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Get a glimpse of nonduality, suddenly we think we are enlightened, or think we know the truth, but in reality we dont, we just have egoic impressions of it, ultimately no one really knows, they only know the path, they may use perceptual concepts of allness, or nothingness, but ultimately if you "experience nonduality" you are lying to yourself in my opinion. the buddha also mentioned that all these are still perceptual realities from our egos, no matter how mystical or "nonexistent" your experience may be, until your actual system is cleared of its fear mechanisms which build the ego, and the concepts that comfort or should i say numb your issues which you are not reflecting, until your system is cleared of mechanisms which make your experience dual, you arent in enlightenment at all, you just got an energetic opening/glimpse. . look at any dude here who uses realizations as egoic masturbation, anyone who dealt with self esteem issues and such can see through the wowness and power trip of these types of experiences and this can be subtle perceptions in the subconcious aswell. because the people who grew out of it they know it ultimately stems from insecurities not yet dealt with, just being real. but as you go through more of life, you get triggered of your issues, and you grow, you shed, and you let go, and each egoic paradigm thats broken down, more and more depth of reality is realized, because you're going through a process of reflection and understanding, being more and more inclusive (love, word can have baggage though) and open to reality, yet also unclinged and indifferent, not numbed. my point being, forget about nondual experiences, use the experiences as guides for your path, but even that attachment to those guides will be dropped too at a certain point. Leo is fully right when he says that this is a process, no doubt about it.

@OrpheusNovum You are REALLY lost in concepts. Everything you said above is a conceptual fantasy that your mind constructed. Time, space, physics, objectivity, depression, body, mind, inner, outer, other people, nihilism, solipsism, Aristotle, Nietzsche, ancient Greece -- are all mental fabrications. If you think Actualized.org is "nihilistic" or "solipsistic" you are really not understanding nonduality, spirituality, or consciousness yet. Neither focusing on the mind or the body is the real solution. What is necessary is to self-reflect and become more conscious. Consciousness is neither inner nor outer, neither mind or body. What you call "the body" is really just another aspect of your mind. And the entire domain of mind is unreal anyways. More practically-speaking, if you're new to this work (and it's obvious you are given what you wrote), nothing I say is against the body per se. If you are stuck in depression and you want to use a body-based approach for breaking out, like Hatha yoga, gym, cleaning up your diet, going out to nightclubs with your friends, starting a business, going mountain-climbing, etc. -- that can be a useful approach. But in the end it will not be a root solution to depression because depression is deeply rooted in your metaphysical disconnection from consciousness & being. No amount of body work will solve that. No amount of success will solve that. For that, you must deeply investigate the inner workings of your own mind and your entire identity. The deepest work you can do it is done in solitude sitting on a cushion. But this is advanced work. Most people are not yet ready to do that. They need a lot of external actions first. And that's okay. I have nothing against taking external action. I spent many years taking external actions. But nowadays I'm at the point in my own development where I mostly care about internal actions. Pretty much all of your external actions are driven by ego, and this is the root problem. You are not going to solve that problem through more external action. But this is not to say external actions are somehow bad. In practice most people need to take a lot of external action when getting started with personal development. Not only is objectivity not necessary, it is impossible! There is no such thing! You made it up.

It's easy to dismiss drugs like psychedelics as fake hallucinatory experiences but the problem is your default state of being is no different. It's just most of life is configured in such a way where they have similarity in hallucinations to some degree. All experiences are legitimate and authentic. To determine what is and isn't useful for digging to see a more holistic outlook of reality requires contemplation and integration. Ego death taught me separation is a mental construction. But I didn't realize this until I found the concept of nonduality contemplated it and saw the link.

Can be . If you are still dreaming , believing in nonduality .

General mind's visualitazion for 'I' should be that the duality is kinda gates for nonduality. See: https://www.actualized.org/articles/reality-is-a-strange-loop If it's done... then 'I' / You can realize that the 'I' / mind will never be more clever than it can be by exploiting duality only. Then spiritual work is required for further progress. That's why religions exist.

The realization of nonduality is an extremely radical shift. Really, your old life is gone. You are dead at this point, so the question of "function" (survival) is moot. There is nothing left to survive. The game of life is over. You have awoken from survival. Consider, the only reason you worry about survival issues is because you hold the belief that you are alive. What would happen if that belief was surrendered? What would happen if you surrendered all control over your life such that there was zero effort or struggle? What would happen if you became God? Would worry about anything? Nonduality is not a paradigm. It is Absolute.

Thank you for the feedback. From reading your posts lately, You also seem to be deepening in your understanding and you have a good use of putting matters of the mind and nonduality into your own language.

Everybody means well,,, Judgement divides. Forgiveness unites. My metaphor for forgiveness- A nondual reset button. We exist in nonduality anyhow. It just has to be realized.

@Ampresus That's nonduality. Now the trick is taming that Ox. Your body? What is a body? Does it really exist? Or is it a conceptual construction? Inquire deeper into what this "body" really is. There is no difference between "your body" and a coffee table.

@ivankiss Yes I can only imagine, the only extended periods of bliss, presence, and some degree of nonduality is when tripping. Definitely see how living life from that state can be one of the most powerful things there is.

but god is not a thing conciousness is not a thing the self is not a thing reality is not a thing. thinking we are the controller of the forces within us, we still think we are the thing. but we still beg that thing to change, we still succumb to it because god in us is not selfrealized yet, as there is no nonduality yet. in a situation like @Highest is at the moment he might be really feeling like the highest - but that also means all that’s written here is only him talking to himself. and this self asks him: what kind of god are you little ego?

because this is not enlightenment - it is not real nonduality - this is the ego thinking in a wet dream of power encapsulated in itself entirely. the ego thinks it is god in its solipsistic life vision, because if it pushes a button the light will go on. that it has willpower in the appropriation of itself as a fetish making a cult of its body and mind. it is the pure devil speaking, there is no nothing in it. the answer is they don’t talk about it: because it is not the truth in that sense! there is truth in it though.

A big picture overview of the different types of yoga, spiritual practice/traditions, etc. Such as: Shamanism Occult Sciences Paranormal Sadhanas Mantra Yoga Contemplative Christianity Spiritual Purification Practices Other spiritual uses of psychedelics beyond Truth realization Occult/Paranormal Facets of Buddhism Daoist/Taoist Practices Shugendo Native American Nonduality Central/South American Nonduality

Another point I’d like to add after watching Mu’s video; If a direct experience becomes “this is obvious”, my mind is vulnerable to assume that “that’s all there is”, even if I just caught a glimpse and scratched the surface. Gor example, one good look at nonduality and my mind may think I’m suddenly an expert on nonduality ? ?

I like the genuine, chill exploratory vibe of your videos. A few thoughts that arose in my mind: 1. When an "insight" arises, my mind has a tendency to adopt the new opposing view. For example, after my first few glimpses of nonduality, duality became "wrong" and nonduality became "right". After direct experience with no-self, the self became "wrong" and no-self became "right". After attaching to a new opposing view, it often takes my mind a while to open up again and think "Wait a minute, could both nonduality and duality exist"? 2. I like how you talked about how new observations and interconnectedness can arise in a mind without attachments and identification. For example, seeing how scientists and buddhists have similar seeking energy toward the truth or flow states in basketball players. I use flow states to let students know they already have direct experience with nonduality. Every student has experienced flow during sports, playing a music or artwork. For some students it's a major revelation. Is well, I think being struck by awe by the beauty of nature is a glimpse. Or, moments of deeply connected love in which one loses sense of their self and time. 3. I liked how you talked about what is true being fluid. I remember reading and discussing the heart sutra in buddhist groups and feeling comfortable I had an understanding of it. After direct experience with Mu, I tried to explain it to someone and she recommended I read the heart sutra. I initially brushed it off thinking "yea, yea. I already know the heart sutra. This is different". Yet, when I read it again I had very different meaning. I was like "yea, they got it. They know." It was super cool to feel that connection with beings that lived over a thousand years ago.

From a relative perspective, there is correct and incorrect. This is the perspective the mind is conditioned for. This is the perspective the mind becomes attached to and identified with. The process is not to destroy relative perspectives and adopt new beliefs that relative perspectives don't exist. The process is to dissolve the attachment and identification to relative perspectives. When a mind gets glimpses of absolute, it's tendency is to contextualize it in relativity - that is what the mind is conditioned to do. Or, the mind may try to embrace the absolute is true and reject the relative. In my journey, I embraced the absolute and sought to further experience nonduality. I began talking in nondual terms and challenging everyone speaking in relative terms. This was quite awkward and annoying to people. So, I isolated myself in my free time. Mediation, yoga and spending time in nature. This helped to embody the essence of presence/stillness/emptiness and gave contrast to relativity. As well, psychedelics helped because they created nondual realities and revealed lessons about distinctions. Eventually nondual be-ingness with and without psychedelics became as real as the conventional relative world. One of Leo's videos (I think the 10 Ox one), revealed the next stage in which the absolute and the relative become a unified whole. Absolute is Relative. Relative is Absolute.

Thank you. Ya sometimes the energy of the speaker communicates more then their words, and sometimes the words create logical energy bridges to the source of what they are pointing to. I literally spent a year watching videos on Nonduality from Adyishanti, Paul Hedderman, Lisa Cairns, Rupert Spira, Da Free John, Papaji, and 95% of the time I couldn't follow any of their words, but the energy of what they shared opened up and disintegrated more then I knew was possible. So again thank you for the comment, makes it worthwhile.

Im more saying that it's more then just experience, its more then just the answer to the question you posed, its more then any human view on it, its also all those, its the answer, the question and the answering/questioning process. So when I say all "awakening to nonduality and everything in between experience" is in a way a metaphor that is pointing to an actual, I'm saying just that and simultaneous its more then that and Is that.

Lose the " I " who seeks or searches or asks questions... Just watch it... Watch it until it disappears. Nonduality . . . the myth Apparently . . . Although there is no such thing as nonduality it seems that there are many different ideas about what it could be. Because the separate seeker experiences everything as a subject object reality it is inevitable that it will see nonduality as a something that can be personally attained and experienced. It will also be seen as a state of no-self that can be taught or energetically transferred. Attempts are made to use the idea of nonduality as a description of the unknown? It is often talked about as a something that needs to be integrated, nurtured and supported? There are even conferences held about its evolutionary development and its possible outcome in another something called the future? It is amazing how many different beliefs and theories can arise about nothing. The term nonduality is just that. It is a term similar to Advaita, and refers to the concept of “not two”. The idea of there being “not two” is attempting to define a mystery. The mystery cannot be named or known, of course, but there are certain descriptions which get somewhere near: the formless form, the relative absolute, the empty fullness or what is and is not, which all defy definition and make no sense. All of these ideas are immediately rejected by the separate seeker who is entirely invested in its own survival and seeks an answer that will satisfy its own experience of reality. Empty fullness cannot be taught or experienced, for how and where would it be found if it is already all there is? Where would there be a place to stand and know or be aware of nothing and everything? However, isn’t it wonderful that the dualistic confusion which surrounds something called nonduality is already empty fullness. -- Tony Parsons; February 2018

Hey, I just want to know whether or not it is possible to have an awakening experience of nothingness or no-self without a serious spiritual practice or psychedelics. I can't have practice because of some environmental reasons (which I'm actively working on to fix) I can't get my hands on psychedelics either. For this, I have to travel, which I can't afford yet (I'm also actively working on to fix this) I know that fastest way to have a glimpse is psychedelics, but given the condition I find myself in, I'll have to wait for a couple of years (or maybe less) to be able to get them. So, that leaves me with a very limited list of options I guess. As far as I understand, the best way for me is 10-day solo meditation retreat. Can you tell me what can I do other than that? The reason why I am asking all of this is that I was planning my life couple of years ago such that I thought I would be able to experience my true nature at least once, in 2-3 years. Then something unexpected happened and I've found myself not capable of even doing a meditation. I just kept reading books and filling myself with all the theory. Now I'm working on the aspects of my life which will enable me to get back on track and pursue the Truth more actively. But that will probably require some time, at least a year or more. I just can't wait anymore. Sometimes all I can think of is these stuff, all the ways that my egoic behavior damages me, and all the unconsciousness that goes into my life... I need to see what is this about, see how deluded I am. I want to know how it feels to look at the world and don't make a distinction of me vs not-me, even for a couple of seconds. I even thought of learning Lucid Dreaming in order to have a glimpse of nonduality at least in my dream Is that possible? So, what can I do?

@Emanyalpsid seeing as there is no possible way to "think about" enlightenment...I feel I am forced to heavily rely on and trust my spiritual experiences and directions from the higher self. I also have to heavily trust in the spiritual practises, that they'll work. What other spiritual practises would cause you to merge with realty? Anyone god ever tells me to listen to holds to nonduality...

I've spent many hours observing biological cells through a microscope and I have barely scratched the surface. I continually return with new curiosities, questions and ideas. I can look at dividing neuroblasts over and over and observe new things each time. My awareness and understanding expands each time. I never know what the microscope will reveal to me. Many times, new pieces of the puzzle are revealed and I return to learn more about how to integrate observations and connect dots. A suggestion that a cellular biologist looks through a microscope a few times and then moves on without return is inaccurate. When I gaze through the microscope, I observe intensely - sometimes hours straight. It takes experience, wisdom and intuition to know when the message has been revealed to you. At that point, only a fool would sit with their eye permanently glued to the microscope. The wise biologist goes away and works on what he has observed. What is this "work"? The work is contextualizing the observations and integrating the new observations with previous observations to form a more holistic model. As well, the data may open new avenues of research or suggest a change of direction. Then, the biologist returns to the microscope to perform the cycle again. Over and over and over. Hundreds or thousands of times. Over time, there is more expansion and more clarity toward a deeper and more holistic understanding. My experience with psychedelics is similar. When an insight is revealed during a trip, I don't stay permanently tripping on that insight. I go away and get to work. What is this work? The work is contextualizing the observations and integrating the new observations with previous observations to form a more holistic perspective. This contextualization and integration process involves hours of meditation, contemplation, yoga etc. As well, the trip may open new avenues of exploration or suggest a change in direction. Then, the explorer returns to trip to perform the cycle again. Over and over. Experimenting with different psychedelics, doses and settings. Each time, there is a bit more expansion and a bit more clarity toward a deeper and more holistic understanding. I often see a misconception on the forum that psychedelics are a stand-alone tool for a spiritual seeker. That is like saying a carpenter only uses a screwdriver. It's complete nonsense. Just as a carpenter uses a variety of tools to master his craft, psychedelics are ONE tool that is combined with several other tools such as meditation, yoga, self inquiry, listening to nonduality speakers, reading spiritual literature etc. Together, this can lead to mastery.

@ivankiss Says you, because, nonduality.

This entire conversation is devolving into masturbation and confusion. There is no difference between enlightenment in Buddhism and Hinduism or any other major religion. @Emanyalpsid Stop spreading misinformation. Stop talking about nonduality on this forum and do the work.

The Void. Infinity. Since reading Leo's blog post on Aztec nonduality, I like Teotl.