Search the Community

Spiritual Autolysis - Journal Entry #46 - Fri Sep 8th '23 - 9:02 AM Higher self: What is true? Lower self: Nothing. Nothing is true. I've got nothing for you. Higher self: Nope... Something is true. Lower self: Yes ... something is true, but I can't use words to explain it, so whats the point. Higher self: The point is to get you there. How else are you going to get there? By watching more Leo videos or reading more books or meditating more? You don't even like meditating... Lower self: Okay fine.... Everything is one. Higher self: Everything is one, aye? What does that mean. What is everything and what is one? Sounds like a duality to me. Lower self: Yes, it is a duality. But dualities do not exist. Thats what this paradox thing is telling us, that there is a fault in the way that we are looking at things. We want to start looking past it. Everything is literally all there is in the entire universe. Everything, by my definition is the entire universe, God, every emotion that you can think of, every event that you can think of, every single thought stream coming out of a sentient being, every plant on this planet or any other, every star in the entire galaxy and beyond, every grain of sand on the beach, every molecule in the human body, all of the water in the sea and ocean on Earth and on every other planet, every video game, every human being that ever existed, every dinosaur that ever existed, every animal, current and past and future, every rock, every boulder, every eye ball, every disease, every infection, every fight, every bar, every insult, every dream, all energy fields, every color, every piece of music, every event that has ever transpired and will ever transpire, every book, every piece of clothing, every neck tie, every job application, every beating heart, every brain, every tornado, every comet crashing into something, every movie and TV show, every Instagram account, every Twitter account, every sentient being on the Earth and outside of it, every hallucination, every acid trip, every picture that you think is in your head, every airplane, every shoe, every shoe lace, every window, every flower, every tree, every forest, every sunset, ever lake, every river, every ocean, every road, every state, every country, every continent, every boat, Magellan, Isaac Newton, Benjamin Franklin, my best friends, my family, every ego, every shin guard, every shin, every soccer ball, football, baseball, cricket, every sporting event, every school, every water fountain, every slice of pizza, every building, every sky scraper, every train ride, every train ticket, every pen, every pencil, every factory, every yoga class, every whole foods, every psychological model, every guru, every alien, every UFO, every Youtube video, every idea, every conspiracy theory, Jed McKenna, every awakening, every spiritual pursuit, every church, every religion, every football team, every high school clique, every sexual encounter, every kiss, every crush... shall I go on? And that is only scratching the surface because I have a limited perspective here on Earth, in this puny human body. Get me out into the stars like you God and I'll be able to see the whole god damn universe. Higher self: Okay... we understand what everything is.. Now what is one? Lower self: One. well, one is the first number in the numerical language.. Higher self: Thats not what you mean by one... you said that everything is one... what does that mean to you? Lower self: It means that everything can be encapsulated in one thing. That is truth. I know that its true because it must be true. Everything has to be encapsulated in something. I guess I'm really just putting everything in a box. I'm categorizing everything, but theres really only one category and it is one... I could add more categories, but that just doesn't feel right. Higher self: I don't get it. Lower self: Yeah me neither... Aright just let me think out loud for a little bit... Well we know that these paradoxes are always true, right? If a statement is a paradox, that means that we are onto something... thats what I am going to conclude from some of our previous discussions.. and "everything is one" is certainly a paradox... Higher self: Can you explain why its a paradox please. Lower self: Because everything is everything, take all of the examples that I listed above and multiply it by infinity... and one is just one thing, it is singular, I mean truthfully when I think of one, I think of one person, one lamp, one desk, one plant. Singular. So that is not everything, that seems like the complete opposite... Which is what makes the statement a paradox... Yet it is such a common term "Oh yeah... everythings one, we are all one, lets all love each other." Yet no body stopped and questioned that this is the most obvious paradox that there is?! Jesus christ we are missing this shit. Of course I never realized it either until I sat down and thought about it so I'm not above it either.. I'm sorry for judging all of you people. Anyways, this is a massive paradox, we know this now, which means that there is truth to it? Can we conclude that truth lies within every paradoxical statement? Higher self: I don't know... I think thats a stretch... what are the paradoxical statements that we've come up with so far? Lower self: "Everything is one" "Nonduality is true" "Non-existence exists" Higher self: No. we cannot conclude that, we need to look into each statement in further depth. Lower self: Okay, yeah I can tell that I was being lazy with that claim. A big problem with this work is that its mentally draining. I feel like I just ran 30 laps but only gained an inch. Higher self: Yes, thats the nature of the work... Lower self: Alright... thanks for that... *Long pause* Now lets gain a little more understanding on the statement "Everything is one," So everything is infinite things, and one is just one thing... how can everything be one... is infinity packed into a single molecule... or a single body... I don't think so... so that means that they are opposites... but no they are not opposites because opposites do not exist, opposites are human mind constructions... But everything can't be one. It just can't be. Higher self: Alright... I'm going to help you out a little bit. I think that what the statement is alluding to is that God is in everything. We humans are all one in the sense that we are all God. Lower self: Okay but even a statement like God is in everything doesn't make any sense to me because I don't know what God is, I just talk to him sometimes but don't even know if its real. You know what... everything cannot be one, thats my answer to this. The shirt that is laying out on the chair in front of me is a singular object. It is NOT infinite. not infinite at all. If it were infinite, it would look infinite and it doesn't, its just a shirt, a single fucking shirt. Higher self: What about all of the cotton threads within the shirt, there must be thousands that make up the singular shirt, does that make the shirt a thousand cotton threads or just one thread. Lower self: I don't know, it depends how you look at it, yeah sure.. you could say "Hey, that person is wearing a thousand cotton threads"... but you'd sound pretty silly. Higher self: Okay... so your definition of one depends upon the persons perspective, which means that it is a relative truth. Lower self: Yeah... sure. Whats your point? Higher self: My point is that we are looking for absolute truths, not relative truths... Therefore, your definition of what one is is relative, it is not absolute. Lower self: Fine then, lets just scrap the "everything is one" statement, its fine by me, not true, get it out of here... Higher self: Okay.. I can tell you are getting aggravated, I think its time for a break. Just to clarify, I think that I have been harping on "Everything is one" as something to look into because I intuit that there is some truth to it. And I think that we should trust my intuition when it comes to where we want our conversations to be steered. Lower self: Yes, I'm on board with that. I need some food, I'll talk to you later.

Spiritual Autolysis - Journal Entry #45 - Wed Sep 6th '23 - 8:50 AM 13.*Look around and say to yourself* A meaningless world engenders fear. *Close your eyes.* A meaningless world engenders fear because I think I am in competition with God. "To move forward, you must figure out exactly what is obstructing you. Whatever it is, it isn’t really there; it has no reality, no substance. It’s your own creation, a phantom lurking in the shadows of your mind, a shadow demon. Your obstructions are your demons, and your demons are shadow dwellers. They live and thrive in the half-light of ignorance, so the way to slay a demon is by illuminating it with the full force and power of your focused attention; by looking at it, hard. Banish shadow with light and see for yourself that no obstruction exists, nor ever did. We create our demons and we feed them. To awaken we must slay them. That’s really the whole process: Slay one demon, take one step. Repeat." ~ from Spiritually Incorrect Enlightenment by Jed McKenna Higher self: Lets take this duality conversation one step further. If duality does not exist, what else does that mean? We established that the thought of two things being opposites is an illusion, according to this insight, what else is an illusion? Lower self: Everything. Everything is an illusion. Higher self: Okay... Give me an example. Lower self: My entire life story is an illusion. Everything about it. My past is an illusion. My friends are an illusion. My cat .. an illusion. The people that I love... Illusion. Higher self: How do you know they are an illusion? I feel like you're just saying these things with no way of backing it up or proving it. You don't truly understand the magnitude of these statements. And what does this have to do with nonduality? Lower self: Nonduality is "all is one." That's literally what it means to be nondual. That means that there is nothing outside of it, which means that anything that is finite or separate, such as my puny little body and my memories and thoughts and family and circle of friends, they are all nondual. Everything is nondual. Higher self: Hmmm. Okay that's interesting, but there are still finite things, you must admit. The chair has a different makeup than the table and than a physical human body. Lower self: Not in the absolute sense, there is no difference between the two, not really. The difference between the two has been constructed in our own minds. The chair and the human are one and the same. Higher self: Hmmm... Interesting.. but you care about the survival of the human body more than the chair that you are sitting on. Lower self: Yes of course because I want to live. I don't want to die. I don't care about that chair because I don't live through the chair, I live through this physical body. I am selfish, we all must be in order to survive. Higher self: Can you transcend survival? Lower self: Yeah probably, but I think that we are all scared to because then we will literally be okay with dieing. Higher self: Well that's where you're headed if you continue down this path... Is that a demon that you are willing to face... Lower self: Errrrrr... Yes, I think so.

I saw there was no post about the actual list of worksheets and home assignments so i made one (maybe there already is one but anyway) Here it is (not including, websites, and links to articles and papers): Paradoxes Of Personal Development: Curing Perfectionism - How To Stop Being A Perfectionist: The Mechanics Of Belief: How To Harness Your Intuition: The Trap Of Projection, Especially Onto Teachers & Mentors: A Rant Against Culture: Money Psychology - The Inner Game of Mastering Money: Mystical Traditions Around The World - Nonduality Goes Cosmopolitan!: Uncovering Your Childhood Vows - Unwire Your Neurotic Personality: The Pre-mortem Technique - The Trick To Avoiding Project Failure: Dropping The Roles You Play: Build Your Infrastructure For Success: Understanding How Paradigms Work; What Is Love? - Part 2 - The Brutal Nature Of Love How Fear Works - Part 2 - The Ultimate Guide To Dealing With Fear How Corruption Works What Is Insight? - How To Become More Insightful:

nonduality reduces God down to a primordial consciousness. it's bottom-up. nonduality wants to transcend the individual self. absolute solipsism recognizes the individual self as an eternal fact. God is top-down, not bottom-up. Therefore God is never fully realized. God is infinitely mysterious because the self can never be transcended. The self excludes all other self's. totally inescapable. imagine a ball of yarn. every string is an individual stream of consciousness. the individual stream is infinite, eternal and absolute. God does not split itself into individuals. individuals are, always have been, and always will be. Oversimplification and obsession with parsimony at all costs is a fool's errand. there is nothing simple about God.

@Razard86 I haven’t got to the point of nonduality but I’ve realised that as a relative truth, you have the power to create anything you see fit or there are synchronicities with the things you ask for, as long as they are, for lack of a explanatory way of saying this, in alignment. These powerful thoughts come from the Self rather than the ego, if we are using Jungian language. It’s more of an intention, rather than a want. Also, your words and actions have a connection with what is going to come next, but, you may be not realising how far it goes. Then again, everything’s predetermined, but, I think it’s better to think of it as I have power.

Spiritual Autolysis - Journal Entry #44 - Mon Sep 4th '23 - 1:56 PM Lower self: The statement nonduality is true is in itself a paradox. It's a paradox because for nonduality to be true, the duality of true and false must not be true.How about the statement duality is false? Higher self: How about this, what does it mean to be false? Lower self: To be false is to be not true. Something that is false... Well actually for something to be false. Someone must have thought that it was true at one point and then realized that it was false afterwards. For example, the earth is flat, this is a false statement. We know that the earth is round, but humans used to think that the earth was flat, then we realized that this is false. Then maybe one day we will realize that the earth isn't round and it's actually square shaped (idk). The point I'm trying to make is that these things are relative. In truth work, we are not looking for relative truths, we are looking for absolute truths. What is the difference between relative and absolute truths? Higher self: An absolute truth is something that without a doubt, cannot be questioned, it knows itself is true, it doesn't need anything else to validate that it is true. That is what we are after here, so let's not get stuck on all of these relative truths, such as the nature of the duality of truth vs falsehood. Lower self: But isn't this an important distinction to make? Why does absolute truth fall outside of the realm of duality?? Higher self: Because there is no absolute falsehood. For there to be falsehood, there must be truth, and that's just not what we're after here. We could find falsehood if we wanted to, absolute falsehood. Is that what you want to find? Lower self: Not particularly. But while we're in the subject, what does absolute falsehood look like? Higher self: Why does it matter? True and false are not opposites. Haven't we established this? That is what we mean by the statement dualities are an illusion. Falsehood still exists and absolute truth still exists, so what are we even talking about here? You are not using the duality of truth and falsehood in the work that you are doing. The duality between the two is the illusion, or the relationship between the two is the illusion. You are simply finding out what's true. That is it. Something being false has nothing to do with it. Lower self: Okay but if something is false, then it is not true, correct? Higher self: No! They're not opposites! That's the problem that you keep running into! Lower self: But can something be true and false at the same time? Nuh uh... I don't think so... Higher self: On the relative scale, something can be true to one person and false to another person. For example, one person thinks that God is real, that is his truth, another thinks God is not real, that is his truth. Who's right? Who's truth is correct? Neither! Neither is, they are just opinions. Lower self: Yes but if there is an absolute truth and an absolute falsehood and in this perfect example, we are speaking about God, one of these people is absolutely true and the other is absolutely false. Higher self: No! You are still using the duality! Lower self: What do you mean? Higher self: The duality of truth and false does not exist, correct? Lower self: Yes.. Higher self: That means that there is no difference between truth and false in the absolute sense, they are one and the same... Lower self: Then what the fuck are we doing?? What is the point of this work? Higher self: It's to get you to that point, where you actually understand what we're talking about here! You don't understand it, do you? Lower self: No! How could I?! It makes no sense! Higher self: Okay, let's back up here for a moment, do you understand what I am saying when I say that the duality of truth and false is not real? Do you understand how significant this is. Every time truth pops into your head, you are thinking of its opposite, falsehood. I am trying to get you to stop doing that. The reason for this is because we have already established the duality between truth and falsehood is imaginary, it is not real. That means that there is NO RELATIONSHIP between the two. Are you starting to understand that? Lower self: Yes.. yes.. I understand now.. Higher self: And that means that the word false does not belong here, there is no point in using it. We are looking for TRUTH. That is it, no attachments, no return engagements, no encore. TRUTH. Lower self: Yes, I understand..

Spiritual Autolysis - Journal Entry #43 - Mon Sep 4th '23 - 9:39 AM Higher self: Okay so we have realized that nonduality is closer to truth than duality. But why? Why is that? Lower self: Well the other day we were dissecting these paradoxes, in which a statement can be right and wrong at the same time, which got us thinking about all of the dualities in the world, ie all of the seemingly opposite things.. such as boy vs girl, positive vs negative, right vs wrong, right vs left, good vs evil. What we discovered is that it is really all one thing, everything is enveloped into one thing. Now what is that thing that everything is enveloped into... That is what we are here to find out.. to summarize, all dualities are an illusion that the human mind has made up in order to categorize things for its own survival needs. Okay now what is next after finding out about nonduality. I feel as though I am missing something there, I don't feel true clarity on the subject. Higher self: Why don't you feel clarity? Lower self: I don't know.. I feel as though I still don't understand what a paradox is.. Higher self: Okay.. then let's go through one.. non-existence exists. Two seemingly opposite statements yet somehow the statement is true, it's true and false at the same time (seemingly) Lower self: This is a paradox. It doesn't make sense to the human brain because we live in a world where we think dualities exist when they really do not. Dualities are not real, the world is non dual. These sorts of statements prove this. Higher self: How and why do these paradoxical statements prove that nonduality is more true than duality? Lower self: Because for a statement to have two polar opposites elements within it and also make sense or be accurate, that means that there must be an issue with the duality of the two opposite elements. If non existence and existence are actually the same thing at its core, then the statement "non-existence exists" would make sense because they do not contradict each other. Us humans have defined these two things as opposites, but in reality they are not. Higher self: Existence does not exist. Is this statement true? Lower self: Not true. Existence does exist. Existence is the existing of something, it is there, it is present, therefore "Existence does not exist" is a false statement. Higher self: What about true and false, isn't that a duality that, according to you, is "just an illusion?" Here lies the problem, you are saying that nonduality is true or at least more true than duality, but at the same time you are using the duality of true and false in the work that you are doing right now. Isn't that contradictory? If duality is made up or false then what is the difference between true and false? There shouldn't be any difference if there are no opposites, which means that there shouldn't be any difference between what is true and what is false, correct? Yet you are sitting over there saying this statement is true and that statement is false. Lower self: Hmmm...

Lol, I don't want to accept? Says fucking who? Of course I didn't pull any of this out of thin air. Neither did you (or anyone else, for that matter). Where would you be without Leo's videos, this forum, Sadguru's teachings? Where would Leo be without all of the stuff he's been studying over the past decade? Where would Sadguru be without his Indian upbringing and studies of Yogic traditions? See, that's the magic of duality: All things are interconnected in an endless divine dance, touching, nudging and influencing each other, passing along the torch and sharing the common energy. Where do you draw the line between "your" wisdom and someone else's? Between "your" life story and that of other people? And yet there is the appearance of otherness that makes life so endlessly entertaining and fascinating; and yet there is "me" over here and "you" over there! THAT is the paradoxical beauty of existence! And yet you use the persona to get ahead in life and have an absolute ball along the way. I mean, just look at us two jokers, pretending to be two different people, arguing and bickering for the sheer glorious heck of it! THIS is what puts all beauty and spice into life, for heaven's sake! Don't you see it? Duality is the greatest gift that God has ever created for itself. Without it, you could not have any experience of any kind whatsoever, so learn to appreciate it, my friend. Like I said in the previous post: The fact that there are black letters on a white screen in front of me is proof of duality (aka. form). Sure, duality is "just an appearance", but that appearance itself is an undeniable aspect of reality. But guess what, duality and nonduality are not really opposed to each other; they are nothing but two sides of the exact same coin, two complementary facets of the oneness of existence. Look at this picture: What do you see? My guess is that you see a circle with black and white shapes inside. Right? But wait... how can this be? Isn't all just one? Then how can there possibly be black on the one side and white on the other? Shouldn't it just be one uniformous blob of... nothing? Well, here's the divine joke of existence: Black and white are different from each other (because otherwise you could not perceive/experience them), and yet they form one big whole which is all one. They are different, and yet the are same! Just like two dance partners who perform different moves and yet dance the same dance. And the big paradoxical mindfuck is that without the appearance of non-unity, the unity of the whole would not be visible! As I said, it's a giant paradox. Don't even try to understand it intellectually... just put on your dancing shoes and join the fun.

Again... "I am a man, not a woman". Your words, not mine. Being a man vs. being a woman = duality. The relative aspect of existence. Being Consciousness/All That Is = nonduality. The absolute aspect of existence. When you are referring to yourself as "Javier" during your day-to-day interactions with other people, you are paying tribute to the relative aspect of existence. When you come to this subforum and put on your Mr. Awakened Guy persona, you are also immersed in the game of relativity/duality... you just don't (seem to) realize it. Are you interested in keeping this body alive? If so, why? If the body is a tool, then what are you using it for? These are all questions that pertain to the relative domain. You are both the form and that which is aware of it. AT ALL TIMES. You are literally EVERYTHING, don't you see? Or rather, consciousness is everything... the dream as well as the dreamer. Is this paradoxical? Yes. But that doesn't mean that it isn't true.

reposting from my journal: how monadology /absolute solipsism differs from nonduality The Mind At Large in Bernardo Kastrup’s theory, the mind at large divides itself into multiple perspectives. Kastrup doesn’t believe mind at large is particularly intelligent, as it is a simple primordial consciousness. upon death the individual’s consciousness becomes one with the mind at large Absole Solipsism in contrast, absolute solipsism recognizes that the Self is absolutely exclusive. there is no merging with the mind at large because the Self IS a mind at large, one of an infinite number of minds at large. Therefore God, the totality, is not a simple primordial consciousness but the totality of infinite soverign Selfs or Monads. in other words, God is not a simple substance, God is infinite complexity of infinite souls interrelating with one another. the individual “I” is not a temporary dissociation from the mind at large, it’s an absolute.

how monadology /absolute solipsism differs from nonduality The Mind At Large in Bernardo Kastrup’s theory, the mind at large divides itself into multiple perspectives. Kastrup doesn’t believe mind at large is particularly intelligent, as it is a simple primordial consciousness. upon death the individual’s consciousness becomes one with the mind at large Absole Solipsism in contrast, absolute solipsism recognizes that the Self is absolutely exclusive. there is no merging with the mind at large because the Self IS a mind at large, one of an infinite number of minds at large. Therefore God, the totality, is not a simple primordial consciousness but the totality of infinite soverign Selfs or Monads. in other words, God is not a simple substance, God is infinite complexity of infinite souls interrelating with one another. the individual “I” is not a temporary dissociation from the mind at large, it’s an absolute.

There are many women mystical people but female spirituality is different in style. They are more like witches, fortune tellers, Reiki people. Example: Teal Swan. Strict nonduality/awakening has a masculine bias baked into it. Most women will not find it appealing. However they will find stuff like yoga or witchcraft appealing.

@Danioover9000 Glad you found it interesting. I don’t see exactly how the video relates to this thread or if it’s meant to, but sure. I didn’t listen to the whole thing, they covered a lot subjects in a short time so I don’t have the full context for the conversation but I can comment on some things I heard them talk about in the first third of the video. He was talking about these spiritual communities and satsangs and I agree with some of his criticism as I have seen it in person myself. I’m not really that interested in these spiritual communities anymore, if it’s zen, buddhism, nonduality or whatever. Besides other problems, like abuses from the guru that might occur in some cases, from my own observation people usually stop thinking for themselves once they have found a group they connect with and have someone with a certain vibe they like, telling them what to think. Not that some aspects of it couldn’t be valuable and very much could help people, it’s just not how I roll. I’ll share a personal example. Some years ago I went to a Rupert Spira retreat in the Netherlands and I met another swede there who was also into nonduality, so when we both were back in Sweden again we continued to meet and talk about this stuff but after awhile it became clear to me that he was mostly re-iterating stuff that I’ve heard Rupert say a million times, but in swedish. To the point that I could take some typical Rupert phrase and put it in a translator and that word for word translation would be something he could say or write to me. He didn’t even have his own words to describe it, just being a parrot. At the same time he didn’t really want to engage in discussing things seriously while also becoming more smug about the whole thing. I called bullshit and haven’t seen him since. It’s easy to repeat words and play with semantics but if they don’t lead to an actual tangible re-contextualization then it’s not really that interesting. The guy in the video also talked a bit about his own experience of first reaching a conceptual understanding before a direct experience and yeah, I definitely think there is a difference between understanding something through logic or conclusions rather than a direct experience but I wouldn’t say there is a need to pick a side and dismissing the other, both have importance in my opinion. Some of us are more conceptual and like to play along with concepts and some of us don’t. It’s interesting when you do both. I’ve experienced some spiritual people using shame tactics against me when I’m using logical reasoning. And then when I go and talk to my normie buddies they call it all woo and says it all goes against science lol. Quite a predicament to be in. I think it also depends on where you are on the spiral dynamics scale and that we can’t exclude psychology from this. This might tie back to the criticism of the spiritual communities. I think some people who are in the pre-rational stage of cognitive development might hear spiritual concepts and because their mind doesn’t feel like it needs evidence for anything they rely on gut feeling or the vibe of the guru that’s telling them stuff and might just ”accept” spiritual concepts right away without even digging or thinking for themselves. And then to strengthen their newly formed belief-system that haven’t really been validated in direct experience they instead group together to feel more right about their self-perceived to be superior spiritual ideology and perhaps even demonize some other group. I mean, that sums up a lot of religion. And then the rational people instead misunderstands what it’s all about and lumps it all together with those religions and people who are in that pre-rational stage. For me growing up in a highly secularized community with atheistic, or at most agnostic, parents and being mostly stage green my primary challenge has been to overcome skeptical arguments that came up as I was having experiences I couldn’t explain. So I tried to make sense of it from my materialistic worldview, which I couldn’t really. Stuff like psychedelics really doesn’t make sense under the materialistic paradigm, the explanations given very fast becomes incoherent, which was the point of discussing the AI, to see how it would react when it's shown its incoherencies. So I don't see it as constructing something new, rather a discovery that what was thought of as reality is something constructed. If there is a model that I’m deconstructing the deconstructing of it isn't itself more construction, unless I make it so. It depends on what’s left after the deconstructing business is done. Maybe I’m making it into something else, very possible so gotta watch out always. It would be similar to those who make a big deal out of being skeptics. Being skeptical and viewed as being skeptical becomes more important itself than using skepticism as a tool in the pursuit of truth so they in many cases cynically just dismiss things which could be true because their identity is tied to looking like a skeptic, which also in mainstream society is associated with intelligence so they are trying to remain on their high horses. I see it with a lot of scientists and public intellectuals right now with this whole UFO thing going on lol Anyway, sorry to ramble on but that’s my thoughts so far.

I can't seem to shake the idea that others don't exist. After watching Leo's "Guided Exercise for Realizing You Are God", I had a moment in which I felt that everyone I knew was a projection, but soon after I found myself asking "But how could they not exist." Every time I saw another person, I questioned whether they were just a part of my imagination or if they are actually having a conscious experience. For example, anyone that replies to this thread could say "others don't exist", maybe evening having the thought that the person who wrote this was a projection of their own imagination, but I on the other side of this thread know that I in fact am not a projection because I am aware as I write this and have consciousness. Perhaps the higher the degree of consciousness, the closer to Nonduality someone gets? Even then, if there are other autonomous units of consciousness, regardless of the degree to which they are conscious, how is it possible that they don't exist altogether? I'm aware that my ego will fill in what I have conceptually striped away and that the more real I believe the Self to be the more real others will be, but then how do I practically experience ongoing Nonduality . I truly do enjoy the concept of nonduality but I'm having some trouble putting it in to practice. Any insights?

I remember feeling this way when attending youth group in high school. I was, admittedly, an undercover Buddhist at the time. I even joined in their nondenominational worship group, as the backup singer and lead guitarist. That was very cringe. Those Protestant Christian songs suck. Hopefully I'll sing in this Gregorian Chant choir soon. Here's a thought experiment. Does "Domine" as the Latin form, or even "Deo" make you equally cringe? If it doesn't, possibly consider that the word associations constructed out of this upbringing of yours has tainted the sounds and utterances of your life. I remember, more recently, attending different Latin Masses and finding some priests whine the Latin Mass in an uncomforting timbre. I also remember a distinct LSD experience where I felt the "nonduality talk" as equally cringe. Nowadays, I still get nauseated at the vocal phrase "we are one" because it invites a deep level of psychological ingratiation in social situations. If I say it to somebody walking down the street, I will feel the cursed detriment of the Most High God. Too "on the nose" perhaps. Yet, I don't find such cringe when saying "we are one in Christ." Might a spiritual-but-not-religious identity make you cringe, or is it more a deep piety that causes ick? In other words, do you think it may have to do with an unsubstantiated understanding of God? Or, rather a deeply conformed knowledge?

https://www.netflix.com/title/80013552?s=a&trkid=13747225&t=cp Here is the link to watch the movie. Moon is in Pisces ♓ (so it's time for some existentially woke shit) The Tale of Princess Kaguya by Studio Ghibli is the most profound and stunning metaphor for nonduality, and the existential sadness (and joy) for living through Earthly lifetimes. I had a full on existential awakening at the end of this movie and cried violently in front of my girlfriend for 20 minutes straight. I highly recommend watching closely. The ending is one of the most mind-blowing and beautiful endings of any movie. The entire movie is a masterpiece that will endure throughout human history as one of the most beautiful pieces of art ever made. The crown jewel of Japan's Walt Disney, Hayao Miyazaki. Also, the nature imagery and unique art style is stunning. He captures the innocence and purity of nature (and also of humans).

This is a really spot on, precise and non-bullshit viewpoint on nonduality and mindfulness. Bottom line: people either tend to get stuck in neo-advaita, which results in endless mental masturbation and self-delusion or they get stuck in meditation/mindfulness practises and get nowhere for years or even decades. Here's the article: In the context of American spiritual practice nondual traditions and mindfulness traditions appear to be in sharp contrast. Nonduality is often associated with the “doing nothing” schools of meditation, and mindfulness meditation is often very effortful. Mindfulness meditation masters in the States commonly refuse to even discuss enlightenment, whereas nondual teachers never stop talking about how we’re already enlightened. At the extremes, these two traditions can become very critical of each other. Some nondualists think that mindfulness meditators are caught in the trap of working hard to get somewhere, and end up just building a meditator ego to replace their everyday ego. Some mindfulness practitioners think that nondualists are just playing a recursive word game (“Who is playing a word game?”) and narcissistically kidding themselves about how enlightened they are, while complacently denying their own foibles. It’s a shame that these two wisdom traditions—especially in their American expressions—are antagonistic to each other. Really they just represent the two ends of a spectrum of theories about the same idea—the idea of how to awaken to real freedom. It’s a shame, because in my opinion most nondualists (especially neo-advaitins) could use a little more of the mindfulness attitude, and most mindfulness practitioners could use a little more of nondual outlook. Working together they could, like peanut butter and chocolate, form something much more excellent than either on their own. Something we might call Nondual Mindfulness, or Practical Advaita. Does Advaita Preclude Practices? Nonduality or advaita (which includes most of Madhyamika Buddhist and Hindu Tantra philosophy, too) holds that we are already completely, perfectly enlightened. Many traditional schools of nondualism stress, however, that we need to do some practice to reveal this true nature to ourselves. We have blinders on, and cannot see our own enlightenment, and a practice (which there are many types of) will remove the blinders and allow our inherent liberation to naturally shine forth. It’s like the practice blows the clouds away and suddenly we can see the sun and sky, which were already and always there. But, due to accidents of history, American nonduality, or what is called “neo-advaita,” took the more radical viewpoint that no practices are necessary to uncover our deepest wisdom. In this viewpoint, practices are actually counter-productive because they are emphasizing the untrue concept that the ego needs to do something to get enlightened. That practice is needed to find awakening. In the neo-advaita view, the more you struggle to be free, the more you ignore your own complete freedom that is already there. The more you fight, the more you emphasize the (unreal) existence of the fighter, thus causing you to become more lost. And that’s why neo-advaita is so inimical to any meditation technique at all, including mindfulness. Mindfulness practice, to a neo-advaitin, is just a lot of effort to convince yourself that you’re not already free. A big waste of time that leaves you worse off—even more mired in delusion—than you were before. The trouble with this viewpoint is that it’s more of a philosophy than a practical application. You can think you’re free and let go of all ideas of non-freedom all you want, but at the end of the day, you may still not feel very free. For people suffering from real world problems like stress, anxiety, depression, drug addiction, relationship breakup, and a thousand other human catastrophes, being told “not to hold on to those stories and just feel your inherent freedom” can feel like an impossibly cynical mindfuck. It can make you feel inadequate or stupid, and doesn’t really help. Just like the New Age catch-22 of telling cancer victims that it’s their own fault, and that they just need to believe they are healed in order to effect a real cure (thanks a lot!), neo-advaitin sometimes people in situations of extreme suffering that it’s all their own fault — and not infrequently this oh-so-helpful message is imparted with an air of superiority and smugness. On a deeper note, if you do begin to do the (non-practice) that neo-advaita prescribes, namely to realize that your thoughts and feelings are not your thoughts and feelings, it can lead to dissociation. Constantly denying your own body and mind has a cost, and some on the nondual path find themselves stuck in the trap of meaninglessness for many years, not realizing that they have been mired in identification with this self who “doesn’t care.” The advaita view, while philosophically powerful, was not traditionally taught with no practices to go with it. For example in Soto Zen—which like most Buddhism philosophically agrees about the inherent awakening in each person, called the Buddha Nature—people are encouraged to do a practice called “just sitting” (shikantaza). Just sitting is just sitting, a practice that is not a practice. Traditionally a monk or nun would do such a non-practice, however, for tens of thousands of hours in their lifetime. For a non-practice, that is an awful lot of practice, and it has a predictably powerful awakening effect. Even the grand master of advaita, Ramana Maharshi, gave his students practices. While talking about how we are already enlightened, he taught people to meditate, chant mantras, do breathwork, and other effortful practices. If you read the detailed histories of his top students (you can do so in the books by David Godman, a series called The Power of the Presence) who were very highly respected, realized persons, he gave all but one of them such practices to do. And they practiced them with all their hearts, sometimes for decades. Ramana, in other words, understood the difference between the philosophy of advaita and its practice. (Ironically, it was someone who met Ramana only once, named H. W. L. Poonja, who gave rise to the American school of radical non-practicing advaita. This was the one student he didn’t give any practices to.) Except in rare cases, it is necessary for a person to do meditation practices to remove their ignorance of their own awakening. Afterwards, from their enlightened perspective, they may see how ridiculous it all was, but they never would have seen that without having done these “ridiculous” practices. Mindfulness has a lot to offer a nondual practitioner. For one thing, the practice of self-inquiry is a kind of mindfulness practice. Investigating the nature of the Self, asking yourself, “Who am I” and looking for the answer to that question can all be considered a kind of “mindfulness of the Self.” Most mindfulness practice as it is taught in America focuses on body sensations, but there is no reason that a practitioner cannot use the same kind of focus on the sense of self and deconstructing that sense of self into its components. In more advanced mindfulness practice, this is exactly the point. Does Mindfulness Practice Actually BLOCK Awakening? But advaita also has something very useful to contribute to mindfulness, because the advaita critique of mindfulness is legitimate and important. Again, it’s the idea that mindfulness strengthens the sense of being somebody (you, the meditator) doing something (practicing meditation) – a sense which, in the long run, is still an ego. Because mindfulness teachers very often talk about the practice as “becoming a witness of experience,” they are actually creating a safe haven for the ego, which can keep the person from realizing their fundamental awakening. You only have to spend time around some of the more long-term mindfulness communities to see the result of this misstep in action. There are a large number of practitioners who have been diligently doing their mindfulness meditation for decades, and who seem to be stuck in a particular place. They have gotten an edge or a handle on life. They’re pretty good at coping with difficulties, and they are much less caught up in the madness of their egos than the average person on the street. All of which is excellent. But beyond this, they are in a cul-de-sac. Nothing has changed in their practice for years or even decades. They seem somewhat flat or depressed. They may even refuse to acknowledge that real awakening exists, and consider enlightenment to be a dirty word. (Talk about missing the point.) The diagnosis is clear: they have fallen into the “Observer Trap.” The prognosis is good, if they can learn how to meditate on the sense of self involved in doing the meditation itself and then deconstruct that. By turning the meditator itself into the object of meditation, they can experience the dissolution of the meditator ego, and touch real awakening. It’s really that simple, but you will find few mindfulness teachers who are aware of this solution, or even of the problem itself. Although I don’t like to promote steps-and-stages models of awakening (they’re always too reductive), I believe that mindfulness could be described as a two-step process. First, you become the witness of experience. Second, you realize that you are not that witness. Virtually all of mindfulness in America only teaches you step one. Again, even step one is a big improvement over having no steps at all. However, if you are stuck in your practice, and you want to experience some of the deeper levels of awakening, then taking the second step is crucial. There are several ways to take this step. The standard nondual method is to simply sit with no agenda. Notice that this is not “not meditating,” it’s meditating with no technique. (The difference is crucial.) Another advaita technique that is applicable is self-inquiry practice, in which you look for the person who is meditating. The method that fits best with mindfulness practice is slightly more effortful, however. It involves patiently deconstructing the sense of the meditating self. Noticing the thoughts of the meditator (“This is going well today.” “Am I doing this right?” etc.) and the feelings of the meditator (happy that it’s going well, frustrated that it’s not, etc.). You can read a more in-depth description of the practice here. Get Clear: Nonduality and Mindfulness Thus the outlook of mindfulness can contribute something useful to advaita, and the outlook of advaita can contribute something useful to mindfulness. In the end, all of these distinctions only matter if they help you to make progress in your practice to reveal your true awakening. Nondualist—ask yourself if you’re just kidding yourself about how much freedom you actually feel each day. There are ways to go deeper without getting trapped in grasping, striving, and comparison, and those ways involve dedicated practice. Mindfulness-folks—ask yourself whether you’ve been stuck in basically the same place in your practice for a long time. There are ways to go deeper which involve deconstructing your practice itself. In both cases it will probably include a lot of discomfort at pushing yourself out of a comfortable resting place you’ve found to camp out in. The peace, joy, and freedom you will find will be worth all the effort. Source: https://deconstructingyourself.com/nonduality-and-mindfulness.html

right. nonduality doesn't fit with experience, it's just a fancy theory. everything is the same substance, but there's an infinity of minds. widowless monads - Leibniz

Beautiful! IT (what you describe, bold markings by me) is always right here, and can not be gone. Just temporarily clouded with containing/giving arising to the illusion-arisings of the self-contraction (certain I-thoughts and I-feelings). One can do perfectly fine without them, because most of them are just suffering. I am happy for you that you had this Awakening, insight and experience. That is a wonderful "place" to live ones life from. Water by the River PS: Just some further musings, not specifically intented as answer for you/your post, but also for others that maybe are a bit put off (or just dont really know what I mean by that) by my frequent mentioning of the Impersonal/Nonpersonal [or empty] Nature of Reality/Pure Primary Consciousness/Infinite Consciousness. I certainly would have been a few years ago. [IT/Infinite Reality (what you describe, bold markings by me) is always right here, and can not be gone. Just temporarily clouded with containing/giving arising to the illusion-arisings of the self-contraction (certain I-thoughts and I-feelings). One can do perfectly fine without them, because most of them are just suffering.] Yet, after waking up, the personal individuality/soul stays, though no longer being a separate-self, but an enlightened being in nondual unity with existence itself. Impersonal or non-personal is not bad at all (although it can sound scary in the beginning), but on the opposite: It allows for the full expression of ones individuality or soul-qualities, that now can finally flourish in nonduality, and are no in a contracted separate-ness, hampeing its flow and expression with suffering and other not so nice experiences. But instead expressing itself fully in the Infinite Existence/Reality that one really is then, containing in this perspective (of Indras Net/Reality itself) this individual soul and its expressions. It is like: Unenlightened Being/perspective = Absolute Reality + Individuality/soul + and separate-self arisings cutting Nonduality/Reality into two, creating suffering and/or boredom. Enlightened Being/perspective (or better woken up perspective in Indras Net, since the separate being has been transcended and replaced with Infinite Reality itself) = Absolute Reality + Individuality/soul (each perspective/being is different, have different traits and capacities and inclinations, even enlightened ones) + and no more separate-self arisings cutting Nonduality/Reality into two, but instead True Identity= Impersonal/Nonpersonal Infinite Reality + containing (transcended and intergrated) Individuality/soul, evolving further in this non-contracted state of being. Enlightenment is not the final end of the caterpillar-being (only of certain aspects of it (clouding mechanisms, separate-self-illusions), preventing it from being a butterfly), but just the beginning of the unique butterfly and its path, this life and the next...

Thanks for describing your experience. I do agree with that, based on my own experience. And thousands of others in all cultures and centuries described it like you do. That is a very important element of the path. It probably sounds quite a bit nuts, boring and strange. At least I would have interpreted it like that a few years ago... But that is exactly how the Impersonal (Silent/Pure/Empty) Infinite Consciousness perceives all of its manifestation in certain awakened nondual states, watching itself, perceiving itself, being itself and the world, by itself, for itself. (1) That starts to happen when the self-contraction/separate-self is seen through, transcended and cut off either with high enough speed & proficiency, or with some more energetic state-change techniques. So the resulting flow of bliss makes it no longer possible for any grasping/contracting thought/feeling-arising to grip & contract the focus/attention (and cut the nondual field into two, or duality), and create bad emotions/stop the flow of bliss. And motivating the separate-self with that resulting suffering again for searching or avoiding certain experiences to eradicate the suffering, and relax the contraction again. That process you describe is the natural way that leads the transition to the deep identity level change to ones True Nature, the Infinite Silent and peaceful/blissful Abyss of Pure Consciousness without location or any kind of objective appearance... When not finding IT (or Consciousness, or oneself), at some point the localization of consciousness dissolves, making every appearance (thought, feeling, cloud, tree, the whole world including ones "small self") just an appearance arising in the Infinite, silent & empty and not-personal Eternal Reality of Ones True Being, Infinite Consciousness, or Reality itself. (2) And when it is seen that even the "Understander" of this Nondual and Awake Realization is nothing more than a bundle of "understanding"-thoughts arising WITHIN THAT, then Full Enlightenment is finally seeing that there never was a separate-self besides an illusion, and nobody (besides) an Illusion actually woke up. Pure Infinite Consciousness/Being was there throughout, undisturbed, just containing some illusion-arisings. And yet, that Realization or waking up of that perspective of Indras Net makes all the difference in the dream of that perspective, finally dissolving the self-contraction/separate-self illusion even of the "Understander" of all of that for good. Selling Water by the River PS: (1) are the stages of dissolving the separate-self into nonduality, and (2) is going from Nonduality/Unity towards even relaxing/dissolving the "Understander"-separate-self-illusion of that into Infinite Consciousness/Reality itself. More on that in this post: PS PS: For Infinite Reality to create a separate-self/self-contraction/ego and to maintain it, there are just two emotions needed that have to regularly occur in cycles (not permanently, that would also kill the separate-self) : 1) suffering (in the meaning of non-satisfied-ness, or "non-bliss" , and 2) boredom. That starts all of the projects for getting back again the bliss via certain experiences (whatever that may be varies a lot). A bliss that would be there if not the separate-self-contraction would stop its flow via contracting. Of course, that can only be seen after having touched the natural bliss of ones True Being, because if that would be seen earlier the whole process would be shut off immediately. But if there is no technique available to just cut off the contraction/suffering, one has to stick to grasping for certain experiences, because that is then all one has...

@Leo Gura Come on man... How can you hold such limiting beliefs so firmly? Aren't you the one that preaches nonduality? If that applies, the stupid linear logic of "have an X disorder, it is grounded in Y " is flawed. EVERYTHING is mental and every disease is in large psychosomatic ESPECIALLY autoimmune ones. You should ask why you allow your mind to keep that disease alive and what role does that disease fulfill? Many people have mentally healed their diseases and not some simple flu, I'm talking about blindness/ cancer/ etc. I honestly wonder how you still think so linearly when you know for a fact that it doesn't work like that.

@Water by the River Your True Nature is God. Which is not the same thing as Emptiness, nor nonduality, nor Buddhism, nor egolessness. The real question you should be asking is, What is God?

Allow me some further musings on the topic. In stage 3 Yoga of One Taste (One Taste = Nondual), Nonduality starts showing up. But Nonduality is not Impersonal Infinite Consciousness, because one can be in nondual Unity and still think that one is an "enlightened person", or any other crappy concept or self-identity for that matter. The ripening of Nonduality goes from stage 3 Yoga of One Taste to stage 4, Yoga of Nonmeditation. Nonmeditation, because the meditation has become so automized that the need for any separate-self agency feeling doing anything is no longer necessary and is discarded and also cut off. And then one is accident-prone to the possible accident of Enlightenment, Impersonal Infinite Consciousness realizing itself. At that stage, doing anything is just creating another cloud hiding the sun of ones true being, because doing anything would be another thougt/feeling-movement in Infinite Consciousness/Mind/Reality. And psychedelics are very nice for helping the whole process, and for exploring the Multiverse and other interesting stuff. But for transcending the last subtle separate-self-identity-arisings (subtle separate-self thoughts and feelings), and cutting off the sometimes arisings-non-bliss-feeling-bad-arisings (in other words: suffering) that are a part of the separate-self-package, I have yet to see one case (just a single one would be very interesting) where that has been done mainly on a stable basis/outcome in daily life with only psychedelics. That can be very well had with meditation practice. Meditation: Actually, from all I have seen, getting rid of all the clouds of the separate-self takes a long time in certain states (boundless, timeless infinite consciousness, nondual and the separate-self already nothing but a feeling of "individuality", some "nothing" watching the nondual totality), 100s of hours. Maybe 1000s. For most practitioners at least, including yours truly. On the stage 3 and 4 of the stages of Yoga of One Taste and Yoga of Nonmeditation alone (and these are not boring or annoying sitting meditation hours by then, but blissful and wonderful hours in daily life in something called Post-Samadhi-Meditation (or off the pillow meditation) in the book). And in that 100s or 1000s of hours subtle separtate-self identities/arisings get spotted, seen (subject->object), transcended and cut off. And I can assure you, oh boy, these are sometimes really sneaky and subtle. When all of that is transcended, the sudden Deep Identity Shift/Understanding can happen. "Yes, there is nothing else than THAT, and "my" essence is that, and what "I" thought I was was just a movement/arising of thoughts/feelings/centers within THAT. My True Being is all of Reality. But nothing specific. No separate-anything. The whole enchilada without center and core". But its not a elaborated thinking. It is Infinite Consciousness UNDERSTANDING/REALIZING itself, and there is nothing else than THAT, never possibly could be. The understanding in thought-form gets elaborated LATER, after Infinite Consciousness/Reality has understood itself, the nature of the world and its own nature (nondual). Psychedelics: bring a lot and strong forms of the Awakened States (nondual, infinite, mere appearance, and a lot more). States that one would only get by meditation if already very empty, or the separate-self-arising (thought/feeling)flow already cut a lot. So the states are very awake/nondual/infinite, but the separate-self-arisings is still colouring the experience. Although they can also be very subtle/empty at that state. And that is my little theory that explains all phenomena and examples I have seen so far: There is just not enough time and deeply cut-off/transcended separate-self-arisings in psychedelic states to cause that deep Identity-Level Shift of Full Enlightenment. And often, and maybe even much more problematic than the point just mentioned, there is a lot of nonduality/Unity in psychedelic states but a lot of separate-self-feelings/identites/... still left. Not a pure and impersonal Nonduality/Unity, but rather a Unity loaded with not-so-impersonal-stuff. And that doesn't fully count as these 100s or 1000s hours mentioned above, because they may be not so flashy consciousness/awakened, but are already quite nondual/Unity and very very impersonal/empty/nearly-no-separate-self still left. Only last fragments, being dissolved as time goes on. Short form: Meditation: Unity/Nonduality/Awakened States only when very large parts of separate-self-arisings (thoughts/feelings) are already gone/transcended Psychedelics: Lots of Unity/Nondual/Awakened States EVEN with separate-self-arisings (thoughts/feelings) in large parts not seen trough, even with the help of the psychedelic. Full Enlightenment: And for the sudden Deep Identity Level Shift of Full Enlightenment the separate-self-arisings/thoughts/feelings need to be ALL seen through/Transcended/cut off (which at the same time is also a huge boost of Nonduality/Awakenings, making the whole field an infinite nondual groundless mere appearance field hovering within ones timeless true always here Being, and Infinite Awareness Space with separate-self-center/Individuality fully gone. Just THIS). In Full Enlightenment, there is no agent left that is still believed, no center. So one IS Reality itself. And literally everything that could ever appear is a manifested/imagined arising/appearance, imagined by "the" Infinite Mind/Consciousness. And that "Mind", or Reality, dreams and is deluded until "It" realized there is only itself, watching itself, fooling and believing itself in endless appearances. If there is "someone", or arisings of a "you" that thinks "it" is enlightened: Welcome, that is another illusion-layer (as Leo correctly points out). It is maybe an Enlightenment (Nondual Unity with the Infinite Void), but not Full Enlightenment. And for the impersonal aspect: Sounds horrible, in practice its wonderful: One is this life "oneself", next life maybe life something else completely: Different personality, different body, Human, Alien, whatever. Impersonal Consciousness open up exactly that. Like dreaming being someone/something else at night. But the price of transcending this specific bodymind has to be paid. And since its only an illusion, only has some fear-defense-mechanism BEFORE the Gateless Gate of waking up to ones True Identity, Infinite Impersonal Consciousness, or Reality itself. Water by the River

Let me try to answer your questions as brief as possible. That is challenging, because the Mahamudra system is technically very complex with many stages. I like to compare Zen/Theravada to cutting a tree with an axe, while Mahamudra is something like a forest harvester: The axe was available already in stone-age and worked, robust and slow. The forest harvester needs precise handling and thorough understanding & training, but is waaay faster. Anyway, lets try the impossible at least roughly. Here is my main thread of the explanation on Mahamudra in the Pointing out the Great Way style (Daniel Brown, 600 page book, around 200-300 pages on the juicy main-practice-stages of Mahamudra). To give you an idea/feeling (not really possible to do in brief, but I try): The description of two main steps: Stage 1 of 4, Skill of Recognition Stage 3 of 4, Yoga of One Taste (One Taste = Nondual) Lets start with Stage 1 of 4, Skill of Recognition It is a "High-Speed-Search-Task into Nature of thoughts, into the "Unfindability/Emptiness" of thoughts. They evaporate when looking into their nature. The nature of every emerging thought/concept, emerging out of Infinite Consciousness/Absolute Reality): And the nature of thoughts is its unfindability: Thoughts have no location, they are "made"/essence out of Infinite Consciousness. Thoughts dissolve when looking into their nature (Aware Empty Infinite Consciousness). One can never "find" a thought. They dissolve when looking into their essence. They move within onself, and dissolve when looking into them And that process/phenomenon is used. and with that cutting off (=Trekchö), since its nature is empty Infinite Consciousness/Suchness. Consciousness literally stops the thought then. At one point when one is fast enough, one sees the order of emergence IN the Infinite Mind is Understanding or just some other cause Thought emergence (fully formed, fully emerging in mili-seconds, but not yet "elaborated-out" over several seconds) being elaborated out over a part of a second to several seconds) And step 3 doesn't happen then. It is cut off. THAT is was brings Awakened States (nondual, boundless, basically if done fast enough. The thought "capsules" start emerging faster and faster then, 10-20 thoughts capsules per second+, and at some point Awareness stays "on top" of even that. That is where the magic starts (Nonduality begins developing, and the mindstream can get silent, bliss starts flowing. A very discrete and "hard" psychological process). And that happens in the beginning phases still on the pillow, but can also happen very much in daily life when intensive thought activity is not necessary. Later, it becomes also possible with sophisticated intellectual/creative thinking, when Awareness has become strong enough to stay lucid THROUGH the thought-elaboration. No longer hypnotized, the creative/intellectual happening within oneself on auto-pilot. Awakened Awareness and its Infinite Intelligence tends to take over, the separate-self/ego gets out of the way. That makes it also much more effective, since the ego/separte-self tended to act as a filter. From this Awakenened Awareness all intelligence and creativity comes from anyway, that is why creativity is so highly valued and pleasurable. This Awakened Awareness is the source of bliss anyway.... So, then the next step described in this post (Stage 2, see link above, jumped due to the specific question of Leo for "daily" practice: Stage 3 of 4, Yoga of One Taste. One Taste = Nondual boundless consciousness. Getting that into daily life. When enough proficiency of creating lucid states with this High-Speed-Cutoff is generated, the Awareness/Lucidity doesn't get lost when thinking. It stays. And with it the Awakened States. And then daily life starts getting nondual, especially if no academic thinking is necessary (still large parts of the day). With academic style thinking/creative thinking, it takes more Lucidity/Training, but is doable. 2nd TOPIC OF THIS POST: God-Realization in your words, or "You become conscious of God as an Infinite Mind dreaming up reality." And this (Yoga of One Taste) brings us then to the "base camp of Full Enlightenment", the "jumping platform" where Full Enlightenment can happen (some of which main aspects you refer to with God Realization): Stage 4, Yoga of Nonmeditation. I have written elsewhere about it, see link above. The Nondual Stages of Yoga of One Taste would get confirmed in other traditions (Zen for example) as Enlightenment/Satori/Kensho. But not Great/Full Enlightenment, or God-Realization in your wording. That is an "accident", for which Stage 3&4 make accident-prone. I agree with you that Emptiness/Void is neither God Realization nor Full Enlightenment, where also that "You become conscious of God as an Infinite Mind dreaming up reality" is realized. I am starting more to understand why you emphasize that in your language/system of experience, and I agree on the importance of it. In Zen, there is a differentiation between just shallower Enlightenments (Kenshos, Satoris) into the empty nature of all appearance, or into emptiness. The separte-self can still be very alive then. The Full Enlightenment on the other side, the total dissolution of the separate-self, leaves one with exactly that realization: "You become conscious of God as an Infinite Mind dreaming up reality." Although there is no more you, nor God, but Reality itself becoming consciousness OF itself IMAGINING itself as all there ever could be. This Enlightenment is probably between 10-50 less common than the real thing of Full Enlightenment. Probably that is why you are so annoyed with the large majority of Buddhist Enlightenments (either contemporarily claimed or described in literature). Let me give you four examples of that differentiation (I could give many more, but that would blast the post. Ok, I admit, its already blasted and way too long... forgive me). 1) Huang Po https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Huangbo_Xiyun "One Mind Huángbò's teaching centered on the concept of “mind” (Chinese: hsin), a central issue for Buddhism in China for the previous two centuries or more. He taught that mind cannot be sought by the mind. One of his most important sayings was “mind is the Buddha”. He said: All the Buddhas and all sentient beings are nothing but the One Mind, beside which nothing exists [red by me]. The One Mind alone is the Buddha, and there is no distinction between the Buddha and sentient beings.[8] He also said: To awaken suddenly to the fact that your own Mind is the Buddha [Nothing exists beside IT=God=Reality=True You], that there is nothing to be attained or a single action to be performed – this is the Supreme Way.[9]" 2) Yogachara school https://integrallife.com/toward-fourth-turning-buddhism/ "The very notion of the “not-twoness” of Emptiness and Form opened the door, as we briefly mentioned, to other even “stronger” versions of nonduality or (metaphoric!) Wholeness, one of the most prominent being the Yogachara, introduced by the half‑brothers Asanga (more of a brilliant innovator) and Vasubandhu (more of an acute synthesizer). Another name for their school—Vijnaptimatra—is usually translated as “Mind-only” or “Representation-only.” The point here is that the “not-twoness” of Emptiness and Form allowed some philosopher-sages to come up with other terms for the “Form” that was seamlessly conjoined with ultimate Emptiness or Shunyata, one of them being “Mind” itself. The idea was that “Mind” itself was the same as Emptiness—the Yogachara philosophers were adamant that they were talking about the same “unqualifiable” Emptiness that Nagarjuna was, but by also referring to it as “Mind” they were giving (some would say metaphorically, some would say absolutely) a type of compass that would help relate ultimate Emptiness to an everyday reality everybody was aware of (such as, namely, the Mind). The Zen saying, “The everyday mind, just that is the Tao (ultimate Truth)” is a good example of this type of Yogachara thinking. And it showed clearly how one could “bring everything to the path,” starting with your own, simple, everyday awareness. This opened so many other doors—especially Tantra and Vajrayana—that it is referred to as “The Third Turning of the Wheel of Dharma.” Buddhism has philosophically run a long way. Hinayana didn't even have the full Nondual Realization of Absolute Reality, Nagarjuna made Madyamaka (nothing can be said about Ultimate Reality). And where did it end? The philosophy all which pretty all sophisticated Tantric Buddhism system rely on? MIND-ONLY, Yogachara. We need to at least differentiate the 2500 year system of Buddhism into these development steps. If not, we are fighting with a "fossil-philosophy"... 3) The Supreme Source, one of the main texts of Dzogchen (quite close to the Mahamudra above, Brown uses Dzogchen and Mahamudra elements together): on which breathtaking beautiful absolute perpective you agreed: There is gold in Buddhism, Full Enlightenment, God Realization. And tools to make it stable in daily life. The later systems of Tantric Buddhism, but also Mahayana, have at their philosophic core Yogachara or Madhyamaka (I have written on that elsewhere). These two qualifications of Ultimate Reality are in line with what you call God Realization. 4) In Zen 3 pillars of Zen, Kapleau: Some quotes from that book: "ROSHI: With a first enlightenment the realization of oneness is usually shallow. Yet if one has genuinely perceived, even though dimly, and continues to practice devotedly for five or ten more years, this inner vision will expand in depth and magnitude as one’s character acquires flexibility and purity." The story of Bassui: "You become conscious of God as an Infinite Mind dreaming up reality." "This way is no other than the realization of your own Mind. Now what is this Mind? It is the true nature of all sentient beings, that which existed before our parents were born and hence before our own birth, and which presently exists, unchangeable and eternal. So it is called one’s Face before one’s parents were born. This Mind is intrinsically pure. When we are born it is not newly created, and when we die it does not perish. It has no distinction of male or female, nor has it any coloration of good or bad. It cannot be compared with anything, so it is called Buddha-nature. Yet countless thoughts issue from this Selfnature as waves arise in the ocean or as images are reflected in a mirror. To realize your own Mind you must first of all look into the source from which thoughts flow And: Realization Emptiness, or Void, IS NOT YET FULL ENLIGHTENMENT: "In this propitious state deepen and deepen the yearning, tirelessly, to the extreme. When the profound questioning penetrates to the very bottom, and that bottom is broken open, not the slightest doubt will remain that your own Mind is itself Buddha, the Void-universe. There will then be no anxiety about life or death, no truth to search for. In a dream you may stray and lose your way home. You ask someone to show you how to return or you pray to God or Buddhas to help you, but still you can’t get home. Once you rouse yourself from your dream-state, however, you find that you are in your own bed and realize that the only way you could have gotten home was to awaken yourself. This [kind of spiritual awakening] is called “return to the origin” or “rebirth in paradise.” It is the kind of inner realization that can be achieved with some training. Virtually all who like zazen and make an effort in practice, be they laypeople or monks, can experience to this degree. But even such [partial] awakening cannot be attained except through the practice of zazen. You would be making a serious error, however, were you to assume that this was true enlightenment in which there is no doubt about the nature of reality. You would be like one who having found copper gives up the desire for gold." Or: Not yet Full Enlightenment-Realization. "But even now repeatedly cast off what has been realized, turning back to the subject that realizes, that is, to the root bottom, and resolutely go on. Your Self-nature will then grow brighter and more transparent as your delusive feelings perish, like a gem gaining luster under repeated polishing, until at last it positively illumines the entire universe [infinite nondual mere appearance boundlessness of ones nondual limitless being then]." "You must understand that anything appearing in your consciousness or seen by your eyes is an illusion [imagined], of no enduring reality. Hence you should neither fear nor be fascinated by such phenomena. If you keep your mind as empty as space, unstained by extraneous matters, no evil spirits can disturb you even on your deathbed. While engaged in zazen, however, keep none of this counsel in mind. You must only become the question “What is this Mind?” or “What is it that hears these sounds?” When you realize this Mind you will know that it is the very source of all Buddhas and sentient beings. And that ends in Full Enlightenment: "keep asking with all your strength, “What is it that hears?” Only when you have completely exhausted the questioning will the question burst; now you will feel like someone who has come back from the dead. This is true realization. You will see the Buddhas of all the universes face-to-face and the Dharma Ancestors past and present [they all have been expressions of this Infinite Mind of yours, of the only Reality there is or could be, dreaming up all these worlds]." There is nothing else than: "You become conscious of God as an Infinite Mind dreaming up reality." And that becomes stable in daily life when there is no longer a separate-self, but only Reality. God. True Nature. Whatever one wants to call "It" then... And that Ultimate Reality is Impersonal Infinite Consciousness. "It" is both nothing/impersonal, but also everything there could be imagined. It is Reality itself. The True Core of each being. As long as something of a remaining separate-self projected on it, its not stable in daily life. The remains of that separate-self will also "colour" all higher insights/realizations. Bliss doesn't flow yet full time, so the suffering will make the being continue and refine anything that is not conforming to this Ultimate Reality, ones True being. Or according to Huang Po, The One [Infinite] Mind that dreams or imagines it all up all Reality. Water by the River PS: Ok, yours truly confesses: short is it not, the post.... But please don't hit me too hard, took some time to write, and I got plenty of other things to do also.

@KatiesKarma There’s no need to abandon Christianity. Just add enlightenment and nonduality to your religion, that’s it.