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I find this National Post article interesting, thought I’d share. It seems our friend JP has been in a bad condition. https://www.google.ca/amp/s/nationalpost.com/news/jordan-petersons-year-of-absolute-hell-professor-forced-to-retreat-from-public-life-because-of-tranquilizer-addiction/amp His family flew him to Russia for his treatment because they claim North American hospitals misdiagnosed him and pharmaceutical companies have less influence in Russia (claiming corruption in NA). Here are some cool excerpts: “His conditioned worsened through the winter, Mikhaila said. He was driven to thoughts of suicide by a movement disorder called akathisia, a well known side effect of various drugs for mental illnesses. It is a sense of restlessness and an inability to sit still.” “She [his daughter] said Russian doctors are not influenced by pharmaceutical companies to treat the side-effects of one drug with more drugs, and that they ‘have the guts to medically detox someone from benzodiazepines.’” Maybe his autoimmune disorders have to do with his philosophy and how he holds his body? (This is probably not true, now that I think about it) Maybe JP will realize that “the left” that he criticizes is not so bad. Maybe this will change his view on competition, “freebies”, western culture and free market economy too. I always thought JP was in deep suffering. I think it was and is evident by his health, emotions and his face. His way of thinking hasn’t served him. It’s too rigid and uptight. Feel free to express what you think about this and share any information you have on him that’s relevant. Hope he gets well?

Yes. Bernie is not a democrat, he is officially an independent. This will play very well in a general election. There is an enormous number of people that are sick and tired of both political parties. The biggest swing group, by far, is non-voter to voter. . . Bernie's independent status will be a huge asset. Bernie doesn't want help from corporate dems. They are part of the problem. Criticism from corporate Dems helps Bernie get stronger. It fuels the grassroots movement. People are sick of corporate corruption, including corporate dems. Bernie supporters can't stand corporate corruption and the Clintons. Bernie is the only candidate that cannot be labeled as corrupt. The best the repubs can do is label him a "socialist" and they have a big surprise coming when people realize what democratic socialism looks like. This will play very well in a general election. Consider that in Canada, even the most conservative politicians are fully behind M4A. Speaking out against M4A would be political suicide, even for a conservative. That's how popular this "socialist" health care is. Progressive dems will be fully behind Bernie with their heart and soul. Not hunger for power and money at any cost - like Repubs and corporate dems.

For reference: to Peterson, evil is not just selfishness that stems from finitude. The tension within the human condition is brought upon because of polarity between finite and infinite s/he experiences. This is the cause of suffering in life and it has no obvious payoff. He sees two ways to address this problem other than suicide - one is by embracing meaning through conquering fear and the other is nihilism. Peterson thinks that when people choose nihilism, they basically rot with resentment and evil is the outward expression of that. It is the deliberate destruction of happiness of other people. Relatively speaking, in terms of human psychology, I think that he is right. Contrary to popular opinion here, I think that he actually does understand postmodernism, but he falls into believing that it is somehow universally evil. It is only evil in his own definition of evil, as it guides people into destroying meaning while giving no alternative. To him, this makes nihilism the only way of addressing suffering and since as a psychiatrist he's been treating people for that - it's no wonder that he hates postmodernists. I think that despite his multi-perspectival (yellow) thinking, he does not appreciate the importance of stages of development. I believe that he is spiral-aware as he brought up Piaget on multiple occasions, but he fails to see that postmodernism is needed at later stages of development. Given how much effort he's put into battling it, I don't think that it's likely that he will ever embrace it. I remember hearing this quote and I'm not sure, but I think that it comes from this video: In terms of human psychology, exploring the "humans infinite capacity for evil" is nothing else than shadow work. It was always clear to me that Peterson is not against enlightenment - on the contrary - he advocates FOR life that guides towards it. The tension point between Leo and Peterson's teaching is the goal they are aiming for. Leo does not respect the relative domain and goes full god-mode, masculine style.

Thank you, Nahm. So far my search for happiness fails. This last being gay issue was the hardest one. I don't plan to commit suicide, but all my passion for life disappeared.

I didn't say to demonize religion. Of course there is a lot of wisdom in everything, including religion. That is the whole point. Seeing that there is wisdom in everything is non-ideological. If someone was pushing an agenda of anti-religious / atheist dogmatic ideology - that also would not be tolerated on the forum. As well, the phrase "and everyone shall find what they're looking for." is consistent with the theme of a non-dogmatic forum. If someone said "Religion resonates with me, personally. I'm looking to deepen and expand my religious understanding. Can someone give me some suggestions?". That orientation is totally fine. Perhaps they would get suggestions about ACIM, Neal Donald Walsch, the sermon on the mount etc. This is fine. It is not the problematic orientation. A clear dogmatic orientation would be something like a person coming to the forum and calling LGBTQ members sinners that will burn in hell and push dogmatic religious conversion therapy on them. That orientation would be inappropriate on the forum. This is welcomed on the forum. No one gets warnings or banned for sharing wisdom or seeking their personal development. You may be referring to grey areas. Consider degree. For example, there was a previous user that kept posting horrific graphic images of human torture, suffering and death. And his writings were equally gruesome. He framed it as "freedom through death" as a way to fly under the radar. Should we say that all perspectives have value and should we allow the graphic imagery and writings that promote human torture, death and suicide? Would moderating this behavior be "wanting the person to behave a certain way and not some other"? I think most people on the forum would want some standard of behavior. This is a nuanced issue. There are extremes and grey areas. Intention and impact can be straight-forward or difficult to determine. As you say, some cases are hard to tell intent, others not so much. The user posting horrific graphic torture images wrote that he wanted to promote nonduality through the acceptance of human torture and to promote ultimate freedom through physical death and suicide. I think most people would agree this is clear intent. . . . Yet as you say, there are cases in which it is not easy to determine intent and cases in which intent cannot be determined. . . However, there are times that impact supersedes intent. What if the above user said his intent was good and that he was posting horrific images of human torture and death to help people? In this case, impact supersedes whatever intent he claims and he won't be allowed to post it. The current spiritual atmosphere we enjoy on the forum isn't the natural default state of online forums . If this forum wasn't moderated it would devolve into a mess of namecalling, trolling, scammers, spammers etc. A lot of people would get sick of it and leave the forum to find another spiritual community. . . The moderators here put in a lot of work to allow for an atmosphere conducive to personal development and spiritual growth. It's easy to say that every comment has value and everyone should be allowed to express whatever they want when the forum is moderated. It's very different in an un-moderated forum filled with trolls, scammers, ideological dogma and people threatening each other. Check out unmoderated anything goes forums - nasty stuff. It's not a black or white issue. It is a nuanced spectrum of degrees. There are grey areas. The extreme stuff is easy to moderate. It is the grey area stuff which is hard to moderate.

The problems women have with men are almost the same problems men have with women. Here's an example: https://www.google.com/amp/s/nypost.com/2016/09/13/man-finds-out-missing-wife-is-alive-in-the-worst-way-possible/amp/ @Keyhole Yeah all women seem to consistently interpret the message that way. But all men interpret it a completely different way. Including the one that wrote it. This is just a very obvious example of female vs male bias. It's completely and very clearly off the mark that theres no doubt there is bias lurking in the brains of the ones interpreting it. Men interpret it more as: Feminism is a solution, not just for women, but for men too. There is a cultural expectation that men must be horny and love sex, more so then a 'safe harbour' or oxytocin, and this causes men to repress their deep need for love, which manifests into neurological and mental disorders. Men don't cry, men don't need love and support, because those things are 'girly' and ooo I don't want to date a girly man, I want a real man, a tough man(Orange stage girls are like this have no idea what you're like). If women(and men) stopped thinking of men as just people who want sex(in other words, we took a more feminist approach), maybe they would be given the space to fully realize their need for love and intimacy, rather than sex. Guys have a lot of stuff suppressed in them because of culture. They have a lot of expectations to do with what a real man is. The patriarchy is affecting men just as much as women, and mental health, suicide and physical assult stats(where all are dominated by men) is clear evidence for it. What if I told you that men are only more violent because of the patriarchy? Sounds far fetched? Let me remind you that gender is a social construct, and even if you still think it's in our DNA, bonobos are very peaceful. Much more than humans. You get what you wish for, if you think men only care about sex, and you subconsciously let your man know that's what you think in your relationship, guess what? He will probably not admit his need for love in fear of become less of a 'man' I have in the past, fully surrendered my need to be a man(even if women expect me to be 'a man', I just say 'fuck you' to them. I've got a bit of feminine needs in me and you either deal with it or leave). And in a relationship, I'm fully open and transparent with this need. Of course most men are waaay to scared to do this, so dont expect your average guy to do it. With this mindset(if the women isn't too stuck up and can tolerate and accept this) the relationship ends up being 100x more loving. I'm not saying for you personally, because you've clearly decided the celibacy approach, but for others reading this: if you want a man to not just be about sex, you also need to take a bit of initiative. You need to be ok with him being a bit feminine. If you can't tolerate a man that cries, cares deeply for things like the environment or his family, is vegan, does womanly things sometimes or thinks like a woman on occasions, then youre part of the problem sorry to say. I know a woman who broke up with a man because he was too 'girly' and was worried he was gay...Sigh. Find a guy who is ok and in touch with his feminine side(plenty at sweat lodges(the shaman stuff) psychedelic retreats and environmental meetups) and if you dare, fully surrender to it. The more the masculine side dominates the man, the more in love the women gets, but the more problems the women gets in the long run. This is why only high consciousness people can date each other, because only high consciousness people are willing to sacrifice, or see through the patriarchy to form a better relationship.

I am so tired of suffering which is going on for 14 years. And every time new issues arise which increase the burden. Meditation was my hope to be happy. I don't believe in hell after life or reincarnation. So I contemplate suicide. There is no point in continuing it. I disgust myself. I hate God (if there is). I just want to disappear and not to be part of anything. Not to reborn, not to be part of God, just not to exist. I hope everything will end after my death.

Listen, friend. I don't expect a reply from you you've been ignoring me consistently for a long while, but just hear me out, okay? Getting free of the co-founder? Probably a good idea. I understand that you're in a tight spot because of the pressure of money and quitting the degree, but this guy... he does not care about you. More than that, he's openly abusive. With a CEO like that, this company will make money, but it won't bring any good to this world. To be like that he has to carry so much pain that he's not thinking straight. You are in your early 20s and you're a cofounder of a startup. You are a bright, capable man and you will find a way to make a living. By sticking with him, you will slowly turn into a sociopath just like him to justify his behavior. Watch out! Getting free of your ex wife? Probably not a good idea, but I feel you. Women can be tough. Working on you relationship AND a company? Your appetite is enormous, and rightly so, but your progress is at the expense of your health. Are you sure that you really appreciate how difficult it is what you're trying to accomplish? It's not just about being smart and hard working. The load is HUGE. Why leaving your parents is associated with suicide? YOU ARE A SMART, CAPABLE, HARD WORKING, YOUNG MAN AND YOU WILL BE ABLE TO TAKE CARE OF YOURSELF! You don't have to be rich, you don't have to be successful, in order to be. These are difficult times for everyone, not just you. It sucks four wife, it sucks for the cofounder, it sucks for your parents, AND IT SUCKS FOR YOU. You are not responsible for them - be responsible for you. Take care of yourself. People may help you, but you are ultimately the most important person in your life. If you don't accept this, you won't be able to help other people, people you care about. Don't put any more pressure on yourself. Take a few step backs and slow down, even if it costs you money.

I’m pretty heavily yellow and thoroughly enjoy stage red music material. I LOVE death metal/trap metal/emo rap/SoundCloud rappers etc. The subject matter is often death, drugs, killing, Satan, suicide, etc. I find listening to this type of music while I train helps me to go “beast mode” and funnel that anger into a resourceful fuel for physical exercise. And listening to depressive/emo rap helps me fully embody my sorrow. Which is wonderful because I was very emotionally numb/repressive for much of my life. That being said, if you don’t listen to the music consciously and understand how it effects you, it could get ugly fast. Music is tool and any tool can be used resourcefully or at the detriment of the user.

I love you man. Being suicidal is never easy to get past. I mutilated my body (in one way or another)from 9-24 years old. 3 suicide attempts and 2 of the 3 times I should've died. I was saved both times by being freaky lucky. I'm so glad you and I are still here. And never be afraid to seek processional help. So you practice any meditation?

That is until your HARD wired survival instinct kicks in. We are all Buddhist monks until we end up in a brazen Roman bull. I get your point but I think it doesn’t apply to me. I’m not afraid of it right now but when being stuck in a torture scenario in my dreams or during a psychedelic trip it is hard to just accept it when the situation is unbearable. @cle103 That is how I developed my fear of torture too. I’m interested in history and there was even a time that I savored the history of torture by doing research. If I can recollect my thought it was like this: “I’m glad that I’m not stuck in a torture scenario. That is why I always must behave. And if people just want to torture me for no reason or false reasons (which happened in history) I must not give them the opportunity and commit suicide before they catch me”. I think you are right that I should dive deep into these thoughts. There might be some underlying reasons why these thoughts pop up. I had a difficult relation with my mother who would scorn me and pick fights with me for no reason. I don’t know if it is linked to that. I have to find out. Having said that I think everybody would fear what we fear. That is besides the point.

I live in a first world country so the likeliness of being tortured is close to nihil. I’m in the process of letting all my fears go and I’m doing a fine job but I’m still not there. A lot of hidden fears are still in my unconscious. When I look to my dreams I still have some nightmares like being stuck in a cave and slowly dying without a way for suicide to save my misery. Or like being stuck in a brazen Roman bull (look it up). I’m planing to do high dose of LSD soon and in the far future some DMT. From what I understand there is the chance of getting stuck in a loop of your deepest fears. How do I deal with such fears? Letting go technique won’t work when you are stuck in a brazen Roman bull.

Hmm. It's good to see that you have finally fully opened up about your situation because I kinda had the feeling that she cannot be just an ex girlfriend. I knew there was more to everything and I had the feeling that you were holding back a lot the first time you posted about breakup. I will just give you real practical advice. This will be in tune with whatever you already want. I didn't know the situation exactly before because I assumed that she was just a girlfriend using you which is quite common. But now that I know that she is your wife, there's a lot invested in here. I don't think that she is using you for a visa although on your side it might feel that way. I think she is genuinely hurt as well given that it is a 3 year marriage. Anyone would be hurt. So you will need to pretend like you are with her at least for the rest of the year till she gets the visa processed so that things go better for her. This is because you love her and it will cause you a lot of guilt to not honor her last needs in the marriage. Let her get her mom to the country you are residing in so that her worries can be taken care of. But you will have to close the marriage chapter as soon as the pending obligations (not really obligations) are done because she is not showing signs for reconciliation. I have no idea why. It's bizzare that she wants to quit on something that was 3 year long. Coming to your startup situation. You're really happy and that guy doesn't sound trustworthy I mean the Chinese guy. If you get into trouble in China with regard to money he most likely won't help you. Being in another country for a long period of time with a person who you can't trust can be very risky. You're young in your 20s which is a great advantage because you can easily find work in your own hometown. You can stay in China for a few months and quit being his slave and find work in your country. Once you get a job you can get a basic studio apartment and get out of the parents home. A note to your parents. I hate the fact that they are not supporting you at a time of need. They should be the last to tell you to move out. But I'm aware that a lot of western parents don't give a shit. So you will need to buckle up. Suicide is not the solution here. Be practical. Emotionally cut off from your ex but do what she says as a way to honor the marriage. Don't think she is using you. And find a place and people you get along with so that the job frustration can be taken care of. Try to keep your mind empty for a few days. I dealt with breakup in the month of November and posted here in the forum and got a lot of support. It was very hard and depressing for me. But now I'm coping well. It takes like 3 to 6 weeks to get over a breakup, of course the scars are going to be long term And as I said even in your previous post about breakup, that you need to settle with a woman who wants to make it work, who wants to build a life with you, not someone who is not okay with your life choices and decisions, because no matter how much you love them, they are going to drift apart for their own needs leaving you high and dry. I'm sorry you're going through so much. Take care..

@electroBeam Please don't commit suicide. Suicide is never the answer. We will all die eventually there is no need to rush this process. I highly recommend you talk to @Nahm. He has helped me in my life more than I could ever imagine a person could help someone. If you have time I want you to read my post history. Spend some time, a few hours. Look at how much i've grown and changed in the past few months. This work, really works. I was never suicidal, but I was deeply unhappy and unsatisfied with life. I'm not done by any means. But this is the greatest i've ever felt in my life and I credit much of this to my work with @Nahm. I want to you to consider something. Where is the drive to commit suicide coming from? Do you really want to end your existence? Or do you want out of your current situation, with the toxic co-worker, the toxic relationship etc. You are clearly very intelligent. Have you considered dropping this project and starting anew? There is more to life then just working and being "successful" and you seem clued into this fact. Your business partner does not seem to see this. I think if you were to walk away, take time to find yourself, then you will come back energized and will be more successful then you could ever imagine. How are your practices? Diet, meditation, yoga, journaling, psychedelics? What are you doing to tame the mind? If you have any questions feel free to message me.

Please do not commit suicide. Give it a little bit of time, accept your emotions. It's ok to feel bad, really. It's ok. I can't give you any practical advice, I sympathize with your position, it's a difficult one for sure. But I can say that it will get better, don't trust catastrophic thoughts. Give it a bit of time, you WILL feel better and a solution will present itself. You are loved. You are loved by the entire universe, even if it doesn't feel that way right now. It's ok to cry, it's ok to not feel good. Hang in there.

I'm reaching out here because I don't know what else to do. I feel very suicidal right now and I just need some opinions and help. I want to talk to someone in person about my issues, because I read somewhere that women get over breakups better then men because they talk to their friends about it. But I can't, you'll see why below. My situation is, I'm currently in a startup. My cofounder is a highly charismatic sociopath. We have spent the last 3 years building a company, and we have probably another 5 years to go. It's going really well and it's got a good chance of being successful. Unfortunately My cofounder is from China(it's based in a poor dangerous part), and our company is based in China. I'm not from China, and I have been doing work from my home country. He has told me in the past that he strongly values strong determination, work ethic, getting rich, and sacrificing everything for the company. He said that he's willing to sacrifice his house, his wife and family relations to make this startup work. His wife is basically his slave, she does what he tells her to do, she gets upset with him a lot because he doesn't take her out on dates, forgets her birthday and anniversary, etc. And he just shruggs it off. Tells her that she can get divorced then. She either sacrifices her well-being for the company or she leaves. He of course expects me to do the same, but I'm not like him. I value compassion, impacting the world, empathy and being kind to women and basically everyone. For the past 3 years, he's been trying to convince me to move to China. I have compromised by going to China every 2-4 months for about a month. I couldn't leave in the past because my wife(ex now) couldn't handle it. She was too clingy. She couldn't even handle 1 month every 3 months, and that's why we have broken up. My ex wife came from Latin America, and we met in uni. We became husband and wife to give her a visa so she could migrate to our country. Of course we thought we would be together, but now we broke up. But we have to keep seeing each other for another year and pretend to be married for her to get a permanent residency. If I divorce her now, it will take her much longer to get a PR, and her mum(who is around 70) won't be able to come to my country because she might die soon. If I cancel her visa, I think there's a strong chance my ex wife my commit suicide, because her mum spent all her money paying for her visa and her university, all in hopes that she could spend her last year's in my home country with her. This gives me a great deal of suffering, because for the visa we have to keep seeing each other for evidence, but I'm deeply hurt she broke up with me. She told me that she broke up with me because she felt insecure about our relationship. Because my company is based in China, she's worried that in the future I will leave to China and never come back. I told her that I didn't move to China specifically to be with her. But she's too insecure and so she broke up. I pretended to quit my company and she cried because she said that I was messing up her head. And that to stop the pain we should just be best friends(friends with benefits) until the visa comes, because she knows I'm very ambitious and again that makes her think that if I get too successful I will leave her. I'm deeply hurt because I'm committed to her, and she won't accept it for a silly reason. And I feel used for the visa. I don't want to see her but I have to for the visa and this is bringing me pain. I agreed that let's be in a relationship then for another year and just enjoy while we can, and lets break up at the end of the year. Lets use this time to detach from each other and make our last memories good ones(because we are still attached to each other). She agreed(close friends of benefits sort of thing till the end of the year) This breakup happened about a week or 2 ago. I'm currently in China and have been for about a week or 2(left just after the breakup). When I go to China, I don't feel comfortable with my cofounder. He's very brutal and harsh(typical Chinese sociopath). He's also 20 years older than me(I'm in my early 20s). I value health, wellbeing, and it's always a struggle for me to do simple things like eat healthy food and go to the gym. He argues with me that I should be working long hours at the startup and thats more important than health and gym. He shows me all the poor people in China and says all of them would do anything to be in my position right now. When i argue he just argues back. And its so uncomfortable because when im there im living in his house, i come from a poor family and dont have enough money for airbnb or hotels while im there. He of course wont spend that money on me because hes a tight chinese man. I told my cofounder about my breakup up(because it's important for us to understand what's going on in our life for planning the startup) and I was hoping that he would be at least a bit sympathetic. Instead he said "hooray! you can finally migrate to China, I'll get you a visa". I was just so put off by this. I broke up with my wife of 3 years about a week ago, and he gave absolutely no empathy. Instead he just capitalised on my loss. I wanted to vomit. I told him that look I need time to get over the relationship. We will continue to live together till the end of the year. I'll come to China permanently a bit later during the year. He told me that I'm being stupid. Why am I choosing to help someone with a visa when they broke up with me? Why do you want to stay in your home country and live with her after the breakup? Youre being stupid, irrational, emotional, feminine. If you were loyal to the startup you would come instantly! This is your future, not your ex wife. Think about the future, stupid 20s man. Even if I don't live with my ex for the rest of the year, the thought of living with this guy in his house for a long period of time makes me wanna puke. Chinese are so harsh and brutal and hate feelings. they only care about rationality. I don't mean to be racist but I hate their culture. The company is on track to make enough money to justify to my tight ass cofounder to give me a pay and have my own place next year. I want to move then. But not now. Sigh. Sigh. Sigh. I told this to my ex wife, and of course she got pissed, saying that he's going to ruin her visa and her plans to come to my home country. So i cant go too soon. I'm just thinking "what about me? It isn't fair, I've had enough and I want my share! My heart has just been teared, and all these people care about is their own petty lives". Fortunately she later confessed that if I go she will cry because she still needs me. But her first reaction was the visa and that hurts me a lot. On top of all of this, to save money I've been living with my parents. Because it's a startup the income is not totally secure, especially since the Chinese dollar is much lower than my own country(I live in a city as expensive as los angeles) and with the corona virus its just dropped again. My parents are pissed that i sacrificed my degree for this startup and have now told me i must move out. So now i have home security problems. Also my parents are divorcing after a lot of hatred and only care about themselves right now. Divorce court fees etc makes me not a concern for them right now. I can't talk to my parents about my ex wife, because to get the visa my parents have to write statements to the immigration. I've also had a lot of fights with them in the past because they helped my ex wife by providing her a house and thought she was ungreatful, but kept all of the resentment in because they thought we would be together forever. Sigh. Sigh. Sigh. Last night I stayed up the whole night. Just contemplating about my life. I wondered "what if instead of my wife disappearing I quit the startup?" Then I suddenly felt like I was on cocaine, ecstatic. The relief from all of the pressure was amazing. But then I remembered all of the pain I got from my controlling ex wife. I then wondered "what if i quit both my ex wife and the startup" omg i felt like I took 10x more cocaine, with all of the relief i felt like i was floating. Then i remembered how stressful it is living with my family. Then it hit me, what if I committed suicide? Just started over again like what we do in our dreams? OMG the relief, the ecstasy. I cannot describe, just like an enlightenment experience. Last night I snuck a knife out of the draw from my cofounder's kitchen and began to locate my heart. As I was about to push it in a flashback of my entire history from the moment I was a kid to now occured. I saw how much mourning my parents would go through if I did this, the shock and terror of my cofounder and the dread of my ex. But the worst part would be my parents would incorrectly feel guilty and responsible for the thing i was about to do. So i put the knife back and instead just wept in the deep dark depression for the entire night. I've talked to therapists in the past, and I find I get worse, not better eith them. I can't speak to my parents about my situation, and I've tried speaking to my ex and cofounder about it: which was a mistake. I have no friends, because I'm too busy. I feel used, exploited, and I feel unlovable and void of love. I feel like people only like me because I make them rich(cofounder) or I give them a visa(my ex wife). I feel very resentful to my ex wife. And I feel like vomiting when I think about my cofounder. I have a deep urge to commit suicide and I just don't know what to do, and I don't have anyone to talk to. What can I do? Is suicide the best thing for such a situation?

It certainly can, depending on who is listening. But try to see it this way. Music teaches you to work with energy, both express, accept it, move it, see the limits and lessons from it. Imagine it this way. Lets take anger for an example, a common "negative" theme in red music. If you got angry lets say in some random daily situation, you would probably see it as something bad happening inside of you, something that should stop happening, or you might just unconsciously let it control you and rage around. You might not, but a teen will. When you listen to music containing anger, you let the feeling flow freely, you are fine with it, you observe it and accept it, you see that this is something happening to other people and you bound based on these feelings, by accepting this feeling it feels good. No one listens to any kind of music in order to feel plain bad, no matter how dark the music gets. There is a transformative element to it. When the show ends people either want more, or at least exit the show joyful and smiling. I have seen this to be quite true in 99% of the cases I've encountered, I am musician myself. One of the project I engage in is a stage red metal band. You may be in a dark place, seeing all the shit in the world, watching shitty news, living in shitty place, having violence around you, these things can brake you and turn you into a lost cause. Music seems to feed into it, but it does not. It can appear to be that way in the beginning, but as you listen to it you'll get better. It can be the spark of light in your world of darkness and as you fall, you'll descend towards the light. I know 2 people that almost committed suicide, it was the darkest of music that stopped them and helped them keep it together. They listened to it for like half a day, every day. its free... shadow work. Also here are two neat quotes: No tree is said to reach up to heaven unless its roots reach all the way to hell. The amount of light one can create is proportionate to the darkness one is willing to confront.

yes, as a rule they are. Sex outside marriage is a criminal offence in most of the world, as it used to be in the West too. That people don't even know this and can't even imagine a world where casual sex isn't the norm boggles the mind. No civilisation in the history of the world survived for long without putting marriage and the nuclear family at the centre of its society. The current state of affairs is like a ticking suicide time bomb that will destroy western civilisation. However, as it is obvious from this thread, nobody cares and it is entirely self-inflicted.

No, I never said it was all suffering and pain. I said SOME nights. Other times it can fun, exciting, positive, etc. Overall it's an adventure. Don't think of it as some negative chore you must do. I don't understand why you need to feel suicidal about it. If you're doing the work, there's plenty of hope and no need for suicide. You will get laid if you go out enough. I guarantee it.

Isn't there a point of no return, where you are truly pathetic enough to really warrant killing yourself? Like I understand if you were only bullied once or twice, or came out on the bottom of a fight or argument looking weak or pathetic that you're maybe a bit irrational to want to end it all, or if you're still really young. I am in my 30s now, still early 30s, but it's still pretty late in the game to think anything in my life is really going to turn around... and only lost once or twice? I have a negative record in everything. I have lost more verbal arguments than I have won by a landslide... I have lost more rounds of online games than I have won by a fucking landslide, I have been tapped out by more people in BJJ than I have tapped out by a fucking embarrassing landslide. Why is it so rare to find someone to honestly tell you that suicide might not be a bad idea? Most bitch-ass people would tell me "everybody feels like that" but that's simply not true. For me to lose in so many ways someone else has to have won, and the human experience is balanced.... if there's a billion lost arguments than there's actually a billion won arguments somewhere else, there ARE winners, I will just never taste that in this life. I hate how alone I've become, I thought I'd find a billion people like me on here but I actually feel very disconnected from everyone else's problems, they all seem petty compared to mine, and I'll bet if I came across this as a year but some things were switched around and the name was changed I'd probably not relate to this stupid rant either. Such a stupid absurd thing this life is, I so much hate that I was born into it. I hate how I'm open to the idea that the enlightenment that could maybe save me from all this doesn't really exist and that youtube gurus like Leo are frauds or actors undertaking a funny little project. I mean, I did meditate 30mins/day for a year straight and experience some phenomenon that seemed to match the path, but the fact that the amount of work it is going to take to achieve anything is completely unknown and subjective and that no teacher can actually get inside of me and know if I'm doing it right just discouraged me from really believing much is possible. Also I'd rather actually just WIN than accept loss to be honest, if such a thing is possible. Psychedelics? Maybe, I kind of like mushrooms, but I can't say they really do much for me once I'm not on them anymore, to me it's kind of like... uhm.. you know.. a drug. I guess you have to do so many you turn into a retard that goes on about how enlightened he is to really "heal"... ugh... That's so cringy I could puke, the noose seems like a far better choice to be honest.

It doesn't matter what I do, the same symbols of failure keep following me around; if I get a hold of one thing, I let something else slip. Like, no matter how hard I try to clean up around myself all the time something ALWAYS ends up out of order somehow... if everything visually is organized something somewhere around a corner has gone into disarray, almost like a demon follows me around and anything that isn't fresh enough in my mind to practically have a photographic memory of will be *deleted* or messed with in some way by the universe. Every time I get pulled over I have an expired insurance card to give the cop (even though I have a current one... somewhere). Like I swear to God, even though my one is current & I know where it is in my glove box, so mote it be I swear to CHRIST that by the next time I get pulled over, I will have been robbed or have freaked out in anger over losing *something else* in between now and then, and I swear to god in a few years when I get pulled over again I am going to pull out an expired insurance card from years ago and look like a dipshit in front of the cop... because that's just my curse. It's not just that though, if I work; I will forget something in front of someone and be embarrassed.... so I try to work as least as I can (not just because of that but whatever). So I try to play a video game for fun; but even still I fuck something up and get an earfull from a teammate, or insulted by a cocky enemy. I'm having a really hard time trying to convince myself not to commit suicide. Two days ago I left the dentist w/ a prescription for antibiotics for a root canal, I fold it and put it in my jacket pocket. I tell myself "it's in this pocket, just don't touch anything until you get it filled" well I go pick up my girlfriend and do a bunch of running around and end up feeling really exhausted and feeling like a nap... figure whatever. I wake up too late to make the pharmacy. Next day I let it get way too late and I'm running at the pharmacy at the last minute... don't I reach in my pocket and feel the prescription so I think, only to pull out the receipt for the dentist Like, when I was younger I would have just gotten away with waiting an extra day, now I swear to god it's like Murphy's Law is just 100% in effect for the rest of my life now and anything I don't immediately address gets fucking swallowed by this turd universe, I hate it. What's worse is actually believing the type of things many say about the universe being mental instead of physical opens up the portal to me believing in a special frustrating type of paranormal majik poo where forgetting things doubles in physical reality as them being fucking lost as well. (I mean I don't know if I really believe this, I'm probably just a dumbass, but if you really want to start entertaining magic and miracles then isn't it just oh so fucking great that the only experience I have of these phenomenon frustrations that keep me busy over nothing productive) I actually self harmed over this, of course it seems ridiculous to get upset over this one instance but the combination of the way these things just seem to follow me around like a curse is just so maddening. What's even worse is I am MOST likely to actually lose my mind as if I'm intoxicated once I get in a rage OVER being forgetful.... I just start thrashing things around and throwing things, not even knowing what I threw where. It's a negative spiral that's going to be the end of me I feel. There's so many other things wrong with me, this life is such a joke I could vent for ever and ever and ever... it's not even just this, I have had my ego bruised and shit on in every possible way... of course everything is relative and there's still practically infinite people below me but in the context of my life I am the most pathetic motherfucker there is. I don't even know what could help me, so far in the history of human life there has not been one proven thing that actually ends one's misery (the nature of subjective experience will keep that unprove-able forever I believe)

Whatever you do, don't make your future about 'needing to survive'. A lot of people with depression, long-term mental health problems and suicidal tendencies are in this rut where they are both too afraid to commit to life and too afraid to die (to commit suicide). And with some people, they can even spend decades going in from one deep depression to another, from one psychiatric hospital to another, from one therapist to another, and they basically live a life alternating from moderate to intense despair, yet they never truly fundamentally change. In such a situation, I'd say it's better for them to commit suicide than to continue the same kind of lifestyle. Continuing to live a life in a state of (intermittent) despair and depression and other continuing mental health problems, is worse than just getting it over with and committing suicide, in my opinion. I think it's both amazing and tragic that some people manage to keep on going for that long. I don't understand how they manage to continue for that long despite for them being no light at the end of the tunnel considering the way they continue to live their lives. They don't want to truly come to terms with the fact that the tiny slivers of hope they have is all just fantasy, and that with the way they keep handling themselves there is going to be no hope for the future. Not that you have to commit suicide. And not that there wouldn't be any hope. Not at all. But please, for the love of god, don't become one of these suicidal dabblers who go on living in misery and torment for years, and sometimes even decades (god knows how they do it). You need to come to terms with the fact that you will have to make a very deliberate decision: Are you going to commit to life, or are you going to commit suicide? I'm not going to tell you which choice to make, but all I'm going to say is that if you don't make a decision, life is not going to miraculously resolve itself and you will most likely be in an almost continuous state of misery until the moment you die. Do you understand me? Is that clear to you that you don't really have a choice but to make a choice? I know that truly coming to terms with your situation as I described can be very painful because you will need to confront your inner demons and some of your worst, most dreaded fears. But the prospect of not doing that is so, so much worse. At least in the long term. If you want to commit suicide, you know what to do. Commit all of your energy to it and get it over with. If you want to go for life, then you absolutely need to commit 100% of your life energy towards it and not give the idea of suicide a second thought anymore. You have to totally and utterly cross off suicide as an option in your mind, otherwise it's not going to work. It's not going to work because you will lack full commitment. And the reason you will lack this commitment is because in the back of you're mind you're thinking: "well if this doesn't work out, I can always still commit suicide". If you have that thought in the back of your mind, then when you encounter struggles or obstacles, instead of being fully committed to pushing yourself through that and taking whatever lessons you can out of it, instead of that, you will start fantasizing and thinking about how death could be a sweet release from it all, and then you will start having suicidal fantasies and idealizations, and if you indulge in those fantasies for too long, it will completely destroy that warrior spirit that you may have been able to tap into when you still seemed to be making progress. There are going to be moments when things just don't seem to work out, and you appear to seem stuck, and you will have the tendency to think that "this will never get better". Expect those moments. Those moments are normal. But it is in those moments where it will be decided whether you will succeed or fail in life. If you don't give up during those moments, then you will make it through and then you're well on you're way to creating a magnificent life. But if you allow fear and self-doubt and desire for death drive to overwhelm you during those moments, then you will fail and you will either end up committing suicide, or even worse, continue this cycle of misery for what may seem like an eternity. Remember that your way to a happy, healthy and beautiful life is decided moment to moment. The only power you truly have is the decision you make in this moment, right here, right now. You can only change the future by the way you act NOW. Read the "power of now" by Eckhart Tolle if you want this to be clarified even more deeply to you. If you want to, I have written much of my thoughts on the topic of suicide and suicidality not too long ago on my journal thread here on actualized.org (you can find in through my profile page). But for you convenience, I have copied and pasted what I have written there and put it in an online text sharing site. You can also read it there. I have also brought in other perspectives on the way you can look at suicide and suicidality there. If those perspectives only feel to be confusing to you and they don't connect with you, then simply disregard them. Different perspectives will work for different people at different moments in time or phases in their evolution. Work with what works for you right now, and dismiss what doesn't serve you right now. Here's the link. https://justpaste.it/5se21 You can also contact me by sending me a private message, if you want to.

Ralston had been contemplating since he was a kid in other areas. Ralston is, as he put it, obsessive and has a relentless work ethic. Things didn’t grow on trees for him. He put in the work. He wanted to know. He also, as I’ve heard, suffered a lot. A lot of great enlightened masters I’ve sought out met and I am very fortunate to say have become teachers of mine have had hellish childhoods, ADHD, OCD, drug addiction, suicide attempts, etc. It’s very simple... do you want to know the truth? Are you committed to honesty? Are you committed to follow your heart’s yearning to know, regardless of what that might entail? Are you committed to admit you don’t know shit and that all this regurgitation of insights of giants who’ve come before you is just arrogant bullshit lies and that really you don’t know? Are you committed to taking on the source responsibility of knowing the truth beyond just the ideal of doing so? If yes then you can. Trying to discuss this stuff in technical detail on these matters will never end. It can serve good utility to have a conceptual framework but eventually it really just becomes a distraction and a waste of time and all of it really is wrong at the end of the day. We can make elaborate explanations using things like karma, trauma, “giftedness”, yogic models, Buddhist maps, spiritual texts, stages of ego development, etc. but that discussion hasn’t ended for thousands of years (which is under the assumption of a past and history) and it’s certainly not going to end now. If you want to wake up, go do it. Do whatever you have to do to do that. Stop trying to play compare and contrast of people that in the end don’t exist anyways.

I didn't know about non-duality or anything at the time. It was 2009, so Eckhart Tolle was my first exposure to spirituality after my suicide attempt. No looking back since then and no suicidal tendencies. It was a cross roads for me. Until it was realized there is no "me"

Then, I did this type of work on/off for years. Wasn't until I actually tried it (suicide) and failed that it completely stopped. Real spiritual began after that...