesting description in relation to THIS : su·per·flu·id·i·ty /ˌso͞opərˌflo͞oˈidədē/ noun the property of flowing without friction or viscosity And another description further down : When stirred, a superfluid forms vortices that continue to rotate indefinitely. Hopefully I can connect with Josh again... That was fun ?

@Nak Khid Hi! Yes. I'm aware of the allegations. I've talked to Culadasa about it. Let me address that. He definitely made a mistake and is ready to purify that shadow aspect of himself. He is also open to working with a therapist if the need arises. He also said that he is doing shamanic breathing practices to work on deep emotional work. This is basically Shinzen's procrastination issue all over again in a different context. The person is awake spiritually but there are still subtler and subtler layers of craving and suffering that results in immoral action. All of us have these issue including myself. I still watch porn and play video games. But these actions become bad, wrong and immoral from the moral excellence paradigm. There is actually no such thing as wrong actions. That is why mindfulness when you are awake sometimes allows for these sorts of 'cracks' in the armor. Morality is a human construct and is relative. These sort of 'negative' behaviours constitute your uniqueness in this infinite-ness of consciousness. And what is interesting is that even if suffering is fully eliminated, these 'immoral' actions can still occur automatically just due to sheer habit force in times when the mindfulness is less powerful. This is also similar to Joshua Sasaki Roshi's sexual allegations with students. The person is deeply awake but gaps in contextual understanding, lack of emotional work, childhood traumas, powerful negative habits all create these cracks in the mindfulness and results in less than moral actions. Behaviors are very important. But one's depth of spiritual realization is not a direct cause of their quality of behaviors due to the existence of egoic habit forces, emotional trauma and shadow aspects. So the teachings do work. Culadasa is deeply awake. But just like everyone he has behavioral issues, a shadow aspect and hasn't embodied a Buddha-like ideal of moral excellence. Such a thing actually doesn't exist. These are different lines of development and should not be confused with the validity of actual spiritual insight or methods. Look at Peter Ralston, Leo, Shinzen, Culadasa, Martin Ball...etc. they all have behavioral issues to a degree and are not morally excellent. You can easily cherry-pick all sorts of behavioral issues by observing them if your standards are moral excellence. For instance, Peter Ralston has a masculine and arrogant personality style. This can be seen as a lack of embodiment and a strong habit force when it comes to morality, personality and love aspects of consciousness. But it also can be a personal choice. Culadasa's style is much more loving and less-arrogant but his cracks in mindfulness are in different areas. This is one of them. Shinzen's style is precise but his mindfulness has cracks in procrastination (which is a behavioral problem) which is a deep unconscious habit force. Martin ball and Leo have insight mastery to varying degrees but are working on both embodiment and behavioral change. And so do everyone else including Eckhart Tolle, Sahdguru etc. All awakened people are in a continuum that has different behavioral strengths and weaknesses. And also all awakened people are conscious of specific spiritual insights and have embodied them to varying degrees. So there is no such thing as a binary awakening. Awakening is a process of spiritual growth. Especially when it comes to behavioral change. Hope this clarified the issue

The problem here is with the overly-simplistic and binary notion of "an enlightened being". There is no such thing. There are many degrees of awakening and many different states of consciousness and many different modes of being. Most so-called awakened people still have plenty of impurities and their state of consciousness is not as high as it could be.

Remember wrote: " this is because you quote a lot instead of experiencing what divinity actually is - as if you knew. theism and divine are not the same, one is an -ism. (and isms are mostly red or blue even buddhism if it is an -ism) also you contradict yourself a lot. (headache program, sorry to say - if you expected an answer hope this is satisfactory enough) " Yes,...Green's (SD 6) believe they are at the top of knowledge, and in a way they are, because at Yellow (SD ) begins a shift to gnowledge. Thanks for your response,...it says you are not Yellow (SD 7) "open to learning at any time and from any source, like bees that gather nectar from many flowers," and surely not higher, as per your beliefs about things divine have been rejected by Buddha, Lao-tzu, Tilopa, Guan Yin, and every known Awakened Being. "Contradictions in perspective among those Seeing the profound do not occur" – Taranatha. And yes,...was so thrilled to come across this Discussuon Forum ( even perhaps having an opportunity to commune with some Kindred Spirits). Considering Kindred Spirits that may come upon this Turquoise (SD 8) thread, instead of commenting on your post,...I'll finish with a few points on things divine, and their place in the One Space-Time; even though my above post on Turquoise (SD 8) was rather complete. Brahma, God, Creator, Allah, all things Divine,... ARE NOT,...nor synonymous with The Tao, Tathagata or Source. The Tao or Tathagata or Source is like a Fulcrum,...they do not Come and Go (Zer0). The Lever is One (Brahma, God, Creator, Allah, all things Divine). Duality effects its motion (Yang-Yin energy) from the Lever. There is no One Lever without Duality, no Center without Boundary, no Here without a There. As quoted before,..."Sensing is but an electric tension set up by the seeming division of one into many which "strain" to fulfill their desire for Oneness" - Walter Russell. However, even ACIM agrees, it will never be found because it's not Real. Oneness and Duality are part of the same illusory loop. Years ago,...likely before Remember was incarnated,...I quested for God,...even attended Religious Studies through the Masters level at two universities and a college. When it could not be found, decided to seek this elusive idea in the Present, which meant I had to let go of all beliefs, even the quest for a God. The Present was uncovered,...and just as Buddha, Lao-tzu, Tilopa, Guan Yin, and every known Turquoise Being had realized,...there is no God or divine thing there. "You abandon completely all belief; you abandon every sort of way of hanging onto life. You accept your complete impermanence; the prospect of your death of vanishing into nothing whatsoever, you see, and of not being able to control anything, of being at the mercy of what is completely other than you, and you let go of that, you see, this means that you even get rid of any God whatsoever, to do it fully. You don't have a thing left to cling to." Alan Watts. To Remember,...this is likely not your incarnation for Truth Realization,...however, an Eastern quote comes to mind that could be helpful in your predicament,...perhaps even posting it on your refrigerator: “Start knowing what you really know, and stop believing what you really don’t know. Somebody asks you. “Is there a God?” and you say, “Yes, God is.” Remember: Do you really know? If you don’t know, please don’t say that you do. Say, “I don’t know.”. . . False knowing is the enemy of true knowledge. All beliefs are false knowledge." And re-member: "In pursuit of knowledge, every day something is acquired. In pursuit of wisdom, every day something is dropped." - Lao Tzu "The real seeker of truth never seeks truth. On the contrary, she tries to clean herself of all that is untrue, inauthentic, insincere." Chandra Mohan Jain "We need to draw our attention to what is false in us, for unless we learn to recognize the false as the false, there can be no lasting transformation, and you will always be drawn back into illusion, for that is how the false perpetuates itself" Eckhart Tolle “Positive thinking does not bring you consistent peace. Positive and negative are attributes of duality. Positive means there's an opposite that you're trying to avoid. Negative means there's an opposite you're trying to attain. This keeps you in a constant state of avoiding, or attaining." Osho

Are you alone when you became enlightened? Have you met people who have shown signs that they might awaken or are awakening or have already awakened?

The human mind is conditioned to think there is something to find, something to attain, someplace to arrive. Realizing the opposite of that is a facet of awakening. There is nothing to find or attain. There is no place to arrive. That is a major realization. . . Yet then the mind will create a new duality and grasp the other side - it will get attached to the belief there is nothing to find, attain or arrive. We can let go of that as well. . . Then there is nothing, something and everything. The realization of Nothing/Everything is a major facet of awakening. To me, it sounds like you have enough conceptual understanding. The concepts can only take a person so far, because any concept (and its opposite) is Nothing/Everything. For the mind to hold a thought / imagine - there must be separation. That thought / image is not another thought / image. This is why direct experience is key. This awakening allows for liberation. This awareness seeks nothing. This awareness is beholden to nothing. This awareness is attached/identified to nothing. It is absolute freedom. Because you are creating things called "me", "you" and an "it" to get. That is relatively true. You've got the separation part down, no need to work anymore on that. Absolute Unity hasn't been revealed yet in direct experience. Thoughts / images are appearances, yet they are very tricky appearances. They are alluring and mesmerizing. Yet they are appearances in Now similar to dog barks appearing Now. For me, a key is not to trap my mind into thinking I need to choose between two opposites. Thoughts / images have no more relevance than any other appearances Now. Yet they also have more relevance than other happenings. A deep insight into the nature of reality has no more relevance than a bumble bee in flight and it also has more relevance than a bumble bee in flight. Awareness of Nothing/Everything has no attachment to either. It is free! The figuring can be helpful to form a framework of support. For example, imagine someone has direct experience of Nothing/Everything. Afterwards, they are like "whoa, what just happened?". Without any conceptual support, it is easy for the person to dismiss it as "woo woo, airy fairy stuff". With a conceptual framework its more like "whoooaaa, so that's what those awakened ones were talking about all those years. . . ". In terms of my personal story, there was a time I felt like there was something deeper I wasn't getting. At times, there would be a still small voice of "your not listening". And I'm like "I'm trying to listen. I'm meditating. I'm participating in a Sangha. I'm journaling. I'm doing Yoga. wtf else am I suppose to do to 'listen'". It got really frustrating. . . I was really curious what this "it" is. I didn't care if it would benefit me or not. It was like something in a safe and I wanted to figure out the lock combination to see what's in the safe. . . What resonated with me was psychedelics. I tried them a few times solo and they revealed so much. Then I went to an Ayahuasca retreat in Peru. At the personal level, each person is different and and have unique pre-dispositions, abilities and resonance. Personally, I sucked at meditation and "just being". I was so analytical and thinking dominated, that I missed all the tiny gaps and glimpses. Others resonate much better with meditation and just being. I've walked in nature with newbies and they are pretty good at getting in tune with Now. It's just how they are. Regarding it being so obvious. . . One thing I remind myself is that "it's paranormal until it's not paranormal". What seems obvious now was mind-blowing during the realization. "what just happened??!!". Yet once it sinks in, it seems pretty obvious. It's remembering something I already knew. @silene After having nondual experience, it's very common to feel like there is a "flipping" between nondual and dual realities. That is a relative human perception / experience. I often feel that way. It's beautiful and can feel amazing and fun. I can even start to influence it - drifting off into a nondual reality. This can also be transcended such that nondual = dual and imagined = real.

Clearly Ralston just hasn't awakened the hart like 100s of other Non-Duality teachers, as Leo says there are manyfacets to awakening and not every teacher is finished, Ralston is one who is definitely not 'finished' so to speak, not shitting on him as his students clearly benefit from him, but just because someone is a teacher doesn't mean they are fully awakened. This is why I constantly recommend truly Self Realized beings to read and watch to understand what full self realization looks like. Eastern Examples- Ramana Maharshi, Nisgardatta Maharaj Western Examples- Rupert Spira, Adyashanti (more recent stuff), Ramaji and Francis Lucille Of course there's many more more but these are just examples of the top of my head. When you open yourself to love, your whole view on the 'world' changes yet again!

@Leo Gura By nature, I am also hyper obsessive and focused. And also have a bit of Aspergers (it has its pros and cons). I have had my hard edges. When I was young (and Christian), I used to pray that God would give me a heart because I felt I lacked the kind of ability to love like "normal" people. The upside is enormous internal strength but felt like I was an empty shell. I suffered very much during my dark night but others wouldnt know it because Im the type that keeps pushing forward no matter what. Deep depression was constantly with me my whole life up until my awakening. I can almost guarantee that Ralston suffered through his awakening. The advantage I have over Ralston is that I did DMT 3.5 years ago and realized that love is the most important thing and that beauty is all around us if we just look. Love and beauty are inextricably connected. Love and beauty have become my focus for what I need to master in this incarnation and I plan on taking it to the peak of my potential. If one is awakened but they dont understand eternal evolution, love or beauty, than the only thing left to do is wait to die. If that is Ralston's state, I dont envy him. At minimum, how I invest myself in my life will be very different.

@mindcentral Ken Wilber co-wrote a book Transformations of Consciousness where they studies people across the world, from different traditions, that were considered enlightened by spiritual adepts that know them. What he found is that the experience of enlightenment is NOT the same for everyone. It can be very different depending on the beliefs and assumptions of that tradition. Ralston's experience of awakening is going to be different than another awakened person that understands Absolute Love. Ralston's kind of awakening, along with much of Zen, can be very dry and "grey" with no connection with love, beauty, gratitude, etc, etc. Remember that the fact that many enlightened people disagree on a variety of subjects just proves that enlightenment doesnt mean they still dont hold delusional beliefs. Enlightenment is a process that continues to be refined after the initial awakening, not a destination.

Ok so, should the dreamers and awakened be in relationships? Such as marriage.